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Why are you arguing 3-4 place if he apperently staled Edel in skill though
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Skill Wars: The Skill Awakens
- Thread starter BakiHanma18
- Start date
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That's severely out of context. It wasn't that he was more skilled than edel. It was a hax negged fight which means it was edel pure skill vs zy but zy had things like flight and other non hax abilities allowed.First Witch said:
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ZY has other stuff entirely unrelated to skill, the thread is just focusing on those aspects that's all. That's what actually caused the stalemate.
I would take the simulation as 50/50. He isn't the one pulling it off, but he can process and effectively use all of the information, which is pretty good.
Also, being able to levitate a sword isn't skill, I never said this, what you do with the sword is the actual skillful part. You still need to consciously control the sword, TK or not. Being able to use that amount of swords at once is pretty good on it's own, making skillful attacks with each of them and 20 fighting styles at once too is damn good.
Also, I wasn't saying he can cut concepts. Just that even if it is done with a sword, if the effect is something entirely magical like setting the person on fire or disrupting their magical energy or etc and etc, things that are logically not possible with a sword and can't be quantified, then it is entirely not good.
All in all though, I do agree he has a lot of cool stuff.
I would take the simulation as 50/50. He isn't the one pulling it off, but he can process and effectively use all of the information, which is pretty good.
Also, being able to levitate a sword isn't skill, I never said this, what you do with the sword is the actual skillful part. You still need to consciously control the sword, TK or not. Being able to use that amount of swords at once is pretty good on it's own, making skillful attacks with each of them and 20 fighting styles at once too is damn good.
Also, I wasn't saying he can cut concepts. Just that even if it is done with a sword, if the effect is something entirely magical like setting the person on fire or disrupting their magical energy or etc and etc, things that are logically not possible with a sword and can't be quantified, then it is entirely not good.
All in all though, I do agree he has a lot of cool stuff.
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Tragically the characters don't have profiles on here yet (though I'd love to make them), but the works of China Miéville have some crazy skilled characters, and I'd put Uther Doul easily within top 5
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You could give the feats anyway, it is fun to hear skill stuff.
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I can't believe no one has argued Wonder Woman yet.
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I'm reading the relevant books tomorrow, so I'll get back to you on that.
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Yaaaaaay.
Hmm... I also wish there was some Exalted 3e/2e profile to argue them... even if a lot of their stuff is kinda magical due to the fact they use "essence" to empower their bullshit abilities.
Sigh
@Milly Sadly not many DC people passed over by here it seems.
Hmm... I also wish there was some Exalted 3e/2e profile to argue them... even if a lot of their stuff is kinda magical due to the fact they use "essence" to empower their bullshit abilities.
Sigh
@Milly Sadly not many DC people passed over by here it seems.
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Exalted would be great. If I recall correctly, the Solars have the most absurd Accelerated Development I've seen in fiction, and the Sidereals can do stuff even they struggle with.
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To be specific, every exalted has essence, and channels it in specific ways, in what I call means and themes. The means of the Solar, Dragon-Blooded and Sidereal are abilities, 25 of them that cover the range of things a human can do. The means of Lunars and Alchemical are their innate stats, their physical qualities, social qualities and mental qualities.
The theme for Solars is perfection, pretty much transhumanism. Their stuff is "human, but so much ******* better".
Among things I can remember at higher essence levels... they can sharpen their senses until they can tell someone's mood by smell, notice a drop of tasteless poison by the minimum dilution of the alcohol, read by simply feeling the ink in the pages. Dawns in specific are meant to be experienced in the main combat abilities: Melee, which deals with handling weapons, Brawl, which is ability at fisticuffs that is inborn from pure talent and instinct rather than more practiced, defined martial arts, Archery, for handling anything used at range that isn't a thrown weapon, Throw, for thrown weapons, and War, for engagements of massive scale and all of it's fascets. A 5 in that rating is more or less the epitome of human perfection at it's highest point, the highest humans can reach but Exalted can go higher, and that is the base skill before using essence to enhance themselves.
The cherry on top is that the names are literal, melee is all melee, archery is all non-thrown projectile weapons. Great, short, curved, straight swords, rapiers, knives, axes, clubs, great axes, hammers and maces, poleaxes, scythes, sledge, staffs, tetsubo's, whips, javelines, lances, short spears. An exalt at the pinnacle of human capability is at said pinnacle with all these weapons, and many more for those that fall under Archery, Thrown, and Martial Arts weapons.
And after that are the more specialized abilities called charms.
The theme for Solars is perfection, pretty much transhumanism. Their stuff is "human, but so much ******* better".
Among things I can remember at higher essence levels... they can sharpen their senses until they can tell someone's mood by smell, notice a drop of tasteless poison by the minimum dilution of the alcohol, read by simply feeling the ink in the pages. Dawns in specific are meant to be experienced in the main combat abilities: Melee, which deals with handling weapons, Brawl, which is ability at fisticuffs that is inborn from pure talent and instinct rather than more practiced, defined martial arts, Archery, for handling anything used at range that isn't a thrown weapon, Throw, for thrown weapons, and War, for engagements of massive scale and all of it's fascets. A 5 in that rating is more or less the epitome of human perfection at it's highest point, the highest humans can reach but Exalted can go higher, and that is the base skill before using essence to enhance themselves.
The cherry on top is that the names are literal, melee is all melee, archery is all non-thrown projectile weapons. Great, short, curved, straight swords, rapiers, knives, axes, clubs, great axes, hammers and maces, poleaxes, scythes, sledge, staffs, tetsubo's, whips, javelines, lances, short spears. An exalt at the pinnacle of human capability is at said pinnacle with all these weapons, and many more for those that fall under Archery, Thrown, and Martial Arts weapons.
And after that are the more specialized abilities called charms.
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But what about martial arts?
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... Welp, my massive comment got deleted...
Edit: You know what? **** it. I'll just, try to write it again later. That destroyed my mood.
Edit: You know what? **** it. I'll just, try to write it again later. That destroyed my mood.
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Tip: When writing a long comment, don't forget to copy all of them before sending
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Big brain strat got past me, since am a fair bit tired.
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- Thread starter
- #376
Any new skill bois?
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Not yet, I've been too busy to answer on Fugil vs Hayato and Hayato vs Yujiro is taking forever.
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- Thread starter
- #378
Hayato v Yuji is coming to a close soon, it's looking similar to the outcome between Fugil and Hayato, but that may changeIonliosite said:
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They won't be added to the list since they don't even have a profile (YET), but let me try saying stuff for the Exalted peeps.
Granted, I can only use like... half of their shit because their martial arts get far too supernatural at higher levels.
Granted, I can only use like... half of their shit because their martial arts get far too supernatural at higher levels.
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I'm reading through some material currently, but it's way more of a slog than I thought it was, so it may be a while before I have skill feats to recountBakiHanma18 said:
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No worries, always love to see new inclusions regardless of timeCreaturemaster971 said:
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Huff... So okay, exalted.
One thing to keep in mind is that in Exalted, the epynomous Exalted work on essence. Which is more or less the smallest mystical building block of Creation. Think Taikyoku, but no High 1-A shenanigans. The not mundane stuff consists of them channeling their skill through this, pulling off stuff absurd stuff. If you do not have enough skill though, doesn't matter how much essence you have, you can do shit. Still, just to explain why I am kinda "eh..." about arguing this but whatever.
Martial arts styles are also very individual and based around a theme completely divorced from the type of Exalt, as what type you are normally defines how your techniques look and how they work when channeled through a skill (not only martial skill, we are talking commerce, medicine and other shit).
Martial arts are best understood as something called the Perfected Blossoming Lotus, representing the different levels of mastery as the parts of a blooming lotus. The levels are 4: the Mud of mundane and normal skills, techniques, expertises and experiences that a martial artist uses to reinforce their basic martial skill, the Roots or Terrestial Martial Arts that start treading into absurd shit, but still normal for the most part, the Bulb or Celestial Martial Arts that start becoming downright supernatural but still have more "normal" shit, and the Lotus or Sidereal Martial Arts which... eh... One of the simpler charms gives you very enlongated claws that **** with Fate to better nail hits and deal damage.
- First Pulse Style allows one to react to and try to evade or parry surprise attacks or ambushes no matter how they are done, but only half as well as usual, a pseudo Edelweiss zero acceleration but not quite, attacking moments earlier than they should be able to and so abuse an opponent predicting them, instinctively reacting and either grappling and throwing an enemy away or punching with greater power than their normal AP, attacking in such a way that they slow down the reaction time of their opponent, and crippling someone with such precision they can decide where and to what extent they may cripple someone easily. it also emphasizes flexibility, lack of hesitation, quick thinking and abusing anything that could possibly work in anyway as a weapon.
- Ill Lily Style doesn't have nearly as much, beyond a dodging maneuver special made to overextend the opponent while leaving yourself in a superb position and the ability to wield any long wooden object like crafted club.
- Jade Mountain Style lets you exert such gripping strength, even in a grapple, above your normal limit, easily shift holds or locks to deter any succesful escape from them, tensing their muscles from any point of impact to the muscles in their legs and feat to redirect the kinetic energy of a strike partially or completely (even a strike with a weapon against his skin), or get an opponent in a hold so weary, they may pass out in minutes or less. And by weary, I mean "heavy work from morning to night isn't a big deal" kind of people are left unconscious in that time.
- Night Breeze Style is more assassination based, sorta, with stuff like bending projectiles with breezes to get around cover or shields, using prediction to know how the enemy will react, make them react how you want and destroy their ability to defend with a flowing progression of attacks, and I mean destroy much harder because they can already do this normally, special footwork that spins and weaves such that you can disappear while standing in front of someone, throwing multiple thrown weapons with the same ease and accuracy they'd have with a single one, on top of being thrown exactly in such a way as to terribly compromise the parrying ability of someone that decides to parry with each consecutive projectile parried.
- Orgiastic Fugitive Style is all about abusing vices like drugs and sex, so a souped up Drunken Fist. They can dodge as if they weren't high on however many drugs they may have consumed, quite literally AP amp their attack by channeling the energy and enthusiasm, the joy of their vices, channel their state of intoxication to further bolster their martial skill so the more inebriated the better they get, instantly putting two people into a hold, attempt multiple different actions at once with barely any drop in their skill, dodge so well that the opponent literally sees and feel them being where they are aiming their attacks until after they are left reeling from missing, or use their inebriation to dodge in extremely unorthodox, irregular ways that are near impossible to keep track of.
- Seafaring Hero Style has fun stuff like meditating on the maddening desperation of no wind to move a boat to step and punch in unexpected, hard to follow ways that throw off balance and an opponents coordination for defense if they get hit, clinch or put someone that you swing into while on a rope on a hold, a lock that if successful leaves the target unable to move around except in a direction of the martial artists' choosing for many dozens of seconds, ignore stuff in the environment that should affect their skills, roll like a ship on the water to roll with attacks and drastically reduce their damage, focusing all their strength on one attack that they can either let free or focus even more by gathering their power like a wave gathers size, stronger the longer they don't release it but that becomes less accurate the more they do so, and measured strikes that limits the movement speed of the target.
- White Veil Style can be used to strike the chakras of the body, impairing a person like they were suffering from massive amounts of damage despite suffering no damage, perfectly conceal your intent to attack, easily divert an attack they are making in the middle of making it with such skill that nobody realizes she tried to attack in the first place, speak and behave with such calm even in the middle of battle life-threatening battle that the intentions and moves of the character are predict or follow and delivering attacks that, as long as they dealt no damage, are impossible to perceive even surrounded by people of great senses and perception.
There's more but, I think this is good enough to give an idea, and also damn long.
One thing to keep in mind is that in Exalted, the epynomous Exalted work on essence. Which is more or less the smallest mystical building block of Creation. Think Taikyoku, but no High 1-A shenanigans. The not mundane stuff consists of them channeling their skill through this, pulling off stuff absurd stuff. If you do not have enough skill though, doesn't matter how much essence you have, you can do shit. Still, just to explain why I am kinda "eh..." about arguing this but whatever.
Martial arts styles are also very individual and based around a theme completely divorced from the type of Exalt, as what type you are normally defines how your techniques look and how they work when channeled through a skill (not only martial skill, we are talking commerce, medicine and other shit).
Martial arts are best understood as something called the Perfected Blossoming Lotus, representing the different levels of mastery as the parts of a blooming lotus. The levels are 4: the Mud of mundane and normal skills, techniques, expertises and experiences that a martial artist uses to reinforce their basic martial skill, the Roots or Terrestial Martial Arts that start treading into absurd shit, but still normal for the most part, the Bulb or Celestial Martial Arts that start becoming downright supernatural but still have more "normal" shit, and the Lotus or Sidereal Martial Arts which... eh... One of the simpler charms gives you very enlongated claws that **** with Fate to better nail hits and deal damage.
- First Pulse Style allows one to react to and try to evade or parry surprise attacks or ambushes no matter how they are done, but only half as well as usual, a pseudo Edelweiss zero acceleration but not quite, attacking moments earlier than they should be able to and so abuse an opponent predicting them, instinctively reacting and either grappling and throwing an enemy away or punching with greater power than their normal AP, attacking in such a way that they slow down the reaction time of their opponent, and crippling someone with such precision they can decide where and to what extent they may cripple someone easily. it also emphasizes flexibility, lack of hesitation, quick thinking and abusing anything that could possibly work in anyway as a weapon.
- Ill Lily Style doesn't have nearly as much, beyond a dodging maneuver special made to overextend the opponent while leaving yourself in a superb position and the ability to wield any long wooden object like crafted club.
- Jade Mountain Style lets you exert such gripping strength, even in a grapple, above your normal limit, easily shift holds or locks to deter any succesful escape from them, tensing their muscles from any point of impact to the muscles in their legs and feat to redirect the kinetic energy of a strike partially or completely (even a strike with a weapon against his skin), or get an opponent in a hold so weary, they may pass out in minutes or less. And by weary, I mean "heavy work from morning to night isn't a big deal" kind of people are left unconscious in that time.
- Night Breeze Style is more assassination based, sorta, with stuff like bending projectiles with breezes to get around cover or shields, using prediction to know how the enemy will react, make them react how you want and destroy their ability to defend with a flowing progression of attacks, and I mean destroy much harder because they can already do this normally, special footwork that spins and weaves such that you can disappear while standing in front of someone, throwing multiple thrown weapons with the same ease and accuracy they'd have with a single one, on top of being thrown exactly in such a way as to terribly compromise the parrying ability of someone that decides to parry with each consecutive projectile parried.
- Orgiastic Fugitive Style is all about abusing vices like drugs and sex, so a souped up Drunken Fist. They can dodge as if they weren't high on however many drugs they may have consumed, quite literally AP amp their attack by channeling the energy and enthusiasm, the joy of their vices, channel their state of intoxication to further bolster their martial skill so the more inebriated the better they get, instantly putting two people into a hold, attempt multiple different actions at once with barely any drop in their skill, dodge so well that the opponent literally sees and feel them being where they are aiming their attacks until after they are left reeling from missing, or use their inebriation to dodge in extremely unorthodox, irregular ways that are near impossible to keep track of.
- Seafaring Hero Style has fun stuff like meditating on the maddening desperation of no wind to move a boat to step and punch in unexpected, hard to follow ways that throw off balance and an opponents coordination for defense if they get hit, clinch or put someone that you swing into while on a rope on a hold, a lock that if successful leaves the target unable to move around except in a direction of the martial artists' choosing for many dozens of seconds, ignore stuff in the environment that should affect their skills, roll like a ship on the water to roll with attacks and drastically reduce their damage, focusing all their strength on one attack that they can either let free or focus even more by gathering their power like a wave gathers size, stronger the longer they don't release it but that becomes less accurate the more they do so, and measured strikes that limits the movement speed of the target.
- White Veil Style can be used to strike the chakras of the body, impairing a person like they were suffering from massive amounts of damage despite suffering no damage, perfectly conceal your intent to attack, easily divert an attack they are making in the middle of making it with such skill that nobody realizes she tried to attack in the first place, speak and behave with such calm even in the middle of battle life-threatening battle that the intentions and moves of the character are predict or follow and delivering attacks that, as long as they dealt no damage, are impossible to perceive even surrounded by people of great senses and perception.
There's more but, I think this is good enough to give an idea, and also damn long.
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Sadly nah, since they are more reserved with NPCs unless they are really powerful. It takes time, but it is more expected that the Player Characters are the ones growing muhc faster than everyone else and just getting tons of stuff. The Sidereal are the biggest ones with martial arts stuff, but they mainly use the higher levels that are waaay more like supernatural shit that can't be used here.
In general, even the totality of this skills is kind of a low ball, as Exalted can create many more charms to their liking as long as their Essence and their skill is sufficiently high and they have time, but we can only go with the ones in the book.
In general, even the totality of this skills is kind of a low ball, as Exalted can create many more charms to their liking as long as their Essence and their skill is sufficiently high and they have time, but we can only go with the ones in the book.
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That's a plan for the future. Is just... Ugh, so much stuff.
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The Unconquered Sun could potentially scale to each of these, right? Or the Sidereals as a whole?
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Sidereals kinda should as they have access to the higher martial arts and they are outright just better than anyone else at martial art stuff. Their shit is almost only magical but they are canonically better in pure martial arts.
Solars, though, are above everyone else because their shit is perfection. So all normal skills that have nothing to do with Martial Arts, and potentially even martial arts if they get a proper teacher.
The Unconquered Sun should be above in pure martial skill even if he can't do, or rather isn't interested, in the martial arts charms themselves. His powers are more about being a nigh-perfect, nearly unstoppable force of nature that is impossible to deter.
The sisters of fate though, mainly Mars, have an ability that is more or less jacking up their mundane skill until they are the most skilled thing in the setting several times over. Like, 5 in a combat skill is the pinnacle of human perfection. They can reach 20 in all of them.
Solars, though, are above everyone else because their shit is perfection. So all normal skills that have nothing to do with Martial Arts, and potentially even martial arts if they get a proper teacher.
The Unconquered Sun should be above in pure martial skill even if he can't do, or rather isn't interested, in the martial arts charms themselves. His powers are more about being a nigh-perfect, nearly unstoppable force of nature that is impossible to deter.
The sisters of fate though, mainly Mars, have an ability that is more or less jacking up their mundane skill until they are the most skilled thing in the setting several times over. Like, 5 in a combat skill is the pinnacle of human perfection. They can reach 20 in all of them.
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I feel like I recall reading somewhere that when channeling a specific virtue (Valor, I think?), the Unconquered Sun becomes several times more skilled than anything else in the vicinity. Not sure if that would include the Sisters, but it's something
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They kinda have stuff like that. Exalted and other Gods in general can channel virtues (UCS has the biggest ones because he's literally the God of Virtue as well), pretty much pulling off an action way way better than they normally could.
That's also most charms, just doing things way more skillfully, sometimes in absurd ways. Solars have a charm that literally make their senses automatically focus and be aware of danger, as long as he should be able catch that danger with his senses but didn't initially for some reason.
That's also most charms, just doing things way more skillfully, sometimes in absurd ways. Solars have a charm that literally make their senses automatically focus and be aware of danger, as long as he should be able catch that danger with his senses but didn't initially for some reason.
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Kenobi was a lot more skilled than Vader in terms of combat strategy and tactics though. Vader never really finds a way to overcome superior force. Honestly in a stats equalized fight Kenobi or Dooku would've had a better chance against Palpatine than Yoda did. They have less technical skill but in terms of fighting people on their level Kenobi and Dooku honestly have better feats than Luke. Only person Luke fought after Palpatine (who has much the same problem I'm getting at. The only people he fought on his level were Luke, Yoda and Windu) who was actually stronger than him was Abeloth and arguably Sarasu Taalon.Creaturemaster971 said:
Anyway, I'm going to nomiate Zero (Mega Man Zero) as the most skilled in his verse. Dude fought a armies of robots powerful enough to hurt him for a year straight. That's also a stamina feat, granted, but he wasn't being repaired at any time so he went into each fight as good or bad as he was before. At the start of the series he's also implied to be weaker than he was in MMX (although around MMZ3 or so he's much stronger), being referred to as an outdated piece of junk but still taking everything in his way apart since even if is weaker he can still damage the people he's fighting. This is different from Geo, Hub or some of the other main characters of the series, who are actually stronger than most people they fought. He's also probably the best character in the series at copying techniques, as many of the one's he copies don't actually have limits on how much he can use them, like X or Rock do.
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Also Vader didn't toy with Kenobi at all. They were more or less evenly matched in a fight. Vader won more because of stamina than skill
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- Thread starter
- #394
Sorry, been distracted recently. Anyone I need to add or shift around?
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Nearly finished with the stuff for Uther Doul
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I think Zero should be added. He has the feat above, a wide variety of skills with weapons and h2h, only lost one fight because he was weaker than Vile at the time, and possibly in X2 against X himself (although he wasn't really beaten as much as "sense knocked into you", since he could still keep fighting). He also has roughly a century of constant battle experienceBakiHanma18 said:
Also remove Luke and replace him with Yoda. He only really beat Palpatine in a duel because he was more powerful at the time with the force (although he was comparable in skill). Palpatine was equal or a little stronger than Yoda and Yoda disarmed him in ROTS
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- Thread starter
- #398
^Does everyone agree with this?
Also, where should Zero go?
Also, where should Zero go?
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I have no idea since I know not everyone here. Future Warrior and Garou shouldn't be above Eldrad however.
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- #400
Well, I suppose you could make your case on why Eldrad is higher than those 2 and we can figure out Zero in comparison to Eldrad or othersBruceTheBatman said:
