Pokemon Tier 2 Hax Additions

[StrymULTRA]

It was bound to come but here we are, with a pretty important Pokémon Tier 2 Hax CRT. Since the list to things to add is hella l o n g, I'll put this Google Doc, which I invite you to read really carefully before commenting here.

Also here are the revised profiles, which are also an huge clean-up due of them being extremely messy normally:

• Dialga
• Palkia
• Giratina
• Uxie
• Mesprit
• Azelf
• Arceus

For Darkrai, also, I'd like to point out that it tanking Dialga and Palkia's abilities isn't = resisting all the CT stuff, so I'd like to make it just the regular resistances of Dialga/Palkia and the ones of a regular Dark Type.

 

[GilverTheProtoAngelo]

Well you showed me this before, I agreed then and still agree now.

 

[RM97]

Seems fine

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

i disagree with type 5 acausality the description is type 4 acausality

 

[StrymULTRA]

i disagree with type 5 acausality the description is type 4 acausality

Except that Giratina already is Type 4, Arceus is completely outside the systems and laws of the verse due of them being just a mere extention of it, including the Distortion World which has laws completely different from the regular world, how's that not Type 5.

 

[theultimate5105]

I am pretty sure Arceus was already accepted to have all powers but since there are so freaking many it could not be applied
anyways agree with everything and neutral on Acausality type 5

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Except that Giratina already is Type 4, Arceus is completely outside the systems and laws of the verse due of them being just a mere extention of it, including the Distortion World which has laws completely different from the regular world, how's that not Type 5.

that not type 5. Type 5 requires explicit statements about being above causality.

 

[Thelastmlg]

Being outside stuff is not type 5, being above type 4 can support it but it would just be a higher degree of type 4 as well, some transcendence claims would help.

 

[StrymULTRA]

that not type 5. Type 5 requires explicit statements about being above causality.

It doesen't need such, PMMM iirc is an example of this.

Being outside stuff is not type 5, being above type 4 can support it but it would just be a higher degree of type 4.

Meh, since even the concepts of space-time are just a mere aspect, which have all the causality stuff, I don't see why Type 5 isn't applicable tbf.

 

[Hasty12345]

I also disagree with type 5 based on the current argument presented, however, I heard that type 1 AE of a type 2 concept can grant type 5 acausality. Can anyone confirm?

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

I also disagree with type 5 based on the current argument presented, however, I heard that type 1 AE of a type 2 concept can grant type 5 acausality. Can anyone confirm?

no

 

[theultimate5105]

Darkrai also should still resist EE since it resisted the creation trios EE

 

[StrymULTRA]

I also disagree with type 5 based on the current presented, however, I heard that type 1 AE of a type 2 concept can grant type 5 acausality. Can anyone confirm?

It's not necessary

 

[StrymULTRA]

Darkrai also should still resist EE since it resisted the creation trios EE

Ik, that's gonna be added too.

 

[Planck69]

Disagree completely with Type 5 Acausality, if that's all the proof there is then it just seems to be a higher degree of Type 4. Everything else seems fine but I'm no Pokemon expert.

@The_real_cal_howard @Elizhaa @Dino_Ranger_Black @Hop_Hoppington-Hoppenhiemer @SomebodyData @WeeklyBattles @Dragonmasterxyz @Colonel_Krukov @Saikou_The_Lewd_King @Starter_Pack @Shadowbokunohero @Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan @SamanPatou @KieranH10 @Executor_N0 @Firestorm808

Your help would be very appreciated here.

 

[NeoZex6399]

following this

 

[Planck69]

I also disagree with type 5 based on the current argument presented, however, I heard that type 1 AE of a type 2 concept can grant type 5 acausality. Can anyone confirm?

No, it doesn't.

 

[Hasty12345]

No, it doesn't.

no

nw

completely disagree on type 5 acausality then.

 

[BlackDarkness679]

You showed it to me before, i still agree with all this

 

[thetechmaster36]

I also disagree with the notion of Type 5 Acausality, but Type 4 should work fine. Everything else, I agree with unless counterarguments are presented.

 

[KieranH10]

Also disagree on Type 5 Acausality for now, but the rest seems fine to me.

 

[NeoZex6399]

Yeah, it looks like type 4 is the most reliable option.

 

[theultimate5105]

The Creation Trio and Arceus should also Resist Conceptual manip from this

 

[StrymULTRA]

The Creation Trio and Arceus should also Resist Conceptual manip from this

Nah, there isn't enough evidence for that tbh

 

[Everything12]

Well besides the whole Acausality 5 thing; that needs a bit more explicit statements and feats to get than what's been posted, I'm closer to agreeing than disagreeing.

The only reason I'm not flat out agreeing is that what does and does not give Type 2 Concepts seems to change each thread and I'd rather wait for at least a knowledgeable in this stuff to agree than have another mess like that Bleach thread.

 

[StrymULTRA]

The only reason I'm not flat out agreeing is that what does and does not give Type 2 Concepts seems to change each thread and I'd rather wait for at least a knowledgeable in this stuff to agree than have another mess like that Bleach thread.

Well, it should be Type 2 since Dialga and Palkia nuking the Spirit straight up completely rewrites the reality instead of just "changing it from that point" like a Type 3 concept nuke would.

 

[Overlord775]

agree mostly beside the type 5 acausality, though there's a thing that i find very wrong about the doc

Giratina isn't Matter, it's just anti-matter, Dialga and Palkia are the creators of matter

 

[Everything12]

Eh, who knows if that would be accepted as proof. The rules for this stuff seem arbitrary and constantly changing.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Giratina isn't Matter, it'sjust anti-matter, Dialga and Palkia are the creators of matter

I always thought it embodies both since they were related in both abilities and myths. I'd wait more input about this particular tho.

 

[KieranH10]

Actually, wouldn't the Avatar stuff only be Multiversal for Arceus? I don't see any major implication of a Multiversal Scale for Palkia and Dialga in their feats tbh, they can just as easily be considered a Universal scale imo, and Arceus stomps both of them, who would actually be Multiversal.

 

[NeoZex6399]

By the way, it is confirmed that Dialga can manipulate time in many more ways, this is from Pokémon Go btw.

-"Dialga has the ability to warp time by slowing it down, speeding it up, and even stopping it altogether, and Sinnoh region mythology says that time began moving when Dialga was born. Be sure to assemble a team that includes Fighting- and Ground-type Pokémon to take down this Legendary Pokémon originally discovered in Sinnoh before it overpowers your Pokémon with its special attacks!"

Don’t waste time - challenge Dialga in Raids! - Pokémon GO

pokemongolive.com

 

[StrymULTRA]

Eh, who knows if that would be accepted as proof. The rules for this stuff seem arbitrary and constantly changing.

Saw lots of verses which are such because of a similar thing like Archie Sonic tbf.

Actually, wouldn't the Avatar stuff only be Multiversal for Arceus? I don't see any major implication of a Multiversal Scale for Palkia and Dialga in their feats tbh, they can just as easily be considered a Universal scale imo, and Arceus stomps both of them, who would actually be Multiversal.

Cyrus stated in games that Palkia was affecting all the dimensions in the reset.

By the way, it is confirmed that Dialga can manipulate time in many more ways, this is from Pokémon Go btw.

-"Dialga has the ability to warp time by slowing it down, speeding it up, and even stopping it altogether, and Sinnoh region mythology says that time began moving when Dialga was born. Be sure to assemble a team that includes Fighting- and Ground-type Pokémon to take down this Legendary Pokémon originally discovered in Sinnoh before it overpowers your Pokémon with its special attacks!"

Don’t waste time - challenge Dialga in Raids! - Pokémon GO

pokemongolive.com

Useful, thanks.

 

[Overlord775]

I always thought it embodies both since they were related in both abilities and myths. I'd wait more input about this particular tho.

"From itself, two beings the Original One did make.Time started to spin. Space began to expand.From itself again, three living things the Original One did make. The two beings wished, and from them, matter came to be. The three living things wished, and from them, spirit came to be."

 

[Everything12]

"From itself, two beings the Original One did make. Time started to spin. Space began to expand.From itself again, three living things the Original One did make. The two beings wished, and from them, matter came to be. The three living things wished, and from them, spirit came to be."

To be fair, myths like this are kind of iffy when Giratina is involved, because to go along with its nature as a renegade that was banished and written out of history even the myths that should mention Giratina don't.

 

[Thelastmlg]

Yeah i find it weird that the creation trio is space, time and antimatter, but if he also embodies matter than half of his being was created by palkia and dialga, which sounds weird tbh, didn't they get born around the same time?

 

[NeoZex6399]

Giratina embodies anti-matter, but not the anti-matter we know, it is complicated.

 

[KieranH10]

Cyrus stated in games that Palkia was affecting all the dimensions in the reset.

Oh ye. Missed that lil top paragraph. Seems fine then!

 

[StrymULTRA]

Giratina embodies anti-matter, but not the anti-matter we know, it is complicated.

Type 1 NEP for Giratina when

 

[StrymULTRA]

Yeah i find it weird that the creation trio is space, time and antimatter, but if he also embodies matter than half of his being was created by palkia and dialga, which sounds weird tbh, didn't they get born around the same time?

Yeah, they were. It can be interpreted in more ways, like Arceus creating Giratina after the 2 wished to.

 

[Overlord775]

If the matter/anti-matter relation remains true then Giratina must have been born as a diachotomy reaction of them wishing matter into a creation and thus standing as the polar opposite of them/their power