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Sonic Cosmology part 3: The End of Magingelion

JJSliderman said:
Thoughts on Solaris having large size type 9 or 10? Since his body is made up of the dimensions he consumed and he‘s accepted to have consumed the entire multiverse (including the 5-D Maginaryworld)
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During the Solaris boss fight,does he already consumed the Multiverse or was going to do it situation??
 
In hindsight idk if people would agree with 6-D without the anchored statement, maybe that shouldn’t have been applied.
 
Btw I don’t think 6D does much for hax, the range might be 6D but the potency will likely remain 5D. Based on hitting compactified things not being impressive for AP either. So it has eh very limited applications.
 
Also 2 things to note: 1) If we argue that the Super hogs can’t interact with Solaris’ body anymore in Phase 2 and instead have to resort to hitting his consciousness, it’s likely that Solaris’ consciousness is not 6D. Thus giving the Supers no 6D range or 2) if we ignore the above, the Supers should have Limited Higher-Dimensional Manipulation (like Alien X) for interacting with Phase 2 Solaris.
 
Greenshifter said:
Also 2 things to note: 1) If we argue that the Super hogs can’t interact with Solaris’ body anymore in Phase 2 and instead have to resort to hitting his consciousness, it’s likely that Solaris’ consciousness is not 6D. Thus giving the Supers no 6D range
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i don't think that there anything saying that, all theu say is that they couldn't finish Solaris off for good
 
Long as the thread is open I’m open to continue discussing the possibility of cyberspace/individual dreams being 5-D.
 
I posted this in the discussion thread already but it makes more sense to do so here, but If we had to summarize the arguments for 5-D it would be:

1. Cyberspace is a dimension with its own flow off time which contains other Cyberspaces (such as the Eggnet) which are infinite in size that don't make up the entirety of Cyberspace

2. Cyberspace being the Ancients' wish/desire for their legacy to live on as well as being referred to as the "Digital Dream" means that it would be a part of Maginaryworld's 4-dimensional space

3. 4-Dimensional Space contains Cyberspace within itself, whilst being an infinite 4-dimensional space with a temporal axis = 4D+1D = 5D

Would this be an accurate summary?
 
Yes, although my argument was extending to Cyberspace itself as 5-D, for being a universe sized space that dwarfs Eggman’s tangible four-dimensional space memories+a time component. Or, going off what Qaws said, being a realm that treats Low 2-C dream/cyber worlds as infinitesimal.

There was also an argument for individual dream worlds, since Eggman referred to the super-dimensional Otherworld as his dream, and Otherworld should have a similar dimensionality to the test run maze due to having a similar purpose of trapping characters, and the “super-dimensional” aspect. Plus the uni size, and a temporal component, makes it 5-D.
 
@Qawsedf234 I think JJ's gonna bring up something else, but since Cyberspace contains Eggman's dream of a maze with 4 (big) spatial dimensions and since it has a time component. Doesn't that just make it 5D by default?

Edit: He brought it up
 
Qawsedf234 said:
What's your new argument for 5D Cyberspace.
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You mentioned that Low 2-C realms being infinitesimal in comparison to another space could make it 5-D.

As established by the Egg Memos, data from the United Federations mainframe and EggNet were both part of cyberspace. Both were represented as levels in Shadow the Hedgehog that could be explored, and the former was described as a space containing “infinite darkness”.

Despite that area being contained in Cyberspace, it’s never seen at any point visually or as part of cyberspace stage level design, despite exploring numerous cyberspace locales, meaning it doesn’t seem to take up a significant chunk of Cyberspace. Cyberspace itself also has statements it contains an endless, unquantifiable, defying quantification amount of data, which shouldn’t be hyperbole since the space was constructed by the Chaos Emeralds that are accepted to possess infinite power. So Cyberspace is infinitely larger than Low 2-C realms of infinite 3-D space, as well as the Low 2-C dream realms of the Ancients that are also part of Cyberspace.

Cyberspace should also be universe sized due to absorbing data from across the universe for thousands of years and the aforementioned size statements, and because of its lore of absorbing the dreams and memories of those who enter, it should possess a copy of Eggman’s dreams and memories of four-dimensional space from the maze he constructed in IDW (since Frontiers is after Test Run chronologically), so Cyberspace is a 4-D uni sized space with a time component, giving another 5-D avenue.
 
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JJSliderman said:
As established by the Egg Memos, data from the United Federations mainframe and EggNet were both part of cyberspace. Both were represented as levels in Shadow the Hedgehog that could be explored, and the former was described as a space containing “infinite darkness”.
Click to expand...
The main issue is the assump that the entirety of those things are in Cyberspace
I have found elements from my own EggNet, United Federation, even Planet Donpa Kingdom race data! As best as I can surmise, this Cyber Space extends well beyond the scope of these islands and is gaining information from around the world. Fascinating!
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Eggman found "elements" of those other programs in Cyberspace. But elements =/= the entirety of them is embedded within the space.

It would just be a bigger Low 2-C compared to them rather than Low 1-C.
 
JJSliderman said:
You mentioned that Low 2-C realms being infinitesimal in comparison to another space could make it 5-D.

As established by the Egg Memos, data from the United Federations mainframe and EggNet were both part of cyberspace. Both were represented as levels in Shadow the Hedgehog that could be explored, and the former was described as a space containing “infinite darkness”.

Despite that area being contained in Cyberspace, it’s never seen at any point visually or as part of cyberspace stage level design, despite exploring numerous cyberspace locales, meaning it doesn’t seem to take up a significant chunk of Cyberspace. Cyberspace itself also has statements it contains an endless, unquantifiable, defying quantification amount of data, which shouldn’t be hyperbole since the space was constructed by the Chaos Emeralds that are accepted to possess infinite power. So Cyberspace is infinitely larger than Low 2-C realms of infinite 3-D space, as well as the Low 2-C dream realms of the Ancients that are also part of Cyberspace.

Cyberspace should also be universe sized due to absorbing data from across the universe for thousands of years and the aforementioned size statements, and because of its lore of absorbing the dreams and memories of those who enter, it should possess a copy of Eggman’s dreams and memories of four-dimensional space from the maze he constructed in IDW (since Frontiers is after Test Run chronologically), so Cyberspace is a 4-D uni sized space with a time component, giving another 5-D avenue.
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From what I know from those size revisions, a space infinitely larger than a Low 2-C structure is no longer Low 1-C.

And there is this FAQ.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
The main issue is the assump that the entirety of those things are in Cyberspace

Eggman found "elements" of those other programs in Cyberspace. But elements =/= the entirety of them is embedded within the space.

It would just be a bigger Low 2-C compared to them rather than Low 1-C.
Click to expand...

I also mentioned the existence of the Ancients’ dreams within cyberspace, with individual dreams also accepted as Low 2-C. Cyberspace has infinite data 10K years after the Ancients’ dreams were inserted and all that time was spent absorbing more data, meaning the Ancients dreams no longer form the totality of Cyberspace, and thus CS as a realm with infinite data has infinitely more data than a Low 2-C data patch.

Plus the part about Cyberspace being a universe sized 4-D space with a time component like MW (just smaller)
 
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JJSliderman said:
Ancients’ dreams within cyberspace, with individual dreams also accepted as Low 2-C. Cyberspace has infinite data 10K years after the Ancients’ dreams were inserted and all that time was spent absorbing more data, meaning the Ancients dreams no longer form the totality of Cyberspace, and thus CS as a realm with infinite data has infinitely more data than a Low 2-C data patch.
Click to expand...
Having infinitely more data still wouldn't be enough for Low 1-C. Because the difference between the two is an uncountable infinite set, or a set of an infinite amount of different infinities.

JJSliderman said:
Plus the part about Cyberspace being a universe sized 4-D space with a time component like MW (just smaller)
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I'm not seeing anything that would really back that Cyberspace is a 5-Dimensional construct over a 4-Dimensional one.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
I'm not seeing anything that would really back that Cyberspace is a 5-Dimensional construct over a 4-Dimensional one.
Click to expand...
Just by the lore and context of how dreams come to be, Eggman’s fourth dimensional space is part of a dream/wish, as he wished for it one day be capable of trapping Sonic forever, which didn’t occur.

Thus, he would have a dream of a fourth dimensional space that can trap Sonic, and since Cyberspace absorbs the dreams and memories of those who enter, and the Test Run story happened before Frontiers, Eggman’s dream should be absorbed by Cyberspace (assuming the Ancients’ dreams aren’t already of a similar size, since it’s currently accepted the dreams of individuals are a similar size). Cyberspace itself is already uni sized and has a temporal component, hence 5-D.
 
JJSliderman said:
Thus, he would have a dream of a fourth dimensional space that can trap Sonic, and since Cyberspace absorbs the dreams and memories of those who enter,
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Ultimately this is were there's a disconnect. Cyberspace draws from some of their memories and some other spaces, but you would need to prove without a doubt that it completely copies everything they remember or dream about. I don't see that as being proven so I'm not seeing more than Tier 2.
 
Well, since all dreams of individuals are currently accepted as a similar size, I arguably don’t have to. The Ancients dreams would be the same size as Eggman’s, and the Ancients coded the totality of their dreams and memories into Cyberspace to fully preserve them. Alternatively, Cyberspace itself, as the dream of a collective group of incredibly intelligent Ancients, should be a peer of Eggman’s mental capacity/dream potential, so Cyberspace should be able to match the 4-D scope of Eggman’s dream, especially since the Ancients persist in the modern day.
 
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