RWBY's Old Calcs Has Became MRKs Overtime

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

Well, this is what we have: the nevermore is inconsistent.

And this is what I said in another thread about this:

"one panel shows us one thing then the other shows other leaving things to interpretation that x amount of people will either agree or disagree.

Who knows if this ends soon, because the real problem here inconsistent draw; you will get different results for everything here because x guy didn't draw properly and this led to people have their own view of this thing.

I can get a total different result that any other user by giving x reasoning that x amount of people will either agree or disagree, you know what you can do when this happens?

Which lead us to the inconsistent draw argument all over again.

All I can say is go with what is more consistent with the series itself with also its context and what it wanted to show us, if nothing is consistent and there is no way to reach an agreement then don't calc it."

So yeah, this variety of sizes of the nevermore falls into this argument.

So, any conclusion from another side other than Ricsi-viragosi's argument to use the concept art?

 

[WeeklyBattles]

It is physically impossible for the nevermore to be inconsistent, it is a puppet rig, it doesnt change size

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

And why there are different sizes then? Because if I add other method the final size of that most likely will be different than the other 8.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Differences in perspective most likely

Due to everything in the show being a single manipulatable model the sizes dont change the shot angle is what changes

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

I see.

So, in the end, the prior argument change from "different sizes" to "different angles".

Which by extend will change from "use what is most consistent" to "use the better angle". This make some of the methods more realiable than others as the perspective is better.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

Yes, that is correct

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

I will wait for dama to check this info and see what he thinks then, since he was the one who evaluated the calc.

 

[Chariot190]

It is physically impossible for the nevermore to be inconsistent, it is a puppet rig, it doesnt change size

Shit that's actually a really good point. Although do we know for sure? It's quite easy to change the models dimensions and sizes between scenes. DBZF for example does it to get cinematic angles that's otherwise not possible for example.

 

[Damage3245]

Chariot190 raises a good point. The scale of the models might change depending on the shot, we'd have no way of knowing.

But if this comes down to simply which perspective of the Nevermore is best to use, the most consistent shot/size would be best.

 

[WeeklyBattles]

It most consistent perspective would be best to use in this case yes

 

[Antoniofer]

Why not simply use the picture that kep and me used? You said than that bird was smaller than the one from the scene, but, despite the different results, the result its between the range.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Honestly, the measured size of the Nevermore doesn't actually change the results by much in most cases, it's kind of just down to weather we use the archaeopterix or raven, which I believe the former is far more reliable as it's close in size and body shape, while all the raven shares is name (that and scaling up a really small animal inflates the weight a buttload because of the square cube law, so using a larger bird will generally always yeild better results).

 

[TheRustyOne]

I believe method 1 is the best option. Weiss and the Nevermore are in the same shot, so there's no need to scale between different scans, and there doesn't seem to be any kind of expansion.

I'm also positive that's a shot meant to compare size anyway. It's the first real look we get of that Grimm and the zoom out doesn't have any cuts.

That's my opinion though.

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I don't really think it's an issue of the sizes fluctuating (I mean, come on, the show is animated with 3D models which would stay consistent in size), it's more an issue of perspective and angling of the camera.

As such, using the side-by-side Anton used in his own calc would be ideal.

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

Well, I don't really have a problem using the side by side image. If that one is a supposed standard nevermore, then it should grant an "at least class xyz" if the one of the feat is bigger than that.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I don't mind if we use the other artwork, but remember the actual Nevermore is bigger than that. That Nevermore is the one Ruby rode on in Volume 4. The art even says Volume 4 on it, the size between the two are also obviously different.

The closest offical art I can find of this Nevermore, is this right here. Which is listed under merchandise in the RWBY wiki.

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

Well, looking at it, the size will be, like, around 25-30 m. So, if it falls into acceptable, it can work.

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

So, is everyone fine with the new scan that TheRustyOne linked?

 

[Schnee_One]

Seems good

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Yeah, it looks good. We can get some progress done here.

 

[Spinoirr]

Perfect

 

[TheRustyOne]

Well if no one has any objections, I'll upload that into a blog in a few hours.

 

[TheRustyOne]

And it's done.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Nice.

 

[Spinoirr]

Now we wait for it to be added

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

Well if no one has any objections, I'll upload that into a blog in a few hours.

I tried doing the same method with the largest bird to have ever lifted (Argentavis) and ended up getting Class 25 with that same image.

I feel like using the largest bird possible would be ideal, as that would be closer to what we'd actually expect a bird the size of a Nevermore to weigh.

 

[DeathNoodles]

I tried doing the same method with the largest bird to have ever lifted (Argentavis) and ended up getting Class 25 with that same image.

I feel like using the largest bird possible would be ideal, as that would be closer to what we'd actually expect a bird the size of a Nevermore to weigh.

How can there be such difference in results?

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Not all birds were made equally thicc.

And the larger the bird, the more slim it'll be, in the real world at least.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

It somewhat affects Rwby so... earthquake crt.

 

[AlexSoloVaAlFuturo]

AAAAAAAAAAA.

So, any thoughts about Dargoo Faust's suggestion?

 

[DeathNoodles]

AAAAAAAAAAA.

So, any thoughts about Dargoo Faust's suggestion?

Not unless you count the disagreement of a user (who isn't even a calc member, a staff member, or even a knowledgeable member/supporter of RWBY) in Rusty's Nevermore weight blog...

 

[WeeklyBattles]

AAAAAAAAAAA.

So, any thoughts about Dargoo Faust's suggestion?

I disagree with it entirely, i dont see why we would use a bird that is not even remotely close to the nevermore' physiology to scale it

 

[Dargoo_Faust]

I disagree with it entirely, i dont see why we would use a bird that is not even remotely close to the nevermore' physiology to scale it

Except the larger size gives less of a margin for error due to inflation from the square-cube law.

There's an exponential increase as you use smaller and smaller animals and scale them up. Realistically a bird that large would want to weigh as little as possible to maintain flight, so using the largest birds we know of for scaling gives us the least it could possibly weigh given our knowledge of biology.

Like, for example, if it more closely matched a hummingbird and we scaled that up, we'd end up with something orders of magnitude above what we get for ravens. I don't think body proportionality makes much of a difference here, the size of the animal we're scaling does.

 

[Spinoirr]

Here is tge thing, Grimm don't have organs

Think about it, the god of darkness made them and he couldn't make life so why would he be able to make organs for Grimm

 

[DeathNoodles]

Here is tge thing, Grimm don't have organs

Think about it, the god of darkness made them and he couldn't make life so why would he be able to make organs for Grimm

It didn't explicitly say anything about the Grimm lacking organs though. It only says that that they lack souls (thus, doesn't have Aura). There are cases where soulless characters in fiction still has internal organs.

In fact, the main reason for Grimm evaporating upon death or in captivity (which they can't escape from or are able to kill their captors) was to prevent their inner biology/anatomy from being studied (so they likely had internal organs, else I don't see why there would even be a purpose for their bodies to evaporate when one should have little to no anatomy if they have no internal organs) . The only thing about them that makes them different from ordinary creatures is that they bleed black smoke rather than blood when injured or dying, that's about it.

 

[Nico-v11]

We've seen Grimm cut apart into pieces multiple times and have seen what the inside of them look like. They have no internal organs...

Now why exactly is it even important whether they do or don't to begin with?

 

[TheRustyOne]

I don't know if this is the right place, but I made this blog that puts the Colossus at 8-A+.

 

[Schnee_One]

Well

Shit

 

[DeathNoodles]

We've seen Grimm cut apart into pieces multiple times and have seen what the inside of them look like. They have no internal organs...

Now why exactly is it even important whether they do or don't to begin with?

Considering they bleed (even if it's a bunch of black smoke), evaporate upon death (which I'm pretty sure the main point of that process is to prevent anatomical/biological study by humanity), and still doesn't have any explicit statements of lacking internal organs (or the ilk)... I'm not even sure if they truly lack internal organs.

I am really only responding because of some user basing Grimm lacking internal organs through the mere speculation of the God of Darkness creating and not creating stuff, so I don't think Grimm having or not having internal organs is really important here.

 

[TheRustyOne]

If a calc group accepts this, then the RWBY Volume 6 cast should be upgraded. Either to at least 8-B, likely 8-A, or baseline 8-A for causing slight damage to the Colossus and making it stumble.