DC Comics - Mandrakk Rewrite

[Alonik]

Later, when you attempted to insist that Dax never split into fragments, but that somehow "split" was a metaphor for madness (which is pure nonsense, but I've been extremely generous to even the most outrageous suggestions from you for the sake of charity), I argued against it as so:

Do note how i showed that CAS was a lesser part of Dax Novu because he was one of the parts left in the multiverse after the "probe" (Dax Novu) being split in two, and let's not forgot how CAS and Mandrakk are dual beings...

 

[Xearsay]

Ant just evaluated it.

Other staff. As in staff other than Ant.

You're misrepresenting my argument, yet again. My argument was as follows:

I didn’t misrepresent anything. I didn’t even bring this part of what you said on the first page up because it wasn’t an argument, as saying “it’s obvious” means nothing. That’s why I said you and Aloniks interpretation of “Monitor” within the Final Crisis scan was your only argument.

And that Multiversity scan you posted doesn’t prove Mandrakk was a byproduct of Dax being split in two. And your interpretation of it stemmed from trying to claim the part of the sentence “is also split in two” was an independent clause when it wasn’t.

why would we interpret Mandrakk as controlling the Hyperstory when the end result was not in his favor, and none of the evidence indicates he's controlling or manipulating it? Superman specifically addresses Mandrakk and Hyperstory separately, he assigns Hyperstory a will of its own, and says it is driving both him and Mandrakk towards the conclusion.

Why would the end result need to be in Mandrakks favor for him to be controlling the Hyperstory? Literally nowhere did CAS say the Hyperstory had a will of its own, and the panels literally feature Mandrakk trying to destroy CAS while the statement is being made. Just because the comic didn’t spell it out for you, doesn’t mean there’s no evidence for it.

I am presenting an alternative possibility supported by other evidence. I have never claimed or implied that there is a scan which says this. The full context of DC supports that this is a universal concept throughout the verse itself, which means it isn't an ability that the Monitors or Mandrakk have specifically.

Your alternative possibility cannot exist, as the comic directly states the Monitors are believing Mandrakk into existence. If there was a mention to some type of collective unconscious that bring Mandrakk into existence from the Monitors belief in him, then you’d have an argument. However there is nothing like that. So therefore there’s no reason to accept your possibility.

 

[Deagonx]

Other staff. As in staff other than Ant.

And why on earth would you get to pick and choose which staff evaluate your post?

I didn’t misrepresent anything. I didn’t even bring this part of what you said on the first page up because it wasn’t an argument, as saying “it’s obvious” means nothing.

You intentionally omitted my entire argument because of your personal assessment that what I said doesn't constitute an argument? Sure, that justifies overtly lying. I clearly laid out how and why the evidence supports the conclusion, and all you had to offer as a counter argument was a completely unsupported claim that "split" meant "went insane" which was directly contradicted by later evidence that was shown.

And that Multiversity scan you posted doesn’t prove Mandrakk was a byproduct of Dax being split in two.

Yes, it does. It proves that the split that Dax went through was comparable in character to the split mentioned earlier, as he was ALSO split in two. Your ignorance of English grammar doesn't change this.

Why would the end result need to be in Mandrakks favor for him to be controlling the Hyperstory?

Because plot manipulation encompasses author like control of a plot. Mandrakk did not portray that whatsoever.

Literally nowhere did CAS say the Hyperstory had a will of its own

Yes, he did. He assigned the action of "trying to destroy him" to Hyperstory. He didn't paint Hyperstory as a tool being used by another person, he described it as "self-assembling" and "trying to destroy him" and later "driving us towards its conclusion." Everything he said about hyperstory assigns agency to the hyperstory itself, never to a third party or Mandrakk.

Just because the comic didn’t spell it out for you, doesn’t mean there’s no evidence for it.

The comic not "spelling it out" in this instance is the fact that the comic doesn't say it at all and doesn't imply it. Your interpretations aren't evidence. The facts support several possibilities, and all you've offered to support yours is blind assertion.

Your alternative possibility cannot exist, as the comic directly states the Monitors are believing Mandrakk into existence.

Except my alternative possibility directly acknowledges that fact and incorporates it, so I have no idea why you'd claim that this information is somehow problematic for me. Also, the comic doesn't state this, Zillo Valla does.

If there was a mention to some type of collective unconscious that bring Mandrakk into existence from the Monitors belief in him, then you’d have an argument. However there is nothing like that. So therefore there’s no reason to accept your possibility.

When does it say in the "Dream of a Thousand Cats" that the collective unconscious is being used to make humans the dominant species? Oh right, it doesn't. It just says that the humans are dreaming it. So I guess there's no collective unconscious! I guess DC Humans simply have reality manipulation, since the alternative possibility "can't exist" if it says the humans did it and not the collective unconscious. What a laughable objection, frankly.

 

[Antvasima]

@Eficiente @Qawsedf234 @Firestorm808 @LordTracer @Maverick_Zero_X @Spinosaurus75DinosaurFan @CrimsonStarFallen @Dark-Carioca @Sandman31 @LuciferDC099

Are any of you willing to help evaluate this thread please?

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

Mandrakk is an alter ego of Dax Novu when the probe split it changed Dax Novu into Mandrakk. When the exchange was done with the Flaw interacting with the Probe the final result was the Thought Robot that appeared from the exchange.

Mandrakk really only implies to beings that go above what normal Nil Monitors do. As overfeeding and it’s apparent that anyone can become a Mandrakk. When Rox Omaga became Mandrakk, he still had the essence of Dax Novu.

As for the part about belief, Mandrakk is really an idea that was put by Dax and in doing so the others would bring the nightmare into Existence. He literally lied about fighting to contain the Darkness which was addressing him after the split and eventually the others found out.

 

[Deagonx]

Mandrakk is an alter ego of Dax Novu when the probe split it changed Dax Novu into Mandrakk. When the exchange was done with the Flaw interacting with the Probe the final result was the Thought Robot that appeared from the exchange.

Mandrakk really only implies to beings that go above what normal Nil Monitors do. As overfeeding and it’s apparent that anyone can become a Mandrakk. When Rox Omaga became Mandrakk, he still had the essence of Dax Novu.

As for the part about belief, Mandrakk is really an idea that was put by Dax and in doing so the others would bring the nightmare into Existence. He literally lied about fighting to contain the Darkness which was addressing him after the split and eventually the others found out.

For what it's worth, the excessive bolding of names makes it harder to read your post.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

For what it's worth, the excessive bolding of names makes it harder to read your post.

I will make sure that I don’t do that again. The short premise is that the Probe splitting was what caused Dax to become Mandrakk. That’s the split and after that resulted in the Cosmic Armor.

 

[Deagonx]

The short premise is that the Probe splitting was what caused Dax to become Mandrakk. That’s the split and after that resulted in the Cosmic Armor.

Agreed. The comic is very clear on this.

 

[Alonik]

Mandrakk really only implies to beings that go above what normal Nil Monitors do. As overfeeding and it’s apparent that anyone can become a Mandrakk. When Rox Omaga became Mandrakk, he still had the essence of Dax Novu.

It was never stated within the comics that Rox Ogama became Mandrakk. This is just a misinterpretation because Rox Ogama appears turning Ultraman into a vampire, and Rox still refers to Mandrakk as "his, him" in the sentence.

As for Mandrakk he was in the same place where Nix Uotan, his son, impaled him in the final crisis ending to the comic called the Unexpected.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

It was never stated within the comics that Rox Ogama became Mandrakk. This is just a misinterpretation because Rox Ogama appears turning Ultraman into a vampire, and Rox still refers to Mandrakk as "his, him" in the sentence.

As for Mandrakk he was in the same place where Nix Uotan, his son, impaled him in the final crisis ending to the comic called the Unexpected.

Rox was Mandrakk as seen him looking exactly like Dax. The only difference was the entity defines himself as Dax. Why is there a separation when he became Mandrakk due to Dax? Let's pretend Dax corrupted him and he is Mandrakk that makes him Mandrakk by exorable logic.

 

[Alonik]

Rox was Mandrakk as seen him looking exactly like Dax. The only difference was the entity defines himself as Dax. Why is there a separation when he became Mandrakk due to Dax? Let's pretend Sax corrupted him and he is Mandrakk that makes him Mandrakk by exorable logic.

I think you misunderstood the comic, just because Rox became a vampire, it doesn't mean that he was Mandrakk. Mandrakk wears a cape and is nake below it, while Rox Ogama in the entire comic he was exactly the same with his monitor suit.

 

[VeryGoofyToddler]

I think you misunderstood the comic, just because Rox became a vampire, it doesn't mean that he was Mandrakk. Mandrakk wears a cape and is nake below it, while Rox Ogama in the entire comic he was exactly the same with his monitor suit.

Well, I won't disapprove of it, you may be right.

 

[Alonik]

Well, I won't disapprove of it, you may be right.

I think the problem is that Rox Ogama is a shape-shifter along with all the other Mandrakk's vampires, for example here in this scan he is standing on top of monuments of universes while waiting for the Mandrakk to come out of his tomb, and here mandrakk at the door of his tomb, far from Ogama. However, Rox Ogama appears here behind Ultraman after being cast from the Monitor Sphere, and says the following words:

• Look at you. They cast me ou too... Who once was proud ogama... Come. Drink deep of the bitter cup of mandrakk as i have, ultraman! Let his blood flow in your veins.

Then in the next scan we have Mandrakk appear, and it appears that he is Rox Ogama because he takes over Ogama's place, but all his vampires appear at once. I see it as an existential link that all his vampires darl army have with him, he can manifest himself and take their place, so much so that when he dies all the others have died too (although Mandrakk has come back to life as is shown in The Unexpected).

 

[Antvasima]

It seems like the staff members that I called for are not interested in this thread. Should I close it now?

 

[Deagonx]

It seems like the staff members that I called for are not interested in this thread. Should I close it now?

Given the universal rejection from commenters, I'd say yes.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I will do so then.

Thank you to everybody who helped out here.