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Devil May Cry - About PoC

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Lephyr help me understand if you have read more because I don't have that much time. The stuff this thread intends to include is main story stuff that are just not there anymore or just stuff that were there to support an event and now are not? In the first case without knowing the standards to my mind it's much more logical to not include stuff that are still there. Basically stuff that were main story back then and now are not are considered to not exist for all intents and purposes beyond maybe giving some small clarifications but big stuff like new people, areas and items I don't think should be in. If it was an event that fits in the timeline of the games but it was just limited and now over and it is for sure canon I see no reason not to include it.
Both cases should be included as long as they aren't retconned (by deletion or otherwise) or contradicted.

To support the notion they weren't retconned, a reference to these events/information should still exist in some way in the base work (PoC in this case).
 
That it applies to both cases. If the information is still recognized and wasn't contradicted, fine to use (and currently aligns with both our standards and precedent set by these standards, as far as I can see)
Bruh the two condition that i say is literally contradicted with each other, how can something is both cases

I mean is the version 1.0 is limited time event or not?

If it mean the other condition, that i see in here where version 2.0 is just update of version 1.0, therefore the version 1.0 is not limited time event. Deleted content cannot be use, because the developer themself want to remove that content, why even we still use that
 
The standards support his point. If there's literally zero mention of stuff from 1.0 (which is why I'm suggesting for Sevii to bring scans of the contrary), then they would effectively be retconned out.
The distinction of 1.0 and 2.0 is purely a global release thing. For mainland China it was just a overhaul update like any other update.
2.0 isn't a reboot of 1.0, both are same thread of game, just represent different versions.
 
The distinction of 1.0 and 2.0 is purely a global release thing. For mainland China it was just a overhaul update like any other update.
2.0 isn't a reboot of 1.0, both are same thread of game, just represent different versions.
So the information deleted it's still recognized in some way? Cuz otherwise, you might have a problem.
 
Both cases should be included as long as they aren't retconned (by deletion or otherwise) or contradicted.

To support the notion they weren't retconned, a reference to these events/information should still exist in some way in the base work (PoC in this case).
Yeah I'm okay with that. Just kinda puzzled what statement would make everything valid but we will see about it, but yes if there are things alluding to those then they would be good. My point is stuff that existed but now nothing points to them shouldn't be taken into account.
Yes one of the bosses that was stated to bypass time by his movement still does it in game so they do reference those with visuals still which I think is a fair game.
Also please bring proof of all that. I would consider it good for the DMC supporters as they can dump all stuff here to have them in future crt.
 
Which would mean everything that is to be included should be referenced. Like after having proof for that boss fight then he can be included and relevant story about him. But it would be best to tackle that stuff individually. Is the game even out yet to have solid proof and maybe play it?
 
...because it's referenced. Thus, it still exists in-verse.
Reference just for if it exist, if it not then just why??? No if it already being deleted it not exist anymore in verse unless it limited time event or in previous version of the verse

I just think we need a thread for discuss this problem
 
Which would mean everything that is to be included should be referenced. Like after having proof for that boss fight then he can be included and relevant story about him. But it would be best to tackle that stuff individually. Is the game even out yet to have solid proof and maybe play it?
Like, literally scan for every single thing? Now that's a tall order. I would disagree with that out the simple fact: No fiction will ever truly do that. But likely other staff members would disagree with me here.

We'll provide it then. Just wait for Sevil to come online.
I guess put me on neutral until then.
 
Reference just for if it exist, if it not then just why??? No if it already being deleted it not exist anymore in verse unless it limited time event or in previous version of the verse

I just think we need a thread for discuss this problem
Umm if it's referenced it still exists. Like if before there was a battle with Dark Lord wtf and the game changes but there is still a Dark Lord WTF and the game portrays him in basically the same way then the information from the past can be used.

Like, literally scan for every single thing? Now that's a tall order. I would disagree with that out the simple fact: No fiction will ever truly do that. But likely other staff members would disagree with me here.
Eventually scans will refer to multiple stuff which would make many things canon again. My problem is taking some stuff as canon and other stuff that are not referenced anywhere themselves basically gaining free entry because if some stuff are canon then it would be (to my mind logically faulty) natural to make nearly everything canon. Basically take the most conservative approach in this topic where only stuff with proof become canon again. But we can see how other people feel about this. Would you be of the opinion that this issue should be tackled in a staff discussion thread to have a precedent and a stable guideline for it?
 
Yeah I don’t think every single fictional verse will reference every single deleted content ,they would reference some of it in a way which in my opinion is more than indicative of it being valid to use.
 
Reference just for if it exist, if it not then just why??? No if it already being deleted it not exist anymore in verse unless it limited time event or in previous version of the verse
I literally brought you an example of things literally deleted. Like, the Living RPG is gone, dead. It is not maintained, nor upholded, nor anything of the sort by WotC (and in fact, information of it isn't supposed to be readily distributed, from what I've heard in certain d&d forums).

It still canon, because Savage Tide referenced it, and Savage Tide is actively recognized as having taken place canonically in the verse, as then it got referenced in subsequent editions.

That fulfills our requirements quite nicely. It's the same here.
 
Yeah I don’t think every single fictional verse will reference every single deleted content ,they would reference some of it in a way which in my opinion is more than indicative of it being valid to use.
Then that content which has been referenced is valid to use. The other content that hasn't been referenced can't be valid to use because for all intents and purposes it doesn't exist except in some webby SSD.

To keep with my example above. Let's say the Dark Lord WTF had in prior version a commander named WTH who could cut space. That commander is never referenced anywhere though, so in the new version we can use Dark Lord's WTF stuff, but we can't use Wth stuff. Now if feats for Wtf involve Wth then yeah it's going to be a pickle so Lephyr do think about making a staff discussion.
 
Umm if it's referenced it still exists. Like if before there was a battle with Dark Lord wtf and the game changes but there is still a Dark Lord WTF and the game portrays him in basically the same way then the information from the past can be used.
Yeah then just a content of "battle with dark lord" that we cannot use, because just it that being deleted. I talking about something that literally being deleted, why we use that?
 
I do know they released a trailer just three weeks ago that still featured Pluto and Nevan, so the characters are still there at least. Pretty much the same boss fight appeared to be being used for Pluto too.
 
I do know they released a trailer just three weeks ago that still featured Pluto and Nevan, so the characters are still there at least. Pretty much the same boss fight appeared to be being used for Pluto too.
Then those characters are fine. Ideally they would have the same story. Is the game nearly out?
 
Then that content which has been referenced is valid to use. The other content that hasn't been referenced can't be valid to use because for all intents and purposes it doesn't exist except in some webby SSD.

To keep with my example above. Let's say the Dark Lord WTF had in prior version a commander named WTH who could cut space. That commander is never referenced anywhere though, so in the new version we can use Dark Lord's WTF stuff, but we can't use Wth stuff. Now if feats for Wtf involve Wth then yeah it's going to be a pickle so Lephyr do think about making a staff discussion.
That’s asking for too much, there is no reason for the devs to reference everything since they will be under the impression that the content is still valid by referencing parts of it.
 
Then that content which has been referenced is valid to use. The other content that hasn't been referenced can't be valid to use because for all intents and purposes it doesn't exist except in some webby SSD.

To keep with my example above. Let's say the Dark Lord WTF had in prior version a commander named WTH who could cut space. That commander is never referenced anywhere though, so in the new version we can use Dark Lord's WTF stuff, but we can't use Wth stuff. Now if feats for Wtf involve Wth then yeah it's going to be a pickle so Lephyr do think about making a staff discussion.
It's not that complicated of an issue to warrant a staff discussion. We simply won't use "General WTH". GGs.
 
That’s asking for too much, there is no reason for the devs to reference everything since they will be under the impression that the content is still valid by referencing parts of it.
How is the content valid if it's being deleted? It's not limited event stuff, if it was then even a small reference unlocks a lot of content. If it was main story stuff though then the approach is much more conservative because those were all basic stuff that are now deleted.

Basically people that played the new version wouldn't even know of their existence.

It's not that complicated of an issue to warrant a staff discussion. We simply won't use "General WTH". GGs.
But what if Dark Lord Wtf has fought the General, but this is not shown anywhere? Do we only make the stuff canon that have no relation to Wth? Basically how much does one character make canon everything connected to it without that other stuff being referenced in some way, except existing in the old version to the character's story.

Nevan was shown in a cutscene, same as before, and Pluto was still fighting with his spear like before. It said it was coming soon, but no date was given.
Hope my phone can run it, cause I haven't played anything beyond base dmc4 and I want new stuff. Too poor to buy pc to support DMC4 V and Dmc5 and stuff.
 
Like, literally scan for every single thing? Now that's a tall order. I would disagree with that out the simple fact: No fiction will ever truly do that. But likely other staff members would disagree with me here.
I wouldn't disagree. And yeah, asking a scan for literally every single thing is just borderline insanity.
 
That’s asking for too much, there is no reason for the devs to reference everything since they will be under the impression that the content is still valid by referencing parts of it.
That's the point. In this example, "General WTH" literally is not mentioned to ever exist anymore. That's a valid retconned case.

However, he doesn't need a name drop. If "General WTH" did something in the story, and the event is mentioned to have happened even without mentioning him, he would still be considered part of the story imo.
 
It's a bit messy. I will say though, that typically having something referenced from something which is no longer available lends credence to the entire entry. If a short game has a monster and some wizards or something, and then some of those wizards are referenced by name and described doing similar things in something else, it basically hints that the whole game is canon, as that game is otherwise the only place that wizard exists.
 
I would like to point out that most of the characters that have been shown in 1.0 and did have the statement for certain movements/ abilities were shown to use them ingame too so yeah they are definitely not retconned in our case.
 
It's a bit messy. I will say though, that typically having something referenced from something which is no longer available lends credence to the entire entry. If a short game has a monster and some wizards or something, and then some of those wizards are referenced by name and described doing similar things in something else, it basically hints that the whole game is canon, as that game is otherwise the only place that wizard exists.
Yeah, that's my belief as well.

But again, couple staff might disagree. So we shall see.
 
Holmes’s creation.
I'm proud of him.
That's the point. In this example, "General WTH" literally is not mentioned to ever exist anymore. That's a valid retconned case.

However, he doesn't need a name drop. If "General WTH" did something in the story, and the event is mentioned to have happened even without mentioning him, he would still be considered part of the story imo.
Yeah if an event he participated in especially if he spearheaded is referenced he can be considered canon except if something was changed enough to exclude his involvement. Also if something Dark Lord Wtf does points to Wth then he can also be considered valid like some move that we know Wth did in the past.
 
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