Worst Fanfictions Ever (New Forum)

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

@Grand_Saver_Ritsuka Dude, I honestly feel the same whenever someone even had anything of JJK and Demon Slayer in any verse that actually would just solo them otherwise.

Seen JJK in HSDXD and an "OC" of Demon Slayer (I saw that as it's just mainly the MC with the name and appearance one of the DS chars) used for HI3rd.

Any verse can be strong ish in their way, I won't deny that. It's just there's verses that are stronger than others, and ones that are even more stronger than those stronger ones...

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

@Grand_Saver_Ritsuka Dude, I honestly feel the same whenever someone even had anything of JJK and Demon Slayer in any verse that actually would just solo them otherwise.

Seen JJK in HSDXD and an "OC" of Demon Slayer (I saw that as it's just mainly the MC with the name and appearance one of the DS chars) used for HI3rd.

Any verse can be strong ish in their way, I won't deny that. It's just there's verses that are stronger than others, and ones that are even more stronger than those stronger ones...

Btw now that i saw the shitshow going on in honkai impact
I realize
Maybe i was too harsh on symphogear
the characters actually are quite likable
Genjuro is chad best dad

 

[Grand_Saver_Ritsuka]

@Grand_Saver_Ritsuka Dude, I honestly feel the same whenever someone even had anything of JJK and Demon Slayer in any verse that actually would just solo them otherwise.

Seen JJK in HSDXD and an "OC" of Demon Slayer (I saw that as it's just mainly the MC with the name and appearance one of the DS chars) used for HI3rd.

Any verse can be strong ish in their way, I won't deny that. It's just there's verses that are stronger than others, and ones that are even more stronger than those stronger ones...

It's worse in vertigo
EVERYTHING that happens is directly due to the presence. It is referring thomism, which is modified from aristriolism which states that everything that happens is due to god. So the moment Ainz would try any BS the presence would not want, he is gonna get yeeted out of reality

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Btw now that i saw the shitshow going on in honkai impact
I realize
Maybe i was too harsh on symphogear
the characters actually are quite likable
Genjuro is chad best dad

Genjuro is so chad, he'd SOLO all of the big bads if he had a Symphogear or anything at all to fight them with owo

 

[TegamiBachi25]

The next generation absolutely matters outside of Boruto. If you've caught up on TBV, there's another person from his class who's pretty good. And it's dumb imo to complain about "forced torch passing," but also complain when old-gen characters get stronger in a series about how working hard and having friends is the most important thing if you want to get stronger.

Agree to disagree. Boruto and sarada’s dream is in the dumpster. Hardly either of them even care about their dream anymore. Sarada goal of becoming hokage doesn’t mean anything because she’s so fixated on Boruto. Boruto wants to find his own shinobi path but instead got changed into now finding Kawaki or dealing with code. The writing in the series is so abysmal it’s hard to even take seriously. Like Boruto mastering flying raijin even though he’s a rogue shinobi? Where the hell did he even learn it from and why didn’t Naruto learn it. Boruto feels like some OC out of a fanfiction work, the worst kind, and that’s why i think the series is fanfiction.

 

[SlendVeny]

Like Boruto mastering flying raijin even though he’s a rogue shinobi? Where the hell did he even learn it from and why didn’t Naruto learn it.

He learned it from Koji, who stole a scroll with a bunch of Jutsu earlier and also probably has some of Jiraiya's memories, even if he doesn't have the same personality. Naruto didn't learn it because he barely ever learns any new Jutsu that don't involve cloning, spinning, or punching. The reason Naruto never learned it is because the Third Hokage never helped him, because he's a bitch.

 

[SlendVeny]

What are some crossovers from very different series that would actually be really good?

I'm thinking LOZ: Majora's Mask and One Piece.

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

It's worse in vertigo
EVERYTHING that happens is directly due to the presence. It is referring thomism, which is modified from aristriolism which states that everything that happens is due to god. So the moment Ainz would try any BS the presence would not want, he is gonna get yeeted out of reality

Just wait until Ainz enter Xianxia in a fanfic lol.

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

What are some crossovers from very different series that would actually be really good?

I'm thinking LOZ: Majora's Mask and One Piece.

Any Xianxia meet with with Japanese Fantasy Fiction.

 

[Ease_of_peas]

Agree to disagree. Boruto and sarada’s dream is in the dumpster. Hardly either of them even care about their dream anymore. Sarada goal of becoming hokage doesn’t mean anything because she’s so fixated on Boruto. Boruto wants to find his own shinobi path but instead got changed into now finding Kawaki or dealing with code. The writing in the series is so abysmal it’s hard to even take seriously. Like Boruto mastering flying raijin even though he’s a rogue shinobi? Where the hell did he even learn it from and why didn’t Naruto learn it. Boruto feels like some OC out of a fanfiction work, the worst kind, and that’s why i think the series is fanfiction.

Wait, he mastered ftg? I'm so glad I bailed ages ago. What a shitshow.

 

[SlendVeny]

Wait, he mastered ftg? I'm so glad I bailed ages ago. What a shitshow.

He didn't master it. He was able to use it, but he explicitly says he's not as good as Minato.

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

All SI's or just OC's (Not as bad as SI's but most of the time still bad) inserts, and they are even worse when they get stupidly over power, with a harem. And most of the time the plot, and everything is mid at best. But properly the worst thing is how most do crossovers, with complete OOC characters, and pretending they act like canon.... I could go on and on, what is wrong with SI inserts.....

 

[SlendVeny]

All SI's or just OC's inserts, and they are even worse when they get stupidly over power, with a harem. And most of the time the plot, and everything is mid at best. But properly the worst thing is how most do crossovers, with complete OOC characters, and pretending they act like canon.... I could go on and on, what is wrong with SI inserts.....

Self-insert characters are only fun in one context, and that's when a story is written by multiple people. I suppose it would also be good if you had to roll a dice to see if your character was able to do things.

Yes, I am just describing a TTRPG.

 

[TegamiBachi25]

He didn't master it. He was able to use it, but he explicitly says he's not as good as Minato.

That still a terrible plot hole because Boruto is a rogue shinobi and the only ones who know the FTG are the fourth hokage guards established in the manga and we haven’t seen them since the fourth war. Either one, they’re dead and killed during the war. Or two, they lived long enough past the fourth war but brainwashed like the rest of the world. Neither of which makes sense as to how Boruto can learn it. If they pull some Boruto stealing the scroll to learn it then it just proves how idiotic Konoha and how their security is absolutely dogshit. Konoha lasted long against the Konoha invasion of sand and sound and against pain. But we got to make everyone else look incompetent and drag other characters through the mud to wank Boruto and his rival. If they use some resurrection type bullshit, then it shows they’re banking on nostalgia for the series to bring back a clone of Minato.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Self-insert characters are only fun in one context, and that's when a story is written by multiple people. I suppose it would also be good if you had to roll a dice to see if your character was able to do things.

Yes, I am just describing a TTRPG.

I never really get the usage of them in general either.

OC's are one thing in a story, and I also use them, but SI's and Y/N type chars are just weird.

Even if you put stuff like a "name, likes, dislikes, age," etc. thing cuz at that point, you ARE making an OC in all but outright giving them an actual name of anything.

 

[SlendVeny]

That still a terrible plot hole because Boruto is a rogue shinobi and the only ones who know the FTG are the fourth hokage guards established in the manga and we haven’t seen them since the fourth war.

There was literally a scroll that was stolen by Kashin Koji, an enhanced clone of Jiraiya with 6-Paths level stats(idk what's up with that, but this guy is genuinely so cool I have no issue, plus genetic enhancement is a bitch), and he specifically beat up Kakashi and some Anbu to get it iirc. This guy also knows all of Jiraiya's techniques, so he probably has his knowledge, and Jiraiya saw enough of the Flying Thunder God that a guy with a lot of natural talent, say, I don't know, the child of two of the top 10 most cracked Shinobi in the village, could learn it during a timeskip. Plus, he trained with Sasuke, and Sasuke has for sure seen that, and has the Sharingan.

You want to complain about him knowing it when Naruto didn't? Blame Hiruzen, the guy who knew EVERY TECHNIQUE IN THE VILLAGE, and didn't teach Naruto shit. The real ****-up for the plot is how we're supposed to see him as a good leader.

 

[Ease_of_peas]

There was literally a scroll that was stolen by Kashin Koji, an enhanced clone of Jiraiya with 6-Paths level stats(idk what's up with that, but this guy is genuinely so cool I have no issue, plus genetic enhancement is a bitch), and he specifically beat up Kakashi and some Anbu to get it iirc. This guy also knows all of Jiraiya's techniques, so he probably has his knowledge, and Jiraiya saw enough of the Flying Thunder God that a guy with a lot of natural talent, say, I don't know, the child of two of the top 10 most cracked Shinobi in the village, could learn it during a timeskip. Plus, he trained with Sasuke, and Sasuke has for sure seen that, and has the Sharingan.

You want to complain about him knowing it when Naruto didn't? Blame Hiruzen, the guy who knew EVERY TECHNIQUE IN THE VILLAGE, and didn't teach Naruto shit. The real ****-up for the plot is how we're supposed to see him as a good leader.

That was hyperbole as Hiruzen never knew KKG and Hiden, which most clans in Leaf are built around. Not to mention that Kishimoto never went this route, either. Heck, he himself never knew how to use FTG.

 

[SlendVeny]

That was hyperbole as Hiruzen never knew KKG and Hiden, which most clans in Leaf are built around. Not to mention that Kishimoto never went this route, either. Heck, he himself never knew how to use FTG.

Are we really meant to believe some random-ass Jonin knew this, but The Professor, star pupil of Tobirama(He's also kind of a bad leader, that "curse of hatred" stuff was just Zetsu propaganda), didn't know it?

What do you mean "he himself?" Obviously Kishimoto can't use it, he's a real person.

 

[Ease_of_peas]

Are we really meant to believe some random-ass Jonin knew this, but The Professor, star pupil of Tobirama(He's also kind of a bad leader, that "curse of hatred" stuff was just Zetsu propaganda), didn't know it?

What do you mean "he himself?" Obviously Kishimoto can't use it, he's a real person.

Eh, the jutsu was available to everyone, but not everyone learned it. Just minato. We just saw some rando jounin use it, but it took 3 of them to use it once, and that's it. Heck, even jiraiya couldn't learn it. I mean, when did you see hiruzen using it? He didn't even use it in war!

I meant hiruzen. What you're posting is just pure headcanon.

 

[SlendVeny]

Eh, the jutsu was available to everyone, but not everyone learned it. Just minato. We just saw some rando jounin use it, but it took 3 of them to use it once, and that's it. Heck, even jiraiya couldn't learn it. I mean, when did you see hiruzen using it? He didn't even use it in war!

I meant hiruzen. What you're posting is just pure headcanon.

When did I imply he had mastered it? The statement said EVERY jutsu, why would it not be included? You're the one dropping headcanon here.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Hmm, interesting thought (probably).

What would you guys say is the least sense/worst sort of crossover thing you've read?

Whether it's just two or more series sharing one verse or even elements of one being in the other.

One I've seen so far is anything with Kamen Rider or Ninja stuff (Naruto) in general. Series that just don't make sense to have them at all due to the kind of setting they have and also how vastly different in culture and time they are in.

 

[SlendVeny]

What would you guys say is the least sense/worst sort of crossover thing you've read?

Batman Meets Godzilla

Batman Meets Godzilla is an unmade Godzilla film. It was intended to be a collaboration between Toho and Greenway Productions. Two separate treatments exist, one by Shinichi Sekizawa and the other by an unknown American author; the former was titled Batman vs. Godzilla (バットマン対ゴジラ, Battoman...

wikizilla.org

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Batman Meets Godzilla

Batman Meets Godzilla is an unmade Godzilla film. It was intended to be a collaboration between Toho and Greenway Productions. Two separate treatments exist, one by Shinichi Sekizawa and the other by an unknown American author; the former was titled Batman vs. Godzilla (バットマン対ゴジラ, Battoman...

wikizilla.org

Jesus christ xD

 

[Ease_of_peas]

When did I imply he had mastered it? The statement said EVERY jutsu, why would it not be included? You're the one dropping headcanon here.

It's a throwaway statement from way back in part 1, my dude. It doesn't mean anything. Hiruzen never used it. Not even once. In the war, we saw tobirama and minato spam it like crazy, but hiruzen still didn't use it. So how's it not headcanon on your part? Hyperbole is a thing. It's used in fiction often. You don't have to take everything literally.

 

[SlendVeny]

It's a throwaway statement from way back in part 1, my dude. It doesn't mean anything. Hiruzen never used it. Not even once. In the war, we saw tobirama and minato spam it like crazy, but hiruzen still didn't use it. So how's it not headcanon on your part? Hyperbole is a thing. It's used in fiction often. You don't have to take everything literally.

He still knew it, he was probably just shit at it. Doesn't really matter, he never taught Naruto anything. What's next, are you gonna tell me the Uzumaki Clan can't use the Reaper Death Seal, despite it literally being their jutsu, just because only Hiruzen and Minato used it? Does Hiruzen only have 10 jutsu?

 

[Ease_of_peas]

He still knew it, he was probably just shit at it. Doesn't really matter, he never taught Naruto anything. What's next, are you gonna tell me the Uzumaki Clan can't use the Reaper Death Seal, despite it literally being their jutsu, just because only Hiruzen and Minato used it? Does Hiruzen only have 10 jutsu?

Knowing a jutsu doesn't mean people know how to use it. People from outside the villages knew jutsus of other villages. They build their strategies around the rival villages' jutsus, but they didn't know how to use them. And why does naruto have to be taught anything by hiruzen? Which kage ever taught anything to the jins? Zero? Naruto's also a talentless loser who bruteforcs through everything as he's a powerhouse. Naruto was never talented, and kishimoto made it a point to show this to people a trillion times in the manga.

Okay, and how does the uzumaki clan thing fit here? Kushina knew it. She taught it to minato, and he taught it to hiruzen. How does naruto factor into this? Why would they teach their nuke a jutsu and would kill it? You're not making any sense at this point.

 

[SlendVeny]

Knowing a jutsu doesn't mean people know how to use it. People from outside the villages knew jutsus of other villages. They build their strategies around the rival villages' jutsus, but they didn't know how to use them. And why does naruto have to be taught anything by hiruzen?

Because Hiruzen promised to take care of him because his parents were dead, and all he did was pay rent on a shitty apartment that looks like it has black mold in it and give him a 20 buck allowance. Sasuke had a penthouse suite, his parents' will did its job better than Hiruzen's promise.

Which kage ever taught anything to the jins? Zero?

A fulfilled his promise to treat B, his adoptive brother, who he had just met, well, and train together with him. Also, most Kage were either shitty people, never seen doing shit onscreen, never shown to have known a Jinchuuriki, or literally were a Jinchuuriki.

None of these count, obviously, but:
-A(it seems like Bs have consistently been Jinchuuriki, and someone had to set up Yugito's training method)
-Every Kage that was the Jinchuuriki
-Minato(Trained Kushina, literally created a new Jutsu for her, and technically trained 2 future Jinchuuriki, but he didn't know that. Also he put part of him and Kushina's souls in Naruto's head.)

Naruto's also a talentless loser who bruteforcs through everything as he's a powerhouse. Naruto was never talented, and kishimoto made it a point to show this to people a trillion times in the manga.

He wasn't talented because no one helped him, he got more talent as people taught him, also he seems to be pretty talented with shadow clones and transformation in chapter 1. He's barely won any of his fights solely through brute force. One of them, brute force was failing, and he won by ******** his pants or something. I mean, you can't tell me Naruto vs Pain would've worked through brute force alone. The brute force thing only worked because skill, magic, and senses blew through like 5 of the enemies.

Okay, and how does the uzumaki clan thing fit here? Kushina knew it. She taught it to minato, and he taught it to hiruzen.

When was this stated?

 

[Ease_of_peas]

Because Hiruzen promised to take care of him because his parents were dead, and all he did was pay rent on a shitty apartment that looks like it has black mold in it and give him a 20 buck allowance. Sasuke had a penthouse suite, his parents' will did its job better than Hiruzen's promise.

A fulfilled his promise to treat B, his adoptive brother, who he had just met, well, and train together with him. Also, most Kage were either shitty people, never seen doing shit onscreen, never shown to have known a Jinchuuriki, or literally were a Jinchuuriki.

None of these count, obviously, but:
-A(it seems like Bs have consistently been Jinchuuriki, and someone had to set up Yugito's training method)
-Every Kage that was the Jinchuuriki
-Minato(Trained Kushina, literally created a new Jutsu for her, and technically trained 2 future Jinchuuriki, but he didn't know that. Also he put part of him and Kushina's souls in Naruto's head.)


He wasn't talented because no one helped him, he got more talent as people taught him, also he seems to be pretty talented with shadow clones and transformation in chapter 1. He's barely won any of his fights solely through brute force. One of them, brute force was failing, and he won by ******** his pants or something. I mean, you can't tell me Naruto vs Pain would've worked through brute force alone. The brute force thing only worked because skill, magic, and senses blew through like 5 of the enemies.

When was this stated?

He did take care of him. Naruto wasn't abused in any manner by Hiruzen. Do you want him to babysit Naruto or something? Minato made a choice to take his own life when Kushina begged him not to. That was on him. I don't see why others have to bear that responsibility in his place. He did the best he could. Jiraiya was personally assigned to teach him his father's jutsu. What else do you want this guy to do?

Eh, Bee was locked up in his village before Naruto was even born. His stint with Ae in the 3rd war was the last time he ever set foot out of the Kiri. Before that, beyond double lariet, what did he teach him? That wasn't even something he taught him, technically. It was something that was needed to become the next Bee. Bee is a code-name that was given to the next Jin in line.

All the fuinjutsu minato knows? Kushina taught those to him. It's mentioned in the manga by kushina. He learned jutsus to safeguard her. He never taught any to her. Not sure where you're going with this. He literally only knew 2 jutsus, 1 extra variant, and that's it. He's mid at best.

Kakashi's literal training method laid this out word for word: Naruto used like 20K plus clones to condense the training method for frs from god knows how many years down to about a week, and still he could only use it correctly 50% of the time. Straight from the tenzo's mouth. Jiraiya pointed it out way back in part 1 that using a jutsu with more hands is a show of poor skill. In war, despite being given the "universal understanding of all things", the biju did all the work. They literally created, kneaded, and processed chakra for him. Kurama kneaded chakra for bm and augmented sm and bm, and the senjutsu during the last battle and the 3-headed avatar was also created by kurama. He sucks. He's always sucked.

Talent is about creating something outside the box and innovating something. In that regard, very few shinobi are actually prodigious/talented/genius. Itachi's pretty garbage, too. Just words. Nothing for show. Beyond characters like tobirama, sasuke, kabuto, orochimaru, and maybe kakashi, I don't see many talented people in the manga.

I don't want to touch that fight with a 10 feet pole, but here's the gist of it: ma summoned the army of frogs to konoha, not naruto; pain had already used almighty push and as a result all his paths were in recovery mode throughout the fight; he had katsuya helping him with information; pain had no intention to kill him; he still lost; then minato's plot-device chakra stepped in to stop his full transformation; then he was magically standing outside CT when he was inside it before; nagato didn't make CT larger when he had a buttload of chakra to bring everyone back to life. I can go on. That pain fight is straight up ass, because it only works if you aren't paying full attention.

 

[SlendVeny]

He did take care of him. Naruto wasn't abused in any manner by Hiruzen.

He wasn't abused by most people. That means jack shit.

Do you want him to babysit Naruto or something?

I want him to actually show up. Naruto was being treated like human garbage by everyone, and he didn't know Hiruzen at all, evem disliking him to apoint he was willing to just steal his shit and graffiti on his face, so it seems like Hiruzen never showed up to talk to him, except in an anime-only scene that implied Naruto had to fish to survive.

Minato made a choice to take his own life when Kushina begged him not to. That was on him. I don't see why others have to bear that responsibility in his place.

They don't, but when they make promises, it should mean more than a shitty allowance and a salary that can afford... expired milk and instant Ramen. When he showed up with Kakashi, and found out Naruto was living off expired milk, he went "huh? Yeah, lol."

He did the best he could. Jiraiya was personally assigned to teach him his father's jutsu. What else do you want this guy to do?

Maybe not just leave a child to live alone in a village that hated him?

Eh, Bee was locked up in his village before Naruto was even born. His stint with Ae in the 3rd war was the last time he ever set foot out of the Kiri. Before that, beyond double lariet, what did he teach him? That wasn't even something he taught him, technically. It was something that was needed to become the next Bee. Bee is a code-name that was given to the next Jin in line.

They trained together and were assigned a free brother, that's honestly better treatment than most people got.

All the fuinjutsu minato knows? Kushina taught those to him. It's mentioned in the manga by kushina. He learned jutsus to safeguard her. He never taught any to her. Not sure where you're going with this. He literally only knew 2 jutsus, 1 extra variant, and that's it. He's mid at best.

Oh, hype, but that last bit literally isn't true.

Beyond characters like tobirama, sasuke, kabuto, orochimaru, and maybe kakashi, I don't see many talented people in the manga.

Sakura was stated to have had excellent chakra control since birth iirc. And talent isn't a single RPG stat, you can be talented in some things but not others. There's also natural talent vs talent acquired through hard work.

 

[Ease_of_peas]

He wasn't abused by most people. That means jack shit.

I want him to actually show up. Naruto was being treated like human garbage by everyone, and he didn't know Hiruzen at all, evem disliking him to apoint he was willing to just steal his shit and graffiti on his face, so it seems like Hiruzen never showed up to talk to him, except in an anime-only scene that implied Naruto had to fish to survive.

They don't, but when they make promises, it should mean more than a shitty allowance and a salary that can afford... expired milk and instant Ramen. When he showed up with Kakashi, and found out Naruto was living off expired milk, he went "huh? Yeah, lol."

Maybe not just leave a child to live alone in a village that hated him?

They trained together and were assigned a free brother, that's honestly better treatment than most people got.

Oh, hype, but that last bit literally isn't true.

Sakura was stated to have had excellent chakra control since birth iirc. And talent isn't a single RPG stat, you can be talented in some things but not others. There's also natural talent vs talent acquired through hard work.

He isn't naruto's parent. Show up? For what? Who treated naruto like human garbage? His circumstances were way better than sanctioned slaves of roots and hyuga and the state oppressed kids like sasuke. Why didn't anyone show up for them? Why just naruto? Is there any reason why you're singling him out? Yeah, don't care about that non-canon anime parts. It makes no sense for hiruzen to allow this to happen. That his village's most important asset, a nuke, would have to "fight to survive". At this point, you're just inventing trauma for him.

His milk expired because he didn't register the expiration date. He was shown to be clumsy. It's happened to me as an adult, too. Like, what the heck? You think people sold him expired milk on purpose? Wat?!

Okay, and do what about it? He had support system in the shape of iruka. Hiruzen personally passed a decree to outlaw even any gossip about him. It was punishable by law. What other orphan had this privilege? Zero is your answer. It isn't unusual for orphans to live alone in these villages. I'd ask again: why are you singling him out? What unique horrors did naruto face?

Never claimed that bee had it bad. My point was about kages teaching jins nothing out of the ordinary. I stand by this. As far as trauma competition goes, then naruto and bee had it fairly easy compared to scores of kids that were put through the villages' grinder for nothing.

If a guy takes over 3 years to make a single incomplete jutsu while under someone's tutelage, then Yeah, he's mid as heck. He's mostly just uplifted by his fanboys.

Eh, chakra control is a pointless term that doesn't mean anything in the grand scheme of things. What are her feats in this, anyway? She's never controlled massive volumes of chakra like sasuke, hashirama, and even naruto. Controlled different chakra types simultaneously and used jutsus simultaneously. Sasuke's the only one who's done that. Heck, I'd consider her once she controls a literal parasite's chakra in her body without a seal. One with sentience. Use its abilities perfectly without even learning them. And control senjutsu that erodes the user's chakra and psyche and regular ninjutsu at the same time. Now that's chakra control at its peak, and sasuke's literally the only non rekoudo character to do that. Both kurama and tobirama praised him greatly for that. The former straight up compared his control on all chakra types to the sage's.

Sakura's meh, at best.

 

[SlendVeny]

He isn't naruto's parent.

He made a promise. He didn't fulfill it.

Show up? For what? Who treated naruto like human garbage?.

The entire village. Sasuke was nicer to him than most of the people, and he was a dick.

His circumstances were way better than sanctioned slaves of roots and hyuga and the state oppressed kids like sasuke.

Imagine anyone going through anything a nd being hit with "at least you aren't a slave bro."

Why didn't anyone show up for them?

You're proving my point. Someone should have helped them, too. Hiruzen enabled all of that by not doing shit about it. He was the village leader.

Why just naruto? Is there any reason why you're singling him out?

Because he literally said he would take care of him, then didn't do it.

His milk expired because he didn't register the expiration date. He was shown to be clumsy. It's happened to me as an adult, too. Like, what the heck? You think people sold him expired milk on purpose? Wat?!

No. When did I say that shit? He was a kid. Someone should have been assigned to come by and check if he was ok.

Okay, and do what about it? He had support system in the shape of iruka.

Iruka didn't like him until a certain amount of time passed. That wasn't a system, that was a good teacher.

Hiruzen personally passed a decree to outlaw even any gossip about him. It was punishable by law.

All that accomplished is him thinking they hated him for no reason.

Never claimed that bee had it bad.

He did. He was just real happy.

If a guy takes over 3 years to make a single incomplete jutsu while under someone's tutelage, then Yeah, he's mid as heck. He's mostly just uplifted by his fanboys.

He also mastered the Flying Raijin with no one helping him, and perfected Sage Mode to a degree Jiraiya couldn't, and that "incomplete Jutsu" is one of the best ones you can learn without some mutation or god powers. Shit was so good it can make a 8-A hit 7-B. Also Kurama compared him to Hashirama Senju.

Eh, chakra control is a pointless term that doesn't mean anything in the grand scheme of things. What are her feats in this, anyway?

She can control it well enough to put the maximum output of her chakra into every hit. She also outperformed Tsunade. And Tsunade may be the 2nd weakest Hokage, but Sakura was said to be her equal before she even unlocked Byakugo. And the powers she uses are purely based on Chakra Control. Plus she knocked off Kaguya's horn and beat the shit out of Shin without using Byakugo, but whatever.

She's never controlled massive volumes of chakra like sasuke, hashirama, and even naruto.

She replenished Bijuu Mode Naruto's Chakra in The Last.

 

[Peppersalt43]

I wonder if it would count if it's done badly on purpose

Anyway here's JJK if it were a live-action movie by Hollywood

 

[Ease_of_peas]

He made a promise. He didn't fulfill it.

The entire village. Sasuke was nicer to him than most of the people, and he was a dick.

Imagine anyone going through anything a nd being hit with "at least you aren't a slave bro."

You're proving my point. Someone should have helped them, too. Hiruzen enabled all of that by not doing shit about it. He was the village leader.

Because he literally said he would take care of him, then didn't do it.

No. When did I say that shit? He was a kid. Someone should have been assigned to come by and check if he was ok.

Iruka didn't like him until a certain amount of time passed. That wasn't a system, that was a good teacher.

All that accomplished is him thinking they hated him for no reason.

He did. He was just real happy.

He also mastered the Flying Raijin with no one helping him, and perfected Sage Mode to a degree Jiraiya couldn't, and that "incomplete Jutsu" is one of the best ones you can learn without some mutation or god powers. Shit was so good it can make a 8-A hit 7-B. Also Kurama compared him to Hashirama Senju.

She can control it well enough to put the maximum output of her chakra into every hit. She also outperformed Tsunade. And Tsunade may be the 2nd weakest Hokage, but Sakura was said to be her equal before she even unlocked Byakugo. And the powers she uses are purely based on Chakra Control. Plus she knocked off Kaguya's horn and beat the shit out of Shin without using Byakugo, but whatever.

She replenished Bijuu Mode Naruto's Chakra in The Last.

My guy, you're spinning around in circles, and I'm not going to repeat myself after this: hiruzen made zero promises to be naruto's parent. He said that he'd take care of him, which he did. He passed decrees and made any public persecution of naruto, even gossiping, punishable by law. Pampered naruto's requests, put up with his shitty attitude when he defaced monuments of a hyper nationalist establishment and got away with not even a slap on the wrist, and didn't put him to death when he stole a freaking kinjutsu scroll. You know why? Because he's a freaking nuke! Sasuke's name on the other hand was put into the bingo book pretty quickly. He also allowed iruka to be his parental figure. Pray tell that which other orphan was shown even half this kindness? Like, hiruzen had a lot of glaring issues, but this wasn't one of them. He literally tried his best. What do you want him to do? Move in with naruto and babysit him?

What did the entire village do? They gave him bad stares, but that's it. He even played with other kids when he was younger. A lot of kids didn't like him as he behaved like an asshole and because of that many parents didn't like that their kids should associate with him. You're making it sound like they physically or verbally abused him. None of that ever happened. You want to blame hiruzen for people staring at naruto? Blame minato. That was his decision to shove a biju into his own kid. Without anyone's consent. People were going to be hostile to his kid. He knew. He did it, anyway.

Not going to reply to every point in the rest of the spaghettified reply that's talking about some trauma **** naruto faced that literally isn't present in the manga. No one claimed that naruto had it easy, but you're exaggerating the hell out of his circumstances. And yeah, arguments of child slavery and ethnic persecution sure as hell matter, buddy, if you're making statements like "they treated him like human garbage". If you'd said that naruto's treatment wasn't the best, then I'd have agreed. But human garbage? This is hyperbolic exaggeration of his circumstances. That's like comparing some kid who faced genocide to a kid whose daddy yelled at him that one time. Sure, the latter isn't the best, but come on. The dismissal you're showing of very obvious and large differences between the trauma of various kids for whom hiruzen did nothing and then how much he did for naruto is glaring. Like, he offered a slave kid's father's head to get out of war with kiri. He destroyed that kid's life. This is a shocking amount of child abuse. Are you seriously trying to claim that his treatment of naruto is even remotely comparable?

Where am I proving your point? We're talking about how hiruzen treated naruto, not how he handled the village in general. Where did you get his impression that I'm trying to white wash hiruzen's disgusting policies? "His treatment of naruto wasn't bad" and "he was a disgusting leader who did nothing of value but made the village go deeper into fash hell hole" can be right at the same time. You're trying to compare two completely unrelated things and stating that well, see, naruto had it real bad! What else are you going to tell me next that "hiruzen let orochimaru run away who'd tortured babies and the only reason hiruzen even decided to track him down is when he targeted konoha's citizens, so that proves that hiruzen treated naruto badly"? Okay? Like, who's claiming that hiruzen is a good guy?

People can let things get past the expiry date. A lot of the time, it's just forgetfulness due to busy schedules and school work. It isn't even shown in the manga in a sinister light. It was literally shown as a gag, because it caused naruto massive diarrhea later. It isn't that deep, but go off I guess.

Okay, so now you're suggesting that hiruzen should've build an entire support system for naruto out of thin air. How? Don't want to prolong this, but you don't seem to understand that how people are a product of their environment, and mental health facilities aren't a thing in that world. They aren't a thing in our world in most countries, either, due to the insane amount of stigma associated with mental illness. And you're ******** on iruka now for trying his level best. Naruto isn't special, and why should he be made to feel special to placate your misgivings is weird as hell.

Naruto wasn't hated for no reason. He was hated for housing something that killed their loved ones. They feared him that he might go berserk and harm their loved ones. His attitude did him no favors, either. It's fear, paranoia, and aversion to jins that made people hate him. You're not even attempting to understand the story at this point and singling naruto out like he isn't a part of the world where nukes are inside people and they're literal ticking time bombs that go berserk and kill hundreds at the drop of a hat. How can you expect people not to fear that?

Okay? Plenty of ninjas study on their own and master jutsus on their own. Am I supposed to be impressed when ftg is a kinjutsu and isn't even made available to everyone? His sm isn't perfect and it's literally useless, and that's something minato himself said in war. Kurama compared his sealing method to hashirama's. You can throw a million of minatos at hashirama and he'd obliterate them all in his sleep. He's on another level compared to all of the shinobi bar maybe 5. The amount of chakra he handles is insane. His chakra is also extremely powerful that only the uchiha chakra has shown to counter easily. Danzo almost died because of his chakra alone. Like, minato doesn't compare on any level. That s rank jutsu simply means that it took him a long time to develop it. S means secret rank, not whatever you're thinking.

It was never said in canon that she outperformed tsunade. Never. Tsunade isn't anything special, either. As for that chakra transfer, then the literal way that the byakugo functions is that the user stores "kneaded" chakra into the seal. Transferring chakra and handling it to create abilities is not even remotely the same. That's like saying that karin restoring tsunade's seal makes her some kind of genius.

 

[SlendVeny]

My guy, you're spinning around in circles, and I'm not going to repeat myself after this: hiruzen made zero promises to be naruto's parent. He said that he'd take care of him, which he did. He passed decrees and made any public persecution of naruto, even gossiping, punishable by law.

Great, so he... just made it so they discriminated against him quietly.

Pampered naruto's requests, put up with his shitty attitude when he defaced monuments of a hyper nationalist establishment

He was the leader of a hypernationalist organization, and only got that position because a previous leader, who supported the oppression of the Uchiha Clan, which almost lead to an event that would have destroyed the village? Curious.

and got away with not even a slap on the wrist, and didn't put him to death when he stole a freaking kinjutsu scroll. You know why? Because he's a freaking nuke!

He's a parentless child who was manipulated into stealing by someone he trusted, anyone who punished him for that would be morally reprehensible.

Sasuke's name on the other hand was put into the bingo book pretty quickly.

Yeah, he was also treated like shit. Crazy. Bet Hiruzen would've hated to see his father's name get slandered like that.

He also allowed iruka to be his parental figure.

Literally no one would prevent that unless they were actively trying to kill Naruto.

Pray tell that which other orphan was shown even half this kindness? Like, hiruzen had a lot of glaring issues, but this wasn't one of them. He literally tried his best. What do you want him to do? Move in with naruto and babysit him?

Probably, I don't know, not leave him literally alone? Maybe assign him a guardian. Kakashi might be a bad example since he was going through some shit(Although I definitely need to make a "Kakashi adopts Naruto" fanfic, that would be adorable), but there would definitely be someone who was willing to come around once in a while and go "hey, Naruto, are you doing alright? You need any help?"

Seriously, what other Hokage would have just left children to live alone? Tobirama, maybe, but he's psychotic.

What did the entire village do? They gave him bad stares, but that's it.

They actively despised him, but I'm starting to think he could literally feel that with his senses. But he was lonely as shit, bro was crying alone on a swing in the schoolyard in his free time.

He even played with other kids when he was younger. A lot of kids didn't like him as he behaved like an asshole and because of that many parents didn't like that their kids should associate with him.

They were actively trying to get their kids not to associate with him. Shikamaru was the biggest exception because his father is a human being with empathy.

You're making it sound like they physically or verbally abused him. None of that ever happened. You want to blame hiruzen for people staring at naruto? Blame minato. That was his decision to shove a biju into his own kid. Without anyone's consent. People were going to be hostile to his kid. He knew. He did it, anyway.

And that shit saved the world. Leaving Naruto alone in an apartment and letting Danzo run around unrestrained didn't.

And yeah, arguments of child slavery and ethnic persecution sure as hell matter, buddy, if you're making statements like "they treated him like human garbage".

He was treated like garbage, though, I didn't say he was treated the worst out of any Jinchuuriki, that would probably go to the guy who had assassins sent after him by his own dad when he was a child. Or maybe the girl who was just made into a suicide bomb.

What else are you going to tell me next that "hiruzen let orochimaru run away who'd tortured babies and the only reason hiruzen even decided to track him down is when he targeted konoha's citizens, so that proves that hiruzen treated naruto badly"? Okay? Like, who's claiming that hiruzen is a good guy?

I think I said "Hiruzen being treated as a good leader is the real plot hole" somewhere in my original argument, that's my main issue.

Okay, so now you're suggesting that hiruzen should've build an entire support system for naruto out of thin air. How?

He didn't have to, bro just had to come by and be like "hey, guy I promised to take care of, are you doing good?" Funnily enough, this could also be a way to prevent him from accidentally nuking everyone.

Naruto wasn't hated for no reason. He was hated for housing something that killed their loved ones. They feared him that he might go berserk and harm their loved ones. His attitude did him no favors, either. It's fear, paranoia, and aversion to jins that made people hate him. You're not even attempting to understand the story at this point and singling naruto out like he isn't a part of the world where nukes are inside people and they're literal ticking time bombs that go berserk and kill hundreds at the drop of a hat. How can you expect people not to fear that?

I suppose you're right. Apathy, human condition, you know the rest.

You can throw a million of minatos at hashirama and he'd obliterate them all in his sleep.

Hashirama after facing 3 Minatos:

It was never said in canon that she outperformed tsunade. Never.

Mangacels be seething over databookchads.

 

[Rakih_Elyan]

Holy hell, how the **** did this turn into Naruto discussion thread?

 

[SlendVeny]

Holy hell, how the **** did this turn into Naruto discussion thread?

People started talking shit.

 

[Ease_of_peas]

Great, so he... just made it so they discriminated against him quietly.

He was the leader of a hypernationalist organization, and only got that position because a previous leader, who supported the oppression of the Uchiha Clan, which almost lead to an event that would have destroyed the village? Curious.

He's a parentless child who was manipulated into stealing by someone he trusted, anyone who punished him for that would be morally reprehensible.

Yeah, he was also treated like shit. Crazy. Bet Hiruzen would've hated to see his father's name get slandered like that.

Literally no one would prevent that unless they were actively trying to kill Naruto.

Probably, I don't know, not leave him literally alone? Maybe assign him a guardian. Kakashi might be a bad example since he was going through some shit(Although I definitely need to make a "Kakashi adopts Naruto" fanfic, that would be adorable), but there would definitely be someone who was willing to come around once in a while and go "hey, Naruto, are you doing alright? You need any help?"

Seriously, what other Hokage would have just left children to live alone? Tobirama, maybe, but he's psychotic.

They actively despised him, but I'm starting to think he could literally feel that with his senses. But he was lonely as shit, bro was crying alone on a swing in the schoolyard in his free time.

They were actively trying to get their kids not to associate with him. Shikamaru was the biggest exception because his father is a human being with empathy.

And that shit saved the world. Leaving Naruto alone in an apartment and letting Danzo run around unrestrained didn't.

He was treated like garbage, though, I didn't say he was treated the worst out of any Jinchuuriki, that would probably go to the guy who had assassins sent after him by his own dad when he was a child. Or maybe the girl who was just made into a suicide bomb.

I think I said "Hiruzen being treated as a good leader is the real plot hole" somewhere in my original argument, that's my main issue.

He didn't have to, bro just had to come by and be like "hey, guy I promised to take care of, are you doing good?" Funnily enough, this could also be a way to prevent him from accidentally nuking everyone.

I suppose you're right. Apathy, human condition, you know the rest.

Hashirama after facing 3 Minatos:

Mangacels be seething over databookchads.

No offence, but the uchiha thing has jack to do with naruto's "poor" treatment. You're still spinning, and none of this whataboutery proves your point.

Ah yes, the "manipulated children" that are killed off in droves in root alone, but no one bats an eye. Naruto getting off scot free is an extraordinary situation. How many headcanons are you going to make at this point? Genins are adults by law, so if they break the law they are punished for it. This was said so in the first 2 chapters. Is it bad? Yeah, okay? Not the discussion we're having. You're going off a million tangents instead of understanding something simple: naruto got off scot free despite being an adult by ninja law. The topic isn't that the system itself is bad or that "child soldiers and their tragic stories". The topic is the huge difference between the treatment of ordinary orphans and naruto. How hard is it to get this?

Yes, sasuke was treated like shit. Shouldn't that be a lightbulb moment here that maybe the dehumanization of a clan and his last surviving member was a lot worse than naruto's? Maybe?

Not gonna bother with that iruka point as we literally saw hiruzen speak with iruka about this. Like, what are you even talking about anymore?

You do know that hiruzen was just as psychotic as tobirama, right? He was literally a part of that psychopath's squad. His literal first pick. You think nothing from that senju bigot rubbed off on this asshole? Despite all of that, he still went out of his way to do his best. That is my point! You're asking for a character to do something that a) is way outside his comfort zone and b) way beyond how that world functions. Hiruzen isn't suddenly going to have an a-ha moment with naruto and bend himself into a pretzel to support orphans and start charity programs. In that world, kids live on their own. It's just how things function there. Is it bad? Yeah, but that's a systematic problem and a completely different discussion. Naruto's treatment in that world is very tame. Is it the best? No. Is it hellish? No?

What did they do? Got any examples? Did they attack him? Verbally abuse him? Prevent his access to education? Vandalized his home? Threatened him? What? That's my problem with naruto discourse as a whole. His life is made to seem way worse than it is. Way worse than what the manga shows. They despised him? Okay? That doesn't prove that he was in any way made to experience that rage or that he was in any danger. Like, I can name so many real life examples that how such sentiments always lead to violence. We have the gaza example right now, but that fits sasuke far more than naruto. There's just no comparison between systematic hatred that ends in violence and whatever the heck that swing rider went through.

Saved the world? What the heck? Where did you get this from? The only thing he saved was his garbage village's sovereignty. What happened to naruto is minato's fault. People will be hostile to nukes whose psyches are fragile at best. He knew how lonely and isolated they got because of all the time he spent with his wife. He did it, anyway. Too high on his own hokage farts.

Hiruzen is a good leader by that world's metrics. He's a trash human being but he saved his village from wars twice. The medic division flourished during his time, as well. All that it cost him was his humanity, conscience, and morality. The dude's a shitstain like his bigoted mentor, but his tenure was fine for that fash village.

Meh, the databooks aren't even translated properly. Can't say I care. It isn't like byakugo can function better in anyway. It's a trash jutsu. There, I said it. I might be one of the few female readers of the manga who can't stand the fanboyism around tsunade and sakura's abilities. They're just bad.

 

[Ease_of_peas]

Holy hell, how the **** did this turn into Naruto discussion thread?

FTG thingy spiraled out of control.

 

[Another_Council]

So going back to the topic before it got derailed, did you know that not even YouTube personalities are safe from cringe RWBY fics?

Welcome To Beacon! - TheLovePuncher - Wattpad

Through certain... means, Vanoss, H20Delirous, Dathi De Nogla, I Am Wildcat, and Terroriser Have been transported to the world of Remanent. Join RWBY and VHDIT...

www.wattpad.com

 

[SlendVeny]

Ah yes, the "manipulated children" that are killed off in droves in root alone, but no one bats an eye.

When did I say this?

Yes, sasuke was treated like shit. Shouldn't that be a lightbulb moment here that maybe the dehumanization of a clan and his last surviving member was a lot worse than naruto's? Maybe?

I literally never said Naruto had it worse. This does not help you at all. I thought you said the Uchiha shit had nothing to do with this.

Hiruzen isn't suddenly going to have an a-ha moment with naruto and bend himself into a pretzel to support orphans and start charity programs.

He specifically marketed himself as the "everyone is equal, I'm a great person," guy, he's hypocritical.

What did they do? Got any examples? Did they attack him? Verbally abuse him? Prevent his access to education? Vandalized his home? Threatened him? What? That's my problem with naruto discourse as a whole. His life is made to seem way worse than it is. Way worse than what the manga shows. They despised him? Okay?

Imagine you're literally unable to interact with any humans except like 3 guys for over a decade.

Saved the world? What the heck? Where did you get this from?

Obito. Madara. Kaguya. Toneri. Momoshiki. Isshiki.

Hiruzen is a good leader by that world's metrics. He's a trash human being but he saved his village from wars twice. The medic division flourished during his time, as well.

Because of Tsunade. One of the main reasons they needed her was to train more medical ninja. Hiruzen was a good teacher, and that's his only thing. Don't really consider him good by Kage standards either, since the only ones worse than him were Tobirama and teeeechnically Danzo.

Meh, the databooks aren't even translated properly. Can't say I care. It isn't like byakugo can function better in anyway. It's a trash jutsu. There, I said it. I might be one of the few female readers of the manga who can't stand the fanboyism around tsunade and sakura's abilities. They're just bad.

You really gonna say "databooks aren't translated properly" like I buy the official things, lol. Byakugo is... a regular-ass transformation, but pretty strong. Regen is good. Chakra storage is neat. Not every jutsu is trash just because major characters use it.