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One Piece High 7-A Field Day (Wano+ Edition)

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Eminiteable said:
For the at least 7-A+ scaling that KingTempest proposed it scales only to Hybrid as far as I can tell, from scaling to Ulti his upscaling to zoan forms is 7-A+.

I don't think Sanji scales since X Drake shrugged off with the kick without noticing & as for the tail smack it's probably unlikely that Sanji scales to 7-A+ for taking this since not only does it not seem to be a serious attack but X Drake was working against the beast Pirates at this point and it's quite plausible that he's not willing to seriously hurt the allies at this point.
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Sanji only got a little bruise from a tail attack from X-Drake in full dinosaur form (which should be his strongest form, physically and only physically). Nothing suggests that Drake was suppressed and he could totally have thought "let's sacrifice this one, I have to, for a greater goal".
Also, 7-A+ Killer and just 7-A Sanji is kinda ridiculous, just look at portray. Sanji had a fight against King, with his suit, could easily send fly headliners in base (no diable jambe), ignored Page One (he previously toyed with him with his suit) and escorted Luffy. Killer had difficulties against some gifters...
 
Lgamer099_99 said:
Sanji only got a little bruise from a tail attack from X-Drake in full dinosaur form (which should be his strongest form, physically and only physically). Nothing suggests that Drake was suppressed and he could totally have thought "let's sacrifice this one, I have to, for a greater goal".
Also, 7-A+ Killer and just 7-A Sanji is kinda ridiculous, just look at portray. Sanji had a fight against King, with his suit, could easily send fly headliners in base (no diable jambe), ignored Page One (he previously toyed with him with his suit) and escorted Luffy. Killer had difficulties against some gifters...
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Killer wouldn't get 7-A+ for this since this is for Zoro's Onigashima Key. His dinosaur shouldn't be his strongest since X Drake is primarily a dual wielder user & against Apoo didn't use his full dinosaur form rather used his Hybrid (which so far has been shown to be the strongest form for most zoan users)

Drake's intentions for helping Law and joining luffy comes from before wano where he talked to Coby, Coby says something along the lines of he helps his friends and but is hard to reach if he's your enemy; Drake wouldn't sacrifice one of Luffy's crewmates where he didn't need too & a casual tail smack shouldn't be compared to his main fighting style in a different form where he's scaling too.
 
Eminiteable said:
Killer wouldn't get 7-A+ for this since this is for Zoro's Onigashima Key. His dinosaur shouldn't be his strongest since X Drake is primarily a dual wielder user & against Apoo didn't use his full dinosaur form rather used his Hybrid (which so far has been shown to be the strongest form for most zoan users)

Drake's intentions for helping Law and joining luffy comes from before wano where he talked to Coby, Coby says something along the lines of he helps his friends and but is hard to reach if he's your enemy; Drake wouldn't sacrifice one of Luffy's crewmates where he didn't need too & a casual tail smack shouldn't be compared to his main fighting style in a different form where he's scaling too.
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I hate when someone doesn't get what I mean, sigh. Of course Drake's hybrid is overall stronger, he uses dual weapons. But physically talking, the dinosaur form is the strongest, his size talks alone.
Also, Drake fought against Zoro and Apoo also in his base form.
And c'mon, lore-wise it's clear that Sanji should scale above Page One and Ulti, he ignored Page One the second time he met him and told Usopp to fight him, Franky is also going to fight Sasaki from what we've seen and Queen mentioned Judge. And no one knows why, Sanji's feats against King were totally ignored, his bones never broke during the clash with King and he didn't took any damage from King's attack, King's full zoan beak attack is clearly well above Ulti's headbutts and Page one's physical attacks...
 
Lgamer099_99 said:
And c'mon, lore-wise it's clear that Sanji should scale above Page One and Ulti, he ignored Page One the second time he met him and told Usopp to fight him
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Don't know about any of that, nor have I argued against it.
Lgamer099_99 said:
Of course Drake's hybrid is overall stronger, he uses dual weapons. But physically talking, the dinosaur form is the strongest, his size talks alone.
Also, Drake fought against Zoro and Apoo also in his base form.
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Yes base Drake and Zoro together pressured Apoo, and then Hybrid Drake continued to pressure Apoo on his own but couldn't break his guard. Serious Zoro showed he could do that and one shot him.

I don't think Sanji should scale when he was swattted away with a tail smack & for having his attack be ignored.

But either way I'm not sure this is relevant to this CRT spefically since it's discussing potential High 7-A scaling for character's and even if Sanji did scale to Drake and other Tobi Roppo it would only mean he's 7-A+.
 
Dr.Fix said:
Still waiting on @Damage3245 to cite "Up-Scaling" days later . . . No sign of it on the scaling page.
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Attack Potency.

"+" symbol​

Currently misused to an extraordinary degree on the wiki, the "+" symbol should be used when the Attack Potency has been calculated to be greater than the average (arithmetic mean) of the high end energy level and low end energy level of a particular tier.

The "+" symbol can also be used if there exists a calculation extremely close to the arithmetic mean, and characters scale above the calculated feat by a wide margin, for example being able to defeat enemies on such levels with a single casual attack.
Click to expand...
 
I wanna get a good justification for High 7-A admirals. The best calc for them is 7-A.
 
@Eminiteable that was helpful thank you.

So for this purpose Zoro does not scale as he would already be in the + tier.. Even if the + was shifted to a whole new tier, he doesn't meet the 1.5. He would need to be close to 800 megatons instead of 550.
 
Dr.Fix said:
@Eminiteable that was helpful thank you.

So for this purpose Zoro does not scale as he would already be in the + tier.. Even if the + was shifted to a whole new tier, he doesn't meet the 1.5. He would need to be close to 800 megatons instead of 550.
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Zoro has much stronger moves. That's why he upscales up there since he can get 2 more swords and do the same thing at the same time.
 
KingTempest said:
Zoro has much stronger moves. That's why he upscales up there since he can get 2 more swords and do the same thing at the same time.
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Even if that is true (Others can get into why or why not) it would apply only to those techniques.

Ie: 7-A+ with one swords, Higher with 2, higher with 3 . . . . . .

Rather than: At least high 7-A.
 
I don't believe a specific number was specified on, but again like what's been said before:
firstly it was a one shot & it cut through a >7-A+ weapon. Secondly it's an unnamed draw attack, making it likely inferior to his standard battle moves. Lastly we know his sword-styles increase in strength by a decent amount and Santoryu is his standard base stats that we use in Vs Battles.

A 1.8 times difference coupled with these reasons seems reasonable. Also "At least High 7-A" was unreasonable I agree so baseline was settled for.
 
It was 2 Mountain+ objects btw, Apoo and his weapon. Apoo took a hit from Kid, his Tonfas took hits from Hybrid Drake.

Not at all, because Zoro has shown that no matter how many swords he has he'll still be on par with his opponent.
Zoro could block 2 of Kaku's swords with 1 sword then match him with 2 swords again.

Plus, he has much stronger techniques so regardless it wouldn't mean much.
 
I read 1.5. Lack of specificity creates abuse. If an exemption is to be made it wouldn't be when the target (Apoo) was busy with Drake when Zoro attacked. I would say that brings the number down further.
 
Reading near the end of the thread many say a "specific number seems inappropriate" so I'm going with that, mostly from what i can tell people just don't agree with it being a 2 times increase.
 
Apoo was dodging attacks from both of them together and was fending off their attacks by himself prior, there's no excuse.

Plus, Zoro came from Drake's direction,
 
Dr.Fix said:
If an exemption is to be made it wouldn't be when the target (Apoo) was busy with Drake when Zoro attacked.
Click to expand...
For this, Apoo's guard was still up and with Zoro cutting the weapon as well it shows superiority to his whole guard, and like Tempest said he was attacking from Apoo's direction where his "guard" should be primary focused.

I can't see how Drake was helping Zoro perform this feat since he was also blitzed alongside Apoo.
 
Damage3245 said:
Well, I don't think we can just reject the CRT outright because you don't want to debate the issues with the scaling justifications.
Click to expand...
A good handful of them I've already covered just to be shut down by heavy bias--especially regarding Zoro scaling. I'm not dismissing them simply because I disagree, but because I've already talked about them, or tried to at least.
 
Also, the difference between someone like Doflamingo and Zoro for upscaling is that Doffy scales far above characters who scale to the 377/420MT region, only jumping up to 550MT.

Scaling Zoro to be High 7-A implies he's somehow 2x stronger than the other (BASE-LINE) 7-A+ characters even though this should only apply to his Haki feats anyways (Which so far is Apoo which is still a questionable case since we never see Zoro's blade at the moment of contact, and Apoo was focused on Drake and likely had no preparation for Zoro. Keep in mind Apoo was holding off a serious Haki-imbued Zoro WITH Drake earlier on when he actually saw him coming)
 
Well, the changes have been made now for Zoro, Apoo and X-Drake.

I'd like to go back to my original suggestion and put a pause on all AP/Durability revisions for the Wano Arc until the Wano Arc, or at least this battle on Onigashima, is over.
 
CinCameron20 said:
Scaling Zoro to be High 7-A implies he's somehow 2x stronger than the other (BASE-LINE) 7-A+ characters even though this should only apply to his Haki feats anyways (Which so far is Apoo which is still a questionable case since we never see Zoro's blade at the moment of contact, and Apoo was focused on Drake and likely had no preparation for Zoro. Keep in mind Apoo was holding off a serious Haki-imbued Zoro WITH Drake earlier on when he actually saw him coming)
Click to expand...
Baseline 7-A is 550 megatons, it's not a 2 times increase and even if Doffy scales far above those 377 Megatons characters he still couldn't one shot them. One shotting a character shows far more superiority and these cases can't be compared.

All this means is Zoro wasn't serious previously, again this has been mentioned before previously if Zoro attacked from where Apoo's Guard was up and cut through both the Tonfa and Apoo while speed blitzing both Drake and Apoo how at all did he do it with help,

So if we're waiting on Wano scaling does this put a hold on the likes of the possibilities getting changed or can we finally begin?
 
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Damage3245 said:
Well, the changes have been made now for Zoro, Apoo and X-Drake.

I'd like to go back to my original suggestion and put a pause on all AP/Durability revisions for the Wano Arc until the Wano Arc, or at least this battle on Onigashima, is over.
Click to expand...
I am not sure if that would be wise or not. If we wait with upgrades for several months or even over a year, it will breed hostility from many One Piece fans.
 
Antvasima said:
I am not sure if that would be wise or not. If we wait with upgrades for several months or even over a year, it will breed hostility from many One Piece fans.
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One Piece fans have been patient thus far (you'd have to be, with a series that's approaching 1000 chapters in length). Waiting for the current battle to be over doesn't seem like much of a stretch.
 
Shouldn't have much longer anyways, they're close to reaching Kaido in the next chapters and there's a time limit for his defeat (being dawn & so he doesn't nuke the flower capital) so we shouldn't have to wait much longer.

Personally I think it's best to wait for scaling the Scabbards & Calamities, although, I do believe we could at least cover Marco for his recent feat against BM and maybe sort of the "at least 7-A+, possibly High 7-A" stuff for him.


Also with Zoro being upgraded now to baseline would it be appropriate for Mihawk to scale as well due to "being the strongest In name and actuality"? I'm not sure if this warrants an "at least high 7-A" but it should at least remove the 7-A+ scaling from him
 
This whole thread isn't just Wano characters.

I appreciate Emin for worrying about other characters as well.

What we need accepted or conversed about (I'm adding new people) outside of Wano is
  1. Whitebeard's Commanders
  2. The Primary Color Admirals
  3. Mihawk and Shanks since people don't think status is enough for Shanks
  4. And probably some more
 
Antvasima said:
I am not sure if that would be wise or not. If we wait with upgrades for several months or even over a year, it will breed hostility from many One Piece fans.
Click to expand...
1) you're exaggerating how long it will be

2) the emotions of impatient people are not a concern unless you care more about appeasement then accuracy. Your rushing matters never helps credibility.
 
Damage3245 said:
Well, the changes have been made now for Zoro, Apoo and X-Drake.

I'd like to go back to my original suggestion and put a pause on all AP/Durability revisions for the Wano Arc until the Wano Arc, or at least this battle on Onigashima, is over.
Click to expand...
Case in point it seems profiles are being changed before without regarding counter arguments.
 
CinCameron20 said:
Also, the difference between someone like Doflamingo and Zoro for upscaling is that Doffy scales far above characters who scale to the 377/420MT region, only jumping up to 550MT.

Scaling Zoro to be High 7-A implies he's somehow 2x stronger than the other (BASE-LINE) 7-A+ characters even though this should only apply to his Haki feats anyways (Which so far is Apoo which is still a questionable case since we never see Zoro's blade at the moment of contact, and Apoo was focused on Drake and likely had no preparation for Zoro. Keep in mind Apoo was holding off a serious Haki-imbued Zoro WITH Drake earlier on when he actually saw him coming)
Click to expand...
I think @CinCameron20 makes the most points and they are not being addressed properly before changing profiles.
 
Dr.Fix said:
most points
Click to expand...
They were already points made by other people and were already addressed before making the changes, his 2 times point is wrong since he's not getting that increase and even so there isn't an issue since he's shown significantly superior to baseline 7-A+ character's, there isn't an issue with that he's making a point that stems from his opinion.

The haki point is unsupported & Drake and Apoo's status/involvement had already been covered so many times.
 
Cin spoke about
  1. Katakuri, Doflamingo, and Cracker scaling.
    1. I gave my counter which was not countered.
      1. I showed feats of Katakuri harming Luffy (uncountered by him or you).
      2. I debunked the Haki property counter (@XDragnoir did before me, which was uncountered by him or you).
      3. I showed Doflamingo's awakening block Luffy's attack (uncountered by him or you).
  2. High 7-A Jack should be 7-A+
    1. I already said I won't backscale Zoro to previous versions pre Onigashima raid which would go with Cin's argument.
  3. High 7-A Zoro is wrong on many levels.
    1. Me, @Eminiteable, @LordGinSama, and @00potato have explained why it's not wrong, repeatedly.
  4. Why is Apoo scaling to Kizaru is faulty as hell.
    1. Me, @UchihaSlayer96, @Damage3245, @Kin201, @Ped2018, @Eminiteable, and many more have already discussed this and it has been removed from the OP a long ass time ago.
  5. Based on opinion
    1. 50% of my messages in this thread have been proving (with the site's rules) the scaling with everything but opinion.
Please inform me of what Cin has stated that hasn't been taken into consideration.

I'm not the one that likes to use Appeal to Motive, but you're extremely sketchy since 90% of the thread has been clearing up misconceptions and you keep bringing up points that have been debunked almost three days ago.
 
Anyways, with the Katakuri High 7-A being a thing, that would give base Luffy High 7-A Dura for taking his attacks.
That would go to the Tobiroppo and those that scale to them.
Do I need to go indepth?
 
I'm not sure I agree with Luffy getting High 7-A durability in base, he scales to Katakuri's blows to a degree (which I believe was what got accepted in the past)

But I do agree with Katakuri being High 7-A, even if we treat boundman superior to him keep in mind boundman in this fight is 1.65 Gigatons, Katakuri at the very least could scale to baseline since he has shown to scale and fight against boundman and Snakeman more than he does Gear third.

Oh and Eustass Kid needs his profile updated to 7-A+ in AP & Durability (harmed Apoo) (took attacks from Apoo) something like that, but this might be considered Wano scaling so I'm unsure if it can be applied now.
 
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