• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Very small Lake Trio revision

The_real_cal_howard

The_real_cal_howard

Read my comic
VS Battles
Retired
40,446
12,914
And I mean veeeeery small.

Given that they're perfectly fine after Dialga/Palkia does a bad ending reset, can casually chill in the Distortion World, can take some attacks from the CT (who casually distort causal law), predates creation, time is almost literally their older brother, and pretty much exist on the level of the CT but with less power, they should be acausal.
 
Oh my frickin' god, Cal. Did you really have to unleash hell upon the wiki? Especially after a High 1-B WH40K upgrade?
 
Kepekley23 said:
Oh my frickin' god, Cal. Did you really have to unleash hell upon the wiki? Especially after a High 1-B WH40K upgrade?
Click to expand...
I know. I'm an absolute monster who must be punished. Severely. There is no redemption for me. ovo

Anyway, since this is a stupidly small revision, I'll add t. Because pretty much no support will be needed for this
 
Y'know, since I'm already here, and this thread being this short will be a bit anticlimactic, I should ask if we should give conceptual manipulation to the CT + LT. It's common knowledge at this point that they control the concepts they embody, so Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, Azelf, Uxie, and Mesprit would have Conceptual Manipulation over the concepts of time, space, antimatter, willpower, knowledge, and emotion respectively.

Also, @NeoZex, what were you saying about Dialga/Palkia erasing spirit again? I always forget to add it, so now that I have the time, could you tell me again?
 
Soul Manipulation for being able to erase all the spirit from existence:

"... ... Everything is ready for the creation of a new world. Now, all will end. And everything will begin. With this, the Red Chain made from the crystals of the three lake Pokémon. And this, the Red Chain I replicated with technological means... With these Red Chains I will pry open the portal to another dimension. I command that you unleash your power for me..."

"Dialga, the mythical Pokémon, and the master of time! ...And the other. Palkia, the mythical Pokémon, and the master of space and dimensions!"

"I've waited so long for this moment, Dialga and Palkia. Shaping this world is a double spiral of time and space. Yes, the very things that you have the ability to control! You will do my bidding! I will have your abilities as mine! With the power I wield, I will create an entirely new world! The incomplete and ugly world we have now can disappear. I am resetting everything to zero. Nothing can remain. It is all for making the ultimate world. A world of complete perfection. Nothing so vague and incomplete as spirit can remain."

"...I should have expected as much. Uxie, "The Being of Knowledge." Azelf, "The Being of Willpower." And Mesprit, "The Being of Emotion"..."

"The Pokémon have come to protect Sinnoh? Pathetic and worthless. It takes the three of them, the three lake Pokémon that symbolize spirit, to balance either the Pokémon of time or space. But they can't maintain balance against the two. Not when both Dialga and Palkia are here. Their coming here is in vain. So much meaningless drama. Now, <player>. You've constantly interfered with my plans, but you will be forgiven. After all, there will remain no spirit for all time when I am done. All spirit will disappear. It will be ripped away... From you! From your Pokémon! From those precious to you...! It is time! My dream will be my reality!"
 
The Everlasting said:
Controllig the concepts they embody doesn't necessarily mean they manipulate the actual concept.
Click to expand...
Dude, control and manipulate mean literally the same thing. They're synonyms lol.

That said, I do think I see what you mean. Just because say, Uxie is the concept of knowledge incarnate and can control knowledge doesn't mean that the concept bends to its will, being able to change up what knowledge means and whatnot. Yet being able to control knowledge on a conceptual level grants you conceptual manipulation, correct? It's somewhat of a broad ability, and it not being as versatile as say, Lucemon's (he does have concept manipulation, right?), it is still manipulating a concept, the same way being able to shoot fire give you fire manipulation rather than needing to bend fire to your every whim, being able to make fire cold and etc..
 
And we kinda debunked that, from the post I made a while back.

It makes absolutely 0 sense for the spirit in pokemon to be just emotion and if we accepted it as that, then the LT wouldnt have soul manipulation for creating it, yet they do.
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
Agreed with ever , not the first time ya brought this up .
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure it is. I've argued for abstract existence before and failed, but idk I argued for conceptual manipulation. Heck, it literally changes nothing about the character's powersets. It just states the level they can control it.

...unless you were talking to Neo
 
Yes, that's what I meant.

Manipulating a concept one embodies =/= manipulating the actual concept.
 
The Everlasting said:
Yes, that's what I meant.

Manipulating a concept one embodies =/= manipulating the actual concept.
Click to expand...
I figured.

Though, does the second half of my post hold true?
 
The term spirit has always been used to refer to the essence of being in pokemon, Spirit World was a dimension where spirits reside, and this plane of existence was revealed in Gen 4.

Cyrus, claiming that the human spirit is weak and incomplete, implies that he is not only referring to emotions.
 
And kukui, like 90% sure all 3 if the lake trio create spirit. Not just one or the other, all 3 in conjuction.

But in cyrus case he was talking about emotion, not the entire concept .
 
Also, something brought up before, if all Cyrus wanted to do was get rid of emotion he wouldnt even need Dialga or Palkia.

He'd just need to literally control or kill Mespirit.
 
Which wouldnt really even be required. Mesprits demise would just end emotion, no need to reset.

But like Cal said, im uneeded for now. So i shall go cry in the corner being unwant-

I mean ovo, watch from afar.
 
TheJ-ManRequiem said:
And kukui, like 90% sure all 3 if the lake trio create spirit. Not just one or the other, all 3 in conjunction.
Click to expand...
I'll derail for a single post to say that I don't think that matters. There's nothing that implies that the power needed to create spirit only works when the three do it together. Though, I doubt that's what you were trying to imply.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
Also, something brought up before, if all Cyrus wanted to do was get rid of emotion he wouldnt even need Dialga or Palkia.
He'd just need to literally control or kill Mespirit.
Click to expand...
That doesn't matter, Cyrus's motivation and his speech to you in US/UM state that spirit = emotion.
 
Well if one can suddenly control the other two aspects then fine , but not that probable , thatd kinda kill the poibt of the other part of the trio .
 
"...I should have expected as much. Uxie, "The Being of Knowledge." Azelf, "The Being of Willpower." And Mesprit, "The Being of Emotio"..."

"The Pokémon have come to protect Sinnoh? Pathetic and worthless. It takes the three of them, the three lake Pokémo that symbolize spirit."

Emotions are an intrinsic part of the spirit, therefore the elimination of the spirit erases emotions.

Also the Distortion World in the manga absorbs the spirits of Archie and Maxie, and they were obviously souls:

"Archie and Maxie explain to the two that after their "deaths", their spirits ended up in another world, where they at one point melded together and became one. After a hole to the real world was opened, an unknown voice called out to them, asking to protect the planet. After escaping from the world, they regained their bodies, albeit slightly different, gained Mega Evolution, and stole the orbs from Bill in order to save the planet from destruction. Just as they disappear completely, Archie and Maxie ask their subordinates to protect the planet."

"In the Omega Ruby & Alpha Sapphire chapter, it was revealed that Archie and Maxie's spirits had been sent to the Distortion World after their supposed deaths. There their spirits were merged, and during the events of the HeartGold & SoulSilver chapter, they had been pulled back to the real world in order to help save the Hoen region from an upcoming disaster."
 
@J-Man. Together likely grants an extended range, or increased potency of it. For example Groudon and Kyogre can't only control weather together, and Palkia and Dialga can't only manipulate matter together (same verse, you can't complain ovo). But again, this is off-topic and I promise this'll be my last post on this here. If you wanna continue, come to my wall (and that way, I can try to make up with ya, as I've not exactly been a good friend [we're friend's right?] recently, judging by some posts).
 
But can groudon control rain and can kyogre control whatever groudon actually does .

Why would each ine control the other aspects like azelf or uxie controlling emotion ?

Also no hard feelings obviously , worried ya git kinda pissed though .
 
Oh, I thought you meant the other time they were talking about spirit. The actual spirit, when they actually meant souls, in the Creation Myth. You're definitely right when it comes to Cyrus' definition of "spirit"

Also, cool. That's good.
 
Cal, Cyrus directly affirms that the spirit is represented by the being of knowledge, the being of emotion and the being of willpower.

They should at least get willpower manipulation and memory manipulation.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

StrymULTRA
Pokémon God Tiers: Several revisions
3 4 5
Replies
195
Views
10K
MountainWine
MountainWine
Everything12
  • Locked
Arceus Nonduality/Transduality Type 2?
Replies
38
Views
3K
Everything12
Everything12
  • Locked
God tier pokemon upgrade
4 5 6
Replies
237
Views
16K
Antvasima
Antvasima
StrymULTRA
  • Locked
Pokemon Tier 2 Hax Additions
4 5 6
Replies
228
Views
13K
Antvasima
Antvasima
StrymULTRA
Arceus and forgotten abilities + 5D Potency (avatar edition)
5 6 7
Replies
250
Views
10K
Arceus0x
Arceus0x
Back
Top