Nasuverse Discussion Board (New Forum)

[Wankbreaker]

@Synnian

could you send the original jp text of the ryougi type lumina thing here again?

also type lumina’s english release is known by the community to have bad translations all around

The guy simply makes absurd strawmans to avoid facing the actual arguments. Like him claiming I said that Shirou's Origin is "hero", just to make me look wrong, when I told him countless of times that Nameless it not the same person as FSN Archer, sending him both an official quote saying that, and a screenshot from the game itself saying that Archer's Origin is the remnant ideals of nameless heroes, which would likely include the Sword Origin of FSN Shirou.
Or him genuinely thinking that "The fate awaiting Ryougi was the murder of a god" is any different from "The destiny in store for her was being a god killer". All because their objective is keeping Arcueid as number 1. It's so bad that Neco/Marshadow literally and unironically said that Earth > the Root on CV..........

Hell, just look at this:

They used this to argue that Avalon can block MEoDP, which is contradicted by all lore and feats in the verse. They would use various parody meme non-canon instances to deny what is blatantly shown in the lore.

They are entirely dishonest and should just be ignored.

the fate extra materials are clear in saying that the only difference in their existence is their true name (Nameless erased his true name)

EMIYA has a true name recorded on the throne, so that discounts him.

but if you wanted to go this route, wouldn’t this mean that he would have access to every nameless heroes origin, which would be a near infinite/infinite amount?

also, it is not contradicted by the lore, as this is the only interaction that these two abilities have.

even then, what we know of avalon is that it is an absolute defense.
"All-Distant Utopia, [Noble Phantasm] Avalon.

Avalon. The land of eternal spring in the Arthurian legends, and the name of a fairyland.

Avalon is an ideal land associated with the island in Greek mythology where the 'immortal apples' are said to exist.

Not only does it heal the owner's wounds and halt aging, but if the true name is released, it decomposes into hundreds of parts and protects the owner from all interference.

• "所有者" (shoyuusha) - owner
• "を" (wo) - object marker
• "あらゆる" (arayuru) - all
• "干渉" (kanshou) - interference
• "から" (kara) - from
• "守りきる" (mamorikiru) - to fully protect

The scabbard of the holy sword was excavated from Cornwall by the Einzberns and given to Kiritsugu as a catalyst for summoning King Arthur.

It is a Noble Phantasm within the realm of magic that shuts out all physical interference, transtioning from parallel worlds, and communication from multidimensional spaces (up to the sixth dimension).

If Saber were to seclude herself with this, it would be beyond anyone’s control."手におえない" (te ni oenai)"

•Avalon: The Everdistant Utopia
The matching “scabbard” of the holy sword Excalibur. The wielder does not age, and injuries will also quickly heal.
After invoking its true name, Avalon dissipates as tiny particles into the air, and shields the wielder from all interference. No damage can be done to the wielder when a state of absolute defence is initiated. Even interference from the parallel world based on the Second Magic will be blocked. An “absolute defence” that can even repel the assault of True Magic, it is a True Magic in itself. No one can harm the tranquil King that stands in the land of Avalon.
When Avalon was unleashed, not even the King of Heroes could harm Saber.”

 

[Wankbreaker]

also, the mystic eyes of death are heavily implied to be able to be undone by rizo’s curse of time, which is purely time reversal.

 

[Wankbreaker]

Normal users can't tag people, so you should just respond to their post or ask on their profile.

ah, thanks

 

[TheSilverKing14]

also, the mystic eyes of death are heavily implied to be able to be undone by rizo’s curse of time, which is purely time reversal.

We have no idea what his time curse and it CAN easily surpass the second magic.

 

[HyperZero95]

Time reversal can work all the way to the abstract level, so this doesn't mean much. The regeneration of ALL Dead Apostles is indeed basic time reversal already, and it cannot stop MEoDP by any means, even prior to reaching its peak. On top of there being no actual evidence that Vaal's curse is time-reversal to being with. It could be countless of high tier forms of time manipulation.

I already obliterated your arguments and had my fill of entertainment with you clowns, I just addressed this one point since it was finally something new. Granted, completely deranged, but still new.

I'll only reply to other users and clarify their doubts stemmed from your lies now.

 

[Wankbreaker]

Time reversal can work all the way to the abstract level, so this doesn't mean much. The regeneration of ALL Dead Apostles is indeed basic time reversal already, and it cannot stop MEoDP by any means, even prior to reaching its peak. On top of there being no actual evidence that Vaal's curse is time-reversal to being with. It could be countless of high tier forms of time manipulation.

I already obliterated your arguments and had my fill of entertainment with you clowns, I just addressed this one point since it was finally something new. Granted, completely deranged, but still new.

I'll only reply to other users and clarify their doubts stemmed from your lies now.

soyou think his curse is above true magic? the highest forms of manipulation in their category? wow, amazing,altrouge must really be strong to keep someone like that under her control

 

[TheSilverKing14]

soyou think his curse is above true magic? the highest forms of manipulation in their category? wow, amazing,altrouge must really be strong to keep someone like that under her control

Straw man and we don’t even know how superordinate Vale is it’s likely he is a physical fighter with certain abstract abilities that counter full on abstract manipulators like Kishima Nanaya etc also true magic and magecrafts distinctions are illusory at best in Tsukihime worlds due to Unified Language being a thing and it is on the same rank/level as MEODP ie can extend to all of creation at it's best.

Though if you ask Mr Vale probably has some control over True Chaos but that’s a stretch and isn’t confirmed but makes sense from what we know

 

[Wankbreaker]

Straw man and we don’t even know how superordinate Vale is it’s likely he is a physical fighter with certain abstract abilities that counter full on abstract manipulators like Kishima Nanaya etc also true magic and magecrafts distinctions are illusory at best in Tsukihime worlds due to Unified Language being a thing.

Though if you ask Mr Vale probably has some control over True Chaos but that’s a stretch and isn’t confirmed but makes sense from what we know

5 magics, are the last 5 tasks humanity deemed impossible. this means that anything else is reproducible by magecraft or by some other method available to humanity. and as we know from knk, all 5 magics have something to do with time or space manipulation, and are the highest mysteries. you could argue that his time curse is a subset of an existing magic, like the fifth or second.

 

[HyperZero95]

soyou think his curse is above true magic? the highest forms of manipulation in their category? wow, amazing,altrouge must really be strong to keep someone like that under her control

Indeed, that's why she can manipulate Gaia down to an abstract level, turned Wallachia into an abstract phenomena, and is stated to rival Type-Moon himself, who is so powerful that Zelretch needed to permanently weaken himself to beat him while he underestimated him. Ik this is unfathomable to you because you think only Arcueid is allowed to be strong, but this is really just a new case of "you just have to accept other people can fight Arcueid".
Furthermore, there are no details on this curse. For all we know, it could be an ability that can only be used defensively, or only apply under specific circumstances. Regardless, this is nothing to Altrouge.

Carry on.

 

[TheSilverKing14]

5 magics, are the last 5 tasks humanity deemed impossible. this means that anything else is reproducible by magecraft or by some other method available to humanity. and as we know from knk, all 5 magics have something to do with time or space manipulation, and are the highest mysteries. you could argue that his time curse is a subset of an existing magic, like the fifth or second.

and as we know from knk, all 5 magics have something to do with time or space manipulation,

Literal Fanfiction since Mahoyo implies that the first magic changed everything at the beginning of reality and no before you mention it, Alice or your beloved Yumina have nothing to do with the first magic and secondly, the third magic is the materialization of the abstract soul in to a tangible form and gives you immortality and we have no idea what the fourth can do and the fifth cannot be realted to time as we know that the second's domain is time and the fifth replicated it on a whim likely meaning it has something to do with entropy which is mentioned in the vn and manipulating reality on all aspects not just time etc. Also, there are only five KNOWN magic's and there can be many more true magic's that humanity may have not discovered or known about in present etc.