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Restored Final Dragon Ball GT/Non-Canon Revision

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so the others are at least 3-B with the absolute god tier gogeta being 3-A and some attacks are 3-A no?
 
TISSG7Redgrave said:
so the others are at least 3-B with the absolute god tier gogeta being 3-A and some attacks are 3-A no?
Click to expand...
The scaling is now supposed to be like this:

3-A: Omega Shenron, SS4 Gogeta and the Universal Spirit Bomb, maybe SS4 Dragon Fist combined with the x10 kamehameha.

At least 3-B: Super 17 / Shadow Dragon Saga SS4 Goku, Post 10x Kamehameha Absorption Super 17, True Form Si Xing Long / Nuova Shenron, Ying Xing Long / Syn Shenron, and SS4 Vegeta.
 
ahhh gotcha though SS4 dragon fist + kamehameha DID destroy omega but he had regen. Also mind if i add smth? Goku was blind cuz of eis but eventually got his sight back after a bit of time. Is this a regen thing or smth?
 
I think Nuova Shenron just gave him a medicine that could cure the ice damage that Eis Shenron had done to his eye after a while. So I don't think that's Regen.
 
when goku was given the medicine from nouva it was destroyed by syn as he shot nouva before goku could use it
 
Regenerating eye damage is only Low, it scales only to SS4 Goku and Vegeta.
 
Didn't Gogeta state that he could kill Omega Shenron with just one finger?

Which could imply he was still heavily suppressed when he kicked away the Minus Power Ball and used his Big Bang Kamehameha, but he thought that level of power would be enough to kill Omega either way, so he didn't bother powering up.
 
@Kep

He says it here and a guide confirms it. It also says he's "dozes" of times more powerful than a regular SS4, which should put him in that range of power.
 
Omega Shenron already spit out the dragon balls though. And his Regenerationn as Omega Shenron comes from Rage Shenron the five star dragon ball which had already separated from him when he was hit by the Big Bang Kamehameha. It just seemed like he managed to barely survive the blast.
 
I mean, we hear a squishy sound and his sillhouethe reappears slowly.

Although, I guess the fact that he lost the Dragon Balls means him regenerating is a technical impossibility.
 
Pan was able to sense ki and is actually unable to sense Goku while he is watching Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr.'s fight, which means his ki can't be sensed by normal mortals.
 
Or that he was suppressing himself to be undetectable. Something done by a lot of characters in series.
 
ByAsura said:
Or that he was suppressing himself to be undetectable. Something done by a lot of characters in series.
Click to expand...
I know. It was just a fun little observation that has no bearing on Goku's power.
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
Why can't we rate him Post-100 year Timeskip GT Goku as 3-C and the reasoning be : (Is far stronger than his Base Self, to a Unknown extent)
Click to expand...
Because it's too low considering Goku's growths, he jumped to SS3 level in Base in GT by training for only five years. He had 100 years of training, so we decided to keep him at Unknown.

Unrelated but according to Toyotaro in his DB AF Manga, Post EoGT Goku can fight evenly with Omega Shenron in Base.
 
Isn't DB AF was like an April Fools joke? I mean Toyotaro is actually doing dragon ball now so...would we even count AF?
 
They seem fine except the intant transmission one since it is not related to speed. It is instant. The time durations are just cinematic timing.
 
1. Cell was able to perceive the glint of Goku's Instant Transmission when Goku was preparing the Warp Kamehameha. Unless Cell has infinite reactions now, it's pretty clear that Instant Transmission isn't literally instantaneous and just fast.

2. You can see the clouds moving when the camera focuses on Earth. If it was instantaneous, they'd be standing still until IT ended.

3. There is a scene in the Meta-Cooler movie where Cooler and Goku fight in the Instant Transmission timeframe window (I repeat point 1) and we see a warped background moving at fast speeds. That is definitely speed.
 
If the Instant Transmission stuff is accepted then the Manga characters will become MFTL via a calc Kep did.
 
I believe you're talking about anime only moments because they are cinematic timings. It literally translates to instantaneous movement and Akira Toriyama even stated in an interview that "Instant Transmission is...well...instant."
 
Akira Toriyama's word is secondary to the anime since he had almost no involvement in filler aside from designs and the feats clearly prove him wrong. Feats > Word of God. Unless you believe Goku, Cooler and Cell have infinite speed.
 
Cooler's whole thing is anime only inconsistency which is contradictory, we can brush it off as outlier. IT is nothing like that.

Cell didn't react to IT. His reaction was for Goku's sudden disappearance from the sky and spent time noticing Goku was already below him.

Plus, AT's word counts about the technique he created. The anime changed it one time with Cooler which can be treated as an inconsistency/outlier.
 
1. Great. This thread is about the anime's version of events, which pretty clearly portray Instant Transmission as not instant. There is even a scene where King Kai is able to sense Goku teleporting to his planet and actually tries to frantically telephatically yell at him to stop before his IT actually ends and he appears. Granted, this is an outlier reaction feat for King Kai, but it shows that Instant Transmission is not instant.

2. No, Cell pretty clearly reacted to Goku shifting into particles and entering Instant Transmission in the manga too (the anime further shows this). In the anime his head even moves downwards a few split seconds before the IT ends while it's in slow-motion.

3. Also, where did Akira Toriyama say that? I copied and pasted your quote while browsing Kanzenshuu, which has literally every single AT interview out there, and only found other people quoting the same thing, but not the actual interview.

Even if he did:

1. His word in the anime's events is secondary at best.

2. The feats prove him wrong.
 
The speed lines or "shifting into particles" thing happens in both anime and manga right before he disappears and right after he reappears, for showing that he used IT. The actual time duration between going from one end of the universe to other end will still be instantaneous, though the speed lines/shifting particle effect will happen on both ends.

I don't have the link to his interview right now but IIRC I saw that piece in a Q&A interview which was in Kanzenshuu.

The handful of times Toei portrays it differently, like with Cooler and such, can be treated as inconsistencies.
 
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