Dimension Of Whirling Lights Remake

[Serlock_Holmes]

I agree with cryo.

 

[Elizhaa]

I think it's a separate space-time, but I have my doubts about it being universe-sized

I think similarly. "Battle of Universal Scale" seems to vague to suggest the dimension is 3-A, let alone Low 2-C.
Statement:

• The main points were "introducing characters from the past and returning to the roots, the "Earth is in danger" stage, but as time went on, Goku and Vegeta grew stronger, and the scale of the battles increased, and the last film took the form of a Battle of Universal Scale." We wanted to write characters other than Goku and Vegeta. This time, Gohan and Piccolo play a very active role, and as we think about the story, we feel it's important to consider what the fans want. Of course, Gohan and Piccolo are popular characters, so we wanted them to play an active role in the film.

 

[CryoTheMayo]

Even if the dimension isn't accepted as universe-sized, it would still be granted 6 2-C durability right? Because Gogeta and Broly don't break out until their full power?

 

[CloverDragon03]

I mean, I guess?

That doesn't exactly do anything though

 

[CryoTheMayo]

I mean, I guess?

That doesn't exactly do anything though

If it's applied to the cosmology then manga characters would get 6 2-C starting with Broly and Gogeta. That's what I was told anyways, that upgrades to the cosmology apply to the entire verse. If so that would apply to Moro, UI Goku (Starting Moro), Granolah, Gas, UE Vegeta and Freeza.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Not sure about that one because we literally have no idea what happens involving the dimension in the manga

 

[CryoTheMayo]

Not sure about that one because we literally have no idea what happens involving the dimension in the manga

From what I can tell the accepted manga scaling chain blog uses the Broly movie as a canonical source for the manga. So I believe all of the dimension feats in the movie are accepted for the manga continuity.

 

[CloverDragon03]

I don't think that necessarily means this dimension has the same durability in the manga compared to the anime though

It has 6 universe 2-C durability in the anime

 

[StekFence]

Doesnt a scene of ssb goku and vegeta fighting broly appear in the manga? And that scene doesn’t occur in Movie. Plus, Dbssh got a manga adaption that is admittedly minorly different from the movie, but different nonetheless, as for example, goten and trunks perform far better and thus have different scaling.
Because of this, I don’t think we can say definitively say that the dimensions scene played out the same way

 

[CryoTheMayo]

I don't think that necessarily means this dimension has the same durability in the manga compared to the anime though

It has 6 universe 2-C durability in the anime

Yes and things like the Toei anime, GT and the movies were accepted as canon parallel timelines to the manga, which includes the DBS Anime and Manga. And I don't see a reason why the DBS manga wouldn't be a canon parallel timeline as well.

The cosmology blog (that is accepted and is on the verse profile) even states:

"Note: The full DB cosmology scales to 2-B due to countless timelines existing within the cosmology. Trunks cites that each action in a timeline creates a new timeline. He states that there’s a timeline where Goku is alive and a timeline where he is dead listing the endless possibilities. (Approved in this thread.) GT is also accepted as one of those endless possibilities/alternate timelines with Toriyama stating it’s a grand side-story and author avatars of Dr. Slump being aware of GT’s existence drawing it in Dr. Slump which is canon to DB/DBZ/DBS also proving that GT is an Alternate Timeline. The DBZ movies are also considered one of those endless timelines with statements such them being side stories, from a different dimension from the main timeline, and even different parallel worlds which further proves that they’re alternate timelines. So they can be used as additional proof. For cosmological purposes."​

​

So...if the Swirling Lights dimension is accepted as having 6 2-C durability that would apply to the cosmology itself across parallel worlds. Meaning for Broly and Gogeta to break into and out of it in the manga, they would need to have similar power to their anime counterparts. So 6 2-C. Unless of course it's demonstrated that the DBS Manga should not be accepted as a parallel world part of the rest of the franchise.

This is how the cosmology is currently treated on the wiki so I don't see the issue.

Doesnt a scene of ssb goku and vegeta fighting broly appear in the manga? And that scene doesn’t occur in Movie. Plus, Dbssh got a manga adaption that is admittedly minorly different from the movie, but different nonetheless, as for example, goten and trunks perform far better and thus have different scaling.
Because of this, I don’t think we can say definitively say that the dimensions scene played out the same way

The DBS Broly movie is still accepted as canon to the manga because those scenes are summarisation for people who haven't seen the movie. Super Hero is its own entire adaptation and doesn't expect you to watch the movie.

If you disagree with that then make a revision thread.

 

[StekFence]

Well if it’s just a summarization of the events, and not indicative of events playing put differently, then I have no complaints

 

[CloverDragon03]

So they can be used as additional proof. For cosmological purposes.

This is definitely the big stand-out for why the durability of the dimension would apply for both continuities, though my concern is that it says this is only applicable for "cosmological purposes." This seems to be extending beyond that, as it's cross-scaling the durability of the dimension in one medium to another where said dimension is never shown.

Edit: To clarify, I believe that "cosmological purposes" means something more along the lines of adding a new space-time to Universe 7's cosmology, for instance

 

[CryoTheMayo]

This is definitely the big stand-out for why the durability of the dimension would apply for both continuities, though my concern is that it says this is only applicable for "cosmological purposes." This seems to be extending beyond that, as it's cross-scaling the durability of the dimension in one medium to another where said dimension is never shown.

Yes but the dimension's properties (6 2-C durability) would apply cross-world (as all the parallel worlds share the same cosmology) unless there is evidence of its properties being different across worlds. And currently the Broly movie is accepted as canonical to the manga, meaning the events with the dimension shown there are currently considered canon.

• In the anime's world, SSB Gogeta and FPSS Broly broke out of the dimension when their Super Saiyan forms (Which are 6 2-C) could not.
• In the manga's world, the same events occur within the same dimension as the anime's world. Meaning it would also be 6 2-C and they would need similar power to break out, scaling them at least above their SS1 anime counterparts and therefore making them 6 2-C.

So we can conclude the dimension should be accepted as part of the cosmology of all these parallel worlds and that it would have 6 2-C durability. Meaning the manga scales to that unless there is a revision made that successfully removes the Broly movie from the DBS Manga continuity.

As it stands, the manga should scale to that feat and be made 6 2-C.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Accepting the Dimension of Strange Swirling Lights as part of the cosmology is different than accepting that it has 6 2-C durability across all canons though...

 

[CryoTheMayo]

Accepting the Dimension of Strange Swirling Lights as part of the cosmology is different than accepting that it has 6 2-C durability across all canons though...

Why would the properties of a dimension differ across parallel worlds when there is no evidence that said properties differ? Or why that would be the case? Isn't it more natural to assume that the dimension has the same durability across worlds unless contradicted?

 

[CloverDragon03]

Why would the properties of a dimension differ across parallel worlds when there is no evidence that said properties differ? Or why that would be the case? Isn't it more natural to assume that the dimension has the same durability across worlds unless contradicted?

You're asserting they have the same properties, so you need to prove that, instead of demanding evidence that they don't

 

[CryoTheMayo]

You're asserting they have the same properties, so you need to prove that, instead of demanding evidence that they don't

You are asserting that the properties are arbitrarily different across parallel worlds when the dimension is part of the cosmology. When there is no evidence of that. I am asserting that since the dimension has the property of being 6 2-C that would apply to its depiction in a parallel world, as there is no evidence on the contrary.

You can't state that an entire dimension just suddenly has infinitely lower durability (multiple levels of infinity at that) in one parallel world with zero justification for that interpretation. You have to justify that claim with evidence. Comparatively I don't need evidence because nothing contradicts the properties presented in the canon. If it is 6 2-C and part of the cosmology that is shared across parallel worlds then why would anyone think it arbitrarily has 3 2-C durability in another world?

I'm getting bored of this so I'm going to drop it. Anyone else can feel free to pick it up. A revision will probably be made after this thread is locked anyways.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I think similarly. "Battle of Universal Scale" seems to vague to suggest the dimension is 3-A, let alone Low 2-C.
Statement:

• The main points were "introducing characters from the past and returning to the roots, the "Earth is in danger" stage, but as time went on, Goku and Vegeta grew stronger, and the scale of the battles increased, and the last film took the form of a Battle of Universal Scale." We wanted to write characters other than Goku and Vegeta. This time, Gohan and Piccolo play a very active role, and as we think about the story, we feel it's important to consider what the fans want. Of course, Gohan and Piccolo are popular characters, so we wanted them to play an active role in the film.

Well, in the novel it describes that in that same dimension there are dimensional barriers, from what I remember the Ultima mentioned that these dimensional barriers would be low 2-C, wouldn't that be even more proof? In addition to calling this dimension another world or superdimensional dimension, the creators of the film themselves mentioned that the film is on a "Universal scale", certainly stating that the feat of breaking this dimension would be Universal, right? Despite all this, we still have Broly and Gogeta who are 2-C fighting inside it (which obviously proves even more that this dimension is not a simple dimension smaller than the Universe itself), it wouldn't make sense for such a dimension to withstand several attacks from 2 characters. 2-C and not be at least 3-A or 2-C

Dimensional barriers

 

[Omegabronic]

Well, in the novel it describes that in that same dimension there are dimensional barriers, from what I remember the Ultima mentioned that these dimensional barriers would be low 2-C, wouldn't that be even more proof? In addition to calling this dimension another world or superdimensional dimension, the creators of the film themselves mentioned that the film is on a "Universal scale", certainly stating that the feat of breaking this dimension would be Universal, right? Despite all this, we still have Broly and Gogeta who are 2-C fighting inside it (which obviously proves even more that this dimension is not a simple dimension smaller than the Universe itself), it wouldn't make sense for such a dimension to withstand several attacks from 2 characters. 2-C and not be at least 3-A or 2-C

Dimensional barriers

The dimensional barriers are not low 2-C, that is not what Ultima said, he said that they are the fabric of space time, so distorting them in a universal scale is a low 2-C feat, the barriers by themselves are not low 2-C constructs

 

[Elizhaa]

The dimensional barriers are not low 2-C, that is not what Ultima said, he said that they are the fabric of space time, so distorting them in a universal scale is a low 2-C feat, the barriers by themselves are not low 2-C constructs

I shared similar thoughts. Also, there is no conclusive statement about the size of the dimension, which weakens the arguments.

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

Eu compartilhei pensamentos semelhantes. Além disso, não há afirmação conclusiva sobre o tamanho da dimensão, o que enfraquece os argumentos.

I see, could you close this?

 

[Elizhaa]

Sure.