MorrisHatesYou
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This is an extremely important CRT and I don't want this thread to devolve like the previous threads, so I kindly request everyone to be calm and sensible so we can have proper conversation.
I find it very unfortunate how half of the things I'm gonna post here are something I've always said which got ignored just because of the verse's reputation, but it is what it is, I'm hoping we'd be heard this time.
1) Dark Impulses Mikey should have fear inducement back.
This is simple, the ability is removed in this thread, but due to bad justification, the actual justification is not addressed there so he should have it back. The ability got accepted by Mr.Duedate here.
2) Fixing the scaling chain.
The scaling chain right now is really bad, everyone got scaled to Subsonic+ even though both the Subsonic+ scales are done by top 2 of the verses, Izana and Mikey.
Only Izana and Mikey should scale to any speed feat done by them.
This is how the scaling chain goes:
Mikey=Izana> South> Kakucho> Takemichi (final arc)> Senju > Angry> Taiju>= Mucho> Wakasa=Benkei> Inui=Koko> Draken> Hanma> Osanai> Mid tiers (Chifuyu, Baji, Ryusei, Kazutora, Mitsuya, Hakkai, Peh Yan, Pah Chin, Smiley, Ran, Rindou, Sanzu, Mochi> Low tiers (Takemichi [before final arc], Kisaki, Akkun, Makoto, Takuya, Yamagishi, Shion, Kojiro).
Reasoning:
Mikey's position is self explanatory.
Izana was able to dominate Mikey in Tenjiku fight even when Mikey was going all out.
South is 3rd because he defeated characters like Kakucho and Senju, and only lost to Mikey, the reason why Izana is higher because South got defeated with low difficulty by Mikey, while Mikey had much harder time against Izana.
Mucho defeated Inui with low difficulty, Wakasa and Benkei defeated Inui and Koko with high difficulty. So this makes Mucho scale above Wakasa and Benkei.
The reason why Inui and Koko scales higher than Draken is because Wakasa fought Base South a lot better than Draken did, and Inui and Koko are only slightly weaker than Wakasa and Benkei.
Draken scales above Hanma because he defeated Hanma, however it is with a high difficulty.
Osanai defeated Pah Chin, who's a mid tier, with a low difficulty, so by default, Osanai scales above all mid tiers.
Scaling Taiju is a bit hard, but we can know that he defeated Inui with low difficulty, same as Mucho.
Angry scales above Taiju because Taiju had problem fighting against Wakasa and Benkei although he defeated them, while Angry was capable of defeating Mucho with a low difficulty, who should be A LOT stronger than Wakasa or Benkei. But we don't really know how Mucho would deal with both of them. So Taiju and Mucho would be pretty relative, but it doesn't hurt to place Taiju higher than Mucho since he has better narrative.
Kakucho scales above Angry because he defeated Angry with low difficulty.
Takemichi in the final arc is relative to Kakucho, but I placed Kakucho higher since he was much more physically active during Tenjiku arc than in final arc.
The hardest part is deciding where Senju scales since only her notable serious fight is against South.
We'd have to use Kakucho as a base for the scaling of Senju.
Kakucho in the final arc was supposed to get KO'D by Takemichi (since Takemichi's full power was revealed), but then after Mikey mentioned about Izana, Kakucho got back his fighting spirit and he went comparable to Takemichi.
So we have two different versions of Kakucho, the one without fighting spirit who was depressed because of Izana's death and the one with fighting spirit, the difference between these two Kakucho(s) is very high since like I said, the Kakucho with fighting spirit can (who was comparable to Takemichi) can KO Kakucho without fighting spirit in a single hit.
The Kakucho without the fighting spirit is already absurdly strong, because in the flashbacks he was able to push South to his dark urges, and when Senju knocked south down, South said that it's been a while since he's that fired up, he should be directly referencing the fight he had with Kakucho since he tend to recruit the stronger members to his gang, here he recruited the S-62 generation and Kakucho.
Also when the legendary duo got upper hand against South, South looked down on them, but when Kakucho was knocked out by Mikey, he was very surprised.
South with urges has three different versions, the first one is when he was against the legendary duo, the second is stronger and it is when he fought Senju, the third one is the strongest, and that was against Mikey.
The South Kakucho fought is in between the first and second version, with second version being closer.
So based on this, Kakucho with fighting spirit can KO the Kakucho who is near South second urge version and Senju. So Kakucho with fighting spirit will scale above Senju.
So, only Izana and Mikey should scale to feats done by them.
South, Kakucho, Takemichi, Senju and Angry should be in the same vaccum.
Taiju and Mucho should scale similarly.
Wakasa, Benkei, Inui and Koko should also scale to one another.
Same with Draken and Hanma.
Osanai should be above mid tiers, but lower than Draken and Hanma.
All mid tiers should scale to one another.
Low tiers are characters who can get KO'D by mid tiers with a single strike, their scaling is not that consistent, they're just slightly stronger than average delinquents.
3) Clarifying Izana's gun feat.
This is the entire feat.
I find this really funny how this feat got removed, someone tried to remove the Izana's feat in this thread which was dedicated to remove other feats. The guy was rather clueless about the context of Izana body's moving on its own being related to the feat itself, so I brought up that and addressed that Izana's body moved in reaction to the gun being fired, the guy then randomly said that Izana's reaction was Kisaki's saying "Die", I told him why he was wrong, he never did address any of my points and randomly said that this feat is not for the thread even though he brought it up. And he then said the same thing he said before in this thread without being able to debunk any of the things I've brought up before, and then sadly, it was automatically agreed upon by Therefir without any of the genuine supporters being able to voice their opinions.
I'll just say what I've said before to rebunk the feat. This got ignored like 4 times, so I'll say it here.
The first Gunshot was shown EXCLUSIVELY on Kisaki's panel, meaning the gun was shot first, Izana's movement was only depicted right after that. But some people (mainly fans of characters/verses whom Mikey/Tokyo Revengers is compared to) aren't satisfied with that, I'll give a deeper explanation.
So, Izana's movement when he saved Kakucho was involuntary, as he mentioned his body moved on its own. The narrative in the chapter's conclusion also supports this notion. This leads us to consider two potential triggers, the gunshot or Kisaki's statement "Die."
Izana reacting to Kisaki saying "Die" blatantly defies storytelling principles. In stories, it's customary to depict a character's reaction immediately after the triggering event to emphasize the cause-and-effect relationship. In this case, Izana only appears in the third panel. What's more, the panel between Kisaki's saying "Die" and Izana saving Kakucho has crucial moment which is a gun being fired. Delaying the character's appearance while showing significant events like a gunshot can create confusion and disrupt the narrative's cause-and-effect flow, now this suggest that Izana indeed didn't react to Kisaki's words. To put it simply, the first gunshot was tied exclusively to Kisaki's panel and Izana was shown right at the next panel, which means Izana reacted to the gunshot.
I'm gonna add another thing, we can know that the guy with the gun was entirely and absolutely blitzed since he didn't see Izana running towards saving Kakucho, so if Izana was reacting to the "Die" it means he will already be there before Kisaki started shooting.
This drawing exists.
Izana had a lot of motion lines on him.
If you're asking what value this holds, if Izana's movement truly was done even before the 2nd panel even starts then it's unnecessary to draw a lot motion lines on him. Motion lines are meant to show ongoing action within a single moment, so if the action is already completed, they can create confusion. This shows that the action is happening in that panel itself. Like bro, if there are 3 panels, and the action of a character is done even before 2nd panel even starts, it's unnecessary to draw a lot of motion lines in the 3rd one, it just goes against how events in mangas are written. If Izana truly was already there before the gun even get shot, there will be no motion lines on him as his movement will already be completed.
4) Addressing Chifuyu's feat
This calculation, and following this thread specifically, I gave up on that thread since our side can't really win, most users in that thread are just instinctively against that feat even though they can't really prove the thing they even claim, I also find it funny how no admins or thread mods reject the thread but got closed, DDM agreed with the upgrade, but not the multiplier, but it still got closed.
The maths and method for this got accepted in the previous thread, but it's denied and deemed an outlier due to breaking this rule, the rule basically states that when two characters are comparable and a calculation results in the other characters being a lot faster, then the feat is an outlier. But that's not the case since the characters are falsely claimed to be comparable to one another.
So, I'll have to explain why Chifuyu and Kojiro has big speed difference.
Baji and Ryusei and comparable and Chifuyu and Ryusei are comparable, so based on this we can establish that they're all comparable to one another.
The feat got rejected based on this where Chifuyu said that Kojiro is fast.
There's one thing I want to point out here, when someone is perceived weak by default, and they suddenly surpass those perceived expectations, it's a typical reaction for others to be surprised by what they do even if they're not necessarily stronger or as strong as them, or even as fast as them.
I'll give an example from the show itself, Takemichi was considered really weak in the entirety of Tokyo Revengers, but in the final arc his true power was revealed, he was able to punch and fly Kakucho some meters away, it surprises everyone including Mikey, this is the final arc where Mikey didn't show much emotions until this moment. Although Mikey is still MASSIVELY SUPERIOR to Takemichi, he was surprised by it. This is what Mikey can actually do to Takemichi.
Here, Kojiro had to use an electronic device to render Chifuyu unconscious and tie him up, and on top of that he's really short and skinny, so by default, Chifuyu is gonna consider him weak.
To prove that there is a big speed difference between them, shortly after Chifuyu called Kojiro fast, Kojiro was unable to hit Baji whom Chifuyu is comparable to, even though Baji was off guard, this speaks volume about their difference in speed.
And here Kojiro got one-shot by Ryusei, the guy comparable to Chifuyu. Here, when Ryusei's arm movement was already completed, Kojiro's arm either didn't really move, or it moved really little. This proves a big speed difference.
Additionally, the calculation I made also can be used to prove that the speed difference is big.
So, Kojiro is NOT comparable to Ryusei, Chifuyu or Baji, so the feat is legitimate.
5) Debunking the notion that Tokyo Revengers characters' speed should be below bullets.
I'm gonna divide this into 2 parts, the 1st will be debunking the claims for the particular feats, and the 2nd being why you can't just limit them.
Part 1:
The claim is this, "Senju a top tier character can't do anything to save Draken from getting shot by a gun"
This version of Senju is not in the scaling vacuum, she has no feats of fighting anyone.
Basically, that thing happens in chapter 220 and 221. These are the scans of chapter 229, here Senju claimed that she avoided her potential because it could lead Takeomi to the wrong path.
Therefore, the claim that the characters of the verse should be below guns is invalid, since Senju at the time doesn't scale anywhere.
Another claim is this, "Kakucho one of the fastest character in the verse can't do anything against a gun and had to be saved by Izana"
If we were to accept that this scene limits Kakucho, we'll also have to accept that Kakucho has below average human speed and he scales below Kisaki since Kakucho was only around 4-7m away there (depending on panel used) and Kisaki had time to watch him running towards him, say "Die" and pull the trigger.
Yes, this is pure PIS, Kakucho is capable of outspeeding characters who are capable of blizting Kisaki, but here Kakucho had to run at below average human speed.
Unless we wanna accept that Kakucho scales below Kisaki, this is PIS.
Also I wanna add two things,
1) The goons that carried the gun with them only targeted Takemichi when Senju was away from him, they only came out after Senju got away from Takemichi.
2) Kisaki had to drug chifuyu and tie him up even when he had a gun.
This strongly implies that even when they have a gun, they don't really have the guts to take on certain characters.
Part 2:
Now let's pretend (keyword: pretend) that everything I just said above is incorrect (which is obviously not true), you still can't limit them using "bullet speed>" argument, I'll explain why.
In Tokyo Revengers, how dangerous weapons with instant lethality are exaggerated, much to the point that it overrides the other elements of said weapons. I'll explain how.
Here, Angry one-shot Mucho, we can see that the speed and power gap is huge. Mucho then pulled up a knife, here it overwhelms Angry even though Angry is a lot faster, and even Takemichi who just witnessed their different in strength. The situation got too bad to the point Kakucho had to interfere in it.
Here Kakucho fought against Sanzu in the final arc but Sanzu was suddenly on par with him and Kakucho lost despite him being massively faster than Sanzu. Their difference in power is like this:
Kakucho defeated Angry, Angry defeated Mucho with low difficulty, Mucho defeated Inui with low difficulty, Wakasa and Benkei defeated Inui and Koko with high difficulty, Wakasa fought Base south a lot better than Draken did, so Inui > Draken either mid-high difficulty. Draken can defeat Hanma with high difficulty, Hanma fought on par with Mikey in the beginning of the series.
Mikey can defeat higher end of mid tier characters like Baji and Pah Chin with low difficulty since they were kids.
Characters like Baji are equal to characters like Mitsuya, Mitsuya defeated Ran with mid-high difficulty, Ran and Sanzu are comparable.
When long sharp objects like Katana or other swords are considered dangerous, the main problem usually lies in the fact that that can kill instantly, and the other problems being the range and the skill of the wielder.
Ran had baton when he was against Mitsuya (who's a mid tier too), but still lost, and he too had baton against Sanzu and Sanzu was using metal pipe, they fought on par, metal pipe and Katana are around the same length, so the range isn't the problem here, skills only starts to matter when the speed of the character is good, especially in this case since it's a fictional work where stats different are much more severe, here Sanzu is still nowhere near Kakucho when it comes to speed.
Here, Takemichi was about to be killed by Sanzu and he had to be saved by Taiju. This Takemichi is directly relative to Kakucho. So even though Takemichi is far superior, he still was about to lose.
When characters are being overwhelmed by guns the default assumption is that it is due to the fact that they can kill instantly and has speed that can't really be reacted, so it's the damage and the speed that's the problem by default.
But what I just wrote proves that in this verse, weapons with instant lethality overwhelms characters even if the said characters are far faster than them.
While that doesn't automatically say that the characters are faster than guns, it does neutralize the default assumption that the speed is the problem.
So in this case, if anyone thinks speed is the problem, the burden of proof falls on them to prove it.
Yeah that's it.
I find it very unfortunate how half of the things I'm gonna post here are something I've always said which got ignored just because of the verse's reputation, but it is what it is, I'm hoping we'd be heard this time.
1) Dark Impulses Mikey should have fear inducement back.
This is simple, the ability is removed in this thread, but due to bad justification, the actual justification is not addressed there so he should have it back. The ability got accepted by Mr.Duedate here.
2) Fixing the scaling chain.
The scaling chain right now is really bad, everyone got scaled to Subsonic+ even though both the Subsonic+ scales are done by top 2 of the verses, Izana and Mikey.
Only Izana and Mikey should scale to any speed feat done by them.
This is how the scaling chain goes:
Mikey=Izana> South> Kakucho> Takemichi (final arc)> Senju > Angry> Taiju>= Mucho> Wakasa=Benkei> Inui=Koko> Draken> Hanma> Osanai> Mid tiers (Chifuyu, Baji, Ryusei, Kazutora, Mitsuya, Hakkai, Peh Yan, Pah Chin, Smiley, Ran, Rindou, Sanzu, Mochi> Low tiers (Takemichi [before final arc], Kisaki, Akkun, Makoto, Takuya, Yamagishi, Shion, Kojiro).
Reasoning:
Mikey's position is self explanatory.
Izana was able to dominate Mikey in Tenjiku fight even when Mikey was going all out.
South is 3rd because he defeated characters like Kakucho and Senju, and only lost to Mikey, the reason why Izana is higher because South got defeated with low difficulty by Mikey, while Mikey had much harder time against Izana.
Mucho defeated Inui with low difficulty, Wakasa and Benkei defeated Inui and Koko with high difficulty. So this makes Mucho scale above Wakasa and Benkei.
The reason why Inui and Koko scales higher than Draken is because Wakasa fought Base South a lot better than Draken did, and Inui and Koko are only slightly weaker than Wakasa and Benkei.
Draken scales above Hanma because he defeated Hanma, however it is with a high difficulty.
Osanai defeated Pah Chin, who's a mid tier, with a low difficulty, so by default, Osanai scales above all mid tiers.
Scaling Taiju is a bit hard, but we can know that he defeated Inui with low difficulty, same as Mucho.
Angry scales above Taiju because Taiju had problem fighting against Wakasa and Benkei although he defeated them, while Angry was capable of defeating Mucho with a low difficulty, who should be A LOT stronger than Wakasa or Benkei. But we don't really know how Mucho would deal with both of them. So Taiju and Mucho would be pretty relative, but it doesn't hurt to place Taiju higher than Mucho since he has better narrative.
Kakucho scales above Angry because he defeated Angry with low difficulty.
Takemichi in the final arc is relative to Kakucho, but I placed Kakucho higher since he was much more physically active during Tenjiku arc than in final arc.
The hardest part is deciding where Senju scales since only her notable serious fight is against South.
We'd have to use Kakucho as a base for the scaling of Senju.
Kakucho in the final arc was supposed to get KO'D by Takemichi (since Takemichi's full power was revealed), but then after Mikey mentioned about Izana, Kakucho got back his fighting spirit and he went comparable to Takemichi.
So we have two different versions of Kakucho, the one without fighting spirit who was depressed because of Izana's death and the one with fighting spirit, the difference between these two Kakucho(s) is very high since like I said, the Kakucho with fighting spirit can (who was comparable to Takemichi) can KO Kakucho without fighting spirit in a single hit.
The Kakucho without the fighting spirit is already absurdly strong, because in the flashbacks he was able to push South to his dark urges, and when Senju knocked south down, South said that it's been a while since he's that fired up, he should be directly referencing the fight he had with Kakucho since he tend to recruit the stronger members to his gang, here he recruited the S-62 generation and Kakucho.
Also when the legendary duo got upper hand against South, South looked down on them, but when Kakucho was knocked out by Mikey, he was very surprised.
South with urges has three different versions, the first one is when he was against the legendary duo, the second is stronger and it is when he fought Senju, the third one is the strongest, and that was against Mikey.
The South Kakucho fought is in between the first and second version, with second version being closer.
So based on this, Kakucho with fighting spirit can KO the Kakucho who is near South second urge version and Senju. So Kakucho with fighting spirit will scale above Senju.
So, only Izana and Mikey should scale to feats done by them.
South, Kakucho, Takemichi, Senju and Angry should be in the same vaccum.
Taiju and Mucho should scale similarly.
Wakasa, Benkei, Inui and Koko should also scale to one another.
Same with Draken and Hanma.
Osanai should be above mid tiers, but lower than Draken and Hanma.
All mid tiers should scale to one another.
Low tiers are characters who can get KO'D by mid tiers with a single strike, their scaling is not that consistent, they're just slightly stronger than average delinquents.
3) Clarifying Izana's gun feat.
This is the entire feat.
I find this really funny how this feat got removed, someone tried to remove the Izana's feat in this thread which was dedicated to remove other feats. The guy was rather clueless about the context of Izana body's moving on its own being related to the feat itself, so I brought up that and addressed that Izana's body moved in reaction to the gun being fired, the guy then randomly said that Izana's reaction was Kisaki's saying "Die", I told him why he was wrong, he never did address any of my points and randomly said that this feat is not for the thread even though he brought it up. And he then said the same thing he said before in this thread without being able to debunk any of the things I've brought up before, and then sadly, it was automatically agreed upon by Therefir without any of the genuine supporters being able to voice their opinions.
I'll just say what I've said before to rebunk the feat. This got ignored like 4 times, so I'll say it here.
The first Gunshot was shown EXCLUSIVELY on Kisaki's panel, meaning the gun was shot first, Izana's movement was only depicted right after that. But some people (mainly fans of characters/verses whom Mikey/Tokyo Revengers is compared to) aren't satisfied with that, I'll give a deeper explanation.
So, Izana's movement when he saved Kakucho was involuntary, as he mentioned his body moved on its own. The narrative in the chapter's conclusion also supports this notion. This leads us to consider two potential triggers, the gunshot or Kisaki's statement "Die."
Izana reacting to Kisaki saying "Die" blatantly defies storytelling principles. In stories, it's customary to depict a character's reaction immediately after the triggering event to emphasize the cause-and-effect relationship. In this case, Izana only appears in the third panel. What's more, the panel between Kisaki's saying "Die" and Izana saving Kakucho has crucial moment which is a gun being fired. Delaying the character's appearance while showing significant events like a gunshot can create confusion and disrupt the narrative's cause-and-effect flow, now this suggest that Izana indeed didn't react to Kisaki's words. To put it simply, the first gunshot was tied exclusively to Kisaki's panel and Izana was shown right at the next panel, which means Izana reacted to the gunshot.
I'm gonna add another thing, we can know that the guy with the gun was entirely and absolutely blitzed since he didn't see Izana running towards saving Kakucho, so if Izana was reacting to the "Die" it means he will already be there before Kisaki started shooting.
This drawing exists.
Izana had a lot of motion lines on him.
If you're asking what value this holds, if Izana's movement truly was done even before the 2nd panel even starts then it's unnecessary to draw a lot motion lines on him. Motion lines are meant to show ongoing action within a single moment, so if the action is already completed, they can create confusion. This shows that the action is happening in that panel itself. Like bro, if there are 3 panels, and the action of a character is done even before 2nd panel even starts, it's unnecessary to draw a lot of motion lines in the 3rd one, it just goes against how events in mangas are written. If Izana truly was already there before the gun even get shot, there will be no motion lines on him as his movement will already be completed.
4) Addressing Chifuyu's feat
This calculation, and following this thread specifically, I gave up on that thread since our side can't really win, most users in that thread are just instinctively against that feat even though they can't really prove the thing they even claim, I also find it funny how no admins or thread mods reject the thread but got closed, DDM agreed with the upgrade, but not the multiplier, but it still got closed.
The maths and method for this got accepted in the previous thread, but it's denied and deemed an outlier due to breaking this rule, the rule basically states that when two characters are comparable and a calculation results in the other characters being a lot faster, then the feat is an outlier. But that's not the case since the characters are falsely claimed to be comparable to one another.
So, I'll have to explain why Chifuyu and Kojiro has big speed difference.
Baji and Ryusei and comparable and Chifuyu and Ryusei are comparable, so based on this we can establish that they're all comparable to one another.
The feat got rejected based on this where Chifuyu said that Kojiro is fast.
There's one thing I want to point out here, when someone is perceived weak by default, and they suddenly surpass those perceived expectations, it's a typical reaction for others to be surprised by what they do even if they're not necessarily stronger or as strong as them, or even as fast as them.
I'll give an example from the show itself, Takemichi was considered really weak in the entirety of Tokyo Revengers, but in the final arc his true power was revealed, he was able to punch and fly Kakucho some meters away, it surprises everyone including Mikey, this is the final arc where Mikey didn't show much emotions until this moment. Although Mikey is still MASSIVELY SUPERIOR to Takemichi, he was surprised by it. This is what Mikey can actually do to Takemichi.
Here, Kojiro had to use an electronic device to render Chifuyu unconscious and tie him up, and on top of that he's really short and skinny, so by default, Chifuyu is gonna consider him weak.
To prove that there is a big speed difference between them, shortly after Chifuyu called Kojiro fast, Kojiro was unable to hit Baji whom Chifuyu is comparable to, even though Baji was off guard, this speaks volume about their difference in speed.
And here Kojiro got one-shot by Ryusei, the guy comparable to Chifuyu. Here, when Ryusei's arm movement was already completed, Kojiro's arm either didn't really move, or it moved really little. This proves a big speed difference.
Additionally, the calculation I made also can be used to prove that the speed difference is big.
So, Kojiro is NOT comparable to Ryusei, Chifuyu or Baji, so the feat is legitimate.
5) Debunking the notion that Tokyo Revengers characters' speed should be below bullets.
I'm gonna divide this into 2 parts, the 1st will be debunking the claims for the particular feats, and the 2nd being why you can't just limit them.
Part 1:
The claim is this, "Senju a top tier character can't do anything to save Draken from getting shot by a gun"
This version of Senju is not in the scaling vacuum, she has no feats of fighting anyone.
Basically, that thing happens in chapter 220 and 221. These are the scans of chapter 229, here Senju claimed that she avoided her potential because it could lead Takeomi to the wrong path.
Therefore, the claim that the characters of the verse should be below guns is invalid, since Senju at the time doesn't scale anywhere.
Another claim is this, "Kakucho one of the fastest character in the verse can't do anything against a gun and had to be saved by Izana"
If we were to accept that this scene limits Kakucho, we'll also have to accept that Kakucho has below average human speed and he scales below Kisaki since Kakucho was only around 4-7m away there (depending on panel used) and Kisaki had time to watch him running towards him, say "Die" and pull the trigger.
Yes, this is pure PIS, Kakucho is capable of outspeeding characters who are capable of blizting Kisaki, but here Kakucho had to run at below average human speed.
Unless we wanna accept that Kakucho scales below Kisaki, this is PIS.
Also I wanna add two things,
1) The goons that carried the gun with them only targeted Takemichi when Senju was away from him, they only came out after Senju got away from Takemichi.
2) Kisaki had to drug chifuyu and tie him up even when he had a gun.
This strongly implies that even when they have a gun, they don't really have the guts to take on certain characters.
Part 2:
Now let's pretend (keyword: pretend) that everything I just said above is incorrect (which is obviously not true), you still can't limit them using "bullet speed>" argument, I'll explain why.
In Tokyo Revengers, how dangerous weapons with instant lethality are exaggerated, much to the point that it overrides the other elements of said weapons. I'll explain how.
Here, Angry one-shot Mucho, we can see that the speed and power gap is huge. Mucho then pulled up a knife, here it overwhelms Angry even though Angry is a lot faster, and even Takemichi who just witnessed their different in strength. The situation got too bad to the point Kakucho had to interfere in it.
Here Kakucho fought against Sanzu in the final arc but Sanzu was suddenly on par with him and Kakucho lost despite him being massively faster than Sanzu. Their difference in power is like this:
Kakucho defeated Angry, Angry defeated Mucho with low difficulty, Mucho defeated Inui with low difficulty, Wakasa and Benkei defeated Inui and Koko with high difficulty, Wakasa fought Base south a lot better than Draken did, so Inui > Draken either mid-high difficulty. Draken can defeat Hanma with high difficulty, Hanma fought on par with Mikey in the beginning of the series.
Mikey can defeat higher end of mid tier characters like Baji and Pah Chin with low difficulty since they were kids.
Characters like Baji are equal to characters like Mitsuya, Mitsuya defeated Ran with mid-high difficulty, Ran and Sanzu are comparable.
When long sharp objects like Katana or other swords are considered dangerous, the main problem usually lies in the fact that that can kill instantly, and the other problems being the range and the skill of the wielder.
Ran had baton when he was against Mitsuya (who's a mid tier too), but still lost, and he too had baton against Sanzu and Sanzu was using metal pipe, they fought on par, metal pipe and Katana are around the same length, so the range isn't the problem here, skills only starts to matter when the speed of the character is good, especially in this case since it's a fictional work where stats different are much more severe, here Sanzu is still nowhere near Kakucho when it comes to speed.
Here, Takemichi was about to be killed by Sanzu and he had to be saved by Taiju. This Takemichi is directly relative to Kakucho. So even though Takemichi is far superior, he still was about to lose.
When characters are being overwhelmed by guns the default assumption is that it is due to the fact that they can kill instantly and has speed that can't really be reacted, so it's the damage and the speed that's the problem by default.
But what I just wrote proves that in this verse, weapons with instant lethality overwhelms characters even if the said characters are far faster than them.
While that doesn't automatically say that the characters are faster than guns, it does neutralize the default assumption that the speed is the problem.
So in this case, if anyone thinks speed is the problem, the burden of proof falls on them to prove it.
Yeah that's it.
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