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Fairy Tail 100 Year Quest Discussion Thread: Post-Void Saga

If i'm being real the whole 5-B stuff in itself isn't accurate to what's in the manga. Kiria should be 5-B, Madmole should be 5-B, and SKullion should be 5-B. But they arent. You are going entirely on the profiles when its not a versus thread. If it was there i couldnt argue because i would need a crt to argue what im arguing.
Your hanging onto the 5-B which would die immediately if the other characters got their proper ratings.

Plot? Mmmmkay..

I dont remember exactly but did their fight happen in that other world? Didnt they have extra magic power there? I could be remembering wrong though.

All that does it sound more like he did use it. Not wanting to use it against friends. Meaning he was expecting he would have to if neccessary no?

"especially when in Fairy Tail people get randomly stronger for plot all the time." Right so Mirajane would auto scale next time she shows gotcha
Okay, I brought up 5B once, and that was to disprove you saying he didn't scale higher when he did. You cant get angry when you ask a question on this site and someone responds using the sites scaling as evidence. I dont need to hang onto anything. I have evidence, it isn't much evidence because Mashima hates Gray, but it's more than anything you've provided.

You still have yet to prove Gray used DS. He said he didn't want to, not that he was expecting to, that's a big ass jump in logic to connect the two.

And if Mashima makes a statement that Mira is = Erza, then yeah you can make that jump. And it is a jump, people jumping in power doesn't automatically mean this specific character gets specific scaling that helps you win an argument.
 
"You cant get angry when you ask a question on this site and someone responds using the sites scaling as evidence. I dont need to hang onto anything. I have evidence, it isn't much evidence because Mashima hates Gray, but it's more than anything you've provided".

Angry? I just said you are using 5-B as an argument when 5-B fails when the other characters get their proper ratings. Atp what are we arguing here? Gray in a later arc beats Mirajane in an older arc? I mean sure? But again if the other characters i said got their 5-B even though they need it even that's not sound. Are we arguing that Gray at that arc beats Mirajane healthy in that arc? I already said yes but because she's a demon. You said it dont matter he didnt use devil mark. Devil mark or not, they were weak and he won. And since he lost to someone that was even with them, there should be no reason he scales better/higher for beating two weak people. Your also clinging onto he didnt use devil mark but you forgot that part where i said either outcome was sad. Outcome one, they were so weak base was needed only, outcome B he needed devil slayer mark. Unless you really think Base Gray during that time was stronger than his devil slayer mark. Which is pretty absurd as they were all still high 6-A during both encounters. Meaning its implied that, even if gray did improve post lost its not massively so.

And you keep using the dont like using devil mark against friends as if it means he aint use it. Just because u dont like using it, doesnt mean you wont if the situation is that dire. So to me it still sounds like a depressing statement rather than a "i refuse to use it at any cost". That you are assuming esp since he has used it against friends.
 
"You cant get angry when you ask a question on this site and someone responds using the sites scaling as evidence. I dont need to hang onto anything. I have evidence, it isn't much evidence because Mashima hates Gray, but it's more than anything you've provided".

Angry? I just said you are using 5-B as an argument when 5-B fails when the other characters get their proper ratings. Atp what are we arguing here? Gray in a later arc beats Mirajane in an older arc? I mean sure? But again if the other characters i said got their 5-B even though they need it even that's not sound. Are we arguing that Gray at that arc beats Mirajane healthy in that arc? I already said yes but because she's a demon. You said it dont matter he didnt use devil mark. Devil mark or not, they were weak and he won. And since he lost to someone that was even with them, there should be no reason he scales better/higher for beating two weak people. Your also clinging onto he didnt use devil mark but you forgot that part where i said either outcome was sad. Outcome one, they were so weak base was needed only, outcome B he needed devil slayer mark. Unless you really think Base Gray during that time was stronger than his devil slayer mark. Which is pretty absurd as they were all still high 6-A during both encounters. Meaning its implied that, even if gray did improve post lost its not massively so.

And you keep using the dont like using devil mark against friends as if it means he aint use it. Just because u dont like using it, doesnt mean you wont if the situation is that dire. So to me it still sounds like a depressing statement rather than a "i refuse to use it at any cost". That you are assuming esp since he has used it against friends.
First off, accusing people of clinging isn't a great way to engage in arguments. I merely brought up 5B because you said Gray didn't scale higher. That's it. You made it a thing. If you wanna buff characters or think someone is wrong go for it. But you accused me of clinging to 5B, when I wasn't.

Secondly, yeah both outcomes are sad because Gray doesn't get shit, yeah I agree. But I was operating under the assumption the initial prompt meant current Gray vs current Mira. Current Gray has Hakune scaling that's above base Natsu tier fights back then, and an author statement putting him narratively at Natsu's level when he was fighting Dogramag.

Thirdly, Gray losing to Skullion really means nothing. If Natsu can go from thinking he needs to use Igneels power to stop Brandish to casually oneshotting someone stronger than her in base in the same arc, Gray suddenly being able to fight better against a tier of fighter he lost to in a practically plot mandatory loss in an entirely different arc can definitely happen.

And still, nothing has been provided to hint at Gray using DS in that fight.

Is the feat kinda pathetic, yes, but that's Gray. He's barely a mid carder. That being said he has a few crumbs of scaling that put him above Mirajane.
 
He beat a battle fatigued Elfman and Mira, who are relative in power, in a two vs one in his base form. Him being exhausted after was mostly overplayed, he could fight just fine after.
Tmk Elfman has never been relative to Mira in power, and Gray being fine later in the day is probably just because of the fact wizard’s passively get eternano back, the fact he had an extremely difficult time beating a weakened bss Mira[the only person he actually considered himself to even be fighting, practically treating Elfman like a no factor] means she’d probably throttle him otherwise, it’s literally brought up in the story that he’s pathetic for struggling against her the way he did and he defends himself with the fact that it’s Mira.

I don’t really see how it’s fanboism when nothing from this interaction implies anything besides the fact that in a normal fight Mira would actually stomp him
 
Tmk Elfman has never been relative to Mira in power,
Man is ignoring when Elfman one shot Seilah who clowned all of Mira’s forms. Plus Elfman also fights a nerfed Spriggan much like Mira does during Alvarez.

If peeps wanna argue with Ben (like goobers) over Mira and the Goat vs Gray using Skullion and Hakune comparisons, just bring up the fact that Skullion bopping Gray due to “standard R1 loss” is the same as Hakune beating Natsu and Gray at first too to yeet that argument out the window.
 
I actually dont think he was comparable to Mira until the 100 year quest. The seilah one shot was nonsensical as even current elfman is only as strong at best to base satan soul. Seilah one shots sitri. So im just assuming its that anime nonsense where if you get caught off guard you have weaker durability. Or she's a glass canon but i doubt its that. Think its just the caught off guard nonsense. I could be remembering the events wrong. I just know she called him and he one shot her
 
Man is ignoring when Elfman one shot Seilah who clowned all of Mira’s forms. Plus Elfman also fights a nerfed Spriggan much like Mira does during Alvarez.
A seilah that was snuck and had just had her powers drained by Mira after a long fight yeah, Mirajane literally spends every other arc being thought of as a monster Elfman cant even compare too, even in 100 year quest where Gray just disregards him as an oppenant and only complains about having to fight base form mira
 
All of this is super funny because you guys are disregarding Elfman just like everyone else was in the Gray and Mira fight. Like Elfman literally just fought along side his sister and got called strong by skullion and madmole, meaning he was as strong as base satan soul mirajane at the very least.

You can't try to say your not fanboys then turn around and try to diss Elfman lol. Elfman is the series punching bag yet he still getting dubs.
 
Tmk Elfman has never been relative to Mira in power, and Gray being fine later in the day is probably just because of the fact wizard’s passively get eternano back, the fact he had an extremely difficult time beating a weakened bss Mira[the only person he actually considered himself to even be fighting, practically treating Elfman like a no factor] means she’d probably throttle him otherwise, it’s literally brought up in the story that he’s pathetic for struggling against her the way he did and he defends himself with the fact that it’s Mira.

I don’t really see how it’s fanboism when nothing from this interaction implies anything besides the fact that in a normal fight Mira would actually stomp him
Because Gray was in base, and we were literally just shown Elfman being comparable to Mira in the fight before hand lmao. Even Lucy commented that they had forgotten Elfman. Mira doesn't stomp, all this is is Gray being Gray, ya know, the guy who thinks he's the weakest person he knows.

The joke was that Gray thought the fight would be easy, and it wasn't, not that he couldn't win outright. Gray's statements about himself are unreliable given his fight with Sai anyway.

Once again, we are back to square one. The best argument for Mira winning against Gray was a gag off screen fight were Gray was in base and a tired Mirajane had the help of someone just as strong as her.
 
'We're not fanboys'

Proceeds the downplay Elfman as hard as possible in order to make Mira look good, something the series already does constantly.
 
A seilah that was snuck and had just had her powers drained by Mira after a long fight yeah, Mirajane literally spends every other arc being thought of as a monster Elfman cant even compare too, even in 100 year quest where Gray just disregards him as an oppenant and only complains about having to fight base form mira
You do realise the 100YQ stuff is a meme right? Elfman isn’t weak at all there. Man damaged Madmole who took FDK hits from Natsu. That’s the kind of monster he is. Mira just has the reputation, Elfman has the scaling.
 
Because Gray was in base, and we were literally just shown Elfman being comparable to Mira in the fight before hand lmao. Even Lucy commented that they had forgotten Elfman. Mira doesn't stomp, all this is is Gray being Gray, ya know, the guy who thinks he's the weakest person he knows.
Seeing as Gray has repeatedly used his ice devil slayer magic in this 100 year quest, and even in this arc against opponents that Mirajane stalemated, your assumption that he didn’t have to use it to beat her makes absolutely no sense.
'We're not fanboys'

Proceeds the downplay Elfman as hard as possible in order to make Mira look good, something the series already does constantly.
If the series does it, it’s not downplay, it’s just fact.
The joke was that Gray thought the fight would be easy, and it wasn't, not that he couldn't win outright. Gray's statements about himself are unreliable given his fight with Sai anyway.

Once again, we are back to square one. The best argument for Mira winning against Gray was a gag off screen fight were Gray was in base and a tired Mirajane had the help of someone just as strong as her.
Elfman is not just as strong as Mira, him being just as strong as her as pointed out above would make no sense storyline wise and that’s not counting the fact that Macro can be used to empower people or the fact that Mirajane had a friendship boosted Elfman sneak attack a drained Seilah.
The joke was that Gray thought the fight would be easy, and it wasn't, not that he couldn't win outright. Gray's statements about himself are unreliable given his fight with Sai anyway.
I mean, the joke was that he absolutely struggled with the fight and was on the verge of passing out afterwards and literally blamed only Mirajane for being the reason he was the way he was.
IMG_3673.jpg
 
Elfman is not just as strong as Mira, him being just as strong as her as pointed out above would make no sense storyline wise and that’s not counting the fact that Macro can be used to empower people or the fact that Mirajane had a friendship boosted Elfman sneak attack a drained Seilah.
You can't simply ignore the blatant scaling feats for the sake of a narrative
 
Seeing as Gray has repeatedly used his ice devil slayer magic in this 100 year quest, and even in this arc against opponents that Mirajane stalemated, your assumption that he didn’t have to use it to beat her makes absolutely no sense.

If the series does it, it’s not downplay, it’s just fact.

Elfman is not just as strong as Mira, him being just as strong as her as pointed out above would make no sense storyline wise and that’s not counting the fact that Macro can be used to empower people or the fact that Mirajane had a friendship boosted Elfman sneak attack a drained Seilah.

I mean, the joke was that he absolutely struggled with the fight and was on the verge of passing out afterwards and literally blamed only Mirajane for being the reason he was the way he was.
IMG_3673.jpg
Okay, once again lol, you've added nothing new to the argument. Stating it's just fact without the proper reasoning isn't a good look. Like yes, Elfman is as strong as Satan soul mirajane in 100 YQ, that was the point and you just kinda responded to an argument I didn't make. And the fact we are still on the base Gray argument is hilarious because in order to justify him using it you have to completely ignore the context of the fight. Gray only used DS before against his friends because he had to, his normal magic got sealed. He stated he didn't wanna use that power, so why would he randomly do it again against someone he knows it would be super effective on? For all we know, the reason he struggled so much is because he didn't use DS. Like this argument can easily be tilted in ways you don't like with just as much validity because you have yet to provide evidence for why Gray used DS.
 
And we are still ignoring Elfman, which the series itself jokes about with people remarking Gray was forgetting about Elfman, who we say before hand is just as strong as Satan Soul Mira. So congrats, we are going in circles
 
I don’t even understand why you’re assuming I’m going in circles and ignoring context when Mirajane’s vs page has this is here justification for her rating.
(Her Satan Soul Form fought and matched Skullion. Her Satan Soul Form is comparable to Beast Soul Elfman. Far stronger than Pre-Elentear Devil Slayer Mark Gray, as he did not think he could defeat her until she became exhausted, as well as Loke and Pre-Elentear X793 Lucy, who both doubted they could defeat Mirajane even if the two of them and Virgo fought her together. Casually stomped Virgo off-screen)
If you disagree so much with the scaling, you can make a crt to have have the justification removed
You can't simply ignore the blatant scaling feats for the sake of a narrative
Yes? Yes you can, feats don’t trump the context of the story, not that it matters because as mentioned above even if Elfman in his best form is comparable to Mirajane’s weakest form, Gray only noted her as being the readon
He stated he didn't wanna use that power, so why would he randomly do it again against someone he knows it would be super effective on? For all we know, the reason he struggled so much is because he didn't use DS. Like this argument can easily be tilted in ways you don't like with just as much validity because you have yet to provide evidence for why Gray used DS.
Juvia said he gave the fight his all, so taking that at face value would mean he did in fact give the fight his all, which would in fact include devil slayer magic.
 
Hiro says Gray is relative to Natsu

Base to FDKM Natsu is relative to Suzaku

Suzaku>>>Skullion verbatim

Mira~Skullion

Mira is a Demon, Gray has Devil Slayer Magic

Mira gets washed about as fast as God Serena did against Acnologia
 
I’m pretty sure the question was referring to pre elentir gray, so this scaling is irrelevant to the scenario at hand
 
Yes? Yes you can, feats don’t trump the context of the story, not that it matters because as mentioned above even if Elfman in his best form is comparable to Mirajane’s weakest form, Gray only noted her as being the readon
The only "context" you have are gags. He withstands Lucy's Lion Maiden and Leo is surprised that Elfman is that strong as well. Lucy constantly mentions to Gray that Elfman is with Mira as well, and for good reason given she was the one that saw just how strong Elfman is.

Elfman is around Mira level. That simple.
 
Even then, Gray did beat Mira, has Devil Slayer advantage, and beat Hakune… All things above Mira
Yet in her justification [which I’m sure one of you made or went over] it’s mentioned that’s she’s vastly superior to him based off of his statements.
Her Satan Soul Form fought and matched Skullion. Her Satan Soul Form is comparable to Beast Soul Elfman. Far stronger than Pre-Elentear Devil Slayer Mark Gray, as he did not think he could defeat her until she became exhausted, as well as Loke and Pre-Elentear X793 Lucy, who both doubted they could defeat Mirajane even if the two of them and Virgo fought her together. Casually stomped Virgo off-screen)
Lucy constantly mentions to Gray that Elfman is with Mira as well, and for good reason given she was the one that saw just how strong Elfman is.
She mentioned elfman literally one time and when Gray comes back he just confirms his point on Mira being stronger and being the only one who really did any damage to him.
Elfman is around Mira level
is around BSS level, which is far below Mira’s peak yes
Wait until we get 5-A Mira...

But for real the wank is too damn high.
No one here is implying she’s stronger than current gray though, and I’m literally not wanking this is an accepted scaling on the site, you can’t just dismiss all opinions that you don’t agree with as wanking
 
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She mentioned elfman literally one time and when Gray comes back he just confirms his point on Mira being stronger and being the only one who really did any damage to him.
You have legitimately zero proof, especially for the bolded part
 
IMG_3673.jpg

He literally says the reason he is the way he is because he fought “Mira Chan” he literally disregards elfman before and after the fight
 
IMG_3673.jpg

He literally says the reason he is the way he is because he fought “Mira Chan” he literally disregards elfman before and after the fight
Mira always gets more hype simply because she's an S-Class Wizard

But you used that to extrapolate something that can't be extrapolated (Mira being the only one that damaged Gray, which has no proof)
 
I do think Mira > Pre Elentear DSM Gray largely due to Gray himself fearing her and Lucy thinking that, even with Loke and Virgo backing her up, she'd get beaten in a 3 on 1.
 
Pre elentear gray is weaker as a whole than Mirajane. He would only beat Satan soul, or sitri maybe because he's a devil slayer. Alegria one shots as it one shots those stronger than her regular satan soul. Also like i said before the 5-B arguments die if the dragon eaters got their tier 5 as well. Im not sure what the point of this debate is. Gray has never been above Mira at any point in the series. The only thing he has going for him, is when Mirajane is no longer in the story so she has no feats against new enemies. Then next time she shows she'll just be op again as per usual. Sting can arm wrestle natsu despite natsu beating up dragon gods, dragon eaters and getting all this type of experience. Gray is weaker than Mirajane whenever they are both present in the same arc. Again the only thing he has going for him, is he slays devils. Again are we just arguing a character from a current arc beats one from a later one? Which again is irrelevant because next time she comes in the story again she'll be stronger than him. So its really a does gray beat a Mira from a further back arc. Congrats Gray. And even then its not sound like i said before as that gap is only showcased by the regular diablos members not getting their tier 5 ratings despite having feats of it. Debate is pointless and none of it saves Gray. Either reality makes him look bad. Need to beat a weakened Mirajane and almost died? Check. Can only beat Mirajane by being present in a current arc vs a later one? Check. Which in itself is pretty silly as the gap between High 6-A and 5-B-5-A isnt actually displayed as large as it is in story. It only looks crazy because its on vsb.
 
IMG_3673.jpg

He literally says the reason he is the way he is because he fought “Mira Chan” he literally disregards elfman before and after the fight
No way someone reads this and thinks its a feat for gray. They even put more emphasis on her being "beat up." This an anti feat for Gray and a Mirajane feat. Gray is weaker. His only advantage is being a devil slayer and if she's no longer in the current story so u can say he wins be default. L Gray
 
"Gray has never been above Mira at any point in the series"

Bruh reading Fairy Tale... Tartaros Arc Gray slaps the shit outta Tartaros Arc Mira... And the Gray that matched END would low diff Alegria considering Alegria lasted approximately 1 attack before Mira ran out of energy. It certainly doesn't help that Devil Slayer Magic negs Demons and as we've seen with Sherria and Dimaria, Slayer Magic can dispel a Take Over form if the the opponent the Take Over is the race the Slayer is super effective against. Gray has far better versatiliy and skills, being able to attack in many different ways, meanwhile Mira is literally just "Look at me punch and create large explosions". You talk as if Mira is actually doing things... She one-shot Heine and Juliet yeah, who could give her Satan Soul trouble, which is definitely noteworthy, but that's not nearly as impressive as bullying a Full Power Invel and matching an END that one-shot Dimaria. Also while Mira did beat Jacob with Satan Soul, it is specifically noted he is weakened by having his eyes closed, it's not the same as when Gray bullied a Full Power Spriggan. That same Gray has one-shotting standard Spriggan level power that lasts multiple attacks while Mira just don't have the stamina and is weak to Devil Slayer Magic.

Stop sleeping on Gray, he isn't as strong as Natsu, Laxus, Erza and the super cracked FT Members, but he's still been above Mira since X791
 
"Gray has never been above Mira at any point in the series"

Bruh reading Fairy Tale... Tartaros Arc Gray slaps the shit outta Tartaros Arc Mira... And the Gray that matched END would low diff Alegria considering Alegria lasted approximately 1 attack before Mira ran out of energy. It certainly doesn't help that Devil Slayer Magic negs Demons and as we've seen with Sherria and Dimaria, Slayer Magic can dispel a Take Over form if the the opponent the Take Over is the race the Slayer is super effective against. Gray has far better versatiliy and skills, being able to attack in many different ways, meanwhile Mira is literally just "Look at me punch and create large explosions". You talk as if Mira is actually doing things... She one-shot Heine and Juliet yeah, who could give her Satan Soul trouble, which is definitely noteworthy, but that's not nearly as impressive as bullying a Full Power Invel and matching an END that one-shot Dimaria. Also while Mira did beat Jacob with Satan Soul, it is specifically noted he is weakened by having his eyes closed, it's not the same as when Gray bullied a Full Power Spriggan. That same Gray has one-shotting standard Spriggan level power that lasts multiple attacks while Mira just don't have the stamina and is weak to Devil Slayer Magic.

Stop sleeping on Gray, he isn't as strong as Natsu, Laxus, Erza and the super cracked FT Members, but he's still been above Mira since X791

More versatility? You mean creating constructs out of magic that hasnt worked on.... The last 20 enemies he fought which is why he has to spam devil slayer mark? vs the girl that flies, has darkness attacks, probably dozens of different ones, has elemental magic, can put people to sleep and control them with macro, is more skilled in combat and some other stuff in her profile of wide range abilities. Everything gray does is ice constructs which hasnt worked on anybody relevant meanwhile in regular satan soul mirajane is even with the guy that beat up gray.

Lmao Invel caught his devil slayer magic with one hand he only lost because of an emotional power up. Which doesnt scale to his regular statistics similarly to Erza.

He stomps Mira in spriggan arc because END one shotted Dimaria? You mean base Dimaria? Whom at most is basic spriggan level? I do agree take over dimaria is far beyond the average spriggan though but she wasnt in that. Alegria one shotted two people at once, one hand each and those two people were > her satan soul meaning Alegria is capable just as much as one shotted average spriggans. Gray only looks good against END because he's a devil slayer. Similar to Mard Geer situation.

You bringing up devil slayer magic a point i already have been saying since the start of the topic. Point is, she is a superior fighter. If he wins its because he's a devil slayer. Which is not all that convincing as Alegria has enough ap to one shot though people above or relative to satan soul which is where devil slayer mark was. She doesn't even have to use any demon magic to do it. Just physicals.

Also Mira was exchanging blows with Jacob without even using Satan soul. She just used it to finish the job. Meaning Base Mirajane isnt too much weaker than an average spriggan meanwhile base gray has to be ice devil slayer to even match one. Invel situation was angry emotional boost when you consider invel was tanking his attacks and catching his sword with one hand.

Gray has been consistently one of the weakest in the group. Now that lucy is powering up, i dare say the weakest other than Gajeel.
 
Ignoring current rankings of tier, consistency arc by arc has looked like this.

Lucy < Wendy < Gray <=Gajeel < Mirajane < Erza <= Natsu < Laxus < Gildarts. I'm well aware that changes in certain arcs talking consistency as a whole.
 
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