• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Alien X Downgrade Rebuttal (Updating Alien X to 2B or 2A again)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Zamasu_Chan said:

Are higher-dimensional beings infinitely stronger than lower-dimensional equivalents?​

Unintuitive as that may be: Not necessarily, as a number of characteristics through which we quantify the strength or power of a character can remain unchanged when transitioning between higher and lower dimensions. For example: Mass is a quantity that is detached from the dimension of the object which it is inherent to, and unlike volume is not divided in units corresponding to each particular dimension (1-volume [length], 2-volume [area], 3-volume, 4-volume...). It is singular in nature and its units equally apply to all dimensions; whether it is distributed over an area or a volume only tells us about the span of space in which it is spread, not about the quantity itself.

As a consequence of that, much of the calculation methods which are used to measure strength apply equally to both higher and lower dimensions, as they do not care about the extra variables and often work with a single one of them. Examples of this are kinetic energy (Ek=0.5*M*V^2), force (F=M*A), work (W=F*d), and etc.

An intuitive example of that is found in the general definition of Work as defined in physics: In essence, as work itself denotes the energy applied to an object as it is displaced along a given path, the basic formula for calculating it only takes into account a single variable, and the path itself is treated as an one-dimensional object, regardless of the dimension of the space in which the action itself takes place.

Hence, a higher-dimensional entity can be both stronger or weaker than a lower-dimensional one, and thus, they are usually quantified based on their own feats, instead of dimensionality alone. If a character is merely stated to be higher-dimensional and simultaneously has no other feats to derive anything noteworthy from, then they are put at Unknown, and the same applies to lower dimensions as well.

Do note, however, that them not qualifying for Tier 2 and above doesn't mean they are "fake" higher-dimensional beings or anything of the sort. It is simply that being higher-dimensional does not inherently mean they have infinite power in the first place, as explained above.

This is from the FAQ. Make of that as you will.
Click to expand...
Alright, I Understand. However I disagree with your reasoning for scaling Atomic X with Alien X. Also AX did show an extradimensional feat with should change his tier to 2B.
 
ShinyFire said:
Alright, I Understand. However I disagree with your reasoning for scaling Atomic X with Alien X. Also AX did show an extradimensional feat with should change his tier to 2B.
Click to expand...
That wasn’t the conclusion. Atomic X is still high 5-A on his profile.
 
I myself am not entirely sure why Alien X would only be Low 2-C when it seems heavily implied to me they effect way more then just one more timeline, I have no race in the Low 1-C stuff for now
 
DragonLord said:
I myself am not entirely sure why Alien X would only be Low 2-C when it seems heavily implied to me they effect way more then just one more timeline, I have no race in the Low 1-C stuff for now
Click to expand...
That's the thing... 1A is bit of a stretch since we don't have a lot to go with when it comes to Celestialsapiens. 2B or 2A are reasonable though.
 
Literal 5th dimensional beings created that extra dimensional barrier and also Ben an 3d being was not able to perceive said 5d being's true forms because he is 3d and his mind can not fathom their true form so he saw them as smoothies instead
Everything12 said:
Calling something extradimensional is as worthless as calling them higher dimensional or fifth dimensional. None of this is even close to Tier 1.
Click to expand...
 
For god sakes, this is has been repeated and done for the umpteenth ******* time. Especially the pure head canon on fusion aliens being weaker when that was NEVER a thing in the first place. And of course, the abuse of social media comments like they mean a thing suddenly.

At this point, someone make a discussion rule for this. This is coming up much too often now.
 
Rez said:
Literal 5th dimensional beings created that extra dimensional barrier and also Ben an 3d being was not able to perceive said 5d being's true forms because he is 3d and his mind can not fathom their true form so he saw them as smoothies instead
Click to expand...
Said fifth dimensional beings show absolutely no infinite superiority to lower dimensional beings in size or nature anyway. Just them being unfathomable isn't proof of anything.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
For god sakes, this is has been repeated and done for the umpteenth ******* time. Especially the pure head canon on fusion aliens being weaker when that was NEVER a thing in the first place. And of course, the abuse of social media comments like they mean a thing suddenly.

At this point, someone make a discussion rule for this. This is coming up much too often now.
Click to expand...
When it comes to fusion aliens being weaker, it's been addressed more than once and confirmed.
 
Planck69 said:
Said fifth dimensional beings show absolutely no infinite superiority to lower dimensional beings in size or nature anyway. Just them being unfathomable isn't proof of anything.
Click to expand...
I agree but they did say their barrier was impossible to breach which should sort of show where they stand.
 
5th dimensional beings
Needs protection from a Big Bang.
Click to expand...


Open_Eye_Laugh_Crying_Emoji.png
 
Planck69 said:
Which means f*ck all anyway as far as proving it to be Tier 1 goes.
Click to expand...
I'm not trying to prove it to be tier 1 nor am I saying it's tier 1. I'm saying it's 2B or 2A.
When I checked the vs wiki, both the Chrono Navigator and Chronosapien time bomb are listed as 2B while Alien X who is superior to both is 2C...
 
ShinyFire said:
I'm not trying to prove it to be tier 1 nor am I saying it's tier 1. I'm saying it's 2B or 2A.
When I checked the vs wiki, both the Chrono Navigator and Chronosapien time bomb are listed as 2B while Alien X who is superior to both is 2C...
Click to expand...
IIRC I think because the Chrono Navigator feat was an overtime feat and the Chronosapien time bomb feat was done via hax so Alien x scaling above it doesn't change his tier but you might probably argue that Alien x is at least 2-C for him being stated to be able to survive a multiversal destruction if a group of Celestialsapiens combined their power so a single Celestialsapien should probably be around 2-C at bare minimum
 
Huh, so wait if Alien X can bypass a shield which can protect from a Big Bang, why isn’t that listed as a reason for his Low 2-C rating?
 
Why would extra-dimensional even mean 5D? 4D is extradimensional as it is a higher dimension, and extra dimensional also means from outside dimensions. If extra dimensional had that meaning then Pokemon would be 5D
 
ShinyFire said:
I'm not trying to prove it to be tier 1 nor am I saying it's tier 1. I'm saying it's 2B or 2A.
When I checked the vs wiki, both the Chrono Navigator and Chronosapien time bomb are listed as 2B while Alien X who is superior to both is 2C...
Click to expand...
If that’s the case then you definitely did not read through that entire thread. It seems to me that you just read the OP then dipped.
 
Arceus0x said:
Why would extra-dimensional even mean 5D? 4D is extradimensional as it is a higher dimension, and extra dimensional also means from outside dimensions. If extra dimensional had that meaning then Pokemon would be 5D
Click to expand...
I don't wanna be a part of this debate but the characters who made the barrier are straight up stated to be 5d so that's why
 
Rez said:
I don't wanna be a part of this debate but the characters who made the barrier are straight up stated to be 5d so that's why
Click to expand...
Being stated to be 5-D is nothing if dimensions aren't shown to be infinitely superior to one another.
 
The time bomb might have been done via Hax but the Navigator isn't Via hax,
Gohanblanco217 said:
IIRC I think because the Chrono Navigator feat was an overtime feat and the Chronosapien time bomb feat was done via hax so Alien x scaling above it doesn't change his tier but you might probably argue that Alien x is at least 2-C for him being stated to be able to survive a multiversal destruction if a group of Celestialsapiens combined their power so a single Celestialsapien should probably be around 2-C at bare minimum
Click to expand...
The time bomb might have been hax but the Navigator isn't. It would have released energy to destroy the Multiverse which is why I think AX should be 2B
 
ShinyFire said:
The time bomb might have been done via Hax but the Navigator isn't Via hax,

The time bomb might have been hax but the Navigator isn't. It would have released energy to destroy the Multiverse which is why I think AX should be 2B
Click to expand...
Except the Chrono Navigator feat was over time which is why Alien X scaling above it won't change his tier
 
Everything12 said:
Calling something extradimensional is as worthless as calling them higher dimensional or fifth dimensional. None of this is even close to Tier 1.
Click to expand...

Zamasu_Chan said:
If that’s the case then you definitely did not read through that entire thread. It seems to me that you just read the OP then dipped.
Click to expand...
I read your whole item. You said Ben 10k is a genius and should have been able to know what a Chronosapien time bomb is and that's not true. If it was, he would've turned into Alien X instead of Atomic X. Why he did not was because his version had never gained control like Ben prime did. As you know, whenever Ben meets his future version, his future changes. So that Ben's Alien X was not an option as he would have been unable to act.

Another reason is that the creators confirmed on more than one occasion that Atomic X is weaker than Alien X so you saying they scale up to each other is not accurate.
 
Gohanblanco217 said:
Except the Chrono Navigator feat was over time which is why Alien X scaling above it won't change his tier
Click to expand...
Even if it was over time, it doesn't make sense for it to scale above Alien X and now I realise the bomb isn't via hax, Clockwork used hax. The bomb released pure energy as well and it was not over time. Doesn't make sense for it to be 2B while AX isn't.
 
ShinyFire said:
Even if it was over time, it doesn't make sense for it to scale above Alien X
Click to expand...
Alien x literally scales above it


ShinyFire said:
now I realise the bomb isn't via hax, Clockwork used hax. The bomb released pure energy
Click to expand...
The Chronosapien time bomb was specifically meant to erase timelines out of existence (existence erasure) which is a hax feat that ignore durability whatever it was Pure energy or not


ShinyFire said:
Doesn't make sense for it to be 2B while AX isn't.
Click to expand...
Read the Chrono Navigator profile again and read what it says :

"Tier: 2-B over time" the Chrono Navigator is just a low 2-C weapon that can cause 2-B destruction over time
 
ShinyFire said:
I read your whole item. You said Ben 10k is a genius and should have been able to know what a Chronosapien time bomb is and that's not true. If it was, he would've turned into Alien X instead of Atomic X. Why he did not was because his version had never gained control like Ben prime did. As you know, whenever Ben meets his future version, his future changes. So that Ben's Alien X was not an option as he would have been unable to act.

Another reason is that the creators confirmed on more than one occasion that Atomic X is weaker than Alien X so you saying they scale up to each other is not accurate.
Click to expand...
That doesn’t matter because Atomic X is high 5-A on his profile, making a large portion of your OP ultimately pointless.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

NXCHT.66
  • Locked
Alien X and Celestialsapiens Additions
2 3
Replies
101
Views
5K
NXCHT.66
NXCHT.66
NXCHT.66
  • Locked
Alien X Addition and Upgrade
2 3 4
Replies
127
Views
8K
Firestorm808
Firestorm808
Aolphl
  • Locked
Minor Alien X Additions (Ben 10)
2
Replies
67
Views
6K
Firestorm808
Firestorm808
Reiner04
  • Locked
Ben 10: Discussion rule for Alien X
2
Replies
44
Views
4K
DaReaperMan
DaReaperMan
ProfessorKukui4Life
  • Locked
Big Alien X Downgrade (Wait…haven't we been here before?)
7 8 9
Replies
349
Views
26K
LordGriffin1000
LordGriffin1000
Back
Top