Accelerator Revisions and minor Kakine revision

[Malox1696]

Didn't deflect the slash, just the sword, the spell would kill him if it hits

in fact here

"However…

"It would seem you cannot prevent the actual omnidimensional slicing."

"Tch."

The child clicked his tongue at the adult's comment.

"Curtana Second will take priority over all else and cut through all dimensions as long as it is in this country. I don't fully understand that reflection of yours, but if I slice through the very coordinates at which the barrier exists, the damage gets through. Isn't that right?" Elizard flipped the flat-tipped sword around to change her stance. "Knowing you are not untouchable is enough for me… Now it comes down to whether or not I can focus on finding an opportunity."

With the sound of something slicing through the air, Elizard disappeared.

Accelerator did not even turn his head.

He took a casual step back just before t''''he giant guillotine of omnidimensional slicing swung down at him from the side. It grazed the tip of his nose, but he was not the type to let anything show on his face."

so read again please

 

[Scrlk666777]

Accelerate420 That explains a lot although I never really got the whole walking NLF argument. If anything he's more of a walking NLD than a walking NLF.

I added Accel being able to reflect omnidirectional attacks in the OP.

 

[Accelerate420]

Malox, it was already explained she was trying to slash at the barrier itself so the debris would fly inside in the very same quote you just posted. Otherwise, why didn't she just....slash inside the barrier? Think about that. NLD?

 

[Malox1696]

MFTL goes from 100x SoL to any higher finite number, then you don't need infinite speed, you just need higher movement speed than what Accel (the vector shield) has demonstrated to reflect.

Well yes if u can overcome his detection calculation then yes but speed needs to be extremely high considering 1) he can use light reflection without esper mode 2) the equation is the simplest of his calculations 3)all his calculation feat like overcoming limited chaos theory, rewriting and scanning a brain, etc, until now only multiple lvl 5 combined calculation and mina ( a super processor that can calculate the future and in tandem with the tree diagram had full chaos theory control) were able to out calculate accel

so MFTL+ is really a low ball

 

[Scrlk666777]

Malox

I did read and provided quotes of him reflecting it which you seemed to have ignored. He only doged it that one time but he was reflecting the omnidirectional attacks before.

So no, it's you who actually needs learn to read and actually read the quotes provided above. There is no debate to be had here since it's as clear as day in the text.

 

[Malox1696]

again he hit the blade with a rock to alter the slash

" Did he alter the course of blade by directly hitting Curtana with a projectile instead of going for the line of the slash!? "

u literally seem to ignore he was hit on the nose

It grazed the tip of his nose

the debris have nothing to do with it

accel simply dodged or attacked the blade it self before the attacks

and it makes absolute sense as AIM is basically a little phase and curtana can slice and ignore those too

 

[Accelerate420]

again he hit the blade with a rock to alter the slash
" Did he alter the course of blade by directly hitting Curtana with a projectile instead of going for the line of the slash!? "

u literally seem to ignore he was hit on the nose

It grazed the tip of his nose

the debris have nothing to do with it

accel simply dodged or attacked the blade it self before the attacks

and it makes absolute sense as AIM is basically a little phase and curtana can slice and ignore those too

Dude. Are you being serious right now? She literally says before she attempts this 'You can't stop the actual event of the debris'. Come on man. Why didn't she jus slash inside his barrier then? Answer that, and then I'll believe you.

 

[Accelerate420]

Also, 'graze' doesn't imply contact. It means it missed by just a hairs breath, so it didn't get through.

 

[Malox1696]

Dude. Are you being serious right now? She literally says before she attempts this 'You can't stop the actual event of the debris'. Come on man. Why didn't she jus slash inside his barrier then? Answer that, and then I'll believe you.

.... mhhh dude u better check ur eyes "It would seem you cannot prevent the actual omnidimensional slicing."

Cause he Dodged and deflected the blade itself , she even says it and that sooner or later she would hit him , he then just pulled the phone and stomped her

"He took a casual step back just before the giant guillotine of omnidimensional slicing swung down at him from the side. It grazed the tip of his nose, but he was not the type to let anything show on his face.

"I doubt you're just swinging that thing around at random."

"You were a little slow to move there." Perhaps as a sign of respect for his observation, the queen regnant spoke up with Curtana Second at the ready. "Nothing I do can arrive in time in the areas you have already calculated out, but you are only acquiring information through your ordinary eyes, ears, nose, tongue, and skin. That means the direction you face is a crucial factor. The difference might be small, but if I keep it up, it will grow to an expanse too wide to ignore."

"Oh, is that so?"

This might have been a deadly situation for him not long ago."

 

[Scrlk666777]

Malox

First of all no, he wasn't dodging, he was reflecitng which is quite clear in the text which you seem to be ignoring because it doesn't suit your own agenda.

Second of all no he wasn't hit on the nose. It Grazed him, this is not the same as something outright hitting him.

 

[Malox1696]

Also, 'graze' doesn't imply contact. It means it missed by just a hairs breath, so it didn't get through.

Definition of graze (Entry 3 of 4)

transitive verb

1  : to' touch lightly in passing The car's wheel grazed the curb. 2  : abrade, scratch 'grazed her knee when she fell

 

[Accelerate420]

She's referring to the debris effect. He can't prevent the omnidimensional slice itself like when she cuts open space, but he can defend against the slice itself, that's why she was trying to slice at the contact point of his barrier. The omnidirectional effect of it is ignored. Again, why didn't she just slice /inside/ his barrier? Why was she focusing on the contact point? The dimensionality of it he cannot prevent but it's the omnidirection.

 

[Malox1696]

Malox
First of all no, he wasn't dodging, he was reflecitng which is quite clear in the text which you seem to be ignoring because it doesn't suit your own agenda.

Second of all no he wasn't hit on the nose. It Grazed him, this is not the same as something outright hitting him.

tell me where it's reflecting cause im sure as hell it never said it, it only mentions him dodging or deflecting the blade itself from range

 

[Scrlk666777]

I already provided quotes to you. It's not my fault you can't read.

 

[Malox1696]

and i did too, not my fault if u can't read

 

[Accelerate420]

You aren't listening. We aren't arguing the dimensional aspect, we're arguing the directional.

 

[Scrlk666777]

Malox No it's you who can't read.

Also you seem you get a question mixed up with facts. Someone asking a question isn't someone statng facts. Learn the difference.

 

[Scrlk666777]

You aren't listening. We aren't arguing the dimensional aspect, we're arguing the directional.

Exactly, We are arguing the fact that the directional part of the omnidirectional attack can't harm him. He can't stop the actual slash from happening but he can prevent it from hurting him. Elizard did a bit of theorzing but this is only theories on her part.

For some reason Theories and Questions are treated as the same as out stated facts in some people's eyes.

 

[Zensum]

Anyway have we come to a consensus on Accels pre headshotshot key

 

[Malox1696]

let's put it in a simple way so u can understand :

1) there is no mention of him reflecting the slash with his barrier , only with projectiles (u can check with ctrl +f)

2)it literally mentions he was grazed, and the definition is quite clear (especially when it mentions him not showing the pain on his face), it needs touch

1  : to' touch lightly in passing The car's wheel grazed the curb. 2  : abrade, scratch 'grazed her knee when she fell

3) it makes absolute sense for curtana to ignore accel barrier as esper basically create a limited phases around themself with aim, curtana already cuts all phases ignoring them

4) NO, she tried to slice him, he just dodged or deflect the blade itself as quoted above, there is no mention of him reflecting the slice, again

 

[Accelerate420]

Anyway have we come to a consensus on Accels pre headshotshot key

We have, we're just waiting on DT to "get time", lol.

 

[Scrlk666777]

Anyway have we come to a consensus on Accels pre headshotshot key

No, not yet. There's still some uncertainity regarding Accel's pre headshot key.

The others are Mind Hax resistence and AP amping.

 

[Accelerate420]

let's put it in a simple way so u can understand :
1) there is no mention of him reflecting the slash with his barrier , only with projectiles (u can check with ctrl +f)

2)it literally mentions he was grazed, and the definition is quite clear (especially when it mentions him not showing the pain on his face), it needs touch

1  : to' touch lightly in passing The car's wheel grazed the curb. 2  : abrade, scratch 'grazed her knee when she fell

3) it makes absolute sense for curtana to ignore accel barrier as esper basically create a limited phases around themself with aim, curtana already cuts all phases ignoring them

4) NO, she tried to slice him, he just dodged or deflect the blade itself as quoted above, there is no mention of him reflecting the slice, again

We're talking about two very different things. The omnidirectionality, not the dimensional slicing aspect.

 

[Malox1696]

the is no omnidirectionality here tho ? it's omnidimensoinal


he can deflect the blade itself, but the slice effect (the one touma negates and happen after 1.5 seconds) will ignore the barrier

 

[Accelerate420]

the is no omnidirectionality here tho ? it's omnidimensoinal

he can deflect the blade itself, but the slice effect (the one touma negates and happen after 1.5 seconds) will ignore the barrier

Curtana's omnidirectionality cuts at 'coordinates'. It can cut anywhere with a swing so long as the wielder knows the location, and in that area, the dimensional slicing takes effect and the debris happens. It's both omnidirectional and omnidimensional, hence the comparison to KL's 'patterns'. Because of this, it cannot cut inside the barrier, but the dimensional slice itself CAN cut the barrier, yes, and then the debris gets through.

 

[Malox1696]

Curtana's omnidirectionality cuts at 'coordinates'. It can cut anywhere with a swing so long as the wielder knows the location, and in that area, the dimensional slicing takes effect and the debris happens. It's both omnidirectional and omnidimensional, hence the comparison to KL's 'patterns'. Because of this, it cannot cut inside the barrier, but the dimensional slice itself CAN cut the barrier, yes, and then the debris gets through.

but it was never actually shown KL was just assuming it had that function, even in this fight it was not shown, we do know that it can slice with further range than the blade tho

and debris actually would still do nothing as it's similar to teleportation, just the slicing would actually damage accel

 

[Accelerate420]

Curtana's omnidirectionality cuts at 'coordinates'. It can cut anywhere with a swing so long as the wielder knows the location, and in that area, the dimensional slicing takes effect and the debris happens. It's both omnidirectional and omnidimensional, hence the comparison to KL's 'patterns'. Because of this, it cannot cut inside the barrier, but the dimensional slice itself CAN cut the barrier, yes, and then the debris gets through.

but it was never actually shown KL was just assuming it had that function, even in this fight it was not shown, we do know that it can slice with further range than the blade tho
and debris actually would still do nothing as it's similar to teleportation, just the slicing would actually damage accel

It...demonstrated slicing further than the blade in OT18 a few times, yes. Like against Kanzaki's shield for instance. Again, you keep saying this, but her strategy was to cut the barrier and not him, it's counter intuitive to what you're saying. "but if I slice through the very coordinates at which the barrier exists, the damage gets through." Your argument falls apart the moment she says this. She has no reason to slice at the coordinate the barrier exists if she can just slash him. Case closed, I'm not taking this off topic any further.

 

[Malox1696]

SO can we finalize the changes?

 

[DontTalkDT]

Soooo.... does this thread have literally 100+ off-topic replies or is it just me?

Well, whatever.

Before getting into responding to the responses to my response let's get into a few things.

First: I want to do the annual reminder that technically you always can get approval of 2 other staff members to make changes, if you don't want to wait for me to get back and reject your stuff. Just saying.

Second: I would suggest that I can do the accepted changes while we still debate.

On the subject matter.

I would be fine with backwards scaling accels reflection and his reflection only. That is due to the entire "doesn't depend on magnitude" argument, which is worth consideration, and since an infinite power jump is rather unlikely, unless there are some extremely noteworthy events.

1 no calculation power is related to the epser power, that what the whole lvl upper thing was about, u can get stronger by finding new way to use ur power or the "coffins" method, but it has nothing to do with reflection tho as it's all based on calculation and formula and it's just x=-x, while vector control actually requires him to calculate the vector before and after the change

2 i think he meant the thing u said at point 1, he can amplify the magnitude

3 look at my post i explained Analytic prediction comes from his ability and requirement to "see" the world in vectors, it was stated he calculates every vector he is aware of even the one he can't see (like radiation, etc) , it was even mentioned in the latest novel

same for information analysis

4 in last 2 chapters and again he shows other feats like he can control his blood flow automatically and his brain even has routine when he is unconscious as showed in his manga

5 he was unaffected when he was with aliester and as i explained he was able to look at 545 that is described as poisonous of the world and would destroy the mind of those who have not delved deeper in the study of magic by simply looking at her clothes, was unaffected by 545 aura of madness and is immune to people clearing field

1. x = -x is also a calculation, even if a low resource one, and there are aspects to power growth aside from calculation capacity. Take the parameter list for an instance. If it were just improving espers calculations they wouldn't need so many resources to grow an esper to their full potential. In fact, they could have create a level 6 by connecting Rensa to Tree Diagram. And what do you think were they doing in the Level 6 Shift project? Roundabout math lessons?

Esper abilities largely depend on the users psyche and can change with it. That's why AC uses drugs and hypnosis to develop esper powers, why an esper can be boosted by body crystal and why killing thousands of people could potentially make Accelerator grow a level.

Esper growth is extremely multicausal.

2. Ehhh...? I don't quite understand the argument.

3. That would be information analysis, but not analytic prediction? Analytical prediction would be that he predicts the vectors before they happen or something like that.

Not that I am against analytical prediction. In fact Kakine should have it as well. Just that the reasoning should be different. Remember in NT 6 Chapter 6 part 4 when Kakine and Accel perfectly predicted what the other would be doing and thinking, including each other predicting it?

That is in my opinion sufficient justification to give them analytical prediction.

4. Well, as said I'm fine with him being able to control his biological function via vectors. Just wasn't sure about the poison thing.

5. Regarding looking at Qliphah: Thing is lots of people seem to be able to look at her unhindered. Like, in the end of NT 22 R there is the scene when Accel walks with Qliphah straight into the board of directors. Unless they all got mind attacked right there, one either has to read her dress closely, she can control that effect or it was removed after the battle with Aleister. I don't know, but everyone that looks at Qliphah getting mind f*** is inconsistent with what we are shown. (E.g. Hamazura has also met Qliphah).

Where has Accel demonstrated immunity to people clearing fields?

As said, I don't understand what exactly the resisting the war madness stuff is supposed to be grounded on. It's not like everyone in the country got bloodlusted and Accel was an obvious exception. Civilians, for example, weren't affected that notably.

I am neither convinced that the spell targeted him nor that if it targeted him it didn't have the intended effect.

4. It was in chapter 54 of the Accelerator Manga.
Btw, apart from the things you stated, is there anything else you disagree with?

I see, that's fine then.

Eh, depends if you have anything in mind aside from what's in the op.

Given, I think the "Omnidirectional attacks"-thing was added recently? I'm not quite sure what that wants to add. Obviously he can reflect omnidirectional attacks.

Judging by the quote I suspect it might suggests to add reflecting omnidimensional slicing, but that wouldn't be accurate. As Elizard herself said "It would seem you cannot prevent the actual omnidimensional slicing."

Not sure if that's what that really was supposed to add, though.

In fact the story makes it clear it's all the extra stuff he gains that bridges this gap (knowledge, wings, 545 ..etc). That would put the burden of proof on you.

Give me a quote of the story saying "His power is weaker than before headshot, but the other stuff makes up for it". Otherwise that is just your headcanon.

"And calculation ability is also not proportional to esper power." It obviously is, that's why the strongest Espers tend to have the highest calculation power and higher level. For example Awaki's Move Point being superior to Kuroku's Teleport and needing more intense calculations allowing it to increase factors like object size, distance and accuracy ...etc.

Teleportation is a great example for that not being true, as it's clearly stated that that power needs disproportional amounts of calculation compared to other powers of the same strength.

We have genius, like Seria, who have no notable esper level despite their exceptional brains.

Also what I already written above.

I think you confuse high calculation power being a requirement for the highest levels, with power growth being the uniquely determining factor. Things are very much multicausal.

 

[Malox1696]

Lvl 6 shift is really a bad example as it was related to the misaka network, and if u mean accel lvl 6 shift then even worse as it was all a farce for aleister to spread aim

AC uses drugs only to develop the personal reality, if drug worked they just have to pump kid full of them for mass lvl 5, body crystals is unique and is actually about to be explained in the accel manga (might be magical as it's really strange in the last 2 chapters)


Analytical predictions was even shown in his fight with elizard in this volume

We know she had that effect when she fought accel and aleister, war madness only work with people participating a conflict so citizens were unaffected, she probably turned the passive mind corruption off after the contract with accel for obvious reason

Immunity to PCF comes from the fact they are always set up during magical incidents, it's the basic of the basic to keep the magic side hidden

Btw being a genius is not equal to calculations power, seria is a master planer not a master calculator, by ur logic aleister would have more calculations powers than the three diagram as he is a super genius

And u are confusing dragon ball character with Espers, just fighting doesn't increase ur lvl, or tsuchi and other lvl 0 would have lvl up at this point, what's important is how u use ur power, even during the lvl shift project accel reflection didn't get stronger, he just learned new way to use his powers, same for kekinay,etc Mikoto upper limit is still 1 b volts , sisters same lower limit Hell the sisters would have long lvldup to 4 or 5 with all the accel battle

 

[Accelerate420]

My dude, we already covered sisters experiment. It wasn't a means to level him up through fights, it was so he'd learn better adaption of his ability. It wasn't powering him up. They wanted to increase his understanding, that's what SYSTEM and Level 6 is about. 'Understanding'.

 

[Accelerate420]

Soooo.... does this thread have literally 100+ off-topic replies or is it just me?
Well, whatever.

Before getting into responding to the responses to my response let's get into a few things.

First: I want to do the annual reminder that technically you always can get approval of 2 other staff members to make changes, if you don't want to wait for me to get back and reject your stuff. Just saying.

Second: I would suggest that I can do the accepted changes while we still debate.

On the subject matter.

I would be fine with backwards scaling accels reflection and his reflection only. That is due to the entire "doesn't depend on magnitude" argument, which is worth consideration, and since an infinite power jump is rather unlikely, unless there are some extremely noteworthy events.

1 no calculation power is related to the epser power, that what the whole lvl upper thing was about, u can get stronger by finding new way to use ur power or the "coffins" method, but it has nothing to do with reflection tho as it's all based on calculation and formula and it's just x=-x, while vector control actually requires him to calculate the vector before and after the change

2 i think he meant the thing u said at point 1, he can amplify the magnitude

3 look at my post i explained Analytic prediction comes from his ability and requirement to "see" the world in vectors, it was stated he calculates every vector he is aware of even the one he can't see (like radiation, etc) , it was even mentioned in the latest novel

same for information analysis

4 in last 2 chapters and again he shows other feats like he can control his blood flow automatically and his brain even has routine when he is unconscious as showed in his manga

5 he was unaffected when he was with aliester and as i explained he was able to look at 545 that is described as poisonous of the world and would destroy the mind of those who have not delved deeper in the study of magic by simply looking at her clothes, was unaffected by 545 aura of madness and is immune to people clearing field

1. x = -x is also a calculation, even if a low resource one, and there are aspects to power growth aside from calculation capacity. Take the parameter list for an instance. If it were just improving espers calculations they wouldn't need so many resources to grow an esper to their full potential. In fact, they could have create a level 6 by connecting Rensa to Tree Diagram. And what do you think were they doing in the Level 6 Shift project? Roundabout math lessons?
Esper abilities largely depend on the users psyche and can change with it. That's why AC uses drugs and hypnosis to develop esper powers, why an esper can be boosted by body crystal and why killing thousands of people could potentially make Accelerator grow a level.

Esper growth is extremely multicausal.

2. Ehhh...? I don't quite understand the argument.

3. That would be information analysis, but not analytic prediction? Analytical prediction would be that he predicts the vectors before they happen or something like that.

Not that I am against analytical prediction. In fact Kakine should have it as well. Just that the reasoning should be different. Remember in NT 6 Chapter 6 part 4 when Kakine and Accel perfectly predicted what the other would be doing and thinking, including each other predicting it?

That is in my opinion sufficient justification to give them analytical prediction.

4. Well, as said I'm fine with him being able to control his biological function via vectors. Just wasn't sure about the poison thing.

5. Regarding looking at Qliphah: Thing is lots of people seem to be able to look at her unhindered. Like, in the end of NT 22 R there is the scene when Accel walks with Qliphah straight into the board of directors. Unless they all got mind attacked right there, one either has to read her dress closely, she can control that effect or it was removed after the battle with Aleister. I don't know, but everyone that looks at Qliphah getting mind f*** is inconsistent with what we are shown. (E.g. Hamazura has also met Qliphah).

Where has Accel demonstrated immunity to people clearing fields?

As said, I don't understand what exactly the resisting the war madness stuff is supposed to be grounded on. It's not like everyone in the country got bloodlusted and Accel was an obvious exception. Civilians, for example, weren't affected that notably.

I am neither convinced that the spell targeted him nor that if it targeted him it didn't have the intended effect.

4. It was in chapter 54 of the Accelerator Manga.
Btw, apart from the things you stated, is there anything else you disagree with?

I see, that's fine then.
Eh, depends if you have anything in mind aside from what's in the op.

Given, I think the "Omnidirectional attacks"-thing was added recently? I'm not quite sure what that wants to add. Obviously he can reflect omnidirectional attacks.

Judging by the quote I suspect it might suggests to add reflecting omnidimensional slicing, but that wouldn't be accurate. As Elizard herself said "It would seem you cannot prevent the actual omnidimensional slicing."

Not sure if that's what that really was supposed to add, though.

In fact the story makes it clear it's all the extra stuff he gains that bridges this gap (knowledge, wings, 545 ..etc). That would put the burden of proof on you.

Give me a quote of the story saying "His power is weaker than before headshot, but the other stuff makes up for it". Otherwise that is just your headcanon.
"And calculation ability is also not proportional to esper power." It obviously is, that's why the strongest Espers tend to have the highest calculation power and higher level. For example Awaki's Move Point being superior to Kuroku's Teleport and needing more intense calculations allowing it to increase factors like object size, distance and accuracy ...etc.

Teleportation is a great example for that not being true, as it's clearly stated that that power needs disproportional amounts of calculation compared to other powers of the same strength.
We have genius, like Seria, who have no notable esper level despite their exceptional brains.

Also what I already written above.

I think you confuse high calculation power being a requirement for the highest levels, with power growth being the uniquely determining factor. Things are very much multicausal.

An esper can have all the calculation power they want, but if they lack the inherent talent, they cannot evolve. Talent is also a big deal, otherwise everyone would be a full Esper in AC, so Seria is a bad choice for this.

 

[Schnee_One]

If only we could

Accelerate these revisions.

 

[Zensum]

Give me a quote of the story saying "His power is weaker than before headshot, but the other stuff makes up for it". Otherwise that is just your headcanon.

This first bit is stuff that's been stated time and time again...

"That day, my brain was damaged alright. Looking at me now, you should know, right? That I can only use the electrode and let the calculation work be done by others, right? If I enter a place where I can't receive the clones' electrowaves, I can't let the clones do the calculation work for me. And even after therapy, I don't know if my recovered power is half of what I originally had. The battery of this thing can only allow me to fight for 15 minutes—"

"—But then again, just because I've gotten weaker, it doesn't mean that you got stronger, RIGHT?"

The other bit is just common sense when you follow what he has gained to supplement this loss in calculation capacity since his brain damage. Relevant knowledge on unknown laws, wings, 545, clonoth etc. Which has allowed his ability to fight beings like MG's and Coronzon.

Teleportation is a great example for that not being true, as it's clearly stated that that power needs disproportional amounts of calculation compared to other powers of the same strength.

We have genius, like Seria, who have no notable esper level despite their exceptional brains.

Also what I already written above.

I think you confuse high calculation power being a requirement for the highest levels, with power growth being the uniquely determining factor. Things are very much multicausal.

??? The Teleporter with the greater calculation capacity has the stronger teleportation power that's my point. It's been stated Teleportation requires more precise calculations because of the 11D space movement calcs so ofc its understandable that this is a heavily calc intensive power. Just like Accelerator who needs to precisely calc the vector before and after.

The front of his frontal lobe seems to be damaged, and it will affect his verbal and calculation abilities." "Calculation ability..." This was critical damage to Accelerator, as he had to first calculate the 'direction before reflection' and 'direction after reflection' before he could use his ability. Even if he could unconsciously use the reflection ability, it was because he unknowingly calculated the simplest formula. He wouldn't be able to use his ability, even the most basic reflection.

-

Seria bit is irrelevant. Being really smart or a genius doesnt equate to being able to develop a strong personal reality thus having a brain with the capacity for intensive esper calaculations. The growth of personal reality which is the basis of esper power allows for greater calculating ability, thus making the esper's powers stronger. Consider the opposite, the Level Upper which was used to borrow esper minds instead to increase power via a network.

In Academy City, where the school curriculum included esper development, the strongest esper in Academy City also had the strongest brain. Having accurately calculated all the air particle flow in the entire city before, Accelerator used all his thoughts to find a way to solve this.

But Accelerator managed to perfectly revise that huge set of equations in less than 10 seconds. His brain had developed to the point that something of that level was no problem. In Academy City, power development was part of the teaching method, so Academy City's strongest espers were also Academy City's greatest honor students.

When has it been mentioned that her brain is capable of great calculation capacity? I only recall her having a high intellect and manipulation skill that borders on actual esper ability.

-

The level system is just on merit to the Academy City, it just so happens the stronger abilities require more calc capacity to even access that greater power. Leveling up is based on training yes but, theres a reason why all espers go through the power ciriculum and plateau at certain levels. Inherint esper potential is limited by various factors as seen with parameter list, which is why Academy City chooses to support espers they know will potentially have what is naturally required to reach these levels.

 

[Accelerate420]

I seriously wonder if people just speedread the novels or actually sit down and process everything in them, because a lot of these is things that have been answered in early OT to begin with.

 

[TIHYDDWBE]

Agree with zensum.

 

[Scrlk666777]

AP Scaling back: I'm personally alright either way whether we scale back the AP or not, although I don't think Accel's overall AP would have changed. The thing is we will never truly know the difference between pre and post headshot except the limited time he can access his powers. The problem I have as well, that while Accel did say he lost over half of his power, this was only said once and while he was still in the hospital. So, it's not out of the realms of impossibility that Accel gained that power back or at least more of it. And even if it hasn't as I said before we don't really know the difference. Post-headshot's calculating power is pretty immense to the point he can figure out Kakine's dark matter in a matter of minutes, while protecting people, being able to make 1000 people go flying without killing or seriously harming them and even breaking Qliphah's contract which is said to be extremely difficult to do.


But on the other hand, Accel's power grows from what he understands rather than his overall calculating ability, imo. Post-headshot Accel is stronger because of this, so while Pre-headshot might have had more calculating ability, Post headshot Accel understands a lot more. He also has his wings, which with platinum wings, it looks like he can bring them out at will. He has the Clonoth which he can access any time via Qliphah and abyss knowledge, which means he fully understands the magical world, at least according to Qliphah. We still haven't seen the full protentional of what Accel can do with this yet.


So overall I do think we should scale back with the AP as well but I'm not overly bothered if we don't.


Mind Hax Resistance: Hamazura and the others didn't look directly at Qliphah's dress, at least not to my knowledge while Accel did in NT20 when he first made a contract with her and Accel was also in the thick of things where most of the madness was taking place. Also and this might not be any extreme proof here but one has to ask why Nephthys didn't try to use her tears of transmission on Accel rather than Qliphah's since that shouldn't have had any vectors. Personally I think this is more than enough proof but either way he should get some mind hax resistance regardless as it has been said he can counteract certain mind based attacks. To me there is more proof that mind hax doesn't work than it does as at least there's some ambulance of proof, while it working there is absolutely none.


Omnidirectional attacks: I couldn't see anything on his profile about this but maybe this is basically said in him being able to reflect teleportation a.k.a 11th dimensional vectors. I think the new thing here though is that Curtana doesn't just cut through dimensions but phrases as well, as it can cut to the pure world where Aiwass resides. So it seems that even something that cuts through phrases can't cut through his reflection. But it should be noted that it was theorized that if his reflection is cut at the right moment and place, then it's possible to get through. Although this probably would take extreme precision and Elizard pointed out that it could take some time.

 

[Accelerate420]

AP Scaling back: I'm personally alright either way whether we scale back the AP or not, although I don't think Accel's overall AP would have changed. The thing is we will never truly know the difference between pre and post headshot except the limited time he can access his powers. The problem I have as well, that while Accel did say he lost over half of his power, this was only said once and while he was still in the hospital. So, it's not out of the realms of impossibility that Accel gained that power back or at least more of it. And even if it hasn't as I said before we don't really know the difference. Post-headshot's calculating power is pretty immense to the point he can figure out Kakine's dark matter in a matter of minutes, while protecting people, being able to make 1000 people go flying without killing or seriously harming them and even breaking Qliphah's contract which is said to be extremely difficult to do.

But on the other hand, Accel's power grows from what he understands rather than his overall calculating ability, imo. Post-headshot Accel is stronger because of this, so while Pre-headshot might have had more calculating ability, Post headshot Accel understands a lot more. He also has his wings, which with platinum wings, it looks like he can bring them out at will. He has the Clonoth which he can access any time via Qliphah and abyss knowledge, which means he fully understands the magical world, at least according to Qliphah. We still haven't seen the full protentional of what Accel can do with this yet.


So overall I do think we should scale back with the AP as well but I'm not overly bothered if we don't.


Mind Hax Resistance: Hamazura and the others didn't look directly at Qliphah's dress, at least not to my knowledge while Accel did in NT20 when he first made a contract with her and Accel was also in the thick of things where most of the madness was taking place. Also and this might not be any extreme proof here but one has to ask why Nephthys didn't try to use her tears of transmission on Accel rather than Qliphah's since that shouldn't have had any vectors. Personally I think this is more than enough proof but either way he should get some mind hax resistance regardless as it has been said he can counteract certain mind based attacks. To me there is more proof that mind hax doesn't work than it does as at least there's some ambulance of proof, while it working there is absolutely none.


Omnidirectional attacks: I couldn't see anything on his profile about this but maybe this is basically said in him being able to reflect teleportation a.k.a 11th dimensional vectors. I think the new thing here though is that Curtana doesn't just cut through dimensions but phrases as well, as it can cut to the pure world where Aiwass resides. So it seems that even something that cuts through phrases can't cut through his reflection. But it should be noted that it was theorized that if his reflection is cut at the right moment and place, then it's possible to get through. Although this probably would take extreme precision and Elizard pointed out that it could take some time.

His power grows in terms of application but it's not like he's magically making his vectors stronger since it's a formula. I wouldn't be so quick to back down just because this is taking a while, the AP should definitely be scaled. I can deal with lack of Mind hax resistance if we have to though and omnidirectional.

 

[Scrlk666777]

To be honest, the majority agree with the scaling back so therefore I think it should be scaled back. But I;ve always been on the fence with this anyway.

I think the mind hax resistence and the omnidirctional attacks are just as important imo.

 

[Accelerate420]

With what you said, Omnidimensiona/directional does indeed make sense consider she /HAS/ to slice at his barrier instead of just him. It means there's a limit being pressed on Curtana by his field. Mind hax should be included, yes, but if one needs to be sacrificed I should choose that.

I don't see a reason to be on the fence with it, it's already been proven in written dialogue that it's all a calculated formula and not some "think stronger" thing.