Sanji Fights Another Supernova

[DaMonkeMan]

Queen took a strike to the head from that nerfed big Mom and wasn't noticeably damaged. There's also the attacks he took from Marco.

Kid took a alot of big hits from Big Mom but he also still took a regular strike to the head from Big Mom and was still damaged.

I just don't think the difference is as massive as some are making it out to be.

Wasn't that a Life Amped, pissed Big Mom though?

 

[Eminiteable]

Wasn't that a Life Amped, pissed Big Mom though?

If you're referring to the regular strike it was from regular big mom on the rooftop on chapter 1009.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

If you're referring to the regular strike it was from regular big mom on the rooftop on chapter 1009.

Oh I thought you meant her punching him in the face.

 

[Eseseso]

If you're referring to the regular strike it was from regular big mom on the rooftop on chapter 1009.

You mean the Tenjin? He and the others were fine. He and the others also likely took hits from Kaido and Big Mom off-screen between 1003 and 1008, considering that by 1008 they had far more bruises than in 1003.

When Hawkins caused him to be in so much pain that he literally couldn't stand, Big Mom jumped up and slammed an inertia-boosted Mama Raid into his back, and yet Kidd seemed perfectly fine and more focused on Hawkins hurting him.

 

[Eminiteable]

Oh I thought you meant her punching him in the face.

For Kid, yeah that's what I meant.

 

[Eminiteable]

You mean the Tenjin? He and the others were fine. He and the others also likely took hits from Kaido and Big Mom off-screen between 1003 and 1008, considering that by 1008 they had far more bruises than in 1003.

I'm talking about when he got punched in the face and was bleeding.

Cool, but we have no context for these hits so giving them priority over hits we do see happen on screen is kinda

 

[Eseseso]

I'm talking about when he got punched in the face and was bleeding.

Eh, he barely bleed from that, and like 5-10 seconds later sent BM into the sea and got up no issue.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Didn't she punch him twice?

 

[Eminiteable]

Eh, he barely bleed from that, and like 5-10 seconds later sent BM into the sea and got up no issue.

He's bleeding a decent amount from a punch, durability is measured by the damage done by the attack not the person's ability to endure or how quickly they recover from damage dealt to them.

I'm just making a point that despite Kid's ability to take and survive even stronger attacks from Mom he's clearly taking significant damage even from her weakest hits.

 

[Eseseso]

He's bleeding a decent amount from a punch, durability is measured by the damage done by the attack not the person's ability to endure or how quickly they recover from damage dealt to them.

I'm just making a point that despite Kid's ability to take and survive even stronger attacks from Mom he's clearly taking significant damage even from her weakest hits.

He still kept fighting her on and off screen for a very long time, taking many hits far tougher than what hurt Sanji, and lasted arguably longer.

 

[Kachon123]

He still kept fighting her on and off screen for a very long time, taking many hits far tougher than what hurt Sanji, and lasted arguably longer.

Don't compare the two's staminas. Sanji clears.

Sanji's Stamina


Sanji ran nonstop for several months, possibly years, being pursued by the Okamas, giving him barely any time to eat or rest. While undergoing these conditions, Sanji was able to not only survive, but he was able to beat 100 Okama Kenpo Masters with each of them being as strong, if not stronger than him.


Sanji could take having his organs completely crushed under pressure and get up, still being able to combo and defeat Kuroobi. Directly after, he fought Arlong) and got destroyed, but was still able to get up to save Luffy from drowning.

Sanji could take having a hole punched through his shoulder, get up right after, break a couple bones and beat Bon Clay. While having broken bones, he was still able to run around the Kingdom or Alabasta.

Sanji could take having internal damage shockwaves to his brain, get up right after, get internal damage shockwaves sent to his chest, take a giant explosion, and get up right after.

Sanji could take having five large spikes driven into him, hit into them again, slammed down into the ground, get up again, destroy the Groggy Brothers

Sanji took getting nailed in the face by Kaku while being off guard and got up right after just to get hit with Rankyaku while being off guard again. He got up right after.

Sanji took torturous beatdown by Kalifa, had a bathtub dropped on him, got up to fight Jabra, took an amped Don Po Ro, took 5 Rankyakurs to the face and got up afterwarads, got stabbed in 5 different spots in his torso, and fought off marines while in this state

Sanji took getting wailed on by Absalom, stabbed through his heart area, immediately recovered and KOd Absalom. While having a hole in his chest, he got smacked around by Oars, got up, got hit with a point-blank Gum Gum Gattling from Oars, got up, had his head burned off, fractured his leg, took Ursus Shock, got up.

Sanji had his body blown up, had his Fibula cracked, and kept fighting.

Sanji took Doffy's Pentachromatic Strings, and instantly got back up

Sanji got slammed to the ground, kicked to the face and sent flying, got shafted (lol)

And then his Onigashima stuff


Sanji took having all of his bones broken + having his organs destroyed beyond repair, and said it "stings a bit"

 

[Eseseso]

Kidd's stamina is incredible.

In Udon, the constant labor and abuse and seastone did not stop him from easily carrying dozens of heavy seastone blocks on a daily basis (even running with them daily), and he seemed to quickly recover from Queen's water-boarding torture.

He was slashed by Apoo, ate a Heavenly Bonbon, fought the Yonko off-screen alongside the Supernovas and took hits off-screen, took a punch from Big Mom and recovered in like 5 seconds, took a Fulgora and was fine, fought BM off-screen for like 10 minutes with no real injury, fought her alongside Law when she was using Hao Infusion, took a beatdown from Bigger Mom and got up after like 60 seconds ready to go, and only collapsed due to using 2 of his strongest attacks.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

I love how almost none of that addresses the fact that Kidd can just throw him to a wall and crush his head or use Damned Punk.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

fought her alongside Law when she was using Hao Infusion, took a beatdown from Bigger Mom and got up after like 60 seconds ready to go, and only collapsed due to using 2 of his strongest attacks.

If this is in reference to her beating the shit out of him and Law then trying to go up to the roof, I think they specifically waited for her to fly up to catch her off guard.

 

[Kachon123]

Kidd's stamina is incredible.

In Udon, the constant labor and abuse and seastone did not stop him from easily carrying dozens of heavy seastone blocks on a daily basis (even running with them daily), and he seemed to quickly recover from Queen's water-boarding torture.

He was slashed by Apoo, ate a Heavenly Bonbon, fought the Yonko off-screen alongside the Supernovas and took hits off-screen, took a punch from Big Mom and recovered in like 5 seconds, took a Fulgora and was fine, fought BM off-screen for like 10 minutes with no real injury, fought her alongside Law when she was using Hao Infusion, took a beatdown from Bigger Mom and got up after like 60 seconds ready to go, and only collapsed due to using 2 of his strongest attacks.

I'm sorry but neither of these are comparable to what I posted above. Like at all.

 

[Kachon123]

Anyways, the vote count is currently 4-2 in Sanji's favor.

.

Are you ready to vote?

 

[DaMonkeMan]

in Sanji's favor.

Um, what?

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Um, what?

sanjis wincon for this fight is his massive speed advantage

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Oh brother.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

Oh brother.

kidds attack speed relatively in verse is slow as ****, if he lands an attack its ggs, but the keyword is if

 

[Eseseso]

Anyways, the vote count is currently 4-2 in Sanji's favor.


Are you ready to vote?

No, @CiscoTheSoto and @That_moron also voted for Kidd.

@KochengPutih seems to favor Kidd but I'm not sure if he actually voted yet.

 

[Eseseso]

kidds attack speed relatively in verse is slow as ****, if he lands an attack its ggs, but the keyword is if

He fought the Yonko, who are among the fastest in the verse.

His speed is fine.

 

[XDragnoir]

( Almost all of this is a fallacy btw, Sanji isn't blitz levels faster as Kidd and others were reacting to Kaidou and BM's attacks and his flames aren't much higher than the ones Kidd has taken before )

Kaido's fastest attack is Thunder Bagua and even Luffy couldn't properly dodge it, but everything else in his kit? A casual Zoro could block a kaifu, Sanji has the same speed as a fully recovered post-rooftop Zoro before the Exoskeleton even amped him.

His super speed then is literally much faster than what we have seen Kid reacting.

And yes, Sanji's flames are higher than the ones Kid has blocked (he wasn't even fully unaffected by Prometheus).

Imagine trying to mock AP scaling when it's clear that someone taking multiple hits from X who is stronger than Y and can keep going after said hits means they can endure hits from Y even better.

Bro, you're again mixing durability with stamina and i didn't mock AP scaling, wtf?

Y'all some goons trying to mock others for their takes when you're spreading blatant lies just because you're Sanji fans.

What?

Okay, say where I lied.

Even if he was notably burnt by Prometheus, again he still can take a few of those flames and keep going despite that.

We all know that, no one claimed he will get one shot by Sanji at all, but he will be burnt time and time again, be it by DJ or even more from Ifrit.

Also I'd like for you both to stop wanking DJ and IJ because Sanji couldn't even melt Queen's metal arm.

That's a feat for Queen's arm, not an anti feat for Sanji, Luffy could casually melt gold and Akainu vaporized a sword without even directly touching it, both feats scale below Ifrit's heat.

He also had to kick Queen several times to even knock him out with IJ, and it's self explanatory why this wasn't that impressive if you consider all the stuff he took before it.

That goes into the AP topic which we all agree Kid has the advantage, but don't forget the hits Kid will take here are even stronger than those ones, as Sanji isn't running dangerously low on energy here.

And stop acting like Kidd can't defend it against his hits. Even if we have no Haki feats from him, we know he can block with his metal structures and put them back together after they're split.

No one is saying he can't defend? He can, but the likeability of doing so against someone who has equal, if not better, Kenbu and who is faster isn't that high, even more when you consider that Kid's fighting style doesn't focus as much in his defense as he could in theory do, he leaves quite a few open spots that Sanji could and would abuse.

 

[BasedNecoScaler69]

He fought the Yonko, who are among the fastest in the verse.

His speed is fine.

The problem is sanji perception blitzed queen in his base form, with an unknown multiplier with diable and ifrit jambe.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Sanji has the same speed as a fully recovered post-rooftop Zoro before the Exoskeleton even amped him.

His super speed then is literally much faster than what we have seen Kid reacting.

And yes, Sanji's flames are higher than the ones Kid has blocked (he wasn't even fully unaffected by Prometheus).

You're slowly losing credibility with stuff like this honestly.

That's a feat for Queen's arm, not an anti feat for Sanji, Luffy could casually melt gold and Akainu vaporized a sword without even directly touching it, both feats scale below Ifrit's heat.

Wtf? It's not a feat for Queen's arm, Sanji's heat is just ass.
You're so damn boring and goofy with your arguments, it's a slog to argue with you.

 

[XDragnoir]

I love how almost none of that addresses the fact that Kidd can just throw him to a wall and crush his head or use Damned Punk.

What? He couldn't crush even Apoo's head when using a surprise attack and bloodlusted, now you're saying he will crush the head of the guy who took the attack of a commander while off guard without haki and without any injury?

You're slowly losing credibility with stuff like this honestly.

You never even had credibility here to begin with.

Wtf? It's not a feat for Queen's arm, Sanji's heat is just ass.
You're so damn boring and goofy with your arguments, it's a slog to argue with you.

Oh, my arguments are bad? The guy using ad hominem just said that to me?

 

[DaMonkeMan]

What? He couldn't crush even Apoo's head when using a surprise attack and bloodlusted, now you're saying he will crush the head of the guy who took the attack of a commander while off guard without haki and without any injury?

He can just immobilize him and ram him.

You never even had credibility here to begin with.

Oh, my arguments are bad? The guy using ad hominem just said that to me?

Get over it.

 

[XDragnoir]

Sanji FRA

Other than that i am out of this thread.

I hate you, Kachon.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Sanji FRA

Other than that i am out of this thread.

I hate you, Kachon.

Just kiss already, sheesh..

 

[Kachon123]

Just kiss already

 

[SnookB]

Kid is clunky as ****, he might genuinely not touch Sanji once.
And every hit that matters would focus on breaking and crushing, which Sanji has shown to be regenerative against. To be honest I don't see Kid even tagging him ONCE if we're being realistic, but let's say that's a wincon- Sanji would still regenerate.
Kid's got the LS advantage and AP.
Sanji has speed, dura neg, high temperatures, EVEN MORE SPEED, Kenbun, and is a smaller target than Big Mom so charging at him with a mf bull isn't gonna end well. He can stack dozens of hits in quick succession and might actually hurt Kid more via heating up his metal.

Voting Sanji

 

[DaMonkeMan]

and is a smaller target than Big Mom so charging at him with a mf bull isn't gonna end well.

He can just immobilize him and ram him.

Also can Sanji regenerate from getting a metal horn stuck in his brain?

 

[SnookB]

Also can Sanji regenerate from getting a metal horn stuck in his brain?

You can fit like fifty Sanji's in the space between that bull's horns.. I doubt he's getting gored. And again, this is assuming Kid even has the time to put assign on him. Every 'scaling' feat he has is done via Law distract Big Mom, Sanji's probably blitzing him to hell and back

 

[DaMonkeMan]

You can fit like fifty Sanji's in the space between that bull's horns.. I doubt he's getting gored. And again, this is assuming Kid even has the time to put assign on him. Every 'scaling' feat he has is done via Law distract Big Mom, Sanji's probably blitzing him to hell and back

Well, Assign was one of his few attacks where BM was paying attention but couldn't do anything to stop him.
So yeah I think he can just use Assign then either charge Damned Punk after throwing some beams on him to keep him busy, or slam him with a metal bull.
Either way it's gonna hurt bad.

 

[SnookB]

Well, Assign was one of his few attacks where BM was paying attention but couldn't do anything to stop him.

It requires a hand gesture. And again, she's the size of a building at that point so pointing at her is FAR easier than pointing at Sanji.
I'm not saying it wouldn't work, but it's a one in one hundred. Sanji's just got a far higher chance of cooking him before he gets one one of his attacks that matter in... and even if he does, regen might just undo it.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

It requires a hand gesture. And again, she's the size of a building at that point so pointing at her is FAR easier than pointing at Sanji.
I'm not saying it wouldn't work, but it's a one in one hundred. Sanji's just got a far higher chance of cooking him before he gets one one of his attacks that matter in... and even if he does, regen might just undo it.

Doesn't DP put a hole on him though?
If Kidd DOES manage to get him stuck and use one of his finishers Sanji is screwed.

 

[SnookB]

Doesn't DP put a hole on him though?

DP might, yeah. Far, far more likely than Corna Dio since the latter didn't gore a much bigger target.

If Kidd DOES manage to get him stuck and use one of his finishers Sanji is screwed.

Yes- but that's too big a if for it to be a clear wincon tbh. Although Sanji might regenerate from that too now that I think about it since Germa regeneration includes repairing muscle and skin tissue- Probably organs too in Sanji's case since the Queen crush might've straight up flattened those and he still recovered, but that's still more crushing than piercing.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

DP might, yeah. Far, far more likely than Corna Dio since the latter didn't gore a much bigger target.

Yes- but that's too big a if for it to be a clear wincon tbh. Although Sanji might regenerate from that too now that I think about it since Germa regeneration includes repairing muscle and skin tissue- Probably organs too in Sanji's case since the Queen crush might've straight up flattened those and he still recovered, but that's still more crushing than piercing.

He didn't look TOTALLY flat after Queen did that, I suspect his organs may have just gotten ruptured a little and his skeleton was what really got broken up.

 

[SnookB]

He didn't look TOTALLY flat after Queen did that,

Didn't he? It might be how the art style made it look, but his leg/torso looked more flat
That and his rib is sticking out entirely to the side, his organs gotta be beyond obliterated. Plus Queen says that technique ruptures organs, so-- it's not an unsafe assumption

 

[Eseseso]

I will admit Kidd's crushing won't do shit to Sanji courtesy of his exoskeleton regen.

But Kidd assigning Bigger Mom before she could even react (it was the 22nd time he tried using Punk Corna Dio) is an impressive speed feat. He literally jumped, zapped her, and zapped the wall before she even react.

And nothing outside of Ifrit Jambe is doing any notable damage to Kidd.