The End All Be All of Fire Force Revision Threads!

[Maitreya12]

Yes I agree which is why I said give specific universal range to all those that showed universal range, an example will be Sho, do you understand now?

What about the 3D to 2D reality warping which you already conceded to being a valid reality warping feat?

Which is still my claim, from the previous replies, I guess you are anime only FF with little knowledge afterwards.
You can read the FF manga from 221, just till the end if you will, it explains all about GC, you can decide for yourself aferwards

Yes and the explanation involves the universe not just the world. Please stop assuming everyone who disagrees with your position knows little about the series

 

[Nierre]

Yeah tmk creation isn't even an ability that's even connected to Adolla nor hinted at in the series whereas Reality Warping is, time and time again, hinted and even outright shown to us. So it's far less speculative to say that's the stars are being reality warped compared to saying that they were just created.

Also @Damage3245, thanks for engaging with the thread, at least we can finally get this thread's gears in motion.

 

[Lunzr]

Can't comment on everything yet - but I don't those are ever suggests to be real stars at interstellar distances which have been altered. We see them up close when Arthur and Dragon literally bump into them while in the Earth/Moon vicinity during their fight.

I have reason to believe that the stars in the background and the stars that are closer too Arthur are 2 different things. The stars closer to Arthur and Dragon were created from Arthur's imagination via using the star ring. I say this because we see stars in front of Arthurs fist here when equipped with the star ring and here again.

The stars created in the background were probably the ones that were light years away being reality warped by Adolla since we have Haumea saying "everything in this world, from humans all the way to the stars, heads towards destruction the second it comes into being". Then if you look closely in this panel we see small stars in the background, proving that they aren't just stars in the Earth's atmosphere. If the stars are that small above Earth's atmosphere they wouldn't be seen from the people on Earth. I'm pretty sure these aren't just stars being created by Adolla or pulled closer to Earth's atmosphere, as in this panel here Giovanni is saying the world's physics are being altered right after saying referencing the moon and stars that were altered. In that context and coupled with the fact that Haumea states this I think it's safe to assume that stars are being reality warped rather than created or pulled closer to Earth.

btw I also appreciate you giving input on the thread.

 

[narutosage15]

Yes I agree which is why I said give specific universal range to all those that showed universal range, an example will be Sho, do you understand now?

Which is still my claim, from the previous replies, I guess you are anime only FF with little knowledge afterwards.
You can read the FF manga from 221, just till the end if you will, it explains all about GC, you can decide for yourself aferwards

Why’re are you assuming that everyone in this thread have little knowledge on FF whereas they’ve proven time and time again to know more about the verse than you do, no offense
You said we should read about the GC and now I’m gonna break it down for you
The GC in general mainly talks about the destruction of the earth or should I say the turning of the earth Into a second sun, with various statements to back it up, basically the GC has a fixated goal which is aimed ONLY towards the earth and like I said earlier this isn’t relevant when talking about range
The various evidence for universal range would be
1) The stars changing it shape and all that
2) Giovanni statement about the stars and how the adolla is affecting the yniverse
3) Dragon’s statement about the stars been changed
4) PI being solvable through the adolla
5) The change in style from a 3D style to 2D
6) Sho’s time manipulation via the adolla
Etc they were other evidences provided but I can’t list them all, so basically look at everything listed here that makes reference to the adolla size and what you’re bringing basically just talks about destruction that the GC would cause
Till you can substantiate your claim that adolla is limited to only the planet for now you have no solid refutation
Hope this would be enough

 

[CloverDragon03]

Which is still my claim, from the previous replies, I guess you are anime only FF with little knowledge afterwards.
You can read the FF manga from 221, just till the end if you will, it explains all about GC, you can decide for yourself aferwards

Why do you insist that people who disagree with you just don't know the Fire Force manga? I probably know a bit less than the active supporters, but that's pretty condescending, don't you think?

 

[Maitreya12]

Can we also acknowledge for a moment that the opposition has conceded that Adolla warping reality from 3D to 2D is a valid universal really warping feat and would apply to range.

This both then makes the stars being created vs the stars being RW conversation illogical, because why would Adolla be creating stars when it literally has warped reality on a universal scale before, as well as irrelevant, because Adolla already has a valid universal reality warping feat regardless.

 

[RoyGundam]

Once again the stars feat is controversial. From my understanding, the two sides of the feat in question are as follows:

The OP's interpretation: Adolla warped the visible stars in the sky so that they matched the perspective of people on Earth

The rebuttal: Fake stars were created in the vicinity of the Earth. Implicit in this argument is the belief that the original stars were not affected in any way and are simply obstructed by the new fake stars that are closer to the Earth

Now, IMO this is not a great rebuttal for the following reasons:

When Shinrabanshoman warped the sun, he didn't create a new sun closer to the earth keeping the original sun intact, he simply warped the sun. Similarly, when Adolla warped the moon, it also simply warped the moon. The idea that the reality warping feats in the verse would affect the sun and the moon in one way but the stars in a completely different (and limited) way requires additional assumptions that are not really substantiated.

Predictable rebuttal to this: But the Great Cataclysm only talks about the earth

Counter-argument(s): The Great cataclysm also changed the universal constant pi and converted an IRL-type world to a manga world

The idea that there is a magic boundary somewhere in space around Earth such that everything inside is manga-like, with a "solvable" pi while everything outside is like the regular real-life universe is just weird and motivated reasoning

 

[PrinceofPein]

Why do you insist that people who disagree with you just don't know the Fire Force manga? I probably know a bit less than the active supporters, but that's pretty condescending, don't you think?

It's not, the question you asked sounds like you have not read the manga, and that is not a bad thing.
Literally read what I wrote, how is it condescending?
And I also said I am guessing not a fact statement.
So if you have read the manga good, I apologize for the assumption

This both then makes the stars being created vs the stars being RW conversation illogical, because why would Adolla be creating stars when it literally has warped reality on a universal scale before, as well as irrelevant, because Adolla already has a valid universal reality warping feat regardless.

Again agreed on the range, adolla is specific, let's give whoever showed universal range a universal range.

Still stand on no stars were brought closer made smaller composition changed and shape changed.
You have no proof of that claim

 

[PrinceofPein]

Once again the stars feat is controversial. From my understanding, the two sides of the feat in question are as follows:

The OP's interpretation: Adolla warped the visible stars in the sky so that they matched the perspective of people on Earth

The rebuttal: Fake stars were created in the vicinity of the Earth. Implicit in this argument is the belief that the original stars were not affected in any way and are simply obstructed by the new fake stars that are closer to the Earth

Now, IMO this is not a great rebuttal for the following reasons:

When Shinrabanshoman warped the sun, he didn't create a new sun closer to the earth keeping the original sun intact, he simply warped the sun. Similarly, when Adolla warped the moon, it also simply warped the moon. The idea that the reality warping feats in the verse would affect the sun and the moon in one way but the stars in a completely different (and limited) way requires additional assumptions that are not really substantiated.

Predictable rebuttal to this: But the Great Cataclysm only talks about the earth

Counter-argument(s): The Great cataclysm also changed the universal constant pi and converted an IRL-type world to a manga world

The idea that there is a magic boundary somewhere in space around Earth such that everything inside is manga-like, with a "solvable" pi while everything outside is like the regular real-life universe is just weird and motivated reasoning

1. Adolla creating things to fit human perception of the environment is my claim.
2. He never warped the sun, in soul eater, the original sun is still there, the smiling one you see at the end of ff was shown twice, and the OG sun is still intact, so my claim that block like stars were created is not unfounded, following the sun point

 

[CurrySenpai]

These counter arguments.... Anyways I agree with it scaling to physicals.

 

[RoyGundam]

in soul eater, the original sun is still there, the smiling one you see at the end of ff was shown twice, and the OG sun is still intact

This is the first I'm hearing of this. Do you have scans from Soul Eater showing the OG sun?

 

[RoyGundam]

1. Adolla creating things to fit human perception of the environment is my claim.

It's warping, not creating. It warped the moon and it warped the art style from IRL to manga-like

 

[PrinceofPein]

This is the first I'm hearing of this. Do you have scans from Soul Eater showing the OG sun?

Sure, I will get it, in a few hours when I am home, need to open the anime

It's warping, not creating. It warped the moon and it warped the art style from IRL to manga-like

So your claim is that adolla never created anything and the only thing is what I am claiming it did? the stars?
Okay so this can be settled by
1. The sun from soul eater
2. Me bringing things created by adolla

okay then

 

[RoyGundam]

Sure, I will get it, in a few hours when I am home, need to open the anime

Cool. I'll wait

So your claim is that adolla never created anything and the only thing is what I am claiming it did? the stars?
Okay so this can be settled by
1. The sun from soul eater
2. Me bringing things created by adolla

The sun would be enough to substantiate your interpretation of the feat because it is also a celestial object, like the other stars. Don't waste your time collecting scans of random stuff that Adolla created because that would be irrelevant to the discussion IMO

 

[Maitreya12]

Again agreed on the range, adolla is specific, let's give whoever showed universal range a universal range.

Including Adolla’s reality warping feat of turning the universe from 3D to 2D which makes your star claim both illogical and irrelevant to the discussion anymore.

Still stand on no stars were brought closer made smaller composition changed and shape changed.
You have no proof of that claim

I already brought proof for the claim multiple times which you have simply dismissed without substantiating your claims in the slightest.

 

[Maitreya12]

1. Adolla creating things to fit human perception of the environment is my claim.

So support your claim. Please show evidence of Adolla creating stars which you have yet to provide.

2. He never warped the sun, in soul eater, the original sun is still there, the smiling one you see at the end of ff was shown twice, and the OG sun is still intact, so my claim that block like stars were created is not unfounded, following the sun point

Support your claim for the love of god man.

You see how everyone provides scans and evidence to support their claims? All except you for some reason. You just keep asserting your positions without actually substantiating anything.

Anyways Shinra clearly did warp the sun, at no point do we see the OG sun still in tact and in Soul Eater it’s directly referred to as the sun as well. Go figure.

 

[PrinceofPein]

So support your claim. Please show evidence of Adolla creating stars which you have yet to provide.

Support your claim for the love of god man.

You see how everyone provides scans and evidence to support their claims? All except you for some reason. You just keep asserting your positions without actually substantiating anything.

Professionally:
I have substansiated all my posts and the new claim I made, I said I will get to the proof when I am home in some hours, like I already said.

Sure, I will get it, in a few hours when I am home,

And the claim is the Op said adolla does not create things and I said I will provide proof of adolla creating things, that is different from me saying "I will provide proof of adolla creating stars", please try to read and comprehend what I write properly.

but deep down all I want to say is:
Shut the hell up and actually read what I write for God's sake!!

Anyways Shinra clearly did warp the sun, at no point do we see the OG sun still in tact and in Soul Eater it’s directly referred to as the sun as well. Go figure.

He turned the evangelist and all the despair into a sun, small and smiling sun, anyway I will drop the post when I get home to my anime(s).

 

[RoyGundam]

He turned the evangelist and all the despair into a sun, small and smiling sun, anyway I will drop the post when I get home to my anime(s).

Manga is strongly preferred, actually. The canonicity of the Soul Eater anime is very suspect

 

[PrinceofPein]

Manga is strongly preferred, actually. The canonicity of the Soul Eater anime is very suspect

The Anime are secondary canons, unless it is contracdicted by the source material, and so far, I cannot remember anything that is contradicting.
but I can go through the manga to get my proof too I dont mind, anime is just easier

 

[Maitreya12]

Professionally:
I have substansiated all my posts and the new claim I made, I said I will get to the proof when I am home in some hours, like I already said.

You literally have not. Deadass, like straight up deadass this was your response to me asking you to provide evidence for you claim over 100 messages ago.

No creation ability was ever seen? huh??

Wait is this a joke or are you serious?

You were actually flabbergasted over the very idea of me asking you to substantiate your claim. You didn’t provide a single piece of evidence for your post then so why has it taken you so long to come to the realization that you actually need to provide proof for your claim when you could’ve done it much earlier ago?

And the claim is the Op said adolla does not create things and I said I will provide proof of adolla creating things, that is different from me saying "I will provide proof of adolla creating stars", please try to read and comprehend what I write properly.

That’s your claim though. You said Adolla is creating the stars so I’m asking for proof for that claim. Please understand how debate works and the very concept of substantiating your points.

but deep down all I want to say is:
Shut the hell up and actually read what I write for God's sake!!

Translation: I’m not gonna bother substantiating my claims. I’m just gonna assert them to be true.

sorry that’s not how debate works.

He turned the evangelist and all the despair into a sun, small and smiling sun, anyway I will drop the post when I get home to my anime(s).

No? He eliminated that despair in the form of Adolla (he literally says “it doesn’t have a place in this world”) and the sun was just reality warped when Shinra changed the depiction of the world once again.

Your claim is that the OG sun is still in the sky so please provide evidence for your claim especially since we never see the OG sun in the sky, only the fire force sun after it’s been warped as well as the fact that it’s directly referred to as the sun in soul eater as well.

 

[RoyGundam]

And the claim is the Op said adolla does not create things and I said I will provide proof of adolla creating things, that is different from me saying "I will provide proof of adolla creating stars", please try to read and comprehend what I write properly.

Just to be clear, this is not my argument. What I am saying is that since the real Moon was warped (this is not in doubt), and the real Sun was supposedly warped (this is something you are contesting), it is more reasonable to conclude that the real stars were also warped.

Proof of Adolla creating random things would be irrelevant to the discussion

 

[RoyGundam]

The Anime are secondary canons, unless it is contracdicted by the source material, and so far, I cannot remember anything that is contradicting.
but I can go through the manga to get my proof too I dont mind, anime is just easier

AFAIK the Soul Eater anime has a completely different ending from the manga. Regardless, if you can find your evidence in the canon part of the anime, it should be simple enough to find a corresponding scan in the manga

 

[PrinceofPein]

No? He eliminated that despair in the form of Adolla (he literally says “it doesn’t have a place in this world”) and the sun was just reality warped when Shinra changed the depiction of the world once again.

Actuallty again, he eliminated despair and we see the sun, literally where he just kicked, page after the page.
You kicked someone and a smiling sun appeared in their place, so yes it is valid to say you turned the person into that smiling sun, especially if you have shown so many reality warping feats previously.
Anyway this argument does not matter, when I get home I will show the FF world still possess another sun.

Just to be clear, this is not my argument. What I am saying is that since the real Moon was warped (this is not in doubt),'

yes

and the real Sun was supposedly warped (this is something you are contesting),

yes, as all we see in chapter 302 was him kicking the evangelist and despair and a small smiling sun appearing in their place.

Proof of Adolla creating random things would be irrelevant to the discussion

it may not necessarily be, since the OP made a claim that Adolla cannot create things, but I dont need to go through the manga showing irrelevant things

 

[Maitreya12]

Actuallty again, he eliminated despair and we see the sun, literally where he just kicked, page after the page.

That doesn’t prove Shinra warped adolla into the sun. He even says in the very scan “go back to sleep” as well as “it doesn’t belong in this world” indicating he simply removed it and did not warp it. You have not proven you claim also this is disputed by how it’s directly stated Shinra has changed the very depiction of the world.

Also he hit it below the black flames while the sun is above the black flames. So what you’re saying isn’t even consistent to what’s shown.

You kicked someone and a smiling sun appeared in their place, so yes it is valid to say you turned the person into that smiling sun, especially if you have shown so many reality warping feats previously.
Anyway this argument does not matter, when I get home I will show the FF world still possess another sun.

No it’s not because there’s literally nothing that says he warped it. There is no statement and there is no showing of Adolla being warped into the sun. You have not proven he warped Adolla into the sun simply asserted your position to be true.

There’s literally only 2 chapters left in the FF manga and in those 2 chapters, not a single image is the OG sun ever shown and only the newly warped sun. If you’re referring to soul eater they directly refer to it as the sun multiple times indicating it is the actual sun.

yes

yes, as all we see in chapter 302 was him kicking the evangelist and despair and a small smiling sun appearing in their place.

Not “in their place” since despair was kicked below the black flames while the sun appears above the black flames dissipating. So you’re objectively wrong on that.

it may not necessarily be, since the OP made a claim that Adolla cannot create things, but I dont need to go through the manga showing irrelevant things

So please show the stars right here we’re created and not warped. Still waiting on that evidence.

 

[Maitreya12]

Update: This Makes No Damn Sense….

Oh and to really freaking hammer in home that Shinra did not warp Adolla into the sun.

But uh…Adolla in fire force is the goddamn Kishin in Soul Eater.

I….I’m actually baffled that I need to explain this to a someone that does indeed read fire force because that should’ve be abundantly obvious in the series….but yeah. That’s literally the whole point of Fire Force.

My god dude it’s a freaking prequel to soul eater. Everything lines up. Literally just watch:

Why does the moon look the way it does in Soul Eater? Oh because Adolla reality warped the moon.

Why does the sun look the way it does in Soul Eater? Oh because Shinra changed the depiction of the world in fire force.

Why does the Kishin exist in Soul Eater? Oh it’s the remnants of the madness and despair Adolla represents when Shinra put it to sleep.

It even goes further back than that.

Why does the Fire force Universe look and behave the way it does? Oh because Adolla rewrote the very rules of the world. Making it into an anime in the first place.

It literally all lines up. Actually everything since everything in fire force is pieced together in order to form the world we see in Soul Eater.

But nah, nah. Adolla’s actually just in the big dumb happy face that’s for whatever reason called the sun in the series according to this interpretation. Just ignore the fact that Adolla looks and behaves exactly like the Kishin does in soul eater. Whatever the **** that is in the series idk. Anyone’s guess I suppose.

….Holy Hell….

 

[Maitreya12]

You see how this:

And this:

Line up together quite nicely in the series? You know they connect with one another?

 

[Maitreya12]

This:

And this:



And not…you know this monstrosity:

Should I keep going? Because I can keep going, or have I made my point clear yet. Because I just find these interpretations really just….wild. Like it’s to the point where I don’t think these conclusions are coming from any type of grounded or logical framework of the series.

 

[azontr]

And not…you know this monstrosity:

Soul Eater sun goes hard.

 

[Maitreya12]

Soul Eater sun goes hard.

Ok…true but,

I’m literally in pain from these arguments rn.

 

[Nierre]

I’m literally in pain from these arguments rn.

You're in.... @Pain_to12 (get it..)

There's more where that came from

 

[RoyGundam]

You're in.... @Pain_to12 (get it..)

There's more where that came from

Maitreya goes to the hospital

Doctor: On a scale from 1 to 10, how much pain are you experiencing?

Maitreya: 12

 

[Maitreya12]

Ok no but for real does everyone understand the point I’m trying to make?

How this thing and this thing line up together much better than this and….this goddamn monster:

 

[azontr]

Gigachad laughing sun.

 

[RoyGundam]

Ok no but for real does everyone understand the point I’m trying to make?

How this thing and this thing line up together much better than this and….this goddamn monster:

I don't appreciate this vicious slander of the laughing sun

 

[Maitreya12]

I don't appreciate this slander of the laughing sun

Look at that thing. Tell me what you see in this creature?

There’s evil in its eyes I swear. Him and his demented moon.

 

[CloverDragon03]

It's not, the question you asked sounds like you have not read the manga, and that is not a bad thing.
Literally read what I wrote, how is it condescending?
And I also said I am guessing not a fact statement.
So if you have read the manga good, I apologize for the assumption

Apologies on my end. I took it in a more condescending way when you didn’t intend for that, so that’s my bad

 

[PrinceofPein]

All jokes aside, I am home now, I have seen all @Maitreya posts, I will work on why the Soul eater has two suns (real and laughing).

 

[Maitreya12]

So for some unknown and unexplained reason there is a real and an animated sun in Soul Eater….but there’s only a single moon.

consistency where?

 

[PrinceofPein]

So for some unknown and unexplained reason there is a real and an animated sun in Soul Eater….but there’s only a single moon.

consistency where?

I know right, it is crazy

 

[Maitreya12]

I know right, it is crazy

or or, maybe you’re just wrong. Hm? Maybe you just have a woefully inaccurate representation of what’s going on in the series.

Me: The moon is warped- reality is warped- the sun is warped- the stars are warped. Everything that’s changed is reality warped.

Pain: The moon is warped- reality is warped- the stars are created??- the sun is actually Adolla?? Only some things that change are actually reality warped while others are arbitrarily created and even other things are completely sealed away with no mention of it in the series.

Yeah…only one interpretation here leads to inconsistencies in the series.