• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

The End All Be All of Fire Force Revision Threads!

Status
Not open for further replies.
Everyone….it’s time 🗿

I wanna make sure I do this right. So, as accurately as I can, I am going to emphasize and highlight how the feats in Fire Force meet all criteria needed for it to qualify for universal ratings. With feats that are backed up with statements. Ok? Let’s begin.

Universal Fire Force Feat #1:
Ok, this one should be very straightforward as it is the most blatant nor should there by any contention with the feat as it is purely shown and explained to us.


This is what the fire force universe used to look like. Before the cataclysm, the fire force universe looked entirely like ours. Our real life 3D selves. Until the cataclysm brought on by Adolla turned the universe into what we see. An anime/manga style away from its original real life style.
You mean this is what earth used to look like in FF. You never showed any scans of a universe. You showed various scenes around the planet Earth.

In fact, in every(1) single shot (2) of space (3) we get (4). In which we can even see galaxies being visible in the background, we can see that the universe is in 2D anime art-style. Real life people have even been carried over from 3D to 2D due to this shift caused by the cataclysm.
"ON THIS PLANET, there have been many "Cataclysms" over the years." Your very own scan debunks your premise. The cataclysms have been happening on/around Earth, not something that's been destroying and birthing entire universes. Also there being an outer space doesn't mean much, Naruto has an outer space, Bleach has an outer space, One Piece has an outer space, etc etc. You need to show scans of a 3D physical universe turning 2D to prove that the entire universe and not just Earth. However, I doubt such evidence exists when we are directly told that the cataclysms have been contextualized to happening on Earth.

This feat undeniably proves that Adolla’s reach is in the universal range. And not some arbitrary cutting off point. To further support this notion, it is outright stated that the cataclysm is the will of the universe. Whatever reality warping is happening is happening to the universe and not some arbitrary multi solar system cutting off point like we currently have it.
Being the will of something does not grant you the properties of said something. You can embody the intentions of a thing, person, or concept but not have the inherent properties or in this case range of what you embody the intentions of. Simply being the will of the universe could just mean it's the will of the universe to destroy Earth. Many people irl and in fiction claim to be the will of God, and yet they do not possess all the properties of God. That scan doesn't support universal range, all it does is tell us that the universe's will is to do whatever Adolla is doing in story.

To suggest that Adolla has some sort of cutting off point in its reach of merging with the universe is not only baseless but also contradictory to the series itself. As well as brings in confused and needless questions such as if Adolla does have a cutting off point at multi solar system levels then the other galaxies in the universe should be visibly in a completely different art style than the rest of the world. But that clearly isn’t the case.
It's not baseless, you haven't provided a single scan stating that they're doing anything to the universe. In fact the only scan of substance you sent states that these cataclysms are restricted to Earth. I'm not gonna repeat myself by re-addressing the same scans you've already sent a few paragraphs ago.

You just bring in more questions than answers by setting this arbitrary, contradictory limit instead of its actual, stated universal range.

Universal Fire Force Feat #2: This feat’s purpose is to further show how Adolla impacting the universe is entirely consistent with the series while the counter position is entirely inconsistent.

The second feat in question is once again Adolla reality warping the universe to change the stars from actual stars to little block stars in order to match the human perception of them.
So this feat is not as simple as you're making it out to be. We see that many of these cartoon stars are roughly a moon's distance from Earth. There are no irl stars that close to Earth (the closest non sun stars to Earth are many, many, many lightyears away). So those cartoon stars would have been created and put there, since there were no stars there to begin with. What is happening is, the thoughts of humanity (of cartoon stars) is being plastered on the near sky/space around Earth.

With this feat in question, not only is it directly shown to us that the universe is being impacted by Adolla’s cataclysm. But it’s outright stated(1) multiple times(2) as well.
So this first scan has been infamously misused and misinterpreted to claim the cataclysm will destroy the universe. That is not what is being talked about at all. He's talking about how the fundamental nature of reality is to inevitable death and destruction of all things. As mankind marches towards its own destruction (war, self-destruction, conflict, etc), the planet does as well (the cataclysm), and as does the universe (the inevitable death of the universe Big Crunch, Big Rip, etc etc etc). This scan does not claim or prove that the cataclysm is destroying the universe, all he is saying is that one day the universe will end, which is a factual statement. The second scan is just talking about the cartoon stars in the sky that I already addressed in the prior section, but let's focus on the physics of the world have changed.

That statement is awful for quantifying shit and I'll explain why. The reason we can quantify any feats (of the scale pertinent to our discussion here) is because we assume that the physics in fiction function similarly enough to our irl physics that we can apply it to the work of fiction itself. But here we are directly told that is no longer the case, physics has changed. Therefore, you cannot assert any kind of quantification for this feat at all. For example, in our irl physics a star have GBEs on the orders of like 10^41 joules, thanks to the irl physics, but if the physics change then that is no longer provably the case. The new physics changing means those feats are unquantifiable because we don't know the physics to quantify it.

Not only that, but interestingly enough, this statement is made in chapter 234. The feat in question happens in chapter 235. While this other statement supporting the notion of Adolla affecting the whole universe happened in 247.
Already addressed all of these scans so I won't bother repeating myself.

Not only is it entirely consistent with Adolla merging with the whole universe, but is is consecutively consistent within the own series itself that says Adolla is merging with whole universe and not some arbitrary cutting off point of multi solar system level.

I reiterate: To suggest that there is a cutting off point with Adolla’s merger, as this site does, when the series presents the opposite is both baseless and entirely inconsistent with the series.

Occam’s razor does not favor the current standard due to its contradictory information with the series.
Considering you've provided 0 evidence of a universe being merged, I disagree. I'm not going to address the statistics stuff, because I don't think you've provided a single piece of evidence for a universal feat occuring at all.

@Damage3245 you were waiting for this ;)
 
You mean this is what earth used to look like in FF. You never showed any scans of a universe. You showed various scenes around the planet Earth.


"ON THIS PLANET, there have been many "Cataclysms" over the years." Your very own scan debunks your premise. The cataclysms have been happening on/around Earth, not something that's been destroying and birthing entire universes. Also there being an outer space doesn't mean much, Naruto has an outer space, Bleach has an outer space, One Piece has an outer space, etc etc. You need to show scans of a 3D physical universe turning 2D to prove that the entire universe and not just Earth. However, I doubt such evidence exists when we are directly told that the cataclysms have been contextualized to happening on Earth.


Being the will of something does not grant you the properties of said something. You can embody the intentions of a thing, person, or concept but not have the inherent properties or in this case range of what you embody the intentions of. Simply being the will of the universe could just mean it's the will of the universe to destroy Earth. Many people irl and in fiction claim to be the will of God, and yet they do not possess all the properties of God. That scan doesn't support universal range, all it does is tell us that the universe's will is to do whatever Adolla is doing in story.


It's not baseless, you haven't provided a single scan stating that they're doing anything to the universe. In fact the only scan of substance you sent states that these cataclysms are restricted to Earth. I'm not gonna repeat myself by re-addressing the same scans you've already sent a few paragraphs ago.


So this feat is not as simple as you're making it out to be. We see that many of these cartoon stars are roughly a moon's distance from Earth. There are no irl stars that close to Earth (the closest non sun stars to Earth are many, many, many lightyears away). So those cartoon stars would have been created and put there, since there were no stars there to begin with. What is happening is, the thoughts of humanity (of cartoon stars) is being plastered on the near sky/space around Earth.


So this first scan has been infamously misused and misinterpreted to claim the cataclysm will destroy the universe. That is not what is being talked about at all. He's talking about how the fundamental nature of reality is to inevitable death and destruction of all things. As mankind marches towards its own destruction (war, self-destruction, conflict, etc), the planet does as well (the cataclysm), and as does the universe (the inevitable death of the universe Big Crunch, Big Rip, etc etc etc). This scan does not claim or prove that the cataclysm is destroying the universe, all he is saying is that one day the universe will end, which is a factual statement. The second scan is just talking about the cartoon stars in the sky that I already addressed in the prior section, but let's focus on the physics of the world have changed.

That statement is awful for quantifying shit and I'll explain why. The reason we can quantify any feats (of the scale pertinent to our discussion here) is because we assume that the physics in fiction function similarly enough to our irl physics that we can apply it to the work of fiction itself. But here we are directly told that is no longer the case, physics has changed. Therefore, you cannot assert any kind of quantification for this feat at all. For example, in our irl physics a star have GBEs on the orders of like 10^41 joules, thanks to the irl physics, but if the physics change then that is no longer provably the case. The new physics changing means those feats are unquantifiable because we don't know the physics to quantify it.


Already addressed all of these scans so I won't bother repeating myself.


Considering you've provided 0 evidence of a universe being merged, I disagree. I'm not going to address the statistics stuff, because I don't think you've provided a single piece of evidence for a universal feat occuring at all.

@Damage3245 you were waiting for this ;)

One question, why would the author draw the universe? To show that adolla is combined with the universe? If it is clearly stated that the universe will be affected, why would drawing the universe be relevant?
 
Wow I was completely off the mark again, this is what happens when you multitask.

Adolla is merging with the universe. There’s no need to arbitrarily prove the existence of two universes
 
...

Ok if anyone wants to respond and read my arguments for it.
again your argument is that needs to show the universe or something,and you are saying is baseless,but again,your arguments are equal as baseless as according to you the arguments giving.
Clearly it is based on the logic that adolla and the universe have been merged,not just the earth
 
Wow I was completely off the mark again, this is what happens when you multitask.

Adolla is merging with the universe. There’s no need to arbitrarily prove the existence of two universes
It kinda does if you think that the world refers as universe and not as earth like 90% of scans are implying in this direction.
 
which is very ignorant of yours the context of the cataclysm
I explain why Giovanni's statement doesn't inherently mean Adolla is destroying the universe in my post, I'm going to ignore you repeating claims without substantiating them.

Ima unfollow this thread, if someone wants my opinion, just reply to my big post (post 121) and I'll get a notification.
 
Why do I need to prove some arbitrary thing you’re demanding?
Wdym? Clover, focus. If you are saying that the world here refers to universe, you are implying the second universe existence, otherwise, I am going to question you, why the hell would author say it twice? Why would author SCALE between two universes?
 
which is very ignorant of yours the context of the cataclysm
again your argument is that needs to show the universe or something,and you are saying is baseless,but again,your arguments are equal as baseless as according to you the arguments giving.
Clearly it is based on the logic that adolla and the universe have been merged,not just the earth
223.jpg
 
I explain why Giovanni's statement doesn't inherently mean Adolla is destroying the universe in my post, I'm going to ignore you repeating claims without substantiating them.

Ima unfollow this thread, if someone wants my opinion, just reply to my big post (post 121) and I'll get a notification.
Why would Giovanni say that? And then he would argue that the stars and the physics of the universe changed? Again, the stars are from the universe and not from the earth.
 
Wdym? Clover, focus. If you are saying that the world here refers to universe, you are implying the second universe existence, otherwise, I am going to question you, why the hell would author say it twice? Why would author SCALE between two universes?
man... Earth is not used in the sense of universe. sekai has more than one meaning, these are world, universe and community. what is mentioned is that in the 1st panel the meaning of sekai is used as the world, in the 2nd panel the meaning of sekai is used as the universe
 
man... Earth is not used in the sense of universe. sekai has more than one meaning, these are world, universe and community. what is mentioned is that in the 1st panel the meaning of sekai is used as the world, in the 2nd panel the meaning of sekai is used as the universe
So you are saying there are two universes?

Guys, no need to debunk me or teach me language or insult my intelligence or anything, choose one of two, does the scan with "World and Universe" means "Universe and Universe" or "Planet and Universe", if the former, you are going to prove the second universe existence, and if it is latter, no need since it is already proven in the story.
 
Wdym? Clover, focus. If you are saying that the world here refers to universe, you are implying the second universe existence, otherwise, I am going to question you, why the hell would author say it twice? Why would author SCALE between two universes?
What second universe? The thing merging with FF’s universe is Adolla itself

Edit: If you’re talking about the whole “this world” followed by “the universe” statement, that’s just escalating scales. In that context, you can say “sekai” means “planet,” but that doesn’t mean it’s that way for every context.
 
no.

I'm telling you, the meaning of sekai changes depending on the panel mentioned. There are no 2 universes
All the damn scans referring to planets. In no damn scan was referring to universe. Look at Pain's comment, the whole feats are plantery.
What second universe? The thing merging with FF’s universe is Adolla itself

Edit: If you’re talking about the whole “this world” followed by “the universe” statement, that’s just escalating scales. In that context, you can say “sekai” means “planet,” but that doesn’t mean it’s that way for every context.
You are going to prove that the sekai in every other scan is referring to universe and not to "World" that the scan itself said.
 
For example, sometimes sekai takes people as the basis, let me say "everyone in this world is stupid" this sentence refers to humanity, not the planet earth. and the meaning of sekai changes depending on the sentence and the context, sometimes it can be used as the world and sometimes as the universe.
 
All the damn scans referring to planets. In no damn scan was referring to universe. Look at Pain's comment, the whole feats are plantery.

You are going to prove that the sekai in every other scan is referring to universe and not to "World" that the scan itself said.
“World” can either mean “planet” or “universe,” that’s what I think you’re missing
 
The cataclysm happened twi

nah, i would probably get burned like my mom did when i was 3 years old...although that was for being silly and I am aware of what is mine if it is out of stupidity

Aint no way bro I had to stop drafting a response to wrap my head around what you just said 😦
 
Sure thing, you are still required to prove why it means “Universe” and not the “humanity or world”.
 
“World” can either mean “planet” or “universe,” that’s what I think you’re missing
Yes, Sekai can mean both, and you are still required to prove it means universe in every scan presented in this thread that most of them are plantery feats.
 
All the damn scans referring to planets. In no damn scan was referring to universe. Look at Pain's comment, the whole feats are plantery.
If you're arguing that what's being talked about in context is the world, say so. Stop saying there are two goddamn universes
 
Sure, I am going to stop, but yet you are going to prove it. Simply jumping to high-end definition won't work here.
 
Yes, Sekai can mean both, and you are still required to prove it means universe in every scan presented in this thread that most of them are plantery feats.
Take the scans that reference "world" when also talking about the moon and the stars. Those can be reasonably assumed to be referring to "universe" because in those instances, they're alluding to beyond the scope of the planet (hence the moon and the stars)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top