Big Alien X Downgrade (Wait…haven't we been here before?)

[CaveGamist]

Ngl the extra dimensional barrier convinced me.
I disagree
And will this ever end?

 

[Reiner04]

Ngl the extra dimensional barrier convinced me.
I disagree
And will this ever end?

I think since proper staff consensus has been reached. A grace period of sort has started.

 

[Reiner04]

Okay man. I'm ngl but I've gotten pretty sick of waiting anymore further. Waited week then days but now even looking at this is just sickening and one can't ignore either for obvious reasons (Am I being impatient? Maybe, but that's it).

 

[Antvasima]

It seems like this thread has been rejected by our staff.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Okay I’m here to make some responses now.

First to @LordGriffin1000

Okay, sooooo I the two main points I agree with the OP on are.

The Statements (Not all)

To explain exactly were I stand in agreement with OP, I 100% without question agree that Alien X and it's kind scale above the Chronosapien Time Bomb, Chrono Navigator and so on in terms of their "power" given the statements/feats (by power, I mean creation, reality warping, and erasure since that last one can be used as AP given the staff thread). However, I don't find "some" of those scans worth much in terms of their physical prowess being at such a level (like the forge of creation having the greatest power were ideas become real) those types of statements "can" refer to someone's abilities rather than their actual physical might. Now this isn't to say their is nothing that backs it up, I think the fear of cutting through the extra dimensional barrier works in a way but that falls in line to the whole big bang stuff being discussed which is out of my field. But this is just what put me on the neutral side of things (I'd prefer just not using some of those statements). Below is what leans me towards agreeing with the OP.

Atomic X (Yeah this fraud)

The Atomic X scaling, and yes, I've seen few (not all) of the arguments pertaining to it and I don't find them convincing enough. Now this isn't to say I believe others are wrong in regards to the scaling of Atomic X to Alien X (I think I took part in a past discussion about this) but the way I see it, it's an anti-feat to Alien X physicals. For example, an argument I recall is that fusion aliens like that are weaker but to me, that's vague because Atomic X is currently several Infinities weaker than Alien X but if we assumed such a drop is because fusions are the issue then every other one becomes infinitely weaker than the individual aliens, or is such a drop in power only related to Alien X fusions because.... Reasons? Another argument is, it's only taking the DNA not the power, but then that goes against the physicals of Alien X being comparable to its power. Now the other interpretation is it's DNA doesn't provide the physical statistics either... Then I ask, what is the point of Atomic X? Like seriously, if he's not getting the physiology boost or powers that make Alien X strong then there is no point in the fusion other than Ben 10000 looking like an idiot for fusing them just to try a box with the death wall and got erased.

Now I do apologize if people already provide proper arguments to these, I haven't been able to keep up with every point made regarding this topic so if you have, you can just quote it and I'll take a look when I can. But just to make clear, my point is that I haven't seen a definitive reason the Atomic X anti feat in depth. Now if someone with that knowledge can provide me with the exact reasonings I'd be in favor of disagreeing with the downgrade or returning to neutral at minimum. I would also like it if only one or two user responds, because I can't discuss something with like three users commenting the same. (So whoever are the two Ben 10 experts, whenever you have the time, can you explain the Atomic X arguments)

First, thank you very much @LordGriffin1000 for your participation in this thread, it’s very helpful and appreciated. I’m sorry I wasn’t here at the time when you gave these evaluations, this was my opportunity to check back in and respond.

But second, yes, as a rundown, these are some of the main points I brought forth as to why I disagree with Alien X physically scaling above that like the Chrono Navigator and whatnot.

Now I am aware you’ve discussed more things with the others later after this and probably changed stances, so I will give some responses to those as well.

DNA combination does provide them some specific boosts from each species that combining but doesn't necessarily on the same lvl as individual or even comparable to them but mainly a single DNA that is based of DNA of both species but provide specific traits with lose of one or another. There's statement regarding Duncan as well that DNA's in biomatrix are diluted but keeping it aside. We have Bigchuck struggling against regular minions of Eon and infact is being taken down by them with pure physical force, also way smaller in height and definitely not comparable to waybig we know of who can passively take on entire army at any day and time.

Regarding this part about DNA and the Biomntrix, I wasn’t going to initially comment on this, but this is exactly part of the reason why I have issues with this whole argument about fusions being “weaker” as these examples are just….bad evidence. Particularly this example with Big Chuck.

Going by this clip you posted, Big Chuck was only “held down” by Eons minions for like literally 3 seconds. That’s it. At the end of the day, Big Chuck ended up shaking them off, devouring them and blasting them away in the rest of the clip and didn’t struggle in doing that. He beats them and fairly easily. Your explanation of the clip made it seem like Big Chuck was either stomped or got completely slammed down by them when that’s not what really happened at all. If a 3 second hold down is all that you guys have to suggest Big Chucks physically inferior to Way Big, then this is just inflating a very minor moment of Bad Writing. A character getting held down for a second by an opponent, something we see all the time across fiction, doesn’t really mean much of anything. It’s not a serious overview of that characters capabilities.

The only thing about this you may have a point on is the height aspect, since Big Chuck obviously doesn’t have Way Bigs height characteristics, but Way Bigs AP and tier doesnt come from only his size, does it?

I'll be making one more comment to make sure I've properly delivered what I want to say regarding fusions; I'm not saying that fusions will be definitely weaker/stronger/not-comparable/comparable- but that it can be any of them. But just not necessarily single one of them, depending upon how far of loss in one abilities from individual species fusion has suffered- it's drop or increase in potential of certain haxes or raw power due to altered/re-written DNA. As seen during Atomic X or Bigchuck, they're far weaker- but some fusions are stronger- knowing this I'd rather judge them based on their feats than to guess.

If you want to judge alien fusions on a case by case basis depending on their feats, that’s something I can go with. But if we’re doing that to make exceptions depending on the alien in question, this should give support to the arguments on why Celestialsapien fusions shouldn’t be treated inferior to individual Celestialsapiens. Atomic X I’ll make comments for specifically later on.

But like it’s been mentioned here before several times, Aggregor by definition and how his power absorbing abilities explicitly work would be a clear cut partial Celestialsapien as well like Atomic X. Aggregor only takes 1/10th of the abilities of the alien species he’s taking powers from, so he’d essentially only be “1/10th Celestialsapien” in this case. A fraction of a Celestialsapien that should be far far away from that of a pure individual Celestialsapien, even worse than Atomic X in terms of rewritten DNA or what carries over. But even despite being just 1/10th of what a Celestialsapien is, Aggregor would still be considered Omnipotent exactly like how a Celestialsapien would be once obtaining their powers. Aggregor proves being 100% Celestialsapien is not required to have their Omnipotence / Supreme power.

The only way Aggregor can be considered that, even with his limitations, is if a Celestialsapiens Omnipotence isn’t based on their raw strength, but their hax abilities, and that having those hax abilities is what makes you considered to have Omnipotence here.

I don't understand at all why we compare Alien X and aliens who have a piece of his DNA. There are a lot of examples in the cartoon when the carrier of a DNA particle is much weaker than a DNA donor. This is perfectly noticeable at the moment when Chromastone could not break the extradimension barrier with his bare hands, but with a fraction of X's strength he could. It's literally like comparing which is stronger, 1/10 of the strength or 1?

Because Alien X can also just as easily be a unique case compared to normal ordinary aliens in the show. And it wouldn’t be unfounded to treat a race of celestial entities with abilities far superior to that of regular aliens as their own case. Especially if you go by Reiner suggesting to treat alien fusions as case by case depending on feats.

And also because of what I explained above regarding Aggregor’s case, where he’s explicitly far inferior physically to a Celestialsapien but would still have their Omnipotence, even if he’s just “1/0th” of one.

Now I think get it. They basically become their own alien at that point, just a fusion that takes traits but not always function at the capacity of the original, possibly having drawbacks or advantages the singular aliens wouldn't which clearly involve statistics as well. Do I understand the point you're trying to make correctly?

What do you think of the above information I presented here @LordGriffin1000 ? Regarding the DNA stuff, Aggregor and whatnot.

Listen, (assuming this thread gets accepted) shouldn't alien x still be tier 1 with reality warping or hax?

That’s pretty much been the premise of my thread here, just to clarify. I don’t agree with Alien X physically upscaling in raw power, but his hax abilities are a different story. You could note on his page that he’s 1-B or whatever with reality warping, that he has 1-B potent abilities relative to the verses dimensions (26-D hax) and I wouldn’t be opposed to it.

 

[Reiner04]

Going by this clip you posted, Big Chuck was only “held down” by Eons minions for like literally 3 seconds.

He was taken down 2 times and as obvious it is, was pretty much baffled or kind of unconscious in second one. Either way being taken down by them is itself a red flag.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Also, I’m sorry, but….exactly why has this already been put into Grace Period before I made my chance to respond back?

I know we don’t want to stall this thread by a lengthily time, but you also have to remember that I am the only sole person from the opposition arguing anything here in a thread that’s essentially one vs a plethora of verse supporters who have made a large number of responses for me to respond to, on top of usual off-site business I have. There should be more consideration on time made here to accommodate for that.

Not to mention, I thought it was agreed that this thread would’ve put things like discussing the Contimelia ED barrier on hold until the Big Bang thread gets cleared up, since that feat is what Alien X is being mainly tired off of and is the main deciding factor for this thread.

 

[OMNIVERSAL-KING]

I thought it was agreed that this thread would’ve put things like discussing the Contimelia ED barrier on hold until the Big Bang thread gets cleared up, since that feat is what Alien X is being mainly tired off of and is the main deciding factor for this thread.

Won't it be wrong to ignore and remove this feat without even debunking it
And if results of this downgrade and the contomillia barrier feat , both remain on Alien X's profile, then it will be a massive contradiction

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

He was taken down 2 times and as obvious it is, was pretty much baffled or kind of unconscious in second one. Either way being taken down by them is itself a red flag.

It appears that way because the clip skips around and doesn’t show what happened in between. Either way, being held down for just a few seconds doesn’t sound like an anti feat, but just a small case of bad writing.

Especially since Big Chuck ended up defeating them anyway.

 

[Reiner04]

I know we don’t want to stall this thread by a lengthily time, but you also have to remember that I am the only sole person from the opposition arguing anything here in a thread that’s essentially one vs a plethora of verse supporters who have made a large number of responses for me to respond to, on top of usual off-site business I have. There should be more consideration on time made here to accommodate for that.

Respectfully, You should also remember that we aren't upto and do not have time to keep waiting for your responses and reply back when u are free. Also that u have made ur responses. Nothing was left to said, nothing was there new to add.

Not to mention, I thought it was agreed that this thread would’ve put things like discussing the Contimelia ED barrier on hold until the Big Bang thread gets cleared up, since that feat is what Alien X is being mainly tired off of and is the main deciding factor for this thread.

Was @Qawsedf234 , @DarkDragonMedeus and @KLOL506 and my own reply weren't enough?

 

[Reiner04]

Especially since Big Chuck ended up defeating them anyway.

As i said, everyone can see it in the clip. That's not new, the very point of him being taken down miserably is enough.

 

[Forthegood]

It appears that way because the clip skips around and doesn’t show what happened in between. Either way, being held down for just a few seconds doesn’t sound like an anti feat, but just a small case of bad writing.

Especially since Big Chuck ended up defeating them anyway.

It happened TWO times noway we are going to pass this off as PIS

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

Won't it be wrong to ignore and remove this feat without even debunking it

It’s not about debunking the feat, but determining how it is to be applied by our standards.

The Big Bang obviously has 1-B level creation, the problem is if it truly has 1-B level destructive output, which is the only way it can actually scale AP to anything. And the whole idea of creation having destructive output in and of itself is a problem, which is why I made that big bang thread to get it cleared up.

 

[Gendolfgg1]

Because Alien X can also just as easily be a unique case compared to normal ordinary aliens in the show. And it wouldn’t be unfounded to treat a race of celestial entities with abilities far superior to that of regular aliens as their own case. Especially if you go by Reiner suggesting to treat alien fusions as case by case depending on feats.

And also because of what I explained above regarding Aggregor’s case, where he’s explicitly far inferior physically to a Celestialsapien but would still have their Omnipotence, even if he’s just “1/0th” of one.

I think that the bearers of the Alien X race's forces scale not by their strength, but by their specific ability to make decisions. Some aliens can spend a billion years thinking about what actions to take, and there are also individuals (like Alien X and Gladiator) who can make decisions in seconds, so they scale above all their other relatives. But if we take as an example only a piece of DNA from other aliens (as Aggregor or Atomic-X wanted to become), then they have no personalities and they simply lose the ability of absolute omnipotence (because the powers come from the personalities of the alien). Yes, they still have omnipotence, but clearly more indecisive than other individuals.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

It happened TWO times noway we are going to pass this off as PIS

If your claiming they can hold Big Chuck down, then your saying that they comparable physical strength to him. Which by the end of the fight, is clearly not the case. So yes, I’d argue that to be closer to PIS then to use a random 3 second display.

Which is it then? Is Big Chuck inferior to them, or superior?

 

[Reiner04]

If your claiming they can hold Big Chuck down, then your saying that they comparable physical strength to him. Which by the end of the fight, is clearly not the case. So yes, I’d argue that to be closer to PIS then to use a random 3 second display.

Which is it then? Is Big Chuck inferior to them, or superior?

Ben Tennyson scales to Humungausaur.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Ben Tennyson scales to Humungausaur.

So whoever revised things made a circular scaling moment.

Puta la wea that's why I scale Warcraft the way we do, to avoid circular scaling at all costs!

 

[Forthegood]

This situation reminds me so much of a match in WWE where two small guys tried to take down one big guy but they failed in doing so and how they wanted to accomplished that is by doing a splash from the turnbuckle(idk who was it in particular but i think it was bruan stowman or big show... might even be the great khali) but remembering this indicates to me what happened to Big Chuck shouldn't be posssible AT ALL.

 

[Forthegood]

If your claiming they can hold Big Chuck down, then your saying that they comparable physical strength to him. Which by the end of the fight, is clearly not the case. So yes, I’d argue that to be closer to PIS then to use a random 3 second display.

Which is it then? Is Big Chuck inferior to them, or superior?

ORRR this happened due to the main fact that the DNA combinations are weaker since Upchuck is also in the main chain of the DNA sample between him and Waybig.

 

[Gendolfgg1]

I think that the bearers of the Alien X race's forces scale not by their strength, but by their specific ability to make decisions. Some aliens can spend a billion years thinking about what actions to take, and there are also individuals (like Alien X and Gladiator) who can make decisions in seconds, so they scale above all their other relatives. But if we take as an example only a piece of DNA from other aliens (as Aggregor or Atomic-X wanted to become), then they have no personalities and they simply lose the ability of absolute omnipotence (because the powers come from the personalities of the alien). Yes, they still have omnipotence, but clearly more indecisive than other individuals.

That is, it turns out that the carriers of the Alien X DNA particle do not have mental projections to higher dimensions, so they remain three-dimensional (but with additional abilities of a physical avatar)

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

ORRR this happened due to the main fact that the DNA combinations are weaker since Upchuck is also in the main chain of the DNA sample between him and Waybig.

This has to do with the size aspect not being the same was Way Big, though. Not the attack potency aspect of it.

Way Bigs tier isn’t based on his size, unless I’m mistaken.

 

[DaReaperMan]

This has to do with the size aspect not being the same was Way Big, though. Not the attack potency aspect of it.

Way Bigs tier isn’t based on his size, unless I’m mistaken.

If it was I'd be asking why Ben himself isn't like tier 7 from sheer size

 

[Reiner04]

Eitherway, there's nothing that cannot be seen in the clip. No one ever said that 3 minions can defeat Big chuck but that they're comparable to him in strength, not far inferior or else they wouldn't have been able to take him down.

 

[Forthegood]

This has to do with the size aspect not being the same was Way Big, though. Not the attack potency aspect of it.

Way Bigs tier isn’t based on his size, unless I’m mistaken.

I am not referring to waybig's attack potency sir i am referring to the diluted DNA combinations between Waybig and Upchuck.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I am not referring to waybig's attack potency sir i am referring to the diluted DNA combinations between Waybig and Upchuck.

I know, but you are saying that Big Chuck isn’t as strong as Way Big because of him being an alien with diluted DNA and not having all of Way Bigs traits.

So unless Way Bigs tier and AP is based on his size (something Big Chuck obviously doesn’t have carried over), you are pretty much saying Big Chucks AP is inferior to Way Bigs.

 

[Reiner04]

I know, but you are saying that Big Chuck isn’t as strong as Way Big because of him being an alien with diluted DNA and not having all of Way Bigs traits.

So unless Way Bigs tier and AP is based on his size (something Big Chuck obviously doesn’t have carried over), you are pretty much saying Big Chucks AP is inferior to Way Bigs.

I think u misunderstood what he said, he said him being combination of DNA's goes through altered DNA of some percentage. Making them possibly inferior/superior depending on potencies of traits or the way of combinations.

 

[OMNIVERSAL-KING]

unless Way Bigs tier and AP is based on his size (something Big Chuck obviously doesn’t have carried over), you are pretty much saying Big Chucks AP is inferior to Way Bigs

So big chuck "doesn't have" a trait that makes the AP( physical power ) of waybig
Similarly, Atomic x "have" a trait that makes him vulnerable to CTB
Also "Alien X being unable to stop annihilarg" is also inaccurate because first Serena and bellicus rejected Ben's proposal for saving universe then Ben said same thing again and they both agreed (Serena saying that thing of Alien X being unable to stop it can be cancelled by my previous example of Alien X trying to save dinosaur)

ANNIHILARG THINGS YOU MENTIONED ABOVE
Well a personality of Alien X wants to "save dinosaurs" (I think it was bellicus , this happened in episode X = Ben + 2) but they are still arguing for it, now Serena's statment "I am afraid it is(late)" means same thing (her fair that since ben didn't stopped it before getting activated so Alien X will never decide to do anything)
I can back this up by fact that fraction of Celestialsapien DNA can cut through contimilla barrier (that protects contimilla from energy of annihilarg, and thus have durability to counter annihilarg)

 

[Ghengiroo115]

I think something that really needs to be stressed is that Atomic-X is not “Atomix with the power of Alien X”. Atomic-X biologically is essentially an offspring between a Celestialsapien and Atomix’s species. It’s a completely different situation to Aggregor simply absorbing power so they can’t be compared.

Saying Atomic-X should be half the strength of Alien X is like saying Ben and Gwen should be High 5-A by default because they’re 1/4 Anodite.

 

[Reiner04]

I also don't get fusion arguments being forced at this point after sheer amount of stuff proving we should avoid guess work statistics. Not to mention general consensus in Bigbang thread is as well that Feat is valid. Given that we already used to scale Explosion types bigbang to where it should as per cosmology. And it's been discussed in previous threads already, Annhilargh Bigbang is an unnatural/massive burst of energy/can be used as attack potency/Extra-Dimensional Barrier can hold it inside (manipulating it at will with sheer dura). Nothing is left really from what I can see.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

I think something that really needs to be stressed is that Atomic-X is not “Atomix with the power of Alien X”. Atomic-X biologically is essentially an offspring between a Celestialsapien and Atomix’s species. It’s a completely different situation to Aggregor simply absorbing power so they can’t be compared.

Saying Atomic-X should be half the strength of Alien X is like saying Ben and Gwen should be High 5-A by default because they’re 1/4 Anodite.

This is still missing the overall point here. It doesn’t matter if Atomic X is essentially just an “offspring” or however you want to label him and Aggregor as. Labeling them under different terms is meaningless.

The point is that in both cases, Celestialsapien DNA, capabilities, and all are not 100% Celestialsapien. Aggregor isn’t a 100% Celestialsapien and neither is Atomic X. If anything, Aggregor is even LESS of one than Atomic X would be for just being a completely different being with their powers. He has less Celestialsapien DNA, or not even any DNA at all. But the Omnipotence of a Celestialsapien is still exactly the same in his possession as it would be in an actual Celestialsapien.

That means, no matter if someone is just 1/2 Celestialsapien, no matter if your just an offspring of a Celestialsapien, or if your a completely different being with their capabilities, the power of a Celestialsapien is considered exactly the same as Alien X’s or any other pure Celestialsapien. So the Omnipotence doesn’t get lowered or taken away regardless of who has their powers, period.

Using different terms to try and treat them as different cases doesn’t defeat this point.

 

[Firestorm808]

But the Omnipotence of a [hybrid] Celestialsapien is still exactly the same in his possession as it would be in an actual Celestialsapien.

What is the basis of this claim? What justification are you using to support that the hybrid had any "omnipotence" in the first place?

 

[Gendolfgg1]

What is the basis of this claim? What justification are you using to support that the hybrid had any "omnipotence" in the first place?

As far as I understood, this statement is based on the fact that by absorbing the power of the Alien X child, Aggregor would gain omnipotence, although he absorbs 1/10 of the force. This is also true for crossed DNA, I think

 

[Firestorm808]

As far as I understood, this statement is based on the fact that by absorbing the power of the Alien X child, Aggregor would gain omnipotence, although he absorbs 1/10 of the force. This is also true for crossed DNA, I think

A Child CSP has a trait of 'Power' that others can absorb.

However, we can't assume that a hybrid CSP inherited the same 'Power' trait.

 

[Antvasima]

Staff members here:

Should this thread be closed now?

 

[Firestorm808]

To my understanding, the staff have reached our verdict. I am fine with closure.

 

[Firestorm808]

@Reiner04 Do we have any drafts for the notes to be added?

 

[Reiner04]

@Reiner04 Do we have any drafts for the notes to be added?

Not currently but I think as @Sir_Ovens suggested, I'll prepare a draft soon enough for discussion rule considering how much everyone is tired of this topic, but ig I'll add it in another CRT (I'm pretty much tired out because of this thread currently)

 

[Ghengiroo115]

This is still missing the overall point here. It doesn’t matter if Atomic X is essentially just an “offspring” or however you want to label him and Aggregor as. Labeling them under different terms is meaningless.

The point is that in both cases, Celestialsapien DNA, capabilities, and all are not 100% Celestialsapien. Aggregor isn’t a 100% Celestialsapien and neither is Atomic X. If anything, Aggregor is even LESS of one than Atomic X would be for just being a completely different being with their powers. He has less Celestialsapien DNA, or not even any DNA at all. But the Omnipotence of a Celestialsapien is still exactly the same in his possession as it would be in an actual Celestialsapien.

That means, no matter if someone is just 1/2 Celestialsapien, no matter if your just an offspring of a Celestialsapien, or if your a completely different being with their capabilities, the power of a Celestialsapien is considered exactly the same as Alien X’s or any other pure Celestialsapien. So the Omnipotence doesn’t get lowered or taken away regardless of who has their powers, period.

Using different terms to try and treat them as different cases doesn’t defeat this point.

It does defeat the point, because they are by definition different things. Using other examples of hybrids/fusions/whatever again:

• Ben and Gwen are at best relative to regular Aliens, despite being 1/4 Anodite which are way stronger than other races. Ben himself can barely access his Anodite abilities at all, as very few Anodite hybrids can.
• Alan Albright has to “activate” his Pyronite form like a transformation, whereas all the other Rooters’ experiments appear as simply hybrids. Alan’s Pyronite form also looks exactly like a Pyronite with no human traits. Despite gaining these powers the exact same way as every other member of the Rooters (other than Phil who’s powers come from the Nemetrix), his powers work completely differently.
• Neither Kevin 11 or Ultimate Kevin have the hyper intelligence of Grey Matter or Brainstorm respectively, despite physically having their traits and their intelligence being natural parts of their biology. Ultimate Kevin also doesn’t replicate any of Rath’s unique forms of speaking or personality (aside from technically rage, but that’s not because of Rath).
• Big Chuck is much smaller than Way Big and has a much less combat-efficent body. If the Biomnitrix fusion was truly “perfect”, surely it would retain more of Way Big’s physique and size? Way Big’s size may not be correlated to his AP, but it’s still a pretty big (heh) part of his powerset. Big Chuck isn’t “way big”, just “big”. The physique is an even bigger point, as having Upchuck’s general body shape is pretty much entirely a downgrade.

With all this in mind is very clear that hybrids/fusions/whatever are:

1. Very different from simply absorbing something
2. Extremely inconsistent even between themselves

It should be considered a case-by-case basis. This is all just by looking at the series itself too, once you consider Duncan’s diluted DNA statement then it’s even more blatant that Atomic-X and Aggregor can’t be compared.

 

[ProfessorKukui4Life]

What is the basis of this claim? What justification are you using to support that the hybrid had any "omnipotence" in the first place?

No offense intended if I sound rude or annoyed in this response, but this is exactly why I keep bringing Aggregor up over and over again as he is evidence that proves this claim for how I’ve explained why already.

Aggregor is not a Celestialsapien at all in the first place, he’s a completely different being who would just take their powers under his possession. So he’s not even a Hybrid, an “offspring” or however you want to call it like Atomic X. And the powers Aggregor takes is just 1/10th that of the actual original aliens. So in this case, we’d have someone whos not a Celestialsapien at all that’s posseseing just 1/10th of an actual Celestialsapiens powers. But Paradox and the show still explicitly consider Aggregor to be Omnipotent if he were to successfully take a Celestialsapiens abilities.

That is proof that the Omnipotence doesn’t get depowered or taken away in another beings hands, no matter who possesses it. Regardless if they’re a hybrid Celestialsapien, an offspring, or just not a Celestialsapien to begin with like Aggregor. The Omnipotence is the same as it is in an actual Celestialsapien.

 

[Reiner04]

Honestly have no idea how what u are saying answers what Firestorm saying at all. Fusions are different thing than individuals man. Just treat them as such. No need to over think Monad lvl of omnipotence.