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SoL-only seems to be too slow for Gold Saints

Hiryu-Z

Hiryu-Z

199
35
Currently the Gold Saints and other 7th Sense Users have a rated speed of Speed of Light

I suggest that we upgrade them to at least FTL, based on a recently-awakened 7th Sense Seiya with a broken leg being able to intercept Aiolia's Lightning Plasma (which is obviously SOL) with his Pegasus Meteor Fists, which is roughly 7 times the speed of light
vsbattles.fandom.com

Seiya's Pegasus Meteor Fist intercepts Lightning Plasma

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

Remind that Aiolia also wasn't at 100% at this fight
 
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That calc is pretty old and hasn't been evaluated by a calc group member yet, so it can't be used until it's accepted by at least one of them.
 
In fact, it can't be consistent within the story. Saga, being one of the strongest gold saints, was blitzed by an ftl attack provoked by Seiya with the Aegis shield. And it seems to me that the calc is old enough to be considered.
 
Disagree.

Gold Saints are light speed, it’s only stated 30 times throughout the franchise.

Saga got blitzed by the first confirmed instance of something being stated faster than light, whilst also stating himself to be light speed due to being a gold.

Saga > Seiya and Aiolia, so it’s inconsistent.
 
Hasty12345 said:
Disagree.

Gold Saints are light speed, it’s only stated 30 times throughout the franchise.

Saga got blitzed by the first confirmed instance of something being stated faster than light, whilst also stating himself to be light speed due to being a gold.

Saga > Seiya and Aiolia, so it’s inconsistent.
Click to expand...
Since when was the Hyperdimension crossing feat disqualified?
 
Hasty12345 said:
it's not on his profile because the calculation was debunked along with many of the other speed feats that need to be recalced, hence why all the 7th sense keys at light speed (not that they should be any higher).
Click to expand...
No matter how you slice it its still blatantly MFTL+ based on visuals. Such a massive downgrade is unwarranted even if its waiting to be re-calced.
 
AllForOne said:
No matter how you slice it its still blatantly MFTL+ based on visuals. Such a massive downgrade is unwarranted even if its waiting to be re-calced.
Click to expand...
No calc, no value, no profile.

so when these characters go back to being speed of sound 10 chapters later in ND, what's your explanation?
 
Hasty12345 said:
No calc, no value, no profile.

so when these characters go back to being speed of sound 10 chapters later in ND, what's your explanation?
Click to expand...
You don't need a calc for the minimum speed of the feat. Crossing one galaxy is enough to get it.

Is it based on translations or original japanese? :unsure:
 
Hasty12345 said:
Can we not turn every Saint Seiya thread into translation scaling??
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Original Japanese > Official English / Spanish > Fan translation

Language translation is everything when dealing with foreign fictions. The japanese word Hoshi can mean either star or planet as an example of this. Two entirely different tiers.
 
Hasty12345 said:
Feel free to make a CRT with all your approved translations.

As it stands, Gold Saints don't have any FTL feats or scaling.
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Will in do time unless somebody beats me to it. Guess all the old mods retired if this is the state of things.

Fan translations deserve to be banned as a whole honestly. In versus debating. Anybody can make them and completely rewrite the original text.
 
You've just said Raws > official translations, now fan translations should be banned?

We are actively working to fix the state of this verse, a part of that is recognizing speed scaling for Golds and non-god-beings are do not surpass light speed with any level of consistency. The characters you are advocating to be MFTL+ are mach 1 in their next appearance. Golds who are stronger than the 20th century Golds are light speed.

Do not make nebulous insinuations about the current verse supporters and mods when the old mods are the ones who royally f**ked the verse to begin with.
 
Hasty12345 said:
You've just said Raws > official translations, now fan translations should be banned?

We are actively working to fix the state of this verse, a part of that is recognizing speed scaling for Golds and non-god-beings are do not surpass light speed with any level of consistency. The characters you are advocating to be MFTL+ are mach 1 in their next appearance. Golds who are stronger than the 20th century Golds are light speed.

Do not make nebulous insinuations about the current verse supporters and mods when the old mods are the ones who royally f**ked the verse to begin with.
Click to expand...
Yes. Fan translations are non-canon by default. Using them in any circumstance over Raw / Official is incredibly disrespectful to the actual content.

That's not a problem. But you need to be using the correct evidence to argue these claims. This needs to be a precedent going forward.
 
IMO all it proves is that Saints can go FTL briefly when they’re against the ropes/ burning cosmo to their limit, their standard 7th sense speed should be seriously be just light speed unless they’re under that specific circumstance.
 
AguilaR202 said:
IMO all it proves is that Saints can go FTL briefly when they’re against the ropes/ burning cosmo to their limit, their standard 7th sense speed should be seriously be just light speed unless they’re under that specific circumstance.
Click to expand...
That doesn't work when you have Saints varying in many orders of magnitude in strength and they're all very consistently light speed.

The whole "faster when burning their cosmo" thing is a myth, it stems from 6th sense users going from mach 1 to like mach 5, 7th sense users ARE light speed. stated over and over and over again.
 
Hasty12345 said:
The CRT is being made with an unaccepted calc, there's no evidence on either ends side.



where's your evidence btw?
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You're the one making the claims yet you never linked anything to back it up. I'm simply pointing out the validity of different translations.

Hasty12345 said:
Saga got blitzed by the first confirmed instance of something being stated faster than light, whilst also stating himself to be light speed due to being a gold.

Saga > Seiya and Aiolia, so it’s inconsistent.
Click to expand...
See here for example.
 
As it currently stands, the CRT has no basis given it's trying to upgrade characters with an unaccepted calc.

It should have been closed pretty much immediately. The OP has made no effort to support their claim with scans or scaling beyond the calc, this debate is pointless. As such, I'm not going to waste my time gathering scans for an extensive debunk of a non-existent point.

This is not a discord debate server unless you're going to take over for the OP with a validated calc and scans of your own, I'm not going waste my time proving claims that are self-evident for anyone who has read the manga, which is who my comments are targeted towards.
 
Hasty12345 said:
That doesn't work when you have Saints varying in many orders of magnitude in strength and they're all very consistently light speed.

The whole "faster when burning their cosmo" thing is a myth, it stems from 6th sense users going from mach 1 to like mach 5, 7th sense users ARE light speed. stated over and over and over again.
Click to expand...
Didn’t seiya surpass the speed of light vs Saga, at that point all he had was willpower and missing several senses so I don’t see why FTL when pushing their limits doesn’t work, specially when it’s so rare and their speed 99% of times would still just be LS.
 
Hasty12345 said:
No calc, no value, no profile.

so when these characters go back to being speed of sound 10 chapters later in ND, what's your explanation?
Click to expand...

That one's stated in ND. They're holding back and not using their 7th Sense.

Ikki stated so to Kaiser and the Pope.

Shiryu stating so to young Dohko

Hyoga stating so to Mystoria.

We also see they can equal or exceed the 18th Century Saints when they DO use their 7th sense.

Ikki blowing back Kaiser's Lightning Plasma had Kaiser shocked

Shiryu was equally matched with Dohko

And Hyoga matched Mystoria and froze his cloth.

Now, the OP's calc is flawed and the idea of them going SOL/FTL is for another time, but the reason for them being blitzed at lightspeed is because they're holding back to not hurt the 18th century Saints.
 
Hasty12345 said:
As it currently stands, the CRT has no basis given it's trying to upgrade characters with an unaccepted calc.

It should have been closed pretty much immediately. The OP has made no effort to support their claim with scans or scaling beyond the calc, this debate is pointless. As such, I'm not going to waste my time gathering scans for an extensive debunk of a non-existent point.

This is not a discord debate server unless you're going to take over for the OP with a validated calc and scans of your own, I'm not going waste my time proving claims that are self-evident for anyone who has read the manga, which is who my comments are targeted towards.
Click to expand...
Don't reply making more unproven claims then. Its hypocritical.

if you would like I can point you out to the proper translations. Viz Media has the entire manga available digitally. :)
 
AguilaR202 said:
Didn’t seiya surpass the speed of light vs Saga, at that point all he had was willpower and missing several senses so I don’t see why FTL when pushing their limits doesn’t work, specially when it’s so rare and their speed 99% of times would still just be LS.
Click to expand...
Nah that statement is in the anime, in the manga when he raises his cosmo to its limit it doesn't state a speed


The FTL statement comes from Athena's shield

AerrowStorm1 said:
That one's stated in ND. They're holding back and not using their 7th Sense.

Ikki stated so to Kaiser and the Pope.

Shiryu stating so to young Dohko

Hyoga stating so to Mystoria.

We also see they can equal or exceed the 18th Century Saints when they DO use their 7th sense.

Ikki blowing back Kaiser's Lightning Plasma had Kaiser shocked

Shiryu was equally matched with Dohko

And Hyoga matched Mystoria and froze his cloth.

Now, the OP's calc is flawed and the idea of them going SOL/FTL is for another time, but the reason for them being blitzed at lightspeed is because they're holding back to not hurt the 18th century Saints.
Click to expand...
I am aware of the context, however, none of those statements make the bronzes FTL, my point wasn't that the bronzes cannot reach light-speed, it was their stated speeds aren't billions of times FTL. The only explicit mention of FTL movement is from Ody and Tenma, where Ody says that he's FTL hence why Golds couldn't hit him with their light speed fist.


Before anyone says this panel goes against me, Sukiyo's cosmo was surrounding Tenma


So it was an aided feat, a feat consistent with how FTL speed is portrayed in the spin-offs as well, but that's not too relevant.

More to the point, if Ody says the Golds are light-speed (whom he fought just about all of), that would include Cain who's above the 18th and 20th century Golds.

So Golds being FTL is massively inconsistent, with the lowest peg on the scaling chain that can reach FTL speeds being Ody and Sukiyo amped Tenma, if not Athena's shield.
 
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