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Justice for Tokyo Revengers.

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Zefra3011 said:
Base Senju
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Base Senju shouldn't scale anywhere as she isn't comparable to anyone. We already went over this.
Zefra3011 said:
Sanzu with a katana downscaling from them.
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We already explained why Sanzu with a katana shouldn't be comparable to Kakucho. I feel like tou're ignoring our past arguments.
Zefra3011 said:
Kojiro
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We just got more proof on why Kojiro is absolutely not comparable to mid tiers.

Kojiro recently fought and defeated 10 delinquents with high-extreme diff in the recent chapter. This seems like a good feat till you realize that Shion (a low tier) defeated 7 no names without difficulty. Kojiro also states that he doesn't want to directly fight aganist Baji again after learning about his strength. All of these suggest that Kojiro is comparable to Below Captain lvl characters.

Also, I don't understand how Taiju and Angry are Captain lvl. Angry no diffed all Tenjiku captains and Taiju easily dealt with Hakkai and Mitsuya who are captain lvl.

I agree with anything else (until someone changes my opinion) but Izana should be a god tier imo as he was faster than Base Mikey.
 
MorrisHatesYou said:
You know what? Dark Impulses doesn't make Mikey stronger, should I create a new thread for this? Or should I dismantle the statistics amplification on dark impulses right here and now?
It's already accepted, so should I create a new thread for it or just argue here?
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Is the only thing you have against my version / I missed ?

Anyway I suggest to do it here, explain why you think that and I'll reply.
 
Dinozxd said:
Base Senju shouldn't scale anywhere as she isn't comparable to anyone. We already went over this.
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She at bare minimum should upscale from Captains since she can beat 100 guys, captains don't have feats on pair with that as far as I remember.
Dinozxd said:
I feel like tou're ignoring our past arguments.
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I'm not, if you think it it's fine.
Dinozxd said:
Kojiro recently fought and defeated 10 delinquents with high-extreme diff in the recent chapter. This seems like a good feat till you realize that Shion (a low tier) defeated 7 no names without difficulty. Kojiro also states that he doesn't want to directly fight aganist Baji again after learning about his strength. All of these suggest that Kojiro is comparable to Below Captain lvl characters.
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he downscales from them, they can't do as they please against him, the difference shouldn't even be 2 times.
Dinozxd said:
Also, I don't understand how Taiju and Angry are Captain lvl. Angry no diffed all Tenjiku captains and Taiju easily dealt with Hakkai and Mitsuya who are captain lvl.
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Both of them upscale from captains feat but they aren't definitely on pair with the guys above imo.
Dinozxd said:
I agree with anything else (until someone changes my opinion) but Izana should be a god tier imo as he was faster than Base Mikey.
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Izana is more less comparable with base Mikey in fact he is god tier, he just doesn't scale to DI Mikey.
 
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MorrisHatesYou said:
You know what? Dark Impulses doesn't make Mikey stronger, should I create a new thread for this? Or should I dismantle the statistics amplification on dark impulses right here and now?
It's already accepted, so should I create a new thread for it or just argue here?
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While I personally liked the idea of Dark Impulse not being a statistical amplifier and something related to accelerated development. I now thing Dark Impulse is actually the kind which I had disagreed upon. Both AD and Stat Amp is a supernatural thing and is not normally seen in humans or in any animal commonly, for that case.

Dark impulse is actually a supernatural ability, and it will make sense if it actually does something supernatural. Mikey himself knows that his dark impulses can get out of control, and he can go berserk.

Also, Mikey asked Kisaki to instigate darkness in him, which might imply that Mikey, despite knowing how dangerous his darkness is, it is a thing which makes him stronger.
 
Zefra3011 said:
Is the only thing you have against my version / I missed ?

Anyway I suggest to do it here, explain why you think that and I'll reply.
Click to expand...

There’s no solid evidence that DI is a stat amp. It’s just Mikey with murderous intent. This lets him never hold back, which he often does in Base unless stated otherwise.
 
Zefra3011 said:
She at bare minimum should upscale from Captains since she can beat 100 guys, captains don't have feats on pair with that as far as I remember.
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Already presented, that's Senju after she reached her True Potential.

Zefra3011 said:
he downscales from them, they can't do as they please against him, the difference shouldn't even be 2 times.
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No way. You seriously don't think a guy who could hardly beat 10 no names is comparable to a guy who beat 40 no names with no difficulty (character book) right? Baji also easily defeated him (no diff at best) and forced Kojiro to use weapons aganist him. He was only pushing Baji back with a baseball bat because of; 1. Range advantage. 2. Even no name goons could break Baji's arm with a baseball hit so he had to be careful.

The scan i sent is more than enough to prove that Kojiro is nowhere near mid tiers.
Zefra3011 said:
Both of them upscale from captains feat but they aren't definitely on pair with the guys above imo.
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Angry is debatable but Taiju for sure should scale imo.
Arnoldstone18 said:
There’s no solid evidence that DI is a stat amp. It’s just Mikey with murderous intent. This lets him never hold back, which he often does in Base unless stated otherwise.
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I think his fights vs Hanma is undeniable proof that DI is a stat amp.
 
Syncornize said:
Mikey currently on the profile possesses amp stats in Dark Impulses. His strength and speed are significantly higher in DI. (evidence that against kazutora was in DI and therefore also against Hanma)
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@Arnoldstone18

I wrote something about this.analyzing the dynamics and also using common sense Mikey has no reason to limit himself in these fights.

Against Kazutora, despite the terrible balance, he succeeded in a feat that in several minutes of combat he did not perform at all. When Mikey is in DI, no one but South and Take can take more than one hit, let alone react to it.

your "limits" point isn't stated or presented in evidence in the work anywhere. (asked to provide evidence) Mikey tries to hold onto his DI, a scan was sent where Takemichi states that Mikey has gotten faster. His stats increase
 
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MorrisHatesYou said:
Didn't have the energy to reply at the moment.

The kick to Taiju being faster than the Kick to hanma is a proof that dark impulses doesn't boost his stats, his stats just grows faster in relation to other characters.
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Even the otherwise can satisfy that, and like much better. Mikey's darkness is always increasing.
 
RoggerReggor said:
Pretty sure Mikey was supposed to end that fight pretty much before as Draken was on the verge of death at the moment.
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He already told Takemichi to take care of it. He trusted him while he dealth with the conflict. DI was just to show how fed up Mikey was and didn’t even want to entertain Hanma.
 
Arnoldstone18 said:
He already told Takemichi to take care of it. He trusted him while he dealth with the conflict. DI was just to show how fed up Mikey was and didn’t even want to entertain Hanma.
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Mikey does look tense here though. Secondly, even if you have entrusted your bud's life to someone, it doesn't make sense for Mikey to not get out of that situation .
 
I mean Mikey was extremely anxious and worried about Draken's life and it wouldn't make sense in first place that just because he trusted him to Takemichi he hold back, Hanma was a problem and didn't let Mikey go while Mikey was extremely worried and his goal was to reach them as soon as possible.

Also about the Taiju kick, no it wasn't faster as the only thing that actually disappeared (I wouldn't even take the word as it is) is Taiju and Take saw him and no one was surprised about the speed while you are claiming is astronomically faster, regardless, considering you said this is a Dark Impulses South without any statment but just since he appears like that I don't see any reason why this (before the Taiju kick) Mikey isn't in Dark Impulses too which would make the kick only scale to DI Mikey and the "it's faster" only proves my point.
 
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Arnoldstone18 said:
You mean when Mikey became serious as ***** as opposed to their first fight when Mikey didn’t seem like he was trying his hardest?
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your premise and your point have no correlation. There is no claim that Miikey are holding back, other than the fact that the dynamic itself makes this point nosense.


Just because Mikey isn't tired doesn't mean he's holding back. your point ignores that:
  1. the fight was stopped at a stalemate
  2. these 2 characters have high stamina. PGs like Mikey can defeat entire gangs without tiring. To get tired, these characters have to fight for very long periods
  3. Draken was in danger
  4. Hanma was able to block one of his kicks (which had never happened up to that point) and his blows damaged him. Mikey has no reason to play

having heavy breathing and going at full power aren't necessarily related. to get tired, stamina must be pushed to the limit and this did not happen.

(I don't remember ever seeing Mikey tired in the entire series)

Hanma compliments mikey on his stamina, he's not implying that he's holding back.
 
Based on new evidence provided we need more clear proof izana is = to mikey since its proven mikey wasn't 100% in that fight based on him: fighting draken before hand and his sister dying in his arms. With multiple statements about how he shouldnt be able to even stand. Izana also prepped for Mikey before hand and was knocked out with a single kick, while Izana hit him a number of times and mikey never went unconscious. Mikey also was in base, when Draken said "Mikey was going all out" he is referring to that particular moment, keep in mind Izana has no damage at the beginning of the fight and mikey is already bruised up from when Mikey was hit repeatedly by Draken before the fight. Draken has never heard of Mikey's Dark Impulse either to see Mikey go all out to say he is equal. Remember Takemichi told Mikey to release his full dark impulse, which is the first time he released everything. Mikey wasn't fighting Izana for the sake of proving he stronger, while Izana was and still lost the fight, which he admitted. Izana was just was physically inferior which is why his limbs got tired even though he hit Mikey far more.
 
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DekuGlazer said:
Based on new evidence provided we need more clear proof izana is = to mikey since its proven mikey wasn't 100% in that fight based on him: fighting draken before hand and his sister dying in his arms. With multiple statements about how he shouldnt be able to even stand. Izana also prepped for Mikey before hand and was knocked out with a single kick, while Izana hit him a number of times and mikey never went unconscious. Mikey also was in base, when Draken said "Mikey was going all out" he is referring to that particular moment, keep in mind Izana has no damage at the beginning of the fight and mikey is already bruised up from when Mikey was hit repeatedly by Draken before the fight. Draken has never heard of Mikey's Dark Impulse either to see Mikey go all out to say he is equal. Remember Takemichi told Mikey to release his full dark impulse, which is the first time he released everything. Mikey wasn't fighting Izana for the sake of proving he stronger, while Izana was and still lost the fight, which he admitted. Izana was just was physically inferior which is why his limbs got tired even though he hit Mikey far more.
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God Tiers:
Based on my Mikey comment this would also narratively make Izana weaker than South and Foresight Takemichi and relative to Senju and Taiju. Senju is the only person besides Mikey to knock South to the ground when she stopped hiding her true strength, even Draken couldnt knock South to the ground and Kakucho was no diffed by Base South, while Senju knocked Dark Impulse South to the ground. Taiju easily beat the Greatest Duo who have shown relativity to Base South with Benkei being able to send him flying with punches and Wakasa overpowering South with his speed, agility and kicks.

High Tiers:
Kakucho is not stronger than Takemichi with foresight and hasn't shown comparability to anyone listed above at their peak. He scales relative to Draken, Hanma, Wakasa/Benkei, and Sanzu with a katana as shown in the 3 deites arc he is able to send Benkei flying , but was caught off guard by Wakasa. Sanzu also killed Kakucho, Mucho and cut down Taiju.

Angry Kawata and Mucho should not be this high as they were both one shot by Kakucho in Tenjiku arc

Inui or Koko don't have any feats above Draken to say they are stronger, and Inui was temporarily knocked out by Yuzuha and mid-high diffed Chifuyu. Koko and Inupi were both beaten and kidnapped by Mucho and Mucho is narratively weaker than Draken if he can be one shot by Kakucho. Draken went toe to toe with base South.

Osanai I agree with. He should be the lowest High tier along with Baji and Pah-Chin's durability who could tank multiple Osanai punches as well as 3 attacks from DI Mikey.


Mid Tiers:
Baji is far stronger than Chifuyu and his underlings. Chifuyu couldnt restrain him during Valhalla arc and Baji wasnt even trying his hardest. Baji is also the savior for them in the spinoff he can one shot people that they struggle with. Kazutora is also narratively equal to Baji.

Base Takemichi is the strongest mid tier as he fought brought Taiju Shiba to his knees after Mitsuya who fought Taiju at 70% could not. Peh-Yan is the next strongest mid tier as he has statements that he is stronger than Mitsuya. Inupi and Koko fall in line with this tier of characters. Chifuyu is relative to Mochii. as well Smiley who has fought Mochi several times in the past, Mitsuya, Kazutora, Ryusei, Kojiro, Hakkai, Ran, Rindou, and Mochi. Since the Haitani brothers ambushed and beat Smiley and Mitsuya then were later beat by mitsuya and hakkai, they should all be comparable to each other

The low tiers:
Overall I agree here.

Updated Chain should be

DI Mikey > Base Mikey > DI South > Foresight Takemichi > Izana => Senju > Taiju > Sanzu with Katana(killed Kakucho)> Wakasa = Kakucho = Benkei = Draken => Hanma > Angry Kawata > Mucho > Osanai > Pah Chin(dura) > Baji => Kazutora > Base Takemichi > Koko = Inupi > Peh Yan > Mitsuya > Hakkai > Ran Haitani = Rindou Hatani > Chifuyu > Mochi > Smiley > Ryusei = Kojiro = Kojima

Low tier stays the same
 
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There are 2 versions, mine and Morris one, we should decide which one is better, there are some difference which I explained n the summary, someone should decide which one is better.
 
Dalesean027 said:
Not sure exactly we should be doing here, I suppose this can be closed if they figured out thier scaling chain but outside of that the only thing accepted so far has been fear manip and if ALL the supporters are in agreeance with the current chain then its fine
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I agree with fear manip but alot of context was left out of the scaling chain part but i added it to the thread for viewing
 
I don't have idea which one you are trying to correct, regardless, I disagree, I explained the scaling chian above.
 
Zefra3011 said:
I don't have idea which one you are trying to correct, regardless, I disagree, I explained the scaling chian above.
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you disagree with no context? Yeah thats logical. Everyone has to agree with one and multiple people do not agree with yours. So it has to be adjusted. Since you disagree with my updated attempt. Its only right to point out the flaws I have in my list.
 
@Antvasima it seems they don't actually have things sorted here but fear manip can be applied, the scaling chain may have to be its own new thread as to not clog this one up further
 
Dalesean027 said:
@Antvasima it seems they don't actually have things sorted here but fear manip can be applied, the scaling chain may have to be its own new thread as to not clog this one up further
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I was going to discuss it here but a new thread is better, I'll apply the fear inducement via social influence if it's fine then and I'll make a new thread for the scaling chain.
 
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