Top most skilled swordmans in the wiki

[Poppio2]

Does reading an entire battle and foreseeing the result without magic count as precognition?

 

[LordGinSama]

I also don't think Musashi would be using her Fate hax to win, honestly seems like she'd want to prolong a good sword fight as opposed to ending it via cutting Fate.


Honestly really ******* stupid for any honorable Swordsmen to have the ability to cut Fate rather than actually enjoying the fight itself. It's basically an instant "**** you I win." button.

 

[LordGinSama]

Does reading an entire battle and foreseeing the result without magic count as precognition?

Clairvoyance, not precognition.

 

[Poppio2]

Clairvoyance, not precognition.

Thanks

 

[Epiccheev]

Probably lol.

I personally view Mihawk as being more skilled, simply because he can toy with Zoro with a butter knife and some simple foot work, this being the same Zoro who can bypass Instinctive Reactions and act dance around attacks from Hatchan which are nigh unpredictable.

Wasn't Edelweiss the Mihawk to Ikki's zoro tho?
I recall her being higher than him in the og skill thread for that

 

[Poppio2]

If I wanted to make a group for setting up a profile for a verse where would I go?

 

[Regidian]

Passive as in thought based btw.
And to top this off, musashi cannot damage soujiro has his has passive barrier that reflects all attacks so all of musashi attacks gets reflected back to her
Even in stats equal soujiro still stomp.
You have not shown me musashi
Resistance to
Concept manip
Fate manip
Time manip (resist her future been cut).

The reason why I mentioned high godly was that he can also bypass people with such regen with his blade.
Which means his attacks erases people conceptually

Musashi can cut multi layered barrier that do praticaly the same thing so his barrier will not be a problem.

You don't have show why he stomp tho.

Here for the résistance the thread was accepted. Crimson just need to add it, and like i tell before Musashi have magic resistance rank A which mean she litteraly resist everything that magic resistance allow to resist (+ concept resistance is already on servant physiology).

https://vsbattles.com/threads/nasuverse-global-hax-revisions.123210/#post-4095511

No ? Negating high godly regen just mean that you stop them to regen nothing to do with erasing conceptualy people.(and poeple with this regen, can regen that in first)

 

[Regidian]

I also don't think Musashi would be using her Fate hax to win, honestly seems like she'd want to prolong a good sword fight as opposed to ending it via cutting Fate.


Honestly really ******* stupid for any honorable Swordsmen to have the ability to cut Fate rather than actually enjoying the fight itself. It's basically an instant "**** you I win." button.

It's depend on the people, need to recall that 99% of people she ever fight are stronger than her and was at this time "more" skilled than her And got hard hax But if she don't need the fate hax she would not using it, except her eyes their are passive she can't stop them.

She even have a skill that make her passively go in zero form if the guy is sensed as dangerous

 

[Regidian]

If I wanted to make a group for setting up a profile for a verse where would I go?

A grp?

 

[Poppio2]

A grp?

What is that in non ancronym?

 

[Regidian]

What is that in non ancronym?

Group

 

[Epiccheev]

If we are accepting things like cutting fate, then how high would Juuzou shishimi be?
He apparently learned to cut through concepts through sheer skill and training,lol.

 

[LordGinSama]

It's depend on the people, need to recall that 99% of people she ever fight are stronger than her and was at this time "more" skilled than her. But if she don't need the fate hax she would not using it, except her eyes their are passive she can't stop them

Yeah but speaking in a narrative view wouldn't it be much more impact full for Musashi to overcome such occurrences via training, hard work and smart thinking? Characters like Zoro and such are capable to fight against more skilled opponents who are strong and faster via growth, and smart thinking, that to me from a writing standpoint seems to empathize skill more than restoring to "I can cut skill GG." I understand that Nasu isn't exactly the most gifted writer, but he definitely took the wrong direction when handling Musashi and Sasaki's skill.

 

[First_Witch]

So i guess i will just rant about Sion for a bit and you guys make the ranking afterwards?

Sion can:

Perfectly copy martial arts after seeing them once. She not only perfects them, she applies experience to said arts like she did it "tens of thousands of time". Her understanding of martial arts is so good that she can deduce the concept and purpose of every move and stance.

Fight absolutly unbothered by the fact that her body is reduced to bones and meat hanging of said bones, by holding her body and strength though body control together.

Reflect the physical force behind a attack back at her enemies.

Do sword techniques with her legs and foot. Furthermore, she can fight regardless of footing and spatial alignment

Her analytical prediction is so good that she can kick her sword, making it spin and behead a enemy cleanly, whipe out an army with temporary energy blades and have her sword, perfectly timed, fall back into her hands for a counter attack against a enemy that was pseudo teleporting at her.

Make her sword attack appear to be invisible through techniques. By erasing her attack rythm and making them completly free, Sion throw unperceivable cuts, a effect that was stated to be impossible to archive with speed.

Evolve her skill mid fight to face far stronger enemies.

Fight Hyperion with nothing but a sword. Hyperion is already physically far superior to Sion, passivly erodes things around it, slowly affecting her. Futhermore, it debuffs anyone who dosnt just die from its aura down to 20%. Not by 20%, down to 20%. Its weapon can deal fatal damage just by touching you, it had Danmaku and drones and 2 revives plus power up. The first powerup gave it pseudo teleportation and energy weapons, the second powerup amped it even more. I got another oneshotting spear and laser foot blades which it used to relentlessly combo onto Sion. Sion faced all of that with nothing more but her sword and she killed it at the end.

Not really worth gush on about but Sion has a massive skill scaling chain as the universe greatest Sword master ever. Furthermore there is some general shit like sufficently skilled Knights being able to cut so well that a dude who literally ***** and cuts with space is envious of that.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Musashi can cut multi layered barrier that do praticaly the same thing so his barrier will not be a problem.

Barrier Generation (Uho-hou is a passive barrier that adapts to spirits and concepts and as such can influence territories like higher dimensional spiritual defenses and its special nature resides in eliminating weakness points) and Limited Attack Reflection (Said barrier will change the direction of any attack in their blind spots ensuring their safety)

Even with stats equal the potency of soujiro barrier cannot be bypassed by her as soujiro barriers are higher D to him

You don't have show why he stomp tho.

Here for the résistance the thread was accepted. Crimson just need to add it, and like i tell before Musashi have magic resistance rank A which mean she litteraly resist everything that magic resistance allow to resist (+ concept resistance is already on servant physiology).

I am saying resistance to type 1 conceptual manip?

No ? Negating high godly regen just mean that you stop them to regen nothing to do with erasing conceptualy people.(and poeple with this regen, can regen that in first)

And again that is his whole thing he attacks people concepts that literally all he does with all his attacks.
Now also where is musashi resistance to
Fate manip and time manip

 

[Regidian]

Yeah but speaking in a narrative view wouldn't it be much more impact full for Musashi to overcome such occurrences via training, hard work and smart thinking? Characters like Zoro and such are capable to fight against more skilled opponents who are strong and faster via growth, and smart thinking, that to me from a writing standpoint seems to empathize skill more than restoring to "I can cut skill GG." I understand that Nasu isn't exactly the most gifted writer, but he definitely took the wrong direction when handling Musashi and Sasaki's skill.

I'm totally okay with that for musashi at least, but we need to know the big part od the grown is not know by us, when we encounter musashi she already praticaly in the peak of her swordsmanship we only see her affronting people with hax so she just development her "hax skill' better and reach the domain she always dreamed (even in fate people call her just a plot device machine she more a shonen prota that us lol)

And sasaki the ones we encounter is already in the peak, but we know from the past that he hard really hard work only two thing have do in life it's battle swordman and training himself to be able to do what he do now.

It's surely one of the lost sad "flaw" you will rarely see a servant grown as their already her as their peak of the limit the class let them be

 

[Regidian]

Barrier Generation (Uho-hou is a passive barrier that adapts to spirits and concepts and as such can influence territories like higher dimensional spiritual defenses and its special nature resides in eliminating weakness points) and Limited Attack Reflection (Said barrier will change the direction of any attack in their blind spots ensuring their safety).

Well one more time does not really have a thing to do with swordmanship skill, but yeah she don't have higher dimmensionnal manip (even tho she can cut god who have barrier of same tier than them)

I am saying resistance to type 1 conceptual manip?

Fate concept is only accepted as type 1 for servant so if she have resistance to concept manip you want it to be what except type 1?

And again that is his whole thing he attacks people concepts that literally all he does with all his attacks.
Now also where is musashi resistance to
Fate manip and time manip

I mean it's just tell that he can cut concept, cutting a concept doesn't mean you can cut the concept of existance of someone.


And can't you read crt?

Magic Resistance should function as Power Nullification, Damage Reduction, and Resistance to Magic, including all the effects listed in this blog.


The blog mentionned

Paul Frank/sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

+ These thing added that was accepted,

"It should be added in resistance they thing that they can do with magecraft.

From Medea Profile:

Light Manipulation: because Rain of Light (Machia Hecatia Graea).

Ice Manipulation (Can manipulate ice and summon it down on enemies)

Telekinesis (Lifted some bodies into the air)

Air Manipulation, Disease Manipulation (Created a plume of air with a simple gesture. Can control Plague Winds with Aero)

Density Manipulation (Manipulated the density of air to trap Saber in a membrane of it)

Thread Manipulation, Body Puppetry (Can create threads of mana that force the affected to move according to how she wishes, preventing them from even screaming)

Transmutation, Size Manipulation, Sealing (Can perform divine punishment, such as turning people into pigs or trapping them into tiny worlds)

Higher-Dimensional Manipulation, BFR (Can send people away by teleporting them with Enforced Transference, pulling them out of the third dimension)

Illusion Creation, Sense Manipulation (Created a detailed illusion that trapped Atrum Galliasta, altering his senses to make him not realize that he was being actively immolated)

Poison Manipulation, Biological Manipulation, Fragrance Manipulation, Empathic Manipulation, Sleep Manipulation, Soul Manipulation (She could develop an Incense, a gaseous poison that "Destroys love", leaves people impotent, and makes them comatose, and used this to steal souls during the UBW route)

From Caster Gilles de Rais:

Blood Manipulation (Caused blood on the ground to evaporate into mist)

Fear Manipulation (Can rouse the fear of the unknown in others)

From Archimedes :

Fate Manipulation (Can cast a Time Lock, which makes events impossible to change past a certain point)

Souren Araya:
Plant Manipulation (used his Magecraft to create an enhanced version of Cannabis, imbued with the concept of Consumption)

Touko Aozaki:
Hypnotism (Via wards and spells)

And with Rin that have gravity manipulation (UBW ep3). "

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

I dunno what is happening here.
Why are people posting walls of haxxes??

 

[LordGinSama]

I dunno what is happening here.
Why are people posting walls of haxxes??

Welcome to any thread involving Nasu and Masada characters.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Well one more time does not really have a thing to do with swordmanship skill, but yeah she don't have higher dimmensionnal manip (even tho she can cut god who have barrier of same tier than them)

He can cut 1B when he was 3D

Fate concept is only accepted as type 1 for servant so if she have resistance to concept manip you want it to be what except type 1?

The scans where it was shown that conceptual attack was resisted was not a type 1 tho. The type of conceptual attack they resist should be specified, cause it is sure as hell not type 1.

I mean it's just tell that he can cut concept, cutting a concept doesn't mean you can cut the concept of existance of someone.

When you attack someone concept what are you trying to do? Make them stronger or kill them? It is simple he attacks the concept of anyone he is fighting which means death on a slash. Which musashi has no resistance to. And also fate manip and time manip

And can't you read crt?

Magic Resistance should function as Power Nullification, Damage Reduction, and Resistance to Magic, including all the effects listed in this blog.

All the rest are useless I will only face this
Resistant to Power Nullification (Could force the activation of his power even after Tenma Sukuna used his Taikyoku), and again by SBA none of soujiro attack is A rank magic or even works like magic in nasuverse.
And if they were to be equalized soujiro magical haxes would be EX++++ & +

 

[PrinceofPein]

I dunno what is happening here.
Why are people posting walls of haxxes??

It is fate what do you think

 

[PrinceofPein]

Just to be clear in an actual battle with all stats equalized, soujiro decimates, don't wanna wank but well here are soujiro haxes, who am I kidding I wanna wank

• Non-Physical Interaction (Gods can interact with souls and concepts, and affect other Gods, which are abstract beings that are the embodiment of their laws)
• Conceptual Manipulation (Type 1; With Taikyoku, Gods become the origin from which all phenomenon and concepts come from, with concepts working on a higher dimensional scale)
• Regeneration (High-Godly; Gods possess regenerative capabilities that are significantly superior that of Frederica regenerative capabilities, who possesses the greatest immortality/regeneration within the entire series barring the gods, even greater than the restoration powers granted by Habaki's Distortion or Gladsheimr's Blessing, the latter which can bring people back even from Machina's erasure. As long as a God possess the same Taikyoku level or higher, they will almost always be able to come back from the destruction of another God, reforming their bodies back to perfect condition, as shown in Tenma Ootake and Yakou Madara's fight)
• Incorporeality and Abstract Existence (Type 1; A God embodies their own Law)
• Regeneration Negation (High Godly; As shown numerous times, Gods can kill other Gods, bypassing their regenerative capabilities and immortality, particularly if they possess a greater Taikyoku value than them)
• Higher-Dimensional Existence (Gods are higher dimensional beings that exist on another phase on physics in comparison to others)
• Immortality (Type 1 - All gods are eternal; Type 3 - All gods can regenerate as shown when Ren created a moment frozen in time, Mercurius went from missing half his body to having his whole body restored)
• Acausality (Type 4; Gudō Gods like Marie have shown to exist outside of the world's laws and concepts, Hadō Gods possess a similar, yet different nature in which one's law turns outward instead of inward affecting all of creation instead of just their person, although they are stated to exist on the same level of existence)
• Resistance to Death Manipulation (Those who possess Taikyoku can survive in Ootake's world of death, only having their lifeforce drained despite it instantly killing those who would take a step inside)
• Law Manipulation and Reality Warping (The Law of a Gudō God is turned inward and the Gudō God becomes their own solitary world parallel and unaffected by the laws of the world, making them human-sized heavens)

 

[First_Witch]

It is fate what do you think

A-aren't you arguing for Soujiro...?

 

[PrinceofPein]

You would think that's all but Nah that is not, it continues

• Spiritual Aura (Overwhelming, Fear-Inducing, and likely Charismatic; Multiple Ewigkeit users have demonstrated that they release a spiritual pressure that denotes the strength of their soul, and this pressure can have a wide variety of effects on others which consists of "breaking down the body", "shattering the soul", fading one's strength, inducing fear and madness, all while paralyzing the opponent in place as well as "attracting followers around them", and inducing "nausea, intoxication, and itchiness" onto others)
• Spacial Manipulation (The ber’iah of wilhelm, rusalka, and Cain are capable of distorting space due to the nature of hegemonies, other hegemony type ber’iah users should be capable of the same. Extrasensory Perception (Due to being an Ewigkeit user, he possesses a "Third Eye" which allows him to see through a person's identity by viewing the color of their soul, and perceive invisible attack

• Pocket Reality Manipulation and Law Manipulation (Ber'iah is the act of an Ewigkeit user forcing their deepest desire on reality and are described as the implementation of a new law into reality that is essentially a single person's craving against the world's, which can nullify the laws of another to the point of non-existence, and which temporarily overwrites even the laws of Mercurius' world due to the Ber'iah user bending "the laws of the world with your own will", causing the "laws of the old world to hold no water" within their own. Hegemony Ber'iahs create a "parallel world" in the space around the user that is constantly in discourse with the law of the "pre-existing world". Transcendence Ber'iahs turn oneself into a "parallel world", a "different world, dislodged from both reality" and other Hegemony domains, they are "unbound by the laws that used to shackle its solid shape")

Resistances

​

• Immunity to Natural Diseases and Poisons
• Resistance to Itchiness and Nausea Inducement/Social Influencing or Charismatic Seducement/Fear Inducement/Paralysis Inducement/Madness Inducement/Mental Destruction (Every user of Die Ewigkeit can fight against the pressure of other Ewigkeit users and the presence of Reinhard's spear, which does this to the mind; Die Ewigkeit users from the L.D.O. have shown they are capable of fighting even in the presence of Methuselah)
• Resistance to Soul Absorption/Destruction (Every user of Die Ewigkeit uses their Ahnenerbe to fight and resists the other Ahnenerbe of another Die Ewigkeit user. Ahnenerbe plunders souls and feeds on them to rob their enemies of life which is considered an act that hinders the soul's recurrence in an attempt to disturb the cycle of recurrence to destroy the current ghetto, breaking the shackles of Foreknowledge, which wouldn't be the case if their souls were too weak and "unable to resist its sorcery". They can also resist Reinhard's pressure as well as the presence and touch of Reinhard's spear)
• Resistance to Spiritual, Biological, and Energy Absorption (All Die Ewigkeit users can fight against and resist the effects of Wilhelm's Ahnenerbe, which squeezes the blood, essence, and soul out of everything it touches, completely mummifying everything dry - even inorganic things are affected)
• Resistance to Magic (Die Ewigkeit users can endure attacks from each other, which are magical in nature)
• Resistance to Law Manipulation/Pocket Reality Manipulation (Ber'iahs possess the ability to negate and ignore the laws of another Ewigkeit user's Ber'iah to the point where it has no effect on them, as well as ignore and override the law of Mercurius, in which "the laws of the old world hold no water")
• Possible Resistance to Fire Manipulation (A Die Ewigkeit user's defenses come from their spiritual armor, and so it is likely that another user of the sorcery can possess the same resistances as Ren Fuji, who endured the flames of Eleonore)
• Possible Resistance to Poison Manipulation and Corrosion Inducement (A Die Ewigkeit user's defenses come from their spiritual armor, and so it is likely that another user of the sorcery can possess the same resistances as Ren Fuji, who endured the poison of Tubal Cain)
• Possible Resistance to Lightning Manipulation (A Die Ewigkeit user's defenses come from their spiritual armor, and so it is likely that another user of the sorcery can possess the same resistances as Ren Fuji, who endured the lightning of Tubal Cain, using the Ber'iah of Beatrice Kircheisen)
• Possible Resistance to Ice Manipulation (A Die Ewigkeit user's defenses come from their spiritual armor, and so it is likely that another user of the sorcery can possess the same resistances as Wilhelm Ehrenburg, who was completely unaffected by being bathed in liquid nitrogen which should have caused his cells to burst and turned him into an ice statue)

 

[PrinceofPein]

A-aren't you arguing for Soujiro...?

It may look the same but oddly different, true story

 

[PrinceofPein]

You would think that's all but Nah that is not, it continues

Just to be clear in an actual battle with all stats equalized, soujiro decimates, don't wanna wank but well here are soujiro haxes, who am I kidding I wanna wank

Please do note this is all for fun and kinda spite against nasu fans but well it is all for fun and I am not usually like this with shinzaverse and I don't argue for shinza (i have not found one that is not a stomp match one way or another) but it was fun this afternoon @Regidian nice chatting with you tho

While at that, you should read dies irae, it is a really nice VN you will not regret it

 

[Poppio2]

If Musashi and Killer Bee faced each other in a battle of skill could she adapt?

 

[Regidian]

He can cut 1B when he was 3D

The scans where it was shown that conceptual attack was resisted was not a type 1 tho. The type of conceptual attack they resist should be specified, cause it is sure as hell not type 1.

When you attack someone concept what are you trying to do? Make them stronger or kill them? It is simple he attacks the concept of anyone he is fighting which means death on a slash. Which musashi has no resistance to. And also fate manip and time manip

All the rest are useless I will only face this
Resistant to Power Nullification (Could force the activation of his power even after Tenma Sukuna used his Taikyoku), and again by SBA none of soujiro attack is A rank magic or even works like magic in nasuverse.
And if they were to be equalized soujiro magical haxes would be EX++++ & +

You have tell it like 10 time by now so we know. And i still will answer by it does mea' nothing in term of sword skill.

It's type 1 every conceptual thing is type 1 in fate now + the blog show other conceptual reisstance. If you not happy then make a crt.

She resist concept manipo, she resist existence erasure and she resist fate and time manip line it's on the blog that was accepted.

All the rest are useless I will only face this
Resistant to Power Nullification (Could force the activation of his power even after Tenma Sukuna used his Taikyoku), and again by SBA none of soujiro attack is A rank magic or even works like magic in nasuverse.
And if they were to be equalized soujiro magical haxes would be EX++++ & +

The rest is not useless, magic resistance allow to resist supernatural not only magic. tell to you in praticaly every thread you participe with nasuverse.

Dream saber shiki shit on soujiro and she don't have that so stop.

 

[Regidian]

Just to be clear in an actual battle with all stats equalized, soujiro decimates, don't wanna wank but well here are soujiro haxes, who am I kidding I wanna wank

You know that the only "good" thing here is the regen and the tier(higher dimmensionnal existance) they have and have nothing to do with the battle of swords skill

 

[Regidian]

We talked about sword skill/hax and most of your lastest argument are thing that none of them.....

 

[Regidian]

If Musashi and Killer Bee faced each other in a battle of skill could she adapt?

Yeah even whitout all her hax, and in first him having 8 sword doesn't have this much problem, she can fight with four

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

FGO needs an anime where everything is shown smoothly.

I'm hoping it too, we just got Camelot movie, Babylonia series, and Solomon final stand movie so hopefully Shinjuku and Shimosa are the next

 

[Regidian]

I'm hoping it too, we just got Camelot movie, Babylonia series, and Solomon final stand movie so hopefully Shinjuku and Shimosa are the next

I more hope we get this gudako as main character lol

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Reminds me someone should make Saber vs Zoro tbh.

Not entirely Saber Artoria but....i'm planning to make Watanabe no Tsuna vs Roronoa Zoro, like the idea?

 

[LordGinSama]

If Musashi and Killer Bee faced each other in a battle of skill could she adapt?

Killer B isn't very impressive, tbh I'm not really sure why he's even here.

Musashi is ranked above Zoro, who can react and defend against 8 Instinctive Reaction sword slashes from Hyouzou, a Blue-Ringed Octopus Fish-Man who has 8 brains in each tentacle, alowing each one to act independently of the others. And being a Cephalopod makes his Swordsmanship very unpredictable. If Zoro could block something like that I'm sure Musashi won't have trouble either.

 

[LordGinSama]

Not entirely Saber Artoria but....i'm planning to make Watanabe no Tsuna vs Roronoa Zoro, like the idea?

He doesn't have a profile iirc. Izo is probably better tbh

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

He doesn't have a profile iirc. Izo is probably better tbh

He got a profile actually: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Saber_(Watanabe_no_Tsuna)

 

[LordGinSama]

He got a profile actually: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Saber_(Watanabe_no_Tsuna)

He seems kinda bland, what can he do exactly?

 

[Regidian]

He doesn't have a profile iirc. Izo is probably better tbh

Izo is cool but it's hard to tell the limit of his copy outside the verse like we kno he can't copy technique categorised outside of anti-unit Np but many technique are not NP even in fate, so which should be considered NP or not and how we know they are anti unit or not lol

 

[SemiRaedi]

We'd have to discuss the skills of every character here and how they compare to one another.

Alr feel free to do so then, please make sure to rank them whenever everyone has come to somewhat of an agreement however long that takes.

For now I won't update the list until that time comes