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One Piece Chapter 1070: "The Strongest Form of Humanity" (Official)

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And H6A Kaido couldn't even kill Kin'emon and Guernica (in Super Hybrid Form + Drunk Mode at that). Should Kaido lose his rating because of that?
 
Kinemon and Guernica are also H6A iirc, and it's not like Kaidou didn't injure them badly.
So I don't know how this compares to Lucci, yes he had one clash but he also missed all his other shots on Luffy and couldn't even knock out Sentomaru who doesn't scale to H6A as far as we know. He also couldn't avoid any of Luffy's attacks. So yeah, I don't think he's H6A, we should wait.
 
That's not even mentioning the fact that Kaidou not killing Kinemon and Guernica is more of a stupid plot moment than an anti feat.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
To be fair Eminiteable is being a little biased here.
He's using one little clash to make a profile while everything else suggests that that clash was probably just an outlier.
Every other time, Lucci either failed to hit Luffy or failed to react to his attacks in time.
Even in the CRT for it they were blatantly ignoring and pushing aside my counter arguments as to why Lucci isn't H6A so yeah, I think this is probably just being added out of bias and spite and should be removed, we practically have no evidence for it anyway.
Click to expand...
First of all, I don't see how anything I've said in this thread or the scaling thread makes me biased towards Lucci or that I'm scaling him out of spite, would appreciate if you dropped the baseless accusations just because you disagree with the scaling.

You've claimed the clash (AP) is an outlier but your arguments for that all involve speed scaling (Which I already covered in the scaling thread and even this thread involving the new content) and have nothing to do with AP, so I'm struggling to see what Anti-feats there are for his AP. I never ignored your arguments, I responded to them and explained why your interpretation of events was false in the thread. Others in the thread also responded to your counter-arguments.

There's plenty of evidence for his current scaling and even more now after this chapter. When the official release drops I'll make a follow-up thread that tackles the events of this chapter for his profile.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
Kinemon and Guernica are also H6A iirc, and it's not like Kaidou didn't injure them badly.
So I don't know how this compares to Lucci, yes he had one clash but he also missed all his other shots on Luffy and couldn't even knock out Sentomaru who doesn't scale to H6A as far as we know. He also couldn't avoid any of Luffy's attacks. So yeah, I don't think he's H6A, we should wait.
Click to expand...
Sentomaru's incapacitated at the end of the chapter and the Seraphims are under the control of the CP0, and it was all because of Lucci's attack on him. So that wasn't an anti-feat like you keep claiming.

Lucci literally avoided a surprise attack from Luffy in this very chapter when he was trying to go after Sentomaru.

We don't have to wait, any more feats would just be further justifications for him to have the H6A rating.
 
Eminiteable said:
First of all, I don't see how anything I've said in this thread or the scaling thread makes me biased towards Lucci or that I'm scaling him out of spite, would appreciate if you dropped the baseless accusations just because you disagree with the scaling.

You've claimed the clash (AP) is an outlier but your arguments for that all involve speed scaling (Which I already covered in the scaling thread and even this thread involving the new content) and have nothing to do with AP, so I'm struggling to see what Anti-feats there are for his AP. I never ignored your arguments, I responded to them and explained why your interpretation of events was false in the thread. Others in the thread also responded to your counter-arguments.

There's plenty of evidence for his current scaling and even more now after this chapter. When the official release drops I'll make a follow-up thread that tackles the events of this chapter for his profile.
Click to expand...
I've already questioned the AP/LS part of the clash.
If the justification is that G5 Luffy with Armament is H6A, then I simply ask how and why?
Let's say Oda claims that G5 is somewhat stronger than G4. That doesn't make it H6A automatically. Because it's nonsensical to think that Luffy, without even increasing his muscles or using his toon force powers like he did with Kaidou, is instantly H6A with G5 because it's supposedly above certain G4 attacks.
So we literally have 0 feats with this specific version of Luffy ( him using G5 but none of the actual amps, mixed with basic Armament ) to say that he scales that high, so the same is for Lucci.
And about his LS- Sure, it can be Class P for lifting Bajrang Gun, but we can not say that he was putting the same amount of effort in against Lucci here.
One was him lifting a huge Island Sized fist, to take down Kaidou, who mind you is definitely a bigger threat than Lucci by the fact that Luffy used that gigantic fist in the first place.
The other is him using basic Haki and "base" G5 against Lucci, who as far as he knows is not as big of a problem as Kaidou. So why would he be putting as much effort into pushing Lucci as he did with swinging BG?
 
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RoronoaxRobin said:
Sentomaru's incapacitated at the end of the chapter and the Seraphims are under the control of the CP0, and it was all because of Lucci's attack on him. So that wasn't an anti-feat like you keep claiming.
Click to expand...
Yeah and Kaku was literally sitting on him the next time we see him. It's pretty obvious what happened.
1: Lucci jumps at him
2: Sentomaru sees him and tries to block
3: This is the fuzziest part- It's either that Lucci got through his guard or went around with Soru. Either way, he dispatches him with Hand Gun.
4: Sentomaru coughs blood, and kneels for a moment.
5: Luffy claps Lucci for him
6: Sentomaru tells Luffy to leave him and go save Vegapunk while he lies there.
7: The other CP0 agents come and they knock him out for Lucci and regroup.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
Yeah and Kaku was literally sitting on him the next time we see him. It's pretty obvious what happened.
1: Lucci jumps at him
2: Sentomaru sees him and tries to block
3: This is the fuzziest part- It's either that Lucci got through his guard or went around with Soru. Either way, he dispatches him with Hand Gun.
4: Sentomaru coughs blood, and kneels for a moment.
5: Luffy claps Lucci for him
6: Sentomaru tells Luffy to leave him and go save Vegapunk while he lies there.
7: The other CP0 agents come and they knock him out for Lucci and regroup.
Click to expand...
Or he just succumbed to his injures from Lucci's attack.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
I've already questioned the AP/LS part of the clash.
If the justification is that G5 Luffy with Armament is H6A, then I simply ask how and why?
Let's say Oda claims that G5 is somewhat stronger than G4. That doesn't make it H6A automatically. Because it's nonsensical to think that Luffy, without even increasing his muscles or using his toon force powers like he did with Kaidou, is instantly H6A with G5 because it's supposedly above certain G4 attacks.
So we literally have 0 feats with this specific version of Luffy ( him using G5 but none of the actual amps, mixed with basic Armament ) to say that he scales that high, so the same is for Lucci.
And about his LS- Sure, it can be Class P for lifting Bajrang Gun, but we can not say that he was putting the same amount of effort in against Lucci here.
One was him lifting a huge Island Sized fist, to take down Kaidou, who mind you is definitely a bigger threat than Lucci by the fact that Luffy used that gigantic fist in the first place.
The other is him using basic Haki and "base" G5 against Lucci, who as far as he knows is not as big of a problem as Kaidou. So why would he be putting as much effort into pushing Lucci and he did with swinging BG?
Click to expand...
I believe the majority of this was already covered by other users in the scaling thread, I'm not going to drag this back up and derail the chapter thread further with a large debate regarding scaling solely based on a past chapter.

Like I said in my previous post I plan on creating a follow-up thread to go over the contents of this chapter so you could probably bring up these points there or even make your own thread for it.
 
Okay, I'll just copypaste my arguments on that thread then so we can stop pushing our debates onto other ones.
 
RoronoaxRobin said:
Yeah, I was thinking Kizaru was coming with a Buster Call too.

If that's what it is, Robin's reaction to it will be interesting
Click to expand...
Same though. Might be one of the bigger buster calls since he summoned a large amount of warships. I'm just worried Buster Call might destroy Vegapunk's brain- he's reckless to move around while having his brain stored almost out in the open unless he can teleport it (since we saw him teleport himself)
 
Lol are we using Shiki movie feats to scale every top tier to High 6A now?


What happened to movies not being canon to the main series lmao

And the same Shiki got destroyed by pre ts G3 Luffy, so guess pre TS Luffy is also High 6A.
 
Ebitan34 said:
Lol are we using Shiki movie feats to scale every top tier to High 6A now?


What happened to movies not being canon to the main series lmao

And the same Shiki got destroyed by pre ts G3 Luffy, so guess pre TS Luffy is also High 6A.
Click to expand...
It was revealed in a canon backstory for the movie that he was a rival to Roger and it required Garp and Sengoku to jump him and imprison him.
He then escaped prison, being the only person besides Luffy to ever break in and out of prison.
So yeah, he's H6A, though him losing to pre ts Luffy was a non-canon outlier.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
It was revealed in a canon backstory for the movie that he was a rival to Roger and it required Garp and Sengoku to jump him and imprison him.
He then escaped prison, being the only person besides Luffy to ever break in and out of prison.
So yeah, he's H6A, though him losing to pre ts Luffy was a non-canon outlier.
Click to expand...
This sounds like selectively picking what is and what isn't canon tbh

Just because Shiki is a canon character and his backstory is canon, doesn't make the movie itself canon lol.

If him losing to pre TS Luffy isn't canon, why should his movie feat be considered canon in the first place then?

Him being a rival to Roger also doesn't automatically mean he is High 6-A since the High 6-A feat is from movie Shiki in the first place that isn't canon, making this a circular argument.
 
Ebitan34 said:
This sounds like selectively picking what is and what isn't canon tbh

Just because Shiki is a canon character and his backstory is canon, doesn't make the movie itself canon lol.

If him losing to pre TS Luffy isn't canon, why should his movie feat be considered canon in the first place then?

Him being a rival to Roger also doesn't automatically mean he is High 6-A since the High 6-A feat is from movie Shiki in the first place that isn't canon, making this a circular argument.
Click to expand...
What H6A Feat? All I know is that he fought Roger, Sengoku and Garp.
 
Ebitan34 said:
And how does that make him H6A?

If I am not mistaken, Shiki's movie feat is the reason every top tier scales to High 6-A now, not the other way round.
Click to expand...
I ask again what feat because I literally didn't watch the movie I just heard about "Chapter 0" that explains his backstory and history with Roger.
 
That was brought up in the thread and was agreed that all of Luffy's feats against Shiki are outliers.
 
Basically.

It's a similar situation as in Film Z, where Luffy is bumped up to these high levels that he shouldn't be in for the sake of the film (Yonko-ish level for Strong World, Admiral for Film Z).
 
There's also Stampede with Bullet who's probably considerably above Admiral level and somewhat below Yonko level yet post WCI Luffy was able to beat him in a team effort.
 
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