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DemonGodMitchAubin

DemonGodMitchAubin

VS Battles Thread Moderator Calculation Group
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  • LordTracer
    Hi, I have a question regarding the upscaling thread. Assuming a specific numerical value gets chosen (M3X’s proposal of being 3/4 of the way to the next tier or the current 1.5x difference seem like the best proposals to me), would it also apply to upscaling to a + rating?

    Like, if Character A was High 7-A (let’s say, 1.99 gigatons), and Character B one-shots Character A, would B be able to upscale to High 7-A+ (2.65 gigatons)?
    View previous comments…
    LordTracer
    LordTracer
    Okay, thank you.
    LordTracer
    LordTracer
    Another question I thought of recently.

    Assuming the number for upscaling used is 1.5x, let’s say that Character A is 1.6x away from the next tier or a + rating, Character B one-shots A, and then Character C one-shots B. Would that then be enough for C to upscale, or would he just be ‘At least [insert whatever tier here]’
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    I don’t know yet, we’re still settling stuff in the CRT
    Arcker123
    Hey, would you mind posting this on the up scaling thread?

    I personally do not believe this:
    “My proposal is simply that we adhere to this principle and stop upscaling characters just because they’re stronger and a higher tier would look neater on their profile. We don’t need to say; “Character B can lift a truck because Character A lifted a car.” To be a valid depiction of upscaling. A more valid one would be like “Character A lifted a large car, so Character B can lift a relatively small truck because they are much stronger than Character A.

    The reason this “1.5 multiplier” is not arbitrary is because when using upscaling correctly, there is a massive gap between characters. Arguing that there is less than A 2x gap between Character C who can one shot Character D is not unreasonable. 1.5 is not unreasonable because it is a lowball, a lowball that requires basic logic and scaling, in my previous example, it should be ok for character C to upscale because he is reasonably stronger than character D, the 1.5 thing for lowballing the gap in power.
    Arcker123
    Arcker123
    Also, sorry for the double post but there is a mistake in the upscaling thread, I wrote:
    To be a valid depiction of upscaling. A more valid one would be like “Character A lifted a large car, so Character B can lift a relatively small truck because they are much stronger than Character A.
    I did not quote the above. I apologize for my bad formatting.
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    No prob
    OneBleachHurricane
    Question

    Would upscaling only be possible if the calculation is extremely close (Between 1 to 1.5X) to the arithmetic mean (+) or the next tier, and these characters scale above the calculated feat by a wide margin, for example being able to defeat enemies on such levels with a single casual attack.

    But would still be a case to case basis that depends on the value of the calc and in-universe context (consistency of feats/statements)?
    View previous comments…
    OneBleachHurricane
    OneBleachHurricane
    The 750 value is if Y were upscaled by a factor of 1.5 from 500.

    I'm basically applying Damage's notion of using 1.5 for each one shot.

    If X = 500, then Y = 750, and finally, Z = 1125
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    Hold on, that thread isn't about multiplying by 1.5x if you one shot someone, it's about upscaling someone to the Baseline of the next tier or arithmetic mean of a tier if the tier gap is less than 1.5x, 1.5x in this scenario will never actually be applied as a multiplier
    OneBleachHurricane
    OneBleachHurricane
    Ah okay
    LordGinSama
    I'm pretty confused on FT's Speed stats, namely how the profiles are set up so i'd like to ask you a few questions.


    1: Why is Rel not an outlier? I can understand some characters being faster than Irene's Deus Sama but that brings up issues with scaling. For starters why would Base Irene and Erza scale to the attack speed of Deus Sama? The feat was one by Dragon Irene who could blitz a non amped Erza, her Dragon Transformation also gains a boost in speed as she was able to blitz Erza who kept up with her human form. i can understand that she "reacted" to Deus Sama but she also had a few moments to react as well as having fodder that could react to it. It just doesn't strike me as logical to have characters who are vastly inferior to Dragon Irene (I.E, characters lie Sting now being faster than an attack from Dragon Irene who previously blitzed Erza, who could keep up with Irene's human form.)


    2: Why isn't the multiplier applied to MHS+? Massively Hypersonic+ (Kept up with Natsu and Gajeel), Varies with Enchantments (Wendy can increase all of her stats with Enchantments) | Massively Hypersonic+ (Faster than before), higher with Dragon Force (At least 4x faster than before due to Dragon Force), Varies with Enchantments (Wendy can increase all of her stats by 2x to 4x for any of her forms with her Enchantments)



    this has some issues, aka the speed multiplier not being applied directly. The value they scale to is mach 1381. Applying the 4x multiplier would be 5524. and now applying her enchants which increase her speed 2-4 times gives us a result of 22096, which is Sub-Rel. We'd end up with Sub-Rel characters long before Irene is even introduced.


    now we get into issues here Sub-Relativistic (Dodged a point blank attack from Dimaria. Faster than a crippled and weakened Erza), Sub-Relativistic+ with Dragon Force (At least 4x faster than before due to Dragon Force), Varies with Enchantments (Wendy can increase all of her stats by 2x to 4x for any of her forms with her Enchantments)

    let's aslo look at the issue of Irene's profile
    Relativistic (Far faster than Dragon Force Wendy. Faster than an Erza who was enchanted by Wendy to be 2x faster than normal) | Relativistic (Faster than her Base Form)

    Erza's profile doesn't make note of this 2x faster stat amp, and applying it would again, change the speed ratings for the verse.


    Wendy scales to 17% SoL with Dragon Force here, applying her 4x Multiplier gives us 68% SoL which is Rel+ and this isn't even getting into the Natsu stuff. Natsu's stuff. Sub-Relativistic+ with FDKM (Comparable to Dragon Force Wendy) or Dragonization (Blitzed Animus), Relativistic with DF (Comparable to Base Zeref), higher with DF+FDKM (Faster than before), far higher with SDFF (Kept up with Fairy Heart Form Zeref)

    FDKM is currently accepted as a 4x increase to all stats, these stats are a mess to be honest with you, and by not applying them that's hiding the outlier of the verse having SoL to FTL speeds if we apply all the multipliers in the profiles.
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    1. It's not an outlier, they scale to Baseline Rel and potentially a little higher, and Erza while crippled was able to react and swing her sword that fast in reaction to Deus Sema, even Base Wendy could react to that kind of speed by Enchanting Erza's sword right as she was swinging, also there's nothing that says Deus Sema is her fastest attack, it's her strongest attack, but that doesn't mean it has to be her fastest, in fact she only chose to use it when Erza was immobilized on the floor, probably because she knew that it summons a Meteor from hundreds of kilometers away from space and it's easier to avoid then her standard attacks, even then, because of the Atmosphere, the Meteor is forced to slow down

    2. The "Varies with Enchantments" exists solely because it is less cluttered formatting wise on Wendy's Profile and also shows everyone that she can amp her Base Form to be either 2x or 4x stronger than before, as for why it says any of her forms, that's because it is possible that she may be able to stack it on her Dragon Force, all it does is signify a possible amp that Wendy can give herself for her forms, in X791, Wendy never shows herself stacking any of her Enchantments on top of Dragon Force, probably because it costs too much magic power or she just flat out can't do it, so because we never see her do that, Dragon Force Wendy in X791 peaks out at Mach 5524

    3. Dragon Force Wendy scales to 8.9% SoL in X792, I have no idea where you got 17% SoL from, this falls into the same category as Point 2, the Varies with Enchantments exists solely as a possible amp she can use on her forms, but yet again, she never uses said amps on her Dragon Force in X792, so trying to scale a possible Dragon Force+Enchantments Wendy in X792 doesn't work, since she never did that, meaning she peaks at 8.9% SoL in X792

    4. FDKM isn't a 4x Amp to speed, I should have clarified that better on the Verse Page and I will, but we haven't been using FDKM as a 4x Speed Multiplier, it's just a coincidence that FDKM Natsu scales to DF Wendy because of feats

    If you still disagree with this, feel free to make a CRT about it, just don't clutter my Message Wall please
    LordGinSama
    Also I noticed another overlooked aspect of Zoro's last feat. The attack not only sent the top half of the horn upwards, but the reverse is also true. The bottom half was also launched downwards, as evident by the shaking and the large cracks on the eye socket. Before Flying Dragon-Blaze the structure wasn't cracked at all, again seen here. The reason why the bottom half wasn't launched off is because it's apart of the floor itself, hence why it shook rather than flying off.



    The calc should probably be adjusted to take this part into consideration.
    View previous comments…
    LordGinSama
    LordGinSama
    Wouldn't newton's 3rd law put the pushing down as the same enegry for pushing it up? The island absorbs the enegry by shaking violently and cracking.
    LordGinSama
    LordGinSama
    Also do you think you can handle some OP lifting strength feats? I have 3 in mind, 2 Zoro feats involving him lifting giants and Nightmare Luffy tossing Oars.
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    Well it depends, because Onigashima is floating like a balloon and it is suspended in the air, so Onigashima doesn't have any pushback or opposite force that could prevent Zoro from pushing the island down really, all Zoro would be pushing back against is the air IMO
    GuildZero
    Hello I was wondering if you could check out my thread about a FTL feat for fairy tail here?
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    Yeah sure
    GuildZero
    GuildZero
    Hey i have a question about the light/laser dodging feats and standards. for the photon slicer specifically it only meets one of the standards for it to be lightspeed but it does not meet any of the standards to show it is not real light. would it be considered light speed since it only meets one of the standards for light speed and none of the standards for not real light.
    Apex_Predator_GX
    ElajRuengies
    I think I started what was basically a Tower of God Speed CRT (here), and it was advised that I get more people before it got any longer. I was wondering if you could stop by, since you participated in the last ToG CRT (which wasn't that long ago now that I think about it...)
    Planck69
    Solacis
    Sorry to bother you, but could you take a look at this storm creation calc? It's been posted on the evaluation thread for over a month now with no response, and it's holding back a lot of progress with the verse.
    Peter1129
    Hey uhh sorry to bother you Mitch, but I’ve been told that I should made a multipliers thread before using the multipliers for a series I’ve been working on. But nobody really responded to the thread to tell me whether or not the multipliers were usable. I saw that since you participated in quite a few mulitplier threads maybe you could give some input on the multipliers for this series I’m working on?

    Cyberblader90
    View previous comments…
    Cyberblader90
    Cyberblader90
    bump
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    How did you get the exact volume, I get somewhat lost on the blog, specifically this part

    "Volume = 5400000000 cc

    The compactor looks pretty hollow, so using 50% hollowness

    2700000000 cc

    4m diameter + 50 m length with 50% hollowness gives 315 m3 for all the pistons together (shown on panel)"

    Specifically how you went from "2700000000 cc to 315 Meters^3"
    Cyberblader90
    Cyberblader90
    I see the problem. I mixed up two calcs. i have edited it one final time
    LordGriffin1000
    Hello DemonGodMitchAubin I was wondering if you could look over this calc before I put it in a blog so I don't end up doing it for nothing. I want to point out though that this isn't my calc. It was done by another user on a thread before the forum move but was deleted due to it being past the save date and I don't remember who wrote the comment. However I copied it down the results to use later just in case.

    Party_Animal_rotates_the_moon.gif


    In this gif, the Party Animal rotates the moon a high speeds.

    Important Note: The reason the moon is shining like a disco ball is simply because on that specific night, it just shines like that so it's still the same moon, it just shines like a disco ball.

    Here was the other user's comment regarding what the results of the feat would be...

    "There aren't enough frames in the gif to tell how fast it's spinning at the beginning, but for the second part with the slower spin, it took 8 frames for one of the squares to go from one side of the disco ball to the other, and the gif is running at 7 fps. That'd be pi radians in 8/7 seconds, or 2.74889357189 rad/s.

    0.5*(2.74889357189 rad/s)^2*8.86868965*10^34 kgm^2=3.35077536*10^35 J Large Planet level."

    I want to know if this calc is correct or not?.
    Arc7Kuroi
    Hey chief can you give this bad boy a quick look if you have the time please?
    View previous comments…
    Arc7Kuroi
    Arc7Kuroi
    Wouldn’t be part of the HST here if it wasn’t controversial, thanks for evaluating it anyhow hahaha.
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    DemonGodMitchAubin
    This is why I normally stay out of HST discussions
    Arc7Kuroi
    Arc7Kuroi
    I don’t blame you, I on the other hand am here for that pain. Controversial revisions should slow down for Bleach after this current one passes lol.
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