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- Thread starter
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Some of their edits have been useful, whereas others have been overreaches, especially for a new regular member.
Should we ban them, and if so, for how long?
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Rule Violation Reports (New forum)
- Thread starter Antvasima
- Start date
Should we ban them, and if so, for how long?
Mr. Bambu
Suffer-Not-Injustice Bambu
VS Battles
Joke Battles
Super Moderator
Administrator
Calculation Group
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They seem to earnestly want to help (in fact, I think I personally recall their change there being fine, I've seen that movie), but unfortunately won't respond to or follow the messages submitted to his wall (you and Agnaa have both advised him on this behavior). I'd really rather be lenient and try to communicate with him but perhaps a very short ban might be a more effective communicator, one he cannot ignore?
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I agree. The amount of overlap in their behavior was suspicious from the start, and over time it's only gotten more damning.
I do not understand what you mean.
noninho
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Someone said, outta nowhere, "I agree the author should get k*lled with his girlfriend[...]"
Can someone be reported for that?
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Resounding yes. We dont tolerate kill and suicide jokes
noninho
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here's the link. at that point in time, there was no applied rules for some threads so people were speaking brazilian portuguese
Life_Of_King said
"Concordo com deletar o verso e matar o criador juntamente com sua namorada para então vingar aquela ex namorada que eu não lembro o nome mas que ele bateu"
which translates to
"Agree to delete the verse and kill the author together with his girlfriend so it revenges his ex girlfriend who i don't know the name but he beat"
to give some context: Cellbit is the author of Ordem Paranormal and few years ago, he got exposed for verbal abuse against his ex-girlfriend
no beating was confirmed afaik, so his blatantly wrong on the last part.
Life_Of_King said
"Concordo com deletar o verso e matar o criador juntamente com sua namorada para então vingar aquela ex namorada que eu não lembro o nome mas que ele bateu"
which translates to
"Agree to delete the verse and kill the author together with his girlfriend so it revenges his ex girlfriend who i don't know the name but he beat"
to give some context: Cellbit is the author of Ordem Paranormal and few years ago, he got exposed for verbal abuse against his ex-girlfriend
no beating was confirmed afaik, so his blatantly wrong on the last part.
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I'm 99% sure that Uuber1 is a sockpuppet of Pizzabox492.
Uuber1 joined July 8th, just a few days after Pizzabox's last sockpuppet, FanFav12, was banned on June 30th.
I've been noticing these similarities between the two users:
Uuber1 joined July 8th, just a few days after Pizzabox's last sockpuppet, FanFav12, was banned on June 30th.
I've been noticing these similarities between the two users:
- Spams Undertale Versus Threads (Especially Sans vs DBS Characters)
- And to a lesser extent, seems focused on Asriel as well.
- Has an interest in Mario.
- Constantly brings up Reddit "debunks" of Persona/SMT ratings, and keeps bringing up some guy named Bunkerman.
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I don't think it's prudent to act against a comment from 7 months ago.
This looks persuasive to me. @Uuber1
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I will also note that Ant didn't find any IP overlap between the two. However, VPNs exist, and it's pretty blatantly obvious Uuber1 is a sock from the evidence I provided.
noninho
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i made sure to ask because i took notice of that just now, that was a lack of earlier reporting.
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Other people did this too, There was:
Are they sockpuppets of pizzabox? 2 were made by the same person btw
I can't like Asriel?
I can't agree with a CRT??????
But the link you sent that claimed that Reddit debunked reddit megaten ratings wasn't even about that, it was about reddit "debunking" creation feats.
Also I was just asking if there was something coming for him, because he has a pretty bad reputation in the powerscaling community, even outside of Megaten stuff.
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No, there just wasn't anyone who was a member of the team who spoke Portuguese there for him to receive a ban.
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You've made 3 Sans vs DBS threads within days of each other.
By themselves, they obviously wouldn't mean anything, but I'm saying you two have very similar interests, make the same threads, and you coincidentally joined the wiki shortly after Pizzabox was banned.
In addition, you both seem to have an interest in Sonic as well.
That's a lie, you made the thread with MT in mind.
If we scroll up, here's you saying it yourself:
You specifically bring him up for MT, and not for any other verses, but alright.
So to reiterate, I'm suspecting you're a sock because:
- You joined the forum like a week after Pizzabox was banned.
- You both share very similar interests, those being Undertale, Mario, Sonic, DB, and MT.
- You also make the same threads for some of these verses in particular.
- For Undertale, you both frequently make Sans vs DBS Versus Threads, and Asriel Versus Threads.
- Whenever either of you bring up MT, it's pretty much always an attempt to "debunk" MT's ratings using arguments from Reddit/Bunkerman.
- You also make the same threads for some of these verses in particular.
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I'd like to post some minor evidence of him being Vapour's alt that I noticed. This is a copy-paste of a DM I sent to a staff member days ago:
This new user, @TheDarkTriadz, might be a sock of Vapour, or at least someone from the Tokyo Revengers goon squad.
- First ever post he makes is a zesty one under Dale's wall, a CGM that many of the Tokyo Revengers supporters have a hate boner for. Then posts another weird one under Clover's wall, who is also not a fan of the verse and its calculations.
- Is already pumping out decent calculations despite just joining yesterday.
- Is a Tokyo Revengers supporter that wanks Mikey.
- Interested in Kagura Bachi, which another Vapour sock also supported.
- Not entirely sure about this one, but his profile picture kinda looks Demon Slayer-esque. Which is a verse that, you guessed it- Vapour also supports.
- He's now participating in downgrading the speed for The Boxer, which is very similar to another thread he made with a different sock. I'm very tempted to make a report on him now.
Besides this, he rabidly defends @DekuGlazer, who is a friend of Vapour and also a part of the TR powerscaling Discord server, and he often defends him to the point of derailing a thread.
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So basically your only evidence of me being a sockpuppet is thinking I can't read through a couple replies and that I participate in similar threads to this guy ? I'm sorry to tell you but when someone is interested in TR, Cote or The boxer they are likely to be interested in the other verses similar to it or want to debate in the other verses too. And no, just because we have the same opinion on a downgrade for a verse doesn't mean we both are sock puppets, the only reason I participated in the downgrade thread was because of viott made it and I noticed it while the boxer thread was going on. And me having a demonslayer profile picture is not good evidence dude ? Demon slayer is one of the most read manga's in recent times ? Also my will to discuss with CGMS comes from me being a normal person ? What is wrong I do not understand it ?
I'm just going to mention the fact that ever since I joined the wiki I've been bombarded with hate, trolls, accusations and overall just disrespect ? For what ? For being a fan of a series, from what I've noticed if you are a tokyo revengers fan, most mods will just ignore you because the series has a bad past ? Thats completely unacceptable and its like some sort of dictator run country where if one person from the past does something wrong, the people related to them are sentenced for WHAT THE PERSON IN THE PAST DID. Completely unacceptable, the same goes for my inability to argue in calcs because I'm a supporter ?! This is just completely unnaceptable, I was even reported for being a troll by people who were making fun of me constantly. It's kind of just disgustingly annoying and disrespectful and it seems only a few mods actually have a willingness to show respect to users who want to participate in a verse.
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This is not evidence dude ? You're one of the people who trolls me the most. I literally messaged every mod online at the time because I thought the feature was cool ? This isn't evidence at all
Pumping out decent calculations isn't evidence
I do not wank Mikey, do not say that, I am somebody who scales him to what he scales
Kagura Bachi took over the internet by storm this is a again not evidence
You said supports but then he's not on the list ? What ?
This is just you, I do not talk like him, again I read the past TR threads and he talks in a different mannerism, you need to stop with this false accusation
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Your first two messages on the site were specifically directed towards two Calc Group Members who hate evaluating the calcs of your verse. It's not just that, but the fact that you did the immature thing of expecting someone that hates you to go slowly back to tolerating you (or in this case, the calcs for your verse) by randomly complimenting them as well.
It is if you're a new user who also happens to be a TR supporter, because that's one of the many reasons so many of Vapour's socks were caught.
This will be my last post regarding the matter, clean it up janitors.
Mr. Bambu
Suffer-Not-Injustice Bambu
VS Battles
Joke Battles
Super Moderator
Administrator
Calculation Group
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I have come to be hesitant regarding unconfirmed socks. I sometimes fear we are too harsh on them, too zealous in seeking out people wishing to come back in that we see them in unrelated parties. This is why I did not deign to speak on this matter immediately. Given the amount of evidence, however (Shmooply's additions are notable enough, I believe), I would agree that this appears to be a very likely case of sockpuppeting and would agree with a ban as such.
One must wonder when we will take action against Tokyo Revengers as a whole, as this sort of sockpuppet arms race is not sustainable in the long run.
One must wonder when we will take action against Tokyo Revengers as a whole, as this sort of sockpuppet arms race is not sustainable in the long run.
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I'm of the opinion it's become far more trouble than it is worth to keep here.
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I've suspected the same for the past few days. I would be comfortable with a ban.
I've had concerns for some time over how persistently controversial TR tends to be. However, if any action is to be suggested, I would think it should be left for a Staff Discussion thread rather than the RVR.
noninho
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i'm reporting @DekuGlazer for Fallacies abuse (Appeal. To. Motive. fallacies, Fallacy Fallacy) Blatantly ignoring posts (and claiming his haven't been answered (i've answered this post too, he just answered to Zetsu's and said it)), Creating a power for his opponent claiming somehow it makes the character who he supports not killable by it (starts here, somehow despite many tries, he stayed with this point for much time starting on it), refusing to add a vote without a reason (giving himself the power to do so), and claiming i'm doing rule-breaking posts without a base.
the threads i noticed it were
Xande vs Mikey
Dazai vs Seven
Ayanokouji vs Jiu Jitae
it's become pretty annoying to discuss with this guy.
the threads i noticed it were
Xande vs Mikey
Dazai vs Seven
Ayanokouji vs Jiu Jitae
it's become pretty annoying to discuss with this guy.
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Before I make this report I would like to contest the descision to ban me, however it likely will not be accepted so I will just be posting this report (I've been making it since before I was reported so no.. It is not a spite report, take it seriously as I have read through 1000s of replies for this. As for CGM'S and staff, multiple have commited multiple falacies especially @Dalesean027 who has committed well over the acceptable ammount of falices and imo commited the worst fallacies on the page, I will be taking them to people who I can trust to not give a biased opinion, @Antvasima is NOT somebody I trust with them and I hope whoever I take it up to isn't influenced by him due to his ignorance regarding staff and calc group members.
Reporting @Zefra3011 for commiting multiple fallacies regarding downgrade threads
1. Burden of proof falacy:
During this thread the burden of proof falacy was on the people who were against the Izana gun calc, however, zefra and multiple others put it on the supporters of the feat
During this thread the burden of proof falacy was on the people who were against the Izana gun calc, however, @Chariot190 switched it on the supporters to give proof behind their claims even though he had given no proof behind the claims that TR is slower then bullets, he was agreed to by everyone even though he had given no proof and even admitted it somewhat here. He stated the burden of proof was on the supporters even though he was on the side that made the debunk thread and even had arguments opposite to what mystic carnage had in the thread but the burden of proof was somehow on carnage and the supporters ?? Although carnage made a claim the same could be said for the people who made a thread of which had no more proof then the supporters as to why they're slower then bullets
3. Half - truth falacy
Here we see Zefra stating "need for some discussions? after a thread of 6 pages and another one of 11 pages??? when like 7 CGMs agree that the calcs are bad?"
This is a half truth, yes CGMS said some calcs are bad but zefra used this statement to debunk the izana gun feat even though there was little to no discussion over it in the previous thread
4. Argument from belief falacy:
Here zefra states "The author doesn't mean them to be faster than a bullet" and people agreed with a falacy somehow, his own beliefs just get accepted as the truth ? Lol
5. Ad Hominem:
Self explanatory
In this thread, we also see Zefra twist the staff to agree with his wording of the feats because staff dislike TR supporters and only trust zefra since he seems to agree with CGMS on most topics the staff all agree with his debunks without seeing the oppositions debunks, some of the supporters were banned from talking in here and some supporters didn't get the chance to comment here leaving the stage clear for zefra to have his own opinions agreed to.
https://vsbattles.com/threads/calc-stacking-in-tokyo-revengers.154723/post-5820691
Here we see zefra twisting the words of CGMS to come to a conclusion quicker
Here we see zefra providing a false point thats contradicted by the after images points to debunk vapourrrrrrs point, again, lying about a point, again, making up points to fit his own narrative, making another false point up to win the debate, Im tired of this and I'm sure there are more falacies commited by this guy, I'm suggesting a long topic ban for him in my opinion
Reporting @NotoriouSoda for making a spite thread, just warrants a warning tbh
Reporting @First_Witch for making fun of other users
Reporting @Deceived3596 for calling other users nerds
Reporting @XxZetsuxX for calling other users clowns and invalidating other peoples debates because they're quote on quote "Biased towards Mikey", calling me biased and his arguments are just filled with the "Argument from incredulity" and "Argument from belief" falacies, calling other users biased for disagreeing
Reporting @Kisaragi_Megumi for calling other users biased with no evidence and contributing to de railing a thread, also saying I was playing the victim card because I told them not to call us biased for arguing for a character ? And then got annoyed implying im soft for telling them to stop ? Said it was my fault for getting annoyed at her calling me biased and then admitted that we were being slandered and implied it was our fault even though we were just arguing for Mikey ? Implying I'm soft again, Again saying I can't take a joke, just being overall disrespecful and not respecting the fact that I don't like being called biased and constantly made fun of from people who I do not know. I'm to triggered for asking them not to namecall and call me biased
Reporting @Zefra3011 for commiting multiple fallacies regarding downgrade threads
1. Burden of proof falacy:
During this thread the burden of proof falacy was on the people who were against the Izana gun calc, however, zefra and multiple others put it on the supporters of the feat
During this thread the burden of proof falacy was on the people who were against the Izana gun calc, however, @Chariot190 switched it on the supporters to give proof behind their claims even though he had given no proof behind the claims that TR is slower then bullets, he was agreed to by everyone even though he had given no proof and even admitted it somewhat here. He stated the burden of proof was on the supporters even though he was on the side that made the debunk thread and even had arguments opposite to what mystic carnage had in the thread but the burden of proof was somehow on carnage and the supporters ?? Although carnage made a claim the same could be said for the people who made a thread of which had no more proof then the supporters as to why they're slower then bullets
3. Half - truth falacy
Here we see Zefra stating "need for some discussions? after a thread of 6 pages and another one of 11 pages??? when like 7 CGMs agree that the calcs are bad?"
This is a half truth, yes CGMS said some calcs are bad but zefra used this statement to debunk the izana gun feat even though there was little to no discussion over it in the previous thread
4. Argument from belief falacy:
Here zefra states "The author doesn't mean them to be faster than a bullet" and people agreed with a falacy somehow, his own beliefs just get accepted as the truth ? Lol
5. Ad Hominem:
Self explanatory
In this thread, we also see Zefra twist the staff to agree with his wording of the feats because staff dislike TR supporters and only trust zefra since he seems to agree with CGMS on most topics the staff all agree with his debunks without seeing the oppositions debunks, some of the supporters were banned from talking in here and some supporters didn't get the chance to comment here leaving the stage clear for zefra to have his own opinions agreed to.
https://vsbattles.com/threads/calc-stacking-in-tokyo-revengers.154723/post-5820691
Here we see zefra twisting the words of CGMS to come to a conclusion quicker
Here we see zefra providing a false point thats contradicted by the after images points to debunk vapourrrrrrs point, again, lying about a point, again, making up points to fit his own narrative, making another false point up to win the debate, Im tired of this and I'm sure there are more falacies commited by this guy, I'm suggesting a long topic ban for him in my opinion
Reporting @NotoriouSoda for making a spite thread, just warrants a warning tbh
Reporting @First_Witch for making fun of other users
Reporting @Deceived3596 for calling other users nerds
Reporting @XxZetsuxX for calling other users clowns and invalidating other peoples debates because they're quote on quote "Biased towards Mikey", calling me biased and his arguments are just filled with the "Argument from incredulity" and "Argument from belief" falacies, calling other users biased for disagreeing
Reporting @Kisaragi_Megumi for calling other users biased with no evidence and contributing to de railing a thread, also saying I was playing the victim card because I told them not to call us biased for arguing for a character ? And then got annoyed implying im soft for telling them to stop ? Said it was my fault for getting annoyed at her calling me biased and then admitted that we were being slandered and implied it was our fault even though we were just arguing for Mikey ? Implying I'm soft again, Again saying I can't take a joke, just being overall disrespecful and not respecting the fact that I don't like being called biased and constantly made fun of from people who I do not know. I'm to triggered for asking them not to namecall and call me biased
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Not even really worth a comment, I've tried damn hard time and time again to work with the verse supporters but most are simply insufferable and will argue to the ends of the earth about the littlest things and have harassed several staff memebers and even fandom staff who aren't even vswiki about tokyo revengers. This little outburst kinda just is your own confirmation that you're vapour and you're just clearly acting out at this point now that the sock account has been caught.
If there weren't those very few people who actually try to do something good for the verse I'd still be advocating for its deletion on the wiki since its one of the most problematic and toxic verses to grace the wiki from users like you who will to no end find you way back here and continously harass people here who disagree with you
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Fallacies are not report-worthy on their own. However, depending on the context, frequently making fallacies can be indicative of report-worthy behaviour - for example, hostilities, stonewalling, and disruptive/inconducive conduct in discussions can be a product of intentional or unintentional fallacies. If someone is being reported for making fallacies, the important question is whether the act is contributing to something that is report-worthy, not whether the fallacy itself was made in the first place.Uh I don't think RVR is for reporting debate fallacies, I think RVR is for reporting toxic/disruptive behavior more or less
Which ties into all this.
Some of the comments you have listed are legitimate concerns. Spite threads like the one made by NotoriouSoda, while not anything severe in isolation, are report-worthy and warrant a warning if done repeatedly. I also do not condone the comments by First_Witch, Deceived3596, and XxZetsuxSX, which only served to needlessly add fuel to the fire that has been Tokyo Revengers threads. None of these are serious offenses, but it would not be appropriate or fair for the staff to condone these comments when very similar comments have led to warnings in past circumstances.
That being said, the majority of this is not anything substantial. I can see that you are upset with these people, but claims about a person being correct/incorrect with particular comments adds nothing to a report on its own, and this is what most of these links amount to - claims that a person said something which was incorrect. Frustrations over disagreements with particular topics of discussion, claims that someone is not being logical, calling someone biased (or claiming they falsely called someone else biased), and other notions of that sort are not bases for a reporting someone else.
I would rather leave this with a few instructional warnings for the aforementioned users and move on.
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I love how the fact that even after you've commited multiple falacies, shown clearly that you are inconsistent and always go for lower numbers regarding Tokyo revengers calculations and made fun of Tokyo revengers supporters blatantly. You are still twisting this misconception that I'm a sockpuppet of vapourrrrr to put down my report.
Most being "insufferable" are a result of them defending themselves from the hate they recieve, I do not know about before but you people seem to want to follow this ideology similar to dictator run countries where if a person does something illegal, the people related to them should also be punished.
You also come to the table saying I've harrased people ?? Let me define that rq "subject to aggressive pressure or intimidation", "make repeated small-scale attacks on (an enemy)"
The only time I have done anything REMOTELY report worthy was when I sent a photo of a character beating another character, this in no form as bad as the shit TR supporters have been subjected to, I've been here for 1 week and I can tell you right now I've been constantly harrased and called names, been called soft, been reported for small scale things ect.
I hate this narrative that you're trying to string where you point to me as the bad guy and to you as the hero who is saving a verse from deletion. If all the toxic users are banned why is it that we are being punished by people like staff ? We have an inability to argue for a calculation without being called harassers.
Then comes the next topic of discussion. Sock Puppets, why is it that I get accused of being a sockpuppet and multiple staff agree to ban me when the only evidence is that I like the same series as someone else ? Completely unacceptable.
Thats fine, but I'm still annoyed at the fact that I'm going to be banned with little to no evidence, I have not been toxic whatsoever and the sockpuppet evidence is literally that I like a series and I said I read through 2000 replies which is apparently so out of this world that I must be a sockpuppet (I literally proved that I did in my report).
The evidence against me is bad and its just unreasonable to act as if I'm a sockpuppet. Stop acting as if TR supporters are the problem when they are the ones being constantly bombarded with hate and disrespect.
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Most of the 'fallacies' pointed out are outright false, blatantly jokes (to the point where the people 'insulted' responded with jokes), or were already acted upon. You know your arguments are stretching the truth when your evidence for a user 'twisting' the words of CGMs literally contains proof that said user might've just misunderstood their intentions (not to mention that Triadz is utterly wrong and Vapourrr was twisting Zefra's words, if anything. But that's besides the point). The only ones who did anything even remotely mean spirited were Zetsux and Soda.
But, at the same time, I'd say something like this on its own is scarcely more report-worthy than what Triadz is accusing people of.
Frankly, this is just deflective time wasting, which is typical of Vapourrr and his socks (especially since it effectively acts as a defence for their past arguments). So, setting that aside, practically everything above the Ad Hominem section were very specific responses to Vapourrr and MysticCarnage from half a year ago. Plus, 'Antvasima is NOT somebody I trust with them' reeks of Vapourrr's unusual love for Ant.
Obvious sock puppet grudge is obvious. And this is coming from someone who defended HollowVanity. But, I won't necessarily say I think that's enough evidence for Triadz to be banned or not.
From what I can see, nobody has given any warnings or anything.
But, at the same time, I'd say something like this on its own is scarcely more report-worthy than what Triadz is accusing people of.
Frankly, this is just deflective time wasting, which is typical of Vapourrr and his socks (especially since it effectively acts as a defence for their past arguments). So, setting that aside, practically everything above the Ad Hominem section were very specific responses to Vapourrr and MysticCarnage from half a year ago. Plus, 'Antvasima is NOT somebody I trust with them' reeks of Vapourrr's unusual love for Ant.
Obvious sock puppet grudge is obvious. And this is coming from someone who defended HollowVanity. But, I won't necessarily say I think that's enough evidence for Triadz to be banned or not.
This is probably worth handling.
From what I can see, nobody has given any warnings or anything.
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bumpReminding again, cuz yeah why not
Rule Violation Reports (New forum)
No problem. 🙏❤️ I do not want us to be overly harsh towards well-intentioned neurodiverse people who have genuine problems understanding and processing social information, as it would likely cause you to feel rejected and like nothing you do is good enough, and that you are unable to properly...vsbattles.com
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How about a two weeks ban combined with a link to one of our instruction threads on their message wall then?
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Also, I have permanently blocked TheDarkTriadz from both our forum and wiki, and think that we should seriously consider the suggestion to permanently delete the Tokyo Revengers verse as a whole from our wiki, and add a new section to our Discussion Rules page regarding that it isn't allowed here anymore, due to that some of its supporters have been relentlessly pestering our calc group members and other staff so much that it detracts too much from their other, usually more important, work.
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We also still need to evaluate this:
vsbattles.com
Rule Violation Reports (New forum)
I think that it is enough to forbid him to post any more versus threads in this forum, as AKM suggested. Thank you for having mercy on me. I am greatly indebted to you.
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A separate thread should be manage to address that verse.
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Yes.
@Dalesean027 @DMUA @Deagonx
Would you be willing to create a discussion thread about that issue in our staff forum?
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About this?
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Hi, I am sorry for bothering you here but i couldn't stay silent about this either. I know another thread might pop up later down the line but i might as well say it here.
I think that instead of deleting the verse, we should freeze it. As in, ban all CRTs in regards to it and ban trying to get calcs for it accepted and finally just straight up lock all the profiles there. There are many verses that are inactive on our wiki and are pretty much frozen despite their series being ongoing, but nobody complains about that, so maybe doing that with this verse would be better as, even though it is only 9-B, it is a pretty big manga/anime, so wiping it out of existence might not be a good option. Additionally we'd be playing into vapourr's hands as he'd end up "winning" in the sense that he'd force us to delete a verse because of him, making it a "If I can't have it, no one can" situation.
If you are heavily against freezing the verse then ig another variant is to give very specific trusted people power over the verse and nobody else so that they can actually keep it updated as long as they break no rules.
If you think my suggestions aren't worth consideration then delete this reply.
noninho
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I agree to this point, but it matters here via being remarked on Discussion Rules page and making discussing extremely annoyingUh I don't think RVR is for reporting debate fallacies, I think RVR is for reporting toxic/disruptive behavior more or less
As it has been recurringly a point that TR as a verse is involved, it surely is fair to put it here
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