Black Leg Sanji vs the Flame Emperor

[DaMonkeMan]

Sanji claims to have better flame manip than Sabo and that he'd cook him, and this sparks a intense battle between the two.
Speed is equalized.
Sanji is in his post Wano key, and they win by either knocking out/killing the opponent or beating them until they can't fight anymore.
Fight is in Onigashima, they start 20m away.
Sanji: @Kachon123 @Eseseso @Dileeden
Sabo: @TheMonkeMan
Chadkainu solos (Incon):

 

[Kachon123]

Dumb match

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Dumb match

Someone really wanted to see this so I made it for them
Not like it's getting added to their profiles anyway so let's just have fun and roll with it, eh?

 

[Kachon123]

Not going to be fun when you literally removed one of Sanji's main assets

 

[The_man_with_the_Midas_touch]

Can't Sanji still blitz with speed amps tho? Iirc those aren't covered under speed equalized.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Not going to be fun when you literally removed one of Sanji's main assets

Someone doesn't have a sense of humor..

Can't Sanji still blitz with speed amps tho? Iirc those aren't covered under speed equalized.

Dunno, Sabo was matching Fujitora and some others so he's definitely not slow.
Also some of Sanji's amps are situational

 

[Kachon123]

Can't Sanji still blitz with speed amps tho? Iirc those aren't covered under speed equalized.

True

 

[Kachon123]

Voting Sanji for being vastly superior in speed with 3 different speed amps that he can stack which makes him many levels FTE to people who are otherwise comparable to him in speed.

Sanji is also more skilled in close quarters combat based on feats.

Sanji can completely no-sell Sabo's flames with his 3 layers of fire resistance (natural resistance via passion, exoskeleton, and haki)

Sanji can also just regenerate from Dragon Clay's durability negation.

Sanji has much hotter flames that Sabo so once Sanji uses his speed amps where he'll be FTE to Sabo, he'd be able to burn him with Ifrit Jambe to secure the victory.


Here are the scaling chains in this hypothetical Base AP and Speed equals match:

AP:

Sanji: Ifrit Jambe Sanji > Diable Jambe Sanji > Base Sanji
Sabo: Base Sabo (no amps)

Speed:

Sanji: Ifrit Sanji > Diable Sanji > Super Speed Sanji > Base Sanji
Sabo: Base Sabo (no amps)

Armament Haki:

Sanji: Current Sanji > WCI Sanji > FMI Luffy ~ Average Buso
Sabo: Sabo ~ Burgess > Average Buso


Sanji takes AP, Speed and Armament Haki.

Does Sabo really have a wincon here?

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Voting Sanji for being vastly superior in speed with 3 different speed amps that he can stack which makes him many levels FTE to people who are otherwise comparable to him in speed.

Sanji is also more skilled in close quarters combat based on feats.

Sabo seems highly skilled at his martial art and you mentioned before that it's also technically dura neg for sending the force of his attack to the core of his opponent. Here, Sabo will reasonably try to get Sanji's skull and crush it. And if we take the explanation for his martial art literally, he might crush Sanji's brain.
The speed advantage is valid, but some are situational, like him going FTE to Queen which was only done because Queen tried to go invisible to fool him. Also, we don't have proof that Ifrit Jambe is a good enough speed amp or even a speed amp at all, since he used it on a tired and heavily damaged Queen who was practically half conscious there. Though most of his hits on Queen were due to Queen's own incompetence and short attention span.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Sanji can completely no-sell Sabo's flames with his 3 layers of fire resistance (natural resistance via passion, exoskeleton, and haki)

I guess? Sabo is also completely immune to his flames, though. It's just how his df works.
In fact Sabo can absorb his flames and use them against him. All Sanji would be doing is make Sabo realize how to use blue flames and start evolving with his fruit.

Sanji can also just regenerate from Dragon Clay's durability negation.

Not sure about that, it's gonna take a few seconds. Even when he was crushed by Queen we don't see him actually moving at all. That gives a window for a combo.

Sanji has much hotter flames that Sabo so once Sanji uses his speed amps where he'll be FTE to Sabo, he'd be able to burn him with Ifrit Jambe to secure the victory.

No. I addressed this before but Logias are immune to their element. Doesn't matter what type of flame it is, he's immune.
Akainu falls in lava, and survives just fine.
Ace sets himself on fire, survives it just fine.
Sabo does the same thing, survives.
Blackbeard can stand in his Darkness.
etc.

 

[Kin201]

Ace is Multi-Continental, and so is Chopper. Meanwhile, Sabo is Large Mountain level.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Ace is Multi-Continental, and so is Chopper. Meanwhile, Sabo is Large Mountain level.

Chopper is Multi-Continental? Lmfao..

 

[Kachon123]

Sabo seems highly skilled at his martial art

Sure, but he lacks skill feats in comparison to Sanji.

Here, Sabo will reasonably try to get Sanji's skull and crush it

Ignoring the fact that he could just regenerate from it, Sanji's much too fast to even be hit.

The speed advantage is valid, but some are situational, like him going FTE to Queen which was only done because Queen tried to go invisible to fool him.

That was his super speed amp. He still has Diable Jambe which was FTE to Queen as well, which he would 100% use.

Also, we don't have proof that Ifrit Jambe is a good enough speed amp or even a speed amp at all

Sanji stated that his heat increases his speed. Ifrit Jambe flames are much hotter than Diable Jambe flames, thus it would have a much greater speed amp. Also, according to the profiles, with Ifrit Jambe, Sanji was able to land 10 consecutive hits on Queen without him able to respond.

Sabo is also completely immune to his flames, though. It's just how his df works.

Haki turns logia bodies into normal bodies, so he would be effected by the heat of Ifrit Jambe.

In fact Sabo can absorb his flames and use them against him

Sanji is FTE layers above Sabo when using Ifrit Jambe so thats not happening.

All Sanji would be doing is make Sabo realize how to use blue flames and start evolving with his fruit.

What?

Not sure about that, it's gonna take a few seconds. Even when he was crushed by Queen we don't see him actually moving at all. That gives a window for a combo.

Not true.

Queen Crushes and Drops Sanji -> Queen Swings at Sanji -> before Queen's blade can reach Sanji, he was able to completely regenerate

If Sabo manages to hit Sanji with Dragon Breath durability negation, Sanji'd be able to regenerate before the followup as shown as he was able to do it during his fight with Queen.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Sure, but he lacks skill feats in comparison to Sanji.

Ignoring the fact that he could just regenerate from it, Sanji's much too fast to even be hit.

That was his super speed amp. He still has Diable Jambe which was FTE to Queen as well, which he would 100% use.

Sanji stated that his heat increases his speed. Ifrit Jambe flames are much hotter than Diable Jambe flames, thus it would have a much greater speed amp. Also, according to the profiles, with Ifrit Jambe, Sanji was able to land 10 consecutive hits on Queen without him able to respond.

The heat amping his speed is valid. However, he used Diable Jambe after he went invisible on Queen, so I don't think it was Diable Jambe that made him speed blitz..

Haki turns logia bodies into normal bodies, so he would be effected by the heat of Ifrit Jambe.

Whitebeard dunked on Akainu with Haki infused Quakes, and Akainu fell into the lava below Marineford, yet he didn't get burnt by it even though he got hit with Haki prior to it. Sabo should be no different.

Sanji is FTE layers above Sabo when using Ifrit Jambe so thats not happening.

It's passive if Sabo is turned into flames before the attack.

What?

Not true.

Queen Crushes and Drops Sanji -> Queen Swings at Sanji -> before Queen's blade can reach Sanji, he was able to completely regenerate

If Sabo manages to hit Sanji with Dragon Breath durability negation, Sanji'd be able to regenerate before the followup as shown as he was able to do it during his fight with Queen.

Exactly. If Queen could do a combo on him like that I don't see what's stopping Sabo especially when his first move is to literally try and make Sanji braindead.

 

[Kachon123]

he used Diable Jambe after he went invisible on Queen

What?

though he got hit with Haki prior to it

Was Akainu still making contact with WB's haki? No. Was the lava that Akainu got hit into hotter than his own magma? No.

It's passive if Sabo is turned into flames before the attack.

I don't know whats hard to understand about the fact that he won't know to do that as Sanji is just that much faster than him.

If Queen could do a combo on him like that I don't see what's stopping Sabo

Queen had no combo. He hit one attack, and Sanji was able to regenerate before he could follow through with a second attack.

especially when his first move is to literally try and make Sanji braindead.

You realize that not every Dragon Claw attack is durability negation right? That's just Ryuusouken. Attacks like the one you linked are dependent on Lifting Strength, which Sanji is superior to Sabo in.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

What?

Was Akainu still making contact with WB's haki? No. Was the lava that Akainu got hit into hotter than his own magma? No.

okay buddy

I don't know whats hard to understand about the fact that he won't know to do that as Sanji is just that much faster than him.

Queen had no combo. He hit one attack, and Sanji was able to regenerate before he could follow through with a second attack.

Then don't say it like he hit a combo on him?

You realize that not every Dragon Claw attack is durability negation right? That's just Ryuusouken. Attacks like the one you linked are dependent on Lifting Strength, which Sanji is superior to Sabo in.

Doesn't matter. If Sabo uses Ryuusouken on him then his brain is clapped.

 

[Kachon123]

Then don't say it like he hit a combo on him?

A combo is a sequence of attacks followed one after the other. Sanji got crushed then was about to get slashed (that inherently is a combo), but then he regenerated before the combo continued. Stop acting like Sanji's regeneration is slow when it's literally not.

If Sabo uses Ryuusouken on him then his brain is clapped.

I meant Ryu no Ibuki. Ryuusouken is Dragon Claw itself. Ryu no Ibuki has never been used directly on an opponent, and even in the moments that Sabo has used Ryu no Ibuki, it has a substantial amount of preptime, so Sanji would just escape his grasp.

And remember, this is if Sanji gets tagged which is highly unlikely considering the sheer gap in speed and the fact that Sabo doesn't have a single amp to close that gap.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

A combo is a sequence of attacks followed one after the other. Sanji got crushed then was about to get slashed (that inherently is a combo), but then he regenerated before the combo continued. Stop acting like Sanji's regeneration is slow when it's literally not.

I meant Ryu no Ibuki. Ryuusouken is Dragon Claw itself. Ryu no Ibuki has never been used directly on an opponent, and even in the moments that Sabo has used Ryu no Ibuki, it has a substantial amount of preptime, so Sanji would just escape his grasp.

And remember, this is if Sanji gets tagged which is highly unlikely considering the sheer gap in speed and the fact that Sabo doesn't have a single amp to close that gap.

When did it need prep time?
First of all: Sanji never had his brain bashed in and I don't think his regen could cover that ( it basically just stitches his organs and bones together like Doflamingo did with his strings against Gamma Knife ).
Second of all: Why wouldn't he use his dura neg move on an opponent who's presumably too durable for him? That's stupid.
Third of all: Speed is equal, goofball.

 

[Eseseso]

Sanji for Kachon's reasons, dude has a gazillion AP and speed amps.

Though once I do the High 6-A Issho CRT that everyone will force me to include Sabo in, AP won't need to be equalized, and probably not speed either for that matter since Issho will scale to Jack and Greenbull (who really needs a profile) scales to stomping the Scabbards

 

[DaMonkeMan]

2-1 in Sanji's favor.

 

[Kachon123]

When did it need prep time?

The only time he used it in the series. In chapter 743. He had to tap around to find the core. It doesn't work by just grabbing someone.

Sanji never had his brain bashed in

He's had his brain pulverized by shockwaves before in Skypiea.

I don't think his regen could cover that

Why wouldn't it?

( it basically just stitches his organs and bones together like Doflamingo did with his strings against Gamma Knife ).

Proof?

Third of all: Speed is equal, goofball.

In speed equalized matches, amps don't get equalized.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

The only time he used it in the series. In chapter 743. He had to tap around to find the core. It doesn't work by just grabbing someone.

That's a big structure. He's just grabbing Sanji's head here. Shouldn't take long to find the core..

He's had his brain pulverized by shockwaves before in Skypiea.

No he didn't. That Impact Dial was weak lmfao. Sabo can crack an entire colosseum floor with his.

Why wouldn't it?

Why WOULD it? We've only seen it revive cracked bones and ruptured organs. Not organs that were mashed up or completely broken apart.

 

[Kachon123]

That's a big structure. He's just grabbing Sanji's head here. Shouldn't take long to find the core..

He's only used it once. We have no idea what "finding the core" means and how he would do it against a target like Sanji, and considering Sanji is so much faster than Sabo, if he gets grabbed (which isn't happening btw), he would just kick Sabo off of him with ease considering he also has a huge AP gap.

No he didn't. That Impact Dial was weak lmfao

Sanji had no internal durability. The shockwaves went straight to his brain. HIs brain was absolutely destroyed.

Not organs that were mashed up or completely broken apart.

"Bones crushed... innards damaged beyond repair"

 

[RoronoaxRobin]

Monke, perhaps you should go ahead and change this to Dressrosa Sanji vs. Dressrosa Sabo since both are Large Mountain Level, but keep the range and location the same. Even with AP and Speed equalized, Current Sanji still has too much of an advantage because of his amps. You can do a match-up between the current versions after somebody (I guess Eseseso?) does the CRT to upgrade Fujitora to Multi-Continent due to his fight with Jack.

 

[Kin201]

Sabo tanked a nuke from Imu, which is presumably more potent than Sanji's flames.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

He's only used it once. We have no idea what "finding the core" means and how he would do it against a target like Sanji, and considering Sanji is so much faster than Sabo, if he gets grabbed (which isn't happening btw), he would just kick Sabo off of him with ease considering he also has a huge AP gap.

I love how I equalize Speed and AP and you flock to the thread to use the same wincons that were neutralized.

Monke, perhaps you should go ahead and change this to Dressrosa Sanji vs. Dressrosa Sabo since both are Large Mountain Level, but keep the range and location the same. Even with AP and Speed equalized, Current Sanji still has too much of an advantage because of his amps. You can do a match-up between the current versions after somebody (I guess Eseseso) does the CRT to upgrade Fujitora to Multi-Continent due to his fight with Jack.

I'll do that.

Sabo tanked a nuke from Imu, which is presumably more potent than Sanji's flames.

See I'd agree and use that as a justification for durability and what not, but we see him looking to his side when it comes down while the citizens are looking straight up when it falls on them, so I don't think it directly hit him.

 

[RoronoaxRobin]

It's implied Sabo's not even on the island when Imu attacked the kingdom

 

[DaMonkeMan]

This isn't relevant to the battle but someone had a theory that Sabo would make a massive wall of flames to protect the citizens from it.

 

[Kachon123]

Unfollowing

 

[DaMonkeMan]

bro said he ain't arguing if it's a fair fight

 

[Kachon123]

bro said he ain't arguing if it's a fair fight

Oh, I still believe Sanji wins, so keep my vote, I'm just tired of saying the same things over and over. I feel like I've had to repeat Sanji's feats for over a combined total 5 pages across different threads so I'm done with that. You know my reasonings so I don't think I need to restate them for the 100th time.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Oh, I still believe Sanji wins, so keep my vote, I'm just tired of saying the same things over and over. I feel like I've had to repeat Sanji's feats for over a combined total 5 pages across different threads so I'm done with that. You know my reasonings so I don't think I need to restate them for the 100th time.

Those wincons are invalid since this is a different key, bro.
Gotta make some new cases for him. That's like a thread with, say, Yamato vs Luffy, and it has G5 Luffy's key. You say " Well Luffy can go G5 and stomp with Bajrang Gun " and they change the key, and you keep your vote. It's gonna be invalid.

 

[Kachon123]

Those wincons are invalid since this is a different key, bro.
Gotta make some new cases for him. That's like a thread with, say, Yamato vs Luffy, and it has G5 Luffy's key. You say " Well Luffy can go G5 and stomp with Bajrang Gun " and they change the key, and you keep your vote. It's gonna be invalid.

Speed amps, AP amps, Haki, Skill.

My points are still the same. My arguments regarding Ryu no Ibuki and Regeneration was me egging you on and if you scroll up, I said time and time again that this is only if Sabo manages to hit Sanji before he can counter, which I don't believe would happen.

So yes, I keep my vote for the same reasons I had before.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Speed amps, AP amps, Haki, Skill.

My points are still the same. My arguments regarding Ryu no Ibuki and Regeneration was me egging you on and if you scroll up, I said time and time again that this is only if Sabo manages to hit Sanji before he can counter, which I don't believe would happen.

So yes, I keep my vote for the same reasons I had before.

Sanji has one speed/AP amp here. And Sanji has no regeneration so he's getting popped by Ryu no Ibuki.

 

[Kachon123]

Sanji has one speed/AP amp here

And Sabo has none. What's your point exactly?

And Sanji has no regeneration so he's getting popped by Ryu no Ibuki.

My arguments regarding Ryu no Ibuki and Regeneration was me egging you on and if you scroll up, I said time and time again that this is only if Sabo manages to hit Sanji before he can counter, which I don't believe would happen.

Like I said before, I'm now unfollowing.

I'm just tired of saying the same things over and over. I feel like I've had to repeat Sanji's feats for over a combined total 5 pages across different threads so I'm done with that. You know my reasonings so I don't think I need to restate them for the 100th time

 

[DaMonkeMan]

Well that was an interesting self destruct.
Anyone else wanna chime in on this thread?

 

[RoronoaxRobin]

I vote Sabo

He fought Fujitora, an Admiral, for an extended time.

He also seems to have superior Buso than Sanji does at this point. Sabo doesn't have any kenbun feats in the manga, but in the anime he was able to sense Luffy become weaken fighting Doffy and dodge bullets, so he has some skill using it. However, Sanji probably has him beat with this ability.

I don't know if Sanji's faster than this version of Sabo (I forgot the speed scaling for the Dressrosa characters), but if he is he shouldn't be much faster since Sabo was able to keep up with Fuji (he was even able to move swiftly while under the effects of Ferocious Tiger).

And I don't see Sanji's DJ being enough to give him the win here with his logia intangibility, heat resistances, and durability. So yeah, Sabo.

 

[DaMonkeMan]

I'm voting Sabo too.

His dura neg will also clap Sanji's organs and bones and he can't do much against that in this key.

 

[Eseseso]

Switching to Sabo FRA

 

[Eminiteable]

Sabo doesn't have Dura neg on his profile, Sanji wins this.