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Dragon Ball Super Episode Discussion Thread 64: I broke Red's Streak (huehue) and it's time for the bittersweet ending of Super.
- Thread starter Stryk3r1337
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or this
or this...OVO
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Both Piccolos say hi ovoRyukama said:Goku may like to fight 1v1, but Frieza was his only major villain victory that wasn't assisted. And even then Trunks had to finish him off
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This episode was the missing puzzle piece for dbs to give us the feels that dbz gave us back then,
Endlich,das ist das alte Pfeffer!
Sferat e dragoit përgjithmon!
Endlich,das ist das alte Pfeffer!
Sferat e dragoit përgjithmon!
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now Jiren can use the power of frendship Deus Ex Machina, so he's stronger than Rage Mode MUI Goku
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lmfao that edit
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And each time he's gotten up, he's gotten noticeably stronger, is my point. Every single instance he ever used UIO, he got back up and then went on to perform stronger feats. Why would this be ANY different?Korudo Daio said:
I'll concede the point about the upgrade, since it's still up in the air regardless, but to claim that Goku ended Super being weaker than Vegeta's SSBE is fallacious, and directly ignoring previous instances wherein he got noticeable power boosts after losing his stamina/losing UI.
I don't care about previous instances. Unless there's explicit evidence that he was stronger then he wasn't as far as I'm concerned.
No, it most certainly isn't. He was stronger after beating Toppo and nothing suggests Goku's gotten any stronger outside of UI since then. You wanna assume Goku got a zenkai then go right ahead, but I'm not because there's no actual evidence of it. So yes, to me Vegeta is stronger than Goku sans UI.
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?Huesito88 said:
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Wow... I watched the episode and honestly... I enjoyed it.
Frieza and Goku working together... I was like ƒÿ▓. Zeno wanting someone to save the universes (Which let's use know why he did the tournament).
Lastly... My boy Frieza is alive!!!! at the end.
While the ending is somewhat of a fairy tale ending I actually liked it.
Frieza and Goku working together... I was like ƒÿ▓. Zeno wanting someone to save the universes (Which let's use know why he did the tournament).
Lastly... My boy Frieza is alive!!!! at the end.
While the ending is somewhat of a fairy tale ending I actually liked it.
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Low 2-C wasn't accepted. Freeza and 17 are being bumped up to "At Least 3-A".
So the list would be more accurately
1. Goku (UI)
2. Jiren
3. Vegeta
4. Goku (Without UI) 5. Toppo 6. Kefla 7. 17 8. Freeza 9. whoever else i'm too lazy to rank. Hit at number 9 for being possibly At Least 3-A as well?
So the list would be more accurately
1. Goku (UI)
2. Jiren
3. Vegeta
4. Goku (Without UI) 5. Toppo 6. Kefla 7. 17 8. Freeza 9. whoever else i'm too lazy to rank. Hit at number 9 for being possibly At Least 3-A as well?
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Android 17 fought a vastly weakened Jiren and Jiren only lost because they team up on himLordWhis said:
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But jiren still wasent low 2c at that point, unless i misu derstood somethingLordWhis said:
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No, it isn't. https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1519539#229LordWhis said:
At Least 3-A keys have been added. Meaning Freeza and 17 are above Hit and Gohan, but still ultimately weaker than SSBE Vegeta and SSBKKx20 Goku.
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MUI Goku is stronger than Beerus. He's stated in the official promos to be. He defeated Jiren who was stated to be the mightiest foe in DB history in the official promos. And Jiren was stated to be equal to if not above the GoDs by Whis before he unlocked his hidden power. The same hidden power who MUI Goku overpowered hard.
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Well, there is no confirmation about UI Goku statement in the anime.
The statement about Jiren being as strong as a GoD if not above it is left open for interpretation. Because the level of GoDs is not equal for all 12 of them. There is still a slight chance that Beerus might still be stronger and they might retcon it later lol
The statement about Jiren being as strong as a GoD if not above it is left open for interpretation. Because the level of GoDs is not equal for all 12 of them. There is still a slight chance that Beerus might still be stronger and they might retcon it later lol
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I'm sorry but this is pure headcanon.
There are two WoG statements that MUI Goku and Jiren who he scales are superior to Beerus. Whis directly says that Jiren is equal or greater to the level of the gods (this means GoDs in general not some arbitrary GoD that isn't Beerus).
Until something gets retconned MUI Goku > Beerus.
There are two WoG statements that MUI Goku and Jiren who he scales are superior to Beerus. Whis directly says that Jiren is equal or greater to the level of the gods (this means GoDs in general not some arbitrary GoD that isn't Beerus).
Until something gets retconned MUI Goku > Beerus.
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The manga is still going, and that will mostlikely have clear statements on how he conpares. One thing is for sure, the hakaishins while they might not have equal power, they are very close to each other, and jirens FP, who is above his god, was shit to MUI, and jiren needed to break his limits to conpete with MUI goku. To think that beerus is above MUI goku and LB jiren, is the same as thinking beerus can one shot a hakaishin, which is not the case. I know you guys dont like using the manga, but the manga is acurate in scaling when it comes to very important story characters.
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I don't mind using the manga for relative scaling between characters. Although I think the anime didn't include any confirmation from Beerus because they wanted to leave things open for the future. Otherwise they would have made it clear. I think it was a choice on purpose. That's all.
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Why would the very promos for said episodes confirm MUI and Jiren are above Beerus then? I think based on explicit official statements and the statements from Whis it's clear that they surpassed Beerus. Unless there's a retcon or some "Beerus was hiding his true power" crap in the future.
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