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I fail to see how resisting being melted by heat is at all comparable to tanking a building level punch, even if the heat is super super hot.The real cal howard said:
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Undertale town level downgrades
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Tbh. The feat seems to all of a sudden imo. Like considering out running undybe before (or wel running from her) she didn't show to be too fast. Just fast enough to catch up to frisk. Seems more like it was possibly just an oversite or spoof feat that isn't ever displayed again. If they had more to sub sonic. There could be a better argument. But for this feat alone to put them in that area seems iffy.
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A "gag feat" is one that is comedic and falls into the more nonsensical side of things making it questionable if it's even supposed to make any kind of sense within the verse's rules and logic.
That's something that makes sense to not consider as a feat, but if the feat is merely comedic in nature there's absolutely no reason to dismiss it.
That's something that makes sense to not consider as a feat, but if the feat is merely comedic in nature there's absolutely no reason to dismiss it.
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Gag feat or not. There is reason to dismiss it. It is a bit too weird Could very well be Game mechanic or an Over site on the creators part.
And considering the not so long ago feat where ya have to run away from undyne showing her not even to be remotely that fast. As if she was. Frisk would get blitzed ground speed. But is shown to be able to run from her for a bit and eventually escaped.
Plus A lack of other feats to support this level of speed for the rest of the game
Seems iffy at absolute best
And considering the not so long ago feat where ya have to run away from undyne showing her not even to be remotely that fast. As if she was. Frisk would get blitzed ground speed. But is shown to be able to run from her for a bit and eventually escaped.
Plus A lack of other feats to support this level of speed for the rest of the game
Seems iffy at absolute best
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Undyne wasn't even shown running in those iirc.
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I agree. That was ultimately my argument.
It's a gag feat. Undyne's speed is the part that's supposed to be funny, thus making the feat nonsensical. The fact that it's precisely her unusual speed that makes up the joke supports this conclusion.
Basically, you need more support for the rating resulting from this feat before either of us will agree with it, because the feat itself doesn't seem consistent with the rest of the game regardless.
It's a gag feat. Undyne's speed is the part that's supposed to be funny, thus making the feat nonsensical. The fact that it's precisely her unusual speed that makes up the joke supports this conclusion.
Basically, you need more support for the rating resulting from this feat before either of us will agree with it, because the feat itself doesn't seem consistent with the rest of the game regardless.
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When you fight and run away from her. It shows her running, cause she runs to catch up with you. It's what ya got to do in pacifist route, run away. She just can catch up with you after a little. Cause she is a bit faster on foot.
We never see her run back to the house. But it wouldn't make sense she suddenly got that giant boost of speed out of the blue, right after getting away from her.
We never see her run back to the house. But it wouldn't make sense she suddenly got that giant boost of speed out of the blue, right after getting away from her.
Jackythejack
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Undyne didn't seem to be running during that fight from what I can see. It more looked like she was...walking honestly. Maybe speed walking. Or the armor just slowed her down.
If we assume Frisk is just walking (they go the same pace throughout the whole game so not a stretch), Undyne just sorta speedwalking to catch up makes sense.
If we assume Frisk is just walking (they go the same pace throughout the whole game so not a stretch), Undyne just sorta speedwalking to catch up makes sense.
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I am extremely limited on time (this is likely to be one of my only comments of the day) and there are a few things I have issue with in the OP, but I don't feel those really matter, since I actually agree on most of the main cast being consistently Tier 9 to possible Tier 8 as opposed to where they are now.
There are some other things in the comments to this thread I find pretty disagreeable, but I really don't have time to care about the specifics right now, and that can be resolved later, if need be. I am fine with the general premise.
There are some other things in the comments to this thread I find pretty disagreeable, but I really don't have time to care about the specifics right now, and that can be resolved later, if need be. I am fine with the general premise.
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Why is Frisk outrunning her an argument? All that would mean is that Frisk scales.
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I believe that this feat is perfectly fine.
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@Paul I assume it's because Frisk isn't able to move this fast through the underground, but i'm just guessing.
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Actually, characters scaling feats that are much faster than the speed they walk in most scenes is pretty common.
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The problems were
1. Undyne clearly wasn't moving at those speeds of Sub sonic. It was immensely slower. Else she would blitz frisk (and even if we said frisk was moving at those speeds too, they clearly weren't by the distance they could make with their speed)
2. Why would she not run? They need frisks soul to escape. She would just start walking like it didn't really matter. Doesn't make sense to the slightest. That also is just more so a limit on her Sprites. It's not like she has a walk and run animation that we can differentiate.
3. I bring up frisk out running her for a bit cause it would be more to that level. It would be more consistent she could catch up with frisk. Who seems to be closer to athletic human. So the sake of consistency is why I bring it up.
1. Undyne clearly wasn't moving at those speeds of Sub sonic. It was immensely slower. Else she would blitz frisk (and even if we said frisk was moving at those speeds too, they clearly weren't by the distance they could make with their speed)
2. Why would she not run? They need frisks soul to escape. She would just start walking like it didn't really matter. Doesn't make sense to the slightest. That also is just more so a limit on her Sprites. It's not like she has a walk and run animation that we can differentiate.
3. I bring up frisk out running her for a bit cause it would be more to that level. It would be more consistent she could catch up with frisk. Who seems to be closer to athletic human. So the sake of consistency is why I bring it up.
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Seeming slow doesn't mean it is slow; not every character who is lightspeed goes around the planet seven times everytime they move, do they? Characters scaling feats that are much faster than the speed they walk in most scenes is pretty common in fiction, you can't expect literally every scene to be a showcase of their speed.
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Paulo is right.
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It wasn't seeming slower. She was slower. If Undyne was moving at those speeds, then she would have made for more distance in the run.
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Not every character who is lightspeed goes around the planet seven times every time they move, do they?
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Yes. But in this case. It takes her a lot longer to make her run there while chasing after frisk Then the time it took to run back, where it happens at more than twice the speed. I get yea that like light speed people don't cross the world 7 times in one second even though that's how it's accurately would go
But in this case. It's the same distance which took two different time frames. (Technically way more since she was going back to the house. But that further supports it being iffy)
But in this case. It's the same distance which took two different time frames. (Technically way more since she was going back to the house. But that further supports it being iffy)
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Which is also something that is very common in fiction. You can't expect every scene to be a showcase of speed.
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Just cause it's common. Doesn't mean we should push aside the problems in the feat.
If one character is chasing another and they cross 100 miles in 5 minutes. And then right after heading back the same way, plus more distance (let's say 150 miles as an example) yet it only takes them 10 seconds this time. That's clearly controdicting itself.
And it's not like it looks like there are other feats that could make sub sonic consistent. Seems they are closer to Athletic human. Which when you look at this feat too. That also makes more sense.
If one character is chasing another and they cross 100 miles in 5 minutes. And then right after heading back the same way, plus more distance (let's say 150 miles as an example) yet it only takes them 10 seconds this time. That's clearly controdicting itself.
And it's not like it looks like there are other feats that could make sub sonic consistent. Seems they are closer to Athletic human. Which when you look at this feat too. That also makes more sense.
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Yeah, fiction contradicts itself all the time, the speed characters move changes drastically from scene to scene in pretty much every verse, but that's really no reason to not use the higher feats, or else pretty much every verse would be downgraded heavily.
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To play devil's advocate, the reason for not using the feat here is that it's played for comedic effect (the joke is that Undyne got to the house absurdly quickly), and because it's out of nowhere and never replicated (other feats in the verse don't go above athletic human).Paulo.junior.969 said:
If this was done during a serious plot moment or was used alongside another feat or two on a similar level it would be much easier to take seriously.
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And this feat is what to contradicting. It's got holes in its own speed via just having done the feat immensely slower
It contradicts the verses normal speeds And there isn't any other feats earlier or later that support the level of speed
It's like if Captain America being at MHS suddenly pulls an FTL+ feat out of nowhere, and then later feats don't support it. It would be written off. Like this feat should be. There isn't enough to support it, plus the holes in the feat itself
It contradicts the verses normal speeds And there isn't any other feats earlier or later that support the level of speed
It's like if Captain America being at MHS suddenly pulls an FTL+ feat out of nowhere, and then later feats don't support it. It would be written off. Like this feat should be. There isn't enough to support it, plus the holes in the feat itself
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Every verse has feats immensely slower.
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Yes. But verses that are placed at say MHS like DC or Marvel have several feats to support MHS at least.
This verse has one. And it has holes in the feat.
This verse has one. And it has holes in the feat.
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Yes but not every verse has a single (comedic) feat above Athletic Human used to give the verse Subsonic+
^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^^^^^
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@Agnaa And being played for comedic effect is no reason to dismiss a feat, what do we care what if tge tone of the scene wasn't a serious one, that doesn't mean the feat was illegitimate.
No I don't think you're arguing for this, but I still have a problem with that argument.
No I don't think you're arguing for this, but I still have a problem with that argument.
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If you guys think it's a gag feat or an outlier, that's fine, but don't use Frisk's walking animation as an argument.
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I'm using how much distance Undyne can actually make shown on screen vs a feat that happened off screen and is contridcted by on screen feats
Plus the speed of the verse in general across the game. Both laser and earlier.
Plus the speed of the verse in general across the game. Both laser and earlier.
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Do you legit expect a game to move at near soundspeed and still be playable? Seriously, if you guys think its an outlier, then just say there isn't any other feat like that, its simple, but saying "they don't move this fast while you're playing so they're not that fast" makes really no sense.Buttersamuri said:
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Yes. It arguing it's an outlier. That's why I'm saying it's contridtced by other feats in the verse and the feat has problems itself. That's what I have been arguing.
And that's only part of the explanation. On screen they shown different feats to this one sub sonic feat that happens off screen.
And that's only part of the explanation. On screen they shown different feats to this one sub sonic feat that happens off screen.
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Yeah, and I'm not saying it isn't an outlier (I don't really care), it's just the "they don't move this fast while you're playing so they're not that fast" you're using is freaking ridiculous.
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