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One Piece: Dinkleberg Quinkleturd Big Planet Shake

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Eseseso said:
Btw when are those gonna be put on Luffy's profile?
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It seems fine to me at least, but you likely need more than one calc group member approving the new calculations, as it is a rather controversial issue.
 
Damage3245 said:
I should be asleep now.
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2fa5da21654e6e42d651a0c331c195d340be738063d8d66e710724101ec11475_1.jpg
 
I assume Planck69's past in the RVT was meant for this thread.

The topic got a little veered off from where the discussion was at earlier so I'll post a new response to a couple of the posts further up tomorrow.
 
Imma just start this off by saying, do not @ me about this, I was asked to comment here and I don’t want to interact with this thread any more than I have to

After reading the arguments for and against Whitebeard’s feat being an outlier, I have to say that I would consider it an outlier? The only comparable calc y’all have is Bajrang Gun, right? Kaido needed his strongest attack to match that, and Whitebeard is accepted as only being comparable to base Kaido… so him being able to output comparable power to Bajrang Gun doesn’t make a lot of sense to me.

So, yeah, I would consider it an outlier, but I’ve said in previous threads, I’m not really knowledgeable in OP, so KT can disregard this if he wants.
 
I know it's a bit of a copout, but I'm actually kind of neutral here.

On the one hand, I can see the arguments for with the whole idea that this is a simple application of his already accepted (possible) range. I can also see how the new BG calc helps provide some consistency and what have you. Some aspects of that range I find iffy, but this is not the thread for it, nor am I knowledgeable or interested enough to tackle it, so yeah fair enough on that front. It doesn't necessarily break the scaling, and WB world ending statements has been reiterated enough for it to be narratively consistent if nothing else.

But on the other hand, I also find merit in Damage's arguments. This is, indeed, far above anything WB has ever showcased on-screen. Additionally, the support feat is the ultimate attack of a much stronger character, so ehh. I also see this fulfilling some (but not all) of our Outlier criteria when viewed under a certain lens, but it's obviously not an objective thing.

I guess I'm just a bit torn, and I'm not really caught up with One Piece to even have a strong personal opinion on the matter, so I'll just leave it at that for now. I'm a coward, sorry not sorry. :p
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
@LordTracer
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UchihaSlayer96 said:
I know it's a bit of a copout, but I'm actually kind of neutral here.

On the one hand, I can see the arguments for with the whole idea that this is a simple application of his already accepted (possible) range. I can also see how the new BG calc helps provide some consistency and what have you. Some aspects of that range I find iffy, but this is not the thread for it, nor am I knowledgeable or interested enough to tackle it, so yeah fair enough on that front. It doesn't necessarily break the scaling, and WB world ending statements has been reiterated enough for it to be narratively consistent if nothing else.

But on the other hand, I also find merit in Damage's arguments. This is, indeed, far above anything WB has ever showcased on-screen. Additionally, the support feat is the ultimate attack of a much stronger character, so ehh. I also see this fulfilling some (but not all) of our Outlier criteria when viewed under a certain lens, but it's obviously not an objective thing.

I guess I'm just a bit torn, and I'm not really caught up with One Piece to even have a strong personal opinion on the matter, so I'll just leave it at that for now. I'm a coward, sorry not sorry. :p
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OOF
 
UchihaSlayer96 said:
This is, indeed, far above anything WB has ever showcased on-screen.
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Kachon123 said:
Whitebeard barely has any feats that show his power. He only has three, with one of them being a casual quake made to discombobulate the island of Marineford the other being him trying to sink the island, and the other just being a result of him being mad that Roger asked Oden to join his crew. Whitebeard never truly had a reason to go all out with his fruit in a way where he'd need to effect the entire world.
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UchihaSlayer96 said:
Additionally, the support feat is the ultimate attack of a much stronger character, so ehh.
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Kachon123 said:
What's calced is not the full power of Bajrang Gun even ignoring the decompression.

The calc ignores the 3 types of Haki being used (Buso: Koka, Hao, Buso Emission), meaning it's not really far fetched to say that Luffy on his own is close the AP of the Kinetic Energy of just the large fist.
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UchihaSlayer96 said:
I know it's a bit of a copout, but I'm actually kind of neutral here.

On the one hand, I can see the arguments for with the whole idea that this is a simple application of his already accepted (possible) range. I can also see how the new BG calc helps provide some consistency and what have you. Some aspects of that range I find iffy, but this is not the thread for it, nor am I knowledgeable or interested enough to tackle it, so yeah fair enough on that front. It doesn't necessarily break the scaling, and WB world ending statements has been reiterated enough for it to be narratively consistent if nothing else.

But on the other hand, I also find merit in Damage's arguments. This is, indeed, far above anything WB has ever showcased on-screen. Additionally, the support feat is the ultimate attack of a much stronger character, so ehh. I also see this fulfilling some (but not all) of our Outlier criteria when viewed under a certain lens, but it's obviously not an objective thing.

I guess I'm just a bit torn, and I'm not really caught up with One Piece to even have a strong personal opinion on the matter, so I'll just leave it at that for now. I'm a coward, sorry not sorry. :p
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This evaluation seems to make sense to me, but as Kachon123 said, we have only seen regular attacks from Whitebeard, not his absolutely strongest special move (as we saw during Kaido's and Luffy's clash), which what is suggested here would likely refer to.
 
Strongly agreed.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Wait, so is what’s being proposed is that WB’s strongest hypothetical attack is what has the possibly 5-C scaling? Or is it just his normal AP?
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Who said that? It's his normal AP
 
Hmm. I do not think that old and sick Whitebeard being able to spam attacks that are stronger than what prime Kaido and Luffy can do at their peaks seems to make sense given what we have seen from old and sick Whitebeard's regular attacks.
 
Antvasima said:
Hmm. I do not think that old and sick Whitebeard being able to spam attacks that are stronger than what prime Kaido and Luffy can do at their peaks seems to make sense given what we have seen from old and sick Whitebeard's regular attacks.
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Old Whitebeard is relative to them. Sick Whitebeard is relative but weaker.

The calcs don't specify the exact values they scale to. It's as if King Kong Gun gets a city level calc but still scales to island level through scaling.
Base Hao Luffy scales to this through Prime Kaido and the technique still scales far above their actual capabilities, AKA it upscales from the value being proposed.

Blackbeard is stated to have the same power to "destroy the world" and Kaidou is stated to be stronger. No scaling is harmed due to these feats. Everything's fine, the Bajrang Gun and Kaen Daiko would upscale from 5-C.

So basically, Old and Sick WB does not spam attacks stronger than what they can do at their peaks, it just showcases more destruction that can be quantified, which is understandable for one of the most destructive devil fruits.

It's like when we had Issho's calcs > Whitebeard's calcs, Whitebeard just scaled above it. All is well
 
To circle back to this:

Arc7Kuroi said:
I guess I’m not explaining myself properly, but I know the statement is not a one off statement. Like as I’ve said, I do believe that the statement in and of itself is consistent. However, I’m more interested in the interpretation of that statement rather than there being multiple iterations of that statement. Like what is exceptional is not the statement, but the interpretation that it’s a single quake of magnitude 6 across the world, that is the argument damage is making. So basically the question is, why is the interpretation that it’s a 5-C attack (as per the calc assumptions) not exceptional. Does that make sense?
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Damage3245 said:
I know that there is more than one "statement" for shaking the world though I don't think necessarily everything brought up in the original thread was valid. But how many of these statements are specifically for "at least Magnitude 6"?
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This was on the topic of the "exceptional event" part of the Outlier standards yesterday. I don't think Arc7 or myself have been answered here yet. How many statements are there specifically for the interpretation of a single global earthquake of at least Magnitude 6 potency?
 
Every single statement of "destroy the world" supports the fact that there would be the capability of a worldwide destructive earthquake which a bunch of mag 4s and 5s wouldn't bring.

So maybe 9 statements of him being able to produce a Mag 6 quake. Is that fine???
 
KingTempest said:
Every single statement of "destroy the world" supports the fact that there would be the capability of a worldwide destructive earthquake which a bunch of mag 4s and 5s wouldn't bring.

So maybe 9 statements of him being able to produce a Mag 6 quake. Is that fine???
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Not really. If you have a list of all of them and where they're sourced from, I could explain why I don't think this point is convincing.
 
KingTempest said:
Old Whitebeard is relative to them. Sick Whitebeard is relative but weaker.

The calcs don't specify the exact values they scale to. It's as if King Kong Gun gets a city level calc but still scales to island level through scaling.
Base Hao Luffy scales to this through Prime Kaido and the technique still scales far above their actual capabilities, AKA it upscales from the value being proposed.

Blackbeard is stated to have the same power to "destroy the world" and Kaidou is stated to be stronger. No scaling is harmed due to these feats. Everything's fine, the Bajrang Gun and Kaen Daiko would upscale from 5-C.

So basically, Old and Sick WB does not spam attacks stronger than what they can do at their peaks, it just showcases more destruction that can be quantified, which is understandable for one of the most destructive devil fruits.

It's like when we had Issho's calcs > Whitebeard's calcs, Whitebeard just scaled above it. All is well
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Okay. I suppose that I am neutral regarding that issue then.
 
Antvasima said:
Okay. I suppose that I am neutral regarding that issue then.
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Does this mean you're neutral for the proposal of the thread overall? Or just for it scaling to other characters beyond Whitebeard?
 
Damage3245 said:
Not really. If you have a list of all of them and where they're sourced from, I could explain why I don't think this point is convincing.
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You don't even know why you disag- ok.

#1 One-Piece.com saying WB has the power to destroy the world.
#2 Volume Z saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#3 Vivre card statement saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#4 Databook Blue Deep saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#5 Sengoku in the series saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#6 The narrator of the Ace Novel saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#7 Pirate Warriors saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#8 The anime's episode title saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#9 Databook Green saying Blackbeard has the power to destroy the world

Damage3245 said:
Does this mean you're neutral for the proposal of the thread overall? Or just for it scaling to other characters beyond Whitebeard?
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He's neutral for the scaling, since he said regarding that issue. His agreement with the thread hasn't been changed yet, it's who it scales to that matters.

This thread does not talk about scaling at all. It's specifically getting this feat accepted as a valid feat.
 
KingTempest said:
You don't even know why you disag- ok.

#1 One-Piece.com saying WB has the power to destroy the world.
#2 Volume Z saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#3 Vivre card statement saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#4 Databook Blue Deep saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#5 Sengoku in the series saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#6 The narrator of the Ace Novel saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#7 Pirate Warriors saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#8 The anime's episode title saying WB has the power to destroy the world
#9 Databook Green saying Blackbeard has the power to destroy the world
Click to expand...

The thing about all of these statements (and I'm not sure that all of them are entirely appropriate sources of canon. An episode title and a tweet from one of the video games?) is that these statements are not very specific. "Destroy the world" can mean a lot of things. As you yourself brought up when you got the statement removed from the Hyperbole page, it is very dependent on context.

A Magnitude 6 earthquake felt all around the planet won't destroy the entire planet so we both at least agree it is at least partially figurative and not as literal destroying the entire world.

If the statements are just for causing mass devastation then, not one of those statements points to it being solely a single attack. Having the "capability to destroy the world" is not necessarily the same thing as "the capability to destroy the world with one attack". Destroying the world over time also counts as "destroying the world".

I'm not convinced that statements of "Whitebeard has the power to destroy the worl" can only mean "Whitebeard has the power to shake the entire planet at Magnitude 6 with a single attack".
 
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Damage3245 said:
The thing about all of these statements (and I'm not sure that all of them are entirely appropriate sources of canon. An episode title and a tweet from one of the video games?) is that these statements are not very specific. "Destroy the world" can mean a lot of things. As you yourself brought up when you got the statement removed from the Hyperbole page, it is very dependent on context.

A Magnitude 6 earthquake felt all around the planet won't destroy the entire planet so we can at least agree it is at least partially figurative and not as literal destroying the entire world.

If the statements are just for causing mass devastation then, not one of those statements points to it being solely a single attack. Having the "capability to destroy the world" is not necessarily the same thing as "the capability to destroy the world with one attack". Destroying the world over time also counts as "destroying the world".

I'm not convinced that statements of "Whitebeard has the power to destroy the worl" can only mean "Whitebeard has the power to shake the entire planet at Magnitude 6 with a single attack".
Click to expand...
Then you're in denial. That's all I can say because it sounds like you're disagreeing to disagree. Everything you've said here has been debunked, over and over.

The last thread accepted that crucial argument.

Nobody said a Mag 6 earthquake can destroy the entire planet. We said a Mag 6 earthquake can reach the entire planet. If you want to say "he can't destroy it in 1 attack", then Mag 6 earthquakes overtime a long ass time can pull out that effect.

You don't know how earthquakes work. Repeated mag 1, 2, 3, 4, and even 5 earthquakes wouldn't cause the damage needed to pull out the destruction of a mag 6 quake unless Whitebeard stood there for dozens to hundreds of years just constantly quaking every second. Even repeated mag 6 quakes would just prolong the time needed for him to do freaking wall level damage to the other side of the planet.

Anybody who agrees with this argument is agreeing for the sake of agreeing or is agreeing out of ignorance.

If the mf is capable of affecting the planet on a scale of destruction accepted in the last thread, he needs no less than Magnitude 6, unless you're saying Whitebeard will constantly quake for hundreds of years until some walls have minor cracks in them.

All the destroy the world statements imply "wide scale destruction". That's the minimum of that damn argument.

You aren't getting specifics. If somebody says "I'm faster than you" you want them to state "when I'm running with my back facing the sky" or some shit? No.

You're looking for needless specifics.

A mag 6 quake is needed. No prolonging of any other damn quake. A mag 5 won't do the damage of a mag 6 quake, much less anything less.
The destroy the world statements support that there will be mag 6 quakes sent by WB.
The statements don't need all that damn context with every piece of support from the range thread pointing towards WIDE SCALE DESTRUCTION.
"Single attack" it doesn't matter. This isn't "pulv the world" that can be split with a timeframe. "Do this effect with earthquakes" does not have a timeframe or "amount of attacks" assumption.

Do you have any other valid arguments other than "it's the only value in this range"?
 
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