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Which were debunked later. It was an avatar which is even weaker than the regular ones, not the true form lmao.based on DT's arguments I disagree with type 1 AE.
I mean, there's a reason third parties usually judge arguments...Which were debunked later. It was an avatar which is even weaker than the regular ones, not the true form lmao.
Whole argument was because of PMD Dialga being affected from time being corrupted, which was debunked due of the regular one having different feats of tanking space-time ditortions and even creating a time loop in the Distortion World. And these are just the avatars, not the True Form.I mean, there's a reason third parties usually judge arguments...
But sure, if you say DT's arguments were debunked.
regular one having different feats of tanking space-time ditortions and even creating a time loop
Why are we assuming there's an association between the types of "distortions" and "corruptions" here?PMD Dialga being affected from time being corrupted
Why are we assuming there's an association between the types of "distortions" and "corruptions" here?
It seems to me based on the arguments presented that there's are completely separate phenomena, I haven't played PMD, so could you prove the time corruption due to the tower thing is the same as these other distortions created due to completely different sources? Because they seem unrelated to me, so idk how this debunks anything.
That's not the case here according to context. From Grovyle's quote:
The Planet's paralysis started with the collapse of Temporal Tower, which was governed by Dialga...
Dialga ensured the proper flow of time from Temporal Tower. But when Temporal Tower collapsed time gradually got out of control and eventually the planet fell into paralysis. When time went out of whack, Dialga also lost control.
When time went out of whack implies distortion not corruption.Nothing implies it was the Time Gears being stolen that caused Dialga to lose control. The Time Gears are only what caused the tower to collapse to begin with, which then in turn caused Dialga to go primal.
so what do you mean here?
Im not gonna say I agree with this 100% just yet, but I will say it seems viable that the tower's effect on time could also just have better potency over time than Dialga and is just upscaled.are they different avatars or do they also have different true forms? because this could just be considered a contradiction or the time tower could just have higher potency then what Dialga can resist.
PMD Dialga =/= Regular Dialga due of it being way weaker, and it showed limits that Regular one hasn't.so what do you mean here?
Former as even implied from Cyrus profile, latter doesen't make sense once you read the Doc.are they different avatars or do they also have different true forms?
It's more likely the latter imho, also after what Kukui said.because this could just be considered a contradiction or the time tower could just have higher potency then what Dialga can resist.
I didn't think the latter made sense either, but use of "regular Dialga" and "PMD Dialga" is weird since if PMD is just another Avatar of the Dialga who can create avatars who casually neg spacetime manip etc, why not just "boost" the avatars resistance (I know this sentence is a mess, but it's not important anyway)? But thank you for clarifying.Former as even implied from Cyrus profile, latter doesen't make sense once you read the Doc.
based on DT's arguments I disagree with type 1 AE.
But this interpretation renders the debunk to DT's arguments debunked does it not? Because if Arceus has to interfere, then it's reasonable to assume true form Dialga couldn't stop it either?Which were debunked later. It was an avatar which is even weaker than the regular ones, not the true form lmao.
True Forms never interfere with what happens. That Arceus was an avatar as well since is a physical version of it like in games/anime.But this interpretation renders the debunk to DT's arguments debunked does it not? Because if Arceus has to interfere, then it's reasonable to assume true form Dialga couldn't stop it either?
wdym? They interfere through their avatars due to being higher dimensional. Or are you implying the avatars act without the knowledge of their true form?True Forms never interfere with what happens. That Arceus was an avatar as well since is a physical version of it like in games/anime.
Yeah, thought about it lol. It's weird and could be intepreted in more ways, but at very least this confirms that Arceus can fix paradoxes above baseline.wdym? They interfere through their avatars due to being higher dimensional. Or are you implying the avatars act without the knowledge of their true form?
Nvm, makes sense. That seems a good addition anyways lolBecause if Arceus has to interfere, then it's reasonable to assume true form Dialga couldn't stop it either?
If you're attempting to debunk multiversal CT, you're gonna have to make a CRT with arguments unique to the already dozens of failed CRT's.A lot of this is wrong.
"Created the multiverse" doesn't mean Abstract Existence, and "Created the world" doesn't mean "created the multiverse".
I find it funny how you list examples of entries saying the Lake Trio gave their abilities to humans to conclude that they exist as abstract concepts of their abilities.
The Lake Trio doesn't create avatars.
Literally nothing from those inscriptions say the verse is part of Arceus's being, lol. At best it says he predates the universe.
...What from that page says anything about Arceus being the entire verse?? At best it says he needs the Plates to be OP... and we already know he's fodder without them.
Concepts transcend reality, destroying reality doesn't mean you destroyed concepts.
Cyrus wasn't going to destroy Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina, in fact he was going to use the former two to meet his goals and Giratina was in the Reverse World.
A lot of those AP feats are wank and none of those are Multiversal.
Arceus didn't create those Pokémon. They came up on their own.
Very little of this is usable. I agree on only the Creation Trio getting Abstract Existence and everything in Part 4 not from another Pokémon.
Then read all the previous downgrade attempts and create a unique downgrade CRT, this is not the CRT for this topic....What? No, none of the feats he listed are multiversal in scale.
Excuse me? It was heavily implied such lmao, as even stated in their current profiles."Created the multiverse" doesn't mean Abstract Existence, and "Created the world" doesn't mean "created the multiverse".
They are parts of the Spirit itself, the abilities just link to what they're are in the True Forms.I find it funny how you list examples of entries saying the Lake Trio gave their abilities to humans to conclude that they exist as abstract concepts of their abilities.
...I'll just ignore this.Literally nothing from those inscriptions say the verse is part of Arceus's being, lol. At best it says he predates the universe.
...What from that page says anything about Arceus being the entire verse?? At best it says he needs the Plates to be OP... and we already know he's fodder without them.
Whole plot of the game says no.Concepts transcend reality, destroying reality doesn't mean you destroyed concepts.
"Distortring all the dimensions" and "causing a space-time distortion which will eventually collapse everything" is Multiversal lol.A lot of those AP feats are wank and none of those are Multiversal.
Me rn.Arceus didn't create those Pokémon. They came up on their own.
Headcanon which even contradicts the current profiles.The Lake Trio doesn't create avatars.
Did you not read the doc?Then read all the previous downgrade attempts and create a unique downgrade CRT, this is not the CRT for this topic.
"Insults"So no debunks, just braggy insults? That's a fast way to get this section fled from by potential accepters.
Most of that are supporting feats which you said just "they're not multiversal" without an explanation.Did you not read the doc?
Yes, and if I misinterpreted your intentions I apologize, but when you say stuff like:Did you not read the doc?
"Created the world" doesn't mean "created the multiverse".
none of the feats he listed are multiversal in scale.
It sounds like you disagree with multiversal AP, which is currently accepted, and this is not the thread to downgrade their AP.A lot of those AP feats are wank and none of those are Multiversal.
Lol whut.I know; he claims a lot of their feats are Multiversal that aren't just because that's their AP.
^^^The document talks about Multiversal Pokémon, but with the knowledge that Pokémon has already been accepted by the Wiki. If you were to try to debunk 2-B/2-A Pokémon then please take it to another CRT to prevent derailment.
Which was alredy accepted from the majority in its entirety as well.Now what exactly needs to be done, because at the moment it looks like we are in impasses with no sides seeming to be changing their minds anytime soon, and I'd rather this thread not just die from inactivity.
Yeah this is def. derailing, please just stopYou haven't exactly been keen on Pokémon Physiology yourself.
It's not that simple, also you forgot me.Agreements: Kirean, Plank, Kukui, Yuri, Everything.
Disagreements: DDM, Elizhaa and DT (But even just on some things and not everything)
It should be added already tbf
I know, I'm not rushing it on here, the profile for it just got deleted again so I have to get it accepted again.The Pokémon Physiology page is a pretty complex thing that affects the whole verse so you will need to be a little more patient pls, geez, we haven't even been able to add space-time manipulation to all the mons, even though it's been widely accepted.
Just wait a bit, also I'm sure we can find more abilities eventually....I know, I'm not rushing it on here, the profile for it just got deleted again so I have to get it accepted again.
Aka is derailing.I know, I'm not rushing it on here, the profile for it just got deleted again so I have to get it accepted again.
Well, everything is accepted but:Would anyone be willing to provide a summary of what has been accepted & is to be implemented so far, please?
Not important, I'm just personally curious.
BTW, can you call Ant so we can see what to do?Now what exactly needs to be done, because at the moment it looks like we are in impasses with no sides seeming to be changing their minds anytime soon, and I'd rather this thread not just die from inactivity.
Agreements: Kirean, Plank, Kukui, Yuri, Everything.
Disagreements: DDM, Elizhaa and DT (But even just on some things and not everything)
Current chart btw.Well, everything is accepted but:
- Type 5 Acausality: rejected from everyone on Earth
- Type 1 AE: currently discussed from DT
- Type 4 Acausality: same from DT