Scaling to Low 6-B

[NikHelton]

Tatsumaki recently received a new update that puts her at Low 6-B+. The mob scales up to it based on ONE's quote saying that the "serious" Shigeo evenly stands with Tatsumaki, while the base one loses. However, scales to Low 6-B only ??? Mob's shape, which is a bit baffling to me, because it should be absolutely incalculably higher than its 100% shape.
I think that in the second key it is worth adding "likely 6-B", just referring to this quote. And you know, it will make sense. High 7-a feat was performed by simply releasing Kageyama's power, and His opponent became at least 4 times stronger during the battle. Then Mob completely trampled this version of the enemy, and the enemy in turn completely trampled this version of Shigeo. I think the scaling should also apply to the 100% version of Suzuki, which is superior to the 100% Mob. As well as for The strongest Mogami ghosts, which were a deadly danger to serious Shigeo.

I would like to ask you to look at Kageyama's Large Mountain feat, because my friend Plank69 noticed that the low end is too "low" and the average value is more suitable for evaluating the level. Moreover, through a series of banal multiplications, this can give us a base line of High 6-C for the 100% Mob shown.

 

[Planck69]

I do agree that the end we use for 100% Mob is a bit too low (the 5 second time-frame is a bit more preferrable while the 2.5 second one is too fast) and that this would scale him further into 6-C. However ???% has the more reasonable claim to being equal to Tatsumaki. Yes, the form we use for a "Serious" Mob may seem a bit arbitrary but currently the gap between the calculated feat for 100% Mob and higher tiers is a bit too high to appropriately upscale.

If we do adjust the end used for scaling, then I can only see the top-tiers being 6-C outright and ???% being Low 6-B.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

That quote is an OLD quote that was made when the One Punch Man manga didn't even have feats for Tatsumaki.


I suggest we completely disregard the quote from now on, via death of the author logic. Surely, ONE never predicted just how much the manga would make the characters of One Punch Man so strong. Tatsumaki's lifting the base feat in the webcomic only did damage to the city, but in the manga, half the entire countryside got cracked open like an egg.


i believe ONE's statements for "mob vs Tatsumaki" should be disregarded.

 

[Planck69]

>That quote is an OLD quote that was made when the One Punch Man manga didn't even have feats for Tatsumaki.

And? Assuming this is true, the fact that ONE didn't retract his statement after giving Tatsumaki new feats means that he still holds ???%'s true power to be around Tatsumaki's. If he was so sure that Tastumaki could perform all of her feats that he gives them to her and approves of their scale in the manga but is unsure who would win in a fight between either of them then he clearly holds Mob's full power above the feats that Tatsumaki scales to.

>I suggest we completely disregard the quote from now on, via death of the author logic. Surely, ONE never predicted just how much the manga would make the characters of One Punch Man so strong. Tatsumaki's lifting the base feat in the webcomic only did damage to the city, but in the manga, half the entire countryside got cracked open like an egg.

He oversees the manga and approved of the feat, he thinks that Tatsumaki scales to said feat, ergo ???% would also scale to this level of power. And that's not how we use Death of the Author at all. It's only brought in when there's a very obvious discrepancy between what is stated by the author and what is implied by the work in question. Here, it's a character whose upper limits have never been showcased having his full power being compared to Tatsumaki. Nothing contradicts this in either manga and thus it can be used.

And even then, if one is taking just the mid-end of the feat that 100% Mob scales to then ???% would scale unfathomably above a very casual 34 Gigatons. So we have a character that upscales massively above Orochi and a casual Tatsumaki's ball park being compared to the latter's full power when he himself is giving it his all. No contradiction here to speak off.

If you can't trust my words then see the past three discussions we've had on the matter where it was decided that the scaling is very much correct.

 

[AtomicSekiro]

Why do you think he would retract a statement he has most likely forgot he has made?


he doesn't need to publicly announce that his statement is wrong. The fact the statement was made when Tatsumaki was incredibly weak in the webcomic, and ONE has no idea the powercreep One Punch Man would go through, makes his statement irrelevant.


Should we keep using Toriyama's "Goku is a 6, Beerus is a 10" statement despite the fact the anime disproves it? Toriyama never retracted the statement, afterall.

 

[NikHelton]

I do agree that the end we use for 100% Mob is a bit too low (the 5 second time-frame is a bit more preferrable while the 2.5 second one is too fast) and that this would scale him further into 6-C. However ???% has the more reasonable claim to being equal to Tatsumaki. Yes, the form we use for a "Serious" Mob may seem a bit arbitrary but currently the gap between the calculated feat for 100% Mob and higher tiers is a bit too high to appropriately upscale.
If we do adjust the end used for scaling, then I can only see the top-tiers being 6-C outright and ???% being Low 6-B.

Just because Shigeo didn't show anything close to Tatsumaki's feats, in his 100% form, I suggest just putting him "likely Low 6-B+", just assuming a higher level. But for ??? Low 6-B will be absolutely accurate.

 

[Planck69]

>Why do you think he would retract a statement he has most likely forgot he has made?

Are we seriously assuming that he somehow forgot a statement made in an official interview about the main protagonist of one of his two most important works and a major supporting character in the other work? By this logic then, any statement that has been around and hasn't been contradicted should be discarded since "he could've forgot".

>he doesn't need to publicly announce that his statement is wrong. The fact the statement was made when Tatsumaki was incredibly weak in the webcomic, and ONE has no idea the powercreep One Punch Man would go through, makes his statement irrelevant.

He still oversees the manga in some regard and approves of the portrayal of feats done by Murata. It's just a matter of scaling at this point. Does he believe X is comparable to Y? Yes. The actual numbers of Y don't matter here unless they contradict anything shown in the story which in-case you haven't noticed, they don't.

>Should we keep using Toriyama's "Goku is a 6, Beerus is a 10" statement despite the fact the anime disproves it? Toriyama never retracted the statement, afterall.

You've literally answered your own question. The original work in question disproves the scaling and therefore Death of the Author comes into play and the statement can't be used. Here, ONE's statement isn't contradicted by anything in the manga. Both upscale massively above the roughly same level of power, Tatsumaki showcased a Low 6-B feat recently and in the case of ???%, any upper bounds to his power are never implied in the original work at all.

But if you feel strongly enough about this then by all means, make a fourth thread.

 

[Planck69]

Just because Shigeo didn't show anything close to Tatsumaki's feats, in his 100% form, I suggest just putting him "likely Low 6-B+", just assuming a higher level. But for ??? Low 6-B will be absolutely accurate.

Thing is, in the case of Orochi, Garou, Golden Sperm and Psykos, all of them scale to Tatsumaki in some regard hence the "Possibly" ratings. Here, nobody has anything that can suggest the top-tiers like 100% Mob can back-scale from ???%.

The excess energy from ???%'s casual strikes which were without any intent to harm or fight could, when absorbed by Toichiro, take him from being depleted to near his prime in chapter 100. In the one combat scenario we see him in, he nukes dozens to a hundred ghosts which could invidually harm an emotion (100% Courage) superior to 80% Toichiro...with a thought.

At best, if the mid-end gets accepted then I can see something like At least 6-C but no more.

 

[NikHelton]

The quote about uniform fighting refers to a "serious" Mob, not ???. I'm not saying just put him and the same Suzuki Low 6-B.
No. Just put "At least 6-C, likely Low 6-B".

 

[AtomicSekiro]

1. Flawed logic. Interview statements can always be disregarded if the events of the series itself contradict the statement, which in this case, does.


2. Yes, he oversees the manga. AND? Manga Tatsumaki would ANNIHILATE Webcomic Tatsumaki via feats and scaling, and Webcomic Tatsumaki is the Tatsumaki ONE stated could defeat a Serious Mob.


3. Except the current OPM manga events contradict the statement. 100% Sadness Mob at best was lifting 30+ buildings to defeat 80% Toichiro, and a serious 100% Courage Mob was being beaten back and most likely would've lost to 100% Toichiro if he didn't lose control of his power.


meanwhile, Manga Tatsumaki split apart an entire city and MOST OF A COUNTRYSIDE BY JUST LIFTING A BASE OUT OF THE GROUND when she "stopped holding back", and may have not even been at full power, due to the lack of strain or sweating she was showcasing.

 

[Planck69]

1. Flawed logic. Interview statements can always be disregarded if the events of the series itself contradict the statement, which in this case, does.

That I agree with (literally see my posts) but I do not agree with it contradicting the series.

2. Yes, he oversees the manga. AND? Manga Tatsumaki would ANNIHILATE Webcomic Tatsumaki via feats and scaling, and Webcomic Tatsumaki is the Tatsumaki ONE stated could defeat a Serious Mob.

No distinction exists in ONE's mind between Manga and Webcomic Tatsumaki, your the one pulling this out of thin air. Even then, so what? We take manga as the primary canon on the wiki anyway so we take it to be the manga version anyway. Again, the numbers aren't the issue. Does ONE consider Tatsumaki to be comparable to full power Mob? Yes. Is there any contradiction? No, considering that ???%'s only showcased feats are flexing on everyone else in the verse while taking flowers to his crush.

3. Except the current OPM manga events contradict the statement. 100% Sadness Mob at best was lifting 30+ buildings to defeat 80% Toichiro, and a serious 100% Courage Mob was being beaten back and most likely would've lost to 100% Toichiro if he didn't lose control of his power.


meanwhile, Manga Tatsumaki split apart an entire city and MOST OF A COUNTRYSIDE BY JUST LIFTING A BASE OUT OF THE GROUND when she "stopped holding back", and may have not even been at full power, due to the lack of strain or sweating she was showcasing.

It's a good thing I'm talking about ???% who has shown no upper bounds at all besides being the god-tier of the verse and casually stomping dozens of ghosts who can individually tango with people comparable to 80% Toichiro by thinking. Of couse 100% Mob scaling to Tatsumaki is a bit ridiculous.

And FYI, it's Mob's "30+ buildings" that Tats' LS scales too, what do you mean by this.?

 

[AtomicSekiro]

1. Is the fact Webomic and Manga Tatsumaki are completely different in strength, durability, speed and techniques to showcase that ONE considers them different in power?


Webcomic Tatsumaki without her barrier up took damage from Psykos throwing her into rocks.


Manga Tatsumaki without her barrier up brushed off multiple blasts from Orochi's dragons with minimal damage.


2. Tatsumaki's newest Manga feat is WAY, WAY, WAY ABOVE Mob lifting 30+ buildings. Why does she scale to him? They're completely different in lifting strength, now. Tatsumaki dominates him. She's way above him, and he can't scale to her due to the statement being irrelevant due to One Punch Man, as a whole, as been buffed compared to the Webcomic, which is what ONE used to scale Tatsumaki to Mob.


Manga Tatsumaki >>> ???% Mob potentially = Webcomic Tatsumaki >>> 100% Serious Mob.

 

[Planck69]

1. Is the fact Webomic and Manga Tatsumaki are completely different in strength, durability, speed and techniques to showcase that ONE considers them different in power?

Webcomic Tatsumaki without her barrier up took damage from Psykos throwing her into rocks.


Manga Tatsumaki without her barrier up brushed off multiple blasts from Orochi's dragons with minimal damage.


2. Tatsumaki's newest Manga feat is WAY, WAY, WAY ABOVE Mob lifting 30+ buildings. Why does she scale to him? They're completely different in lifting strength, now. Tatsumaki dominates him. She's way above him, and he can't scale to her due to the statement being irrelevant due to One Punch Man, as a whole, as been buffed compared to the Webcomic, which is what ONE used to scale Tatsumaki to Mob.


Manga Tatsumaki >>> ???% Mob potentially = Webcomic Tatsumaki >>> 100% Serious Mob.

1. You really dont seem to understand what I and three discussions have established do you? The numerical statistics are irrelevant to the scaling being established. It didn't matter when Tats was High 6-C, it didn't matter when she was 6-C and it doesn't matter now that she's Low 6-B. The statement isn't contradicted anywhere so he scales. Again, we also use the manga as the primary canon so any cross-scaling would come from there. Until the manga and webcomic stuff is separate then it's staying as it is. Even then, Murata is the one that increases the scale so it's not as though ONE is just deciding to make his established characters stronger. The fact that he sees this and gives it the go ahead is a point for Mob scaling not the other way around. Yet you don't seem to get this.

2. We have multiple statements of scaling between characters done in OPM. If you want to downgrade Mob because of discrepancy in feats, please remember that Golden Sperm, Orochi and Garou should also be downgraded. The former two have no feats on that level while the latter has nothing to his High 6-A key beyond the statement but his key is completely uncontested, even though his best feat prior to that was smashing some rocks. Fighting Saitama is unquantifiable since he was obviously not putting in any effort (as always). That scaling is legitimate yet people complain about this for some reason, despite the tier difference being even smaller.

This doesn't even just apply to ONE. Multiple author statements are used for characters to scale on here anyway so why would this be any different? Before you try to bring up cross-scaling, look at all of the three threads I posted above, them being in two different verses was proven to be completely irrelevant and an arbitrary distinction.

So what's left here? Your main argument is that it would scale to web-comic Tats who doesn't have any relevance to scaling on this wiki as of this post. I've already pointed out how ONE allowing Murata to up the scale to what it is already proves that he doesn't think that anything showcased would affect the how the two compare in his mind and there are no anti-feats on Mob's part to disprove him scaling.

Make a CRT on why he shouldn't scale. Until then, he does.

 

[Schnee_One]

We literally discussed whether he scales or not to death https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3993929?useskin=oasis

 

[Planck69]

I know, it's tiring on my end believe me.

 

[NikHelton]

2. Tatsumaki's newest Manga feat is WAY, WAY, WAY ABOVE Mob lifting 30+ buildings. Why does she scale to him? They're completely different in lifting strength, now. Tatsumaki dominates him. She's way above him, and he can't scale to her due to the statement being irrelevant due to One Punch Man, as a whole, as been buffed compared to the Webcomic, which is what ONE used to scale Tatsumaki to Mob.

30 buildings? Lol. If you don't rely on my last calc, then Tatsumaki is exactly scaled relative to these "30 buildings". I don't understand why you're trying to understate Shigeo's feat.


Manga Tatsumaki >>> ???% Mob potentially = Webcomic Tatsumaki >>> 100% Serious Mob.


How do you know how much stronger Tatsumaki is from the manga ??? Mob, if he banal walking and waving his hands tramples characters 6-C+?

How do you know how much stronger Tatsumaki is from the manga ??? Mob, if he banal walking and waving his hands stomps characters 6-C+?

Moreover, what makes you think that Tatsumaki from a webcomic is many times stronger than 100% Mob? All of her exploits are taken from the manga. What we see in a webcomic hardly exceeds 7-B.

 

[Planck69]

He's trying to say that ???% is only equal to web-comic Tatsumaki. Not sure why when she isn't even relevant to the wiki as far as scaling goes.

But you're right. When a guy whose ass-claps can restore a depleted esper to 6-C is stated to scale to a Low 6-B at full power, I find that far more believable than him scaling to a 7-B Webcomic Tats when he already has a 7-A to 6-C feat via walking. Seriously, it's becoming a tradition every time Tatsumaki changes tier and everyone who brings it up forgets that scaling exists.

 

[Schnee_One]

Atomic Sekiro has to make a CRT on his own to try and adjust the scaling

Thus, I will close this.

Edit: Nevermind, the OP discussed something seperately