DEATH BATTLE! Discussion Thread (2024–2025) (All-time Death Battle Spoilers Alert)

[SpecterSkater]

Buddy all jojo villains get ended by punch rush, thats not an argument against a literal bio from manga

It says there will and actions go to zero, a barrage aint proof its not working, also if joker is resisting this, i wanna see proof of that, not that "oh he resists all haxes ever", its not nlf either, reality warping was the only thing beating it and thats in non canon stuff

Like I said, I understand that's what the bio says but my main point of contention is how it's actually shown.

No-one is arguing that GER doesn't reset actions to zero. It's been shown off plenty of times. That's not what I'm arguing either, it's the 'reset will' part. In Jojo willpower is almost as important as in Persona, especially 5. My argument was that even after the punch rush it didn't show that Diavolo no longer had the willpower necessary to summon his stand to try and fight back. If after that punch rush Diavolo couldn't summon his Stand anymore and sat there to get squashed by Giorno it'd do what is said on that bio.

I'm also not trying to argue that Joker has a NLF with his willpower either here, I'm only going with the examples that we've seen in the games/anime that have had more showings than the effects of RTZ. The entire endings of 5 Vanilla and Royal have shown that his willpower is enough to outhax gods and people who are capable of creating entire dimensions-worth of willpower-altering haxes. Not only did he resist 5's end boss and Maruki, he overwhelmed them and won.

I'm only trying to point out that Joker's abilities and wincons (and in this case wincon denials of Giorno) have far more showings and examples than GER's one appearance in canon.

 

[SpecterSkater]

Just because Giorno has the ability to revert will doesn't mean he used it against Diavolo, from what I recall he hasn't done it canonically the only time he has was in the non-canon Jorge Joestar novel against Pucci (at least that's what I've heard I cant find the scan unfortunately).

Apologies for the double post, still getting used to forums again but this is another point.

If Giorno has this ability and has never shown it in canon I don't think it's fair to use it in the debate for this fight. I think it's why this whole debate is as contentious as it is because while I respect Giorno's abilities, him using GER is basically distilling him into Potential Man because of how vague it works from its one showing. And I know nobody is arguing against using GER at all for the debate because it's really not fair as he has the power at the end of Part 5.

 

[BlackDarkness679]

So we cant use a power officially stated cuz it wasnt used, yeah no, its stated it exists, no ifs or buts, just cuz he didnt try to Diavolo doesnt mean you exclude it and im getting fed up of this joker wank of "he resists all these haxes" proof it never happened, it gets old to just hear talk on his side

 

[Tipper17]

Sums it up well

 

[Peter_"Quicksilver"_Maximoff]

Joker-55% of winning
Girono-45% of winning

 

[ZeNoviceArtist]

I might get bonked for this, but is it selfcest if you have intercourse with your persona/stand?

 

[SpecterSkater]

So we cant use a power officially stated cuz it wasnt used, yeah no, its stated it exists, no ifs or buts, just cuz he didnt try to Diavolo doesnt mean you exclude it and im getting fed up of this joker wank of "he resists all these haxes" proof it never happened, it gets old to just hear talk on his side

All I'm saying is that if it were any other character that had a one sentence ability listed that they never showed in actual canon, people would be doubting its reliability in a vs debate. This isn't strictly a Giorno downplay or Joker wank in this regard, it's how discussing abilities against other ones work. Not to mention debating when verse-equalization comes into play.

I think Giorno has a lot of abilities that are great for vs debating and can play off of combatants really well. Life-shot, aging up, life creation are really cool abilities that are rad to think about how other powers interact. It's just that Joker has plenty of resistances to most of them being a JRPG character that has so many abilities/passives/items/etc that make a lot of that not as debatable than someone who comes from like another manga/anime.

Like Toma from A Certain Magical Index's power is his right arm negates all supernatural phenomenon, would we argue that it shuts down Stands entirely, even GER? Does he solo Jojoverse because of that one sentence? That's all I'm trying to argue here, and perhaps I'm not arguing it the best because I've never actually done much VS debating personally, just been watching it for years.

 

[BlackDarkness679]

No offense but i dont read all that, you just repeat basically same things

Some verses are different, case by case exists, also stands arent supernatural, its the user psyche manifested, ghosts are supernatural and they aint like stands

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

I might get bonked for this, but is it selfcest if you have intercourse with your persona/stand?

Uh... probably. They are aspects of yourself, after all.

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

"Death Battle shill" and all I'm doing is calling you out for being an annoying piece of work

Every time I comment you start sperging over the fact I didn't like Omni-Man VS Bradock. Meanwhile, all your comments are constantly glazing the show.

 

[JoshDoshMosh]

What does turning a person's "will" to zero even mean in this context? Will people affected by this lose all desire to fight and be left comatose? Isnt that just empathic manipulation? If Jonkler resists that it's gg then right

I know it wouldn’t work on him, but it’s the funniest idea to me. Imagine The Phantom Thieves just writing their calling card and mid way through Giorno’s ability hits and then they’re just like