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Kirby General Discussion Thread (fun edition)

So just from my 100% playthrough of the game, I tried to jot down any versus viable stuff that could be added to Kirby's profile in the future, I might make a CRT for it down the road, but have you guys noticed so far? There'll be spoilers down below for those who haven't finished yet:

Kirby has gained:

Time Manipulation via Time Crash

ID-F86 / Fecto Forgo seems to have the following abilities:

-A planet-wide wave of psychic energy that can take control of (either mind control/possession)the inhabitants of the planet, including every enemy and boss you encounter
-Can also manually possess specific indiviuals
-Soul manipulation & BFR, as it was able to shatter Leongar's soul and scatter it across an entire dimension.
-Illusion creation, capable of creating replicas of various enemies & bosses across the series using psychic energy based on ID-F86's collected memories of the victim while under their control.
-Low Godly regen (?), via being able to survive the complete and utter destruction of its body by surviving purely through its own powerful mind, taking a phantom form instead.

Fecto Elfilis / Chaos Elfilis seems to have the following abilities/feats:

-One of the most solid High 5A feats in the series via throwing Planet Popstar through a spatial-teleportation vortex, causing it and the Forgotten Land to both approach their Roche Limit.
-Presumably everything the prior form has
-Heavily enhanced spatial-teleportation abilities

Meta Knight has gained:

-Limited possession/mind control resistance, as he was able to resist ID-F86's control attempts via sheer force of will.

Morpho Knight has gained:

-Soul destruction/absorption, via consuming ID-F86/Soul Forgo, killing it completely

Anything else worth noting you guys think?
 
That's is mostly correct, I will add it in time in the sandbox I linked in the CRT. But I would need help to have scans of the type of dialogues that may not be findable in youtube.
 
Except for the fact that there's no reason for MK to have limited resistance. He resisted mind hax which could control Dedede who resisted the influence of jamba hearts being present near him (after we fight him). Pretty sure that's straight up resistance to mind manipulation.
 
Lou_change said:
It's will power supernatural will is a thing.
Click to expand...

Actually nvm

Supernatural Willpower is the ability to exceed one's own limits through sheer willpower to a degree extremely far beyond real human standards.

This is the description, so while he could get Supernatural willpower he also gets res to mind manipulation along with it
 
Lou_change said:
It can also be a weakness of the mind manipulation if I recall.
Click to expand...
That would be blatant downplay in Forgo's case, not to mention that it's layered mind manip as it controlled Dedede who has a resistance
 
Arceus0x said:
That would be blatant downplay in Forgo's case, not to mention that it's layered mind manip as it controlled Dedede who has a resistance
Click to expand...
I mean the context is literally willpower let meta knight resist I don't know what is the default assumption I just wanted to point out the possibility.
 
Lou_change said:
I mean the context is literally willpower let meta knight resist I don't know what is the default assumption I just wanted to point out the possibility.
Click to expand...
Ik but it is straight up resistance, the method doesn't matter. If you have a helmet that reflects mind controlling waves then that is also resistance to MM. In this case MKs will is so strong it counters mind control
 
Eficiente said:
That's is mostly correct, I will add it in time in the sandbox I linked in the CRT. But I would need help to have scans of the type of dialogues that may not be findable in youtube.
Click to expand...
If necessary, I have a 100% profile and could snatch the screencaps of the various lore pages and such that are needed. I have a capture card, or could alternatively just post the pics to twitter, download them, then delete the posts.
 
Arceus0x said:
Ik but it is straight up resistance, the method doesn't matter. If you have a helmet that reflects mind controlling waves then that is also resistance to MM. In this case MKs will is so strong it counters mind control
Click to expand...
You're not listening it could be high willpower gives a resistance to Fecto Elfilis's mind hax meaning resisting it that way doesn't give resistance to mind hax in general you have no prove that high willpower doesn’t gives resistance to Fecto Elfilis's mind hax meanwhile it is stated that strong enough will give resistance to it.
 
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Lou_change said:
You're not listening it could be high willpower gives a resistance to Fecto Elfilis's mind hax meaning resisting it that way doesn't give resistance to mind hax in general you have no prove that high willpower doesn’t gives resistance to Fecto Elfilis's mind hax meanwhile it is stated that strong enough will give resistance to it.
Click to expand...
So Kirby also has super supernatural willpower now? His willpower in protecting his friends (those he deems having friendship with) does give him such.

Maverick_Zero_X said:
Beat the game. Chaos Elfilis has a really good design
Click to expand...
Anyone feeling difficulty of Forgotten Land raises largely after Star Allies?

And... Anyone misses Kracko? Even Wispy Woods sent its cousin Tropic Woods to get in.
 
Lou_change said:
You're not listening it could be high willpower gives a resistance to Fecto Elfilis's mind hax meaning resisting it that way doesn't give resistance to mind hax in general you have no prove that high willpower doesn’t gives resistance to Fecto Elfilis's mind hax meanwhile it is stated that strong enough will give resistance to it.
Click to expand...
Doesn't change anything. Like half the resistances on the wiki are based on willpower, it's one of the main ways to resist it. In fact that is how many types of mind hax resistances work in fiction. Literally the most common cliche is the main character to struggle against mind manipulation only to overpower it with his immense power of will. There aren't that many people who have some random immunity to mind hax that isn't based on them overpowering some control. It's either specifically based on their existance as a whole or it's based on willpower.
Also do note that MK has resistance to mind hax already which means that this instance is just him showing a higher degree of it.
Let's just stop this argument either way since there ain't nobody in here to currently who cares enough to confirm or deny any of our statements.
 
Arceus0x said:
Let's just stop this argument either way since there ain't nobody in here to currently who cares enough to confirm or deny any of our statements.
Click to expand...
Let me clarify unless meta knight got an unexplained buff to his mind hax resistance which was previously comparable to king dedede it seems the mind hax has a weakness to people with strong wills given the context.
 
Lou_change said:
Let me clarify unless meta knight got an unexplained buff to his mind hax resistance which was previously comparable to king dedede it seems the mind hax has a weakness to people with strong wills given the context.
Click to expand...
Let's just get down to the basics. Mind control (with the exception of empa hax and memory manip) is, in it's core, will manipulation. In 99% of the situations it doesn't magically alter your brain to work a certain way, rather, it asserts one's will onto another person and thus mind controls them, making the will of the controlling one the will of the controlled one. This means that if someone's will is stronger than the controlling will of the manipulator it will overpower it, making leaving the hax useless.

Also i dont understand why you are complaining about the will of a guy who constantly trains becoming suddenly stronger when we literally have Kirby's tier jump from high 6-A to 4-A to 2-C.
 
Arceus0x said:
Let's just get down to the basics. Mind control (with the exception of empa hax and memory manip) is, in it's core, will manipulation. In 99% of the situations it doesn't magically alter your brain to work a certain way, rather, it asserts one's will onto another person and thus mind controls them, making the will of the controlling one the will of the controlled one. This means that if someone's will is stronger than the controlling will of the manipulator it will overpower it, making leaving the hax useless.
Click to expand...
I mean no it is far more complex it controls the brains inputs, changes things other then will like you want to work for me, and normally willpower doesn’t help it is like saying a device would resist being turned off because it has a battery.
 
Arceus0x said:
Let's just get down to the basics. Mind control (with the exception of empa hax and memory manip) is, in it's core, will manipulation. In 99% of the situations it doesn't magically alter your brain to work a certain way, rather, it asserts one's will onto another person and thus mind controls them, making the will of the controlling one the will of the controlled one. This means that if someone's will is stronger than the controlling will of the manipulator it will overpower it, making leaving the hax useless.
Click to expand...
That is definitely not the default assumption lmao
 
Arceus0x said:
alright then explain what the heck is mind hax and why does having strong willpower rejects one having mind manip resistance
Click to expand...
It's manipulating one's mind, duh. I believe we consider that a weakness of the specific mindhax.
 
Arceus0x said:
the author didn't say anything in this case, all we know is that MK could break it via his immense willpower which doesn't automatically mean that he doesn't have resistance
Click to expand...
He does have resistance mind hax is just that this isn’t a feat to support it
 
Armorchompy said:
It's manipulating one's mind, duh. I believe we consider that a weakness of the specific mindhax.
Click to expand...
Litteraly all our profile with Resistance through willpower says otherwise. Unless it is acknowledged as the power's weakness (which it's not in this case) it is perfeftly valid Resistance.
 
Jasonsith said:
Anyone feeling difficulty of Forgotten Land raises largely after Star Allies?
Click to expand...
If we're looking at main game stuff? Yeah definitely, Forgotten Land's main game is probably the toughest Kirby campaign yet I'd think? But altogether no, I don't think anything in Forgotten Land touches Star Allies' post-game content, Soul Melter EX is still the hardest thing in any Kirby game.
 
QuasiYuri said:
Litteraly all our profile with Resistance through willpower says otherwise. Unless it is acknowledged as the power's weakness (which it's not in this case) it is perfeftly valid Resistance.
Click to expand...
That's definitely not what I've seen around, but aight, guess there isn't really a standard.
 
Armorchompy said:
That's definitely not what I've seen around, but aight, guess there isn't really a standard.
Click to expand...
And the mechanism of mind hax and hax resistance needs to be well-defined.

... So how is the mind (and soul) hax of Fecto Forgo different from Void Termina and Jamba Heart?
 
Jasonsith said:
And the mechanism of mind hax and hax resistance needs to be well-defined.

... So how is the mind (and soul) hax of Fecto Forgo different from Void Termina and Jamba Heart?
Click to expand...
idk to be honest. Void's mind hax made everyone agressive and brought out the worst out of everyone who got controlled. They would mostly do as they please as long as they would obstruct the actions of those trying to fight the jamba hearts and the jambastion cult and try to kill them. On the other hand Fecto controlled people directly, being capable of speaking through the ones controlled and being capable of fully manipulating their actions.
 
POV: You've finally showed your love to your crush, she accepts it and as a reward, she starts to eating you alive
images.jpeg
 
So about that no solid timeline thing are we going to have to make a "kirby timelime according to us" page?
 
People overaggerate that statement, it doesn't mean anything we don't already know; between minigames being canon or not by looking too much into them, they not knowing if 0 and 02 are the same and if Ado and Adeleine are the same, there very much isn't a "clear" timeline, but that's not the same as all the events across all games being at random points in time. The rest of what he said and the question made (Zelda having a timeline that divides into 3 with every story fitting in) are also to be taken into consideration, you can't have a "maybe this is canon, maybe it's not" up in the air with a clear timeline. Galacta Knight's order of appearances too would either lose the fun or we would get told that they're not gonna elaborate.

Even if all minigames were always noncanon, 0, 02, the Ados and GK didn't exist, it would be correct to say that the series "has no" clear timeline if they feel like never drawing one, it would simply mean that they don't want players to start from the beginning, keep positions in time for games kept in mind and/or get overwhelmed, not that there literally, in-universe, is no timeline.
 
Eficiente said:
People overaggerate that statement, it doesn't mean anything we don't already know; between minigames being canon or not by looking too much into them, they not knowing if 0 and 02 are the same and if Ado and Adeleine are the same, there very much isn't a "clear" timeline, but that's not the same as all the events across all games being at random points in time. The rest of what he said and the question made (Zelda having a timeline that divides into 3 with every story fitting in) are also to be taken into consideration, you can't have a "maybe this is canon, maybe it's not" up in the air with a clear timeline. Galacta Knight's order of appearances too would either lose the fun or we would get told that they're not gonna elaborate.

Even if all minigames were always noncanon, 0, 02, the Ados and GK didn't exist, it would be correct to say that the series "has no" clear timeline if they feel like never drawing one, it would simply mean that they don't want players to start from the beginning, keep positions in time for games kept in mind and/or get overwhelmed, not that there literally, in-universe, is no timeline.
Click to expand...
02 was actually going to have a trophy in Super Smash Bros. Melee, but it got scrapped.
 
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