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Ninjago Star Tiering and Possible New Value

YmTheSuper said:
Wu's meeting with Kai is different from that in the show
Click to expand...
The point is still the same, though. It's not an entirely new scene, it’s just a summary of what Wu said… so nah
YmTheSuper said:
This wouldn't scale to physical stats since Nadakhan's wishes are not a UES.
From the Creation Feats page in the wiki
Click to expand...
It still shows that stellar feats are a thing in Ninjago, and your argument relies on "OUTLIER!!!1!!!" yappery. 2 is already more than enough, as I gave examples with Gravity Falls and Wander over Yonder who haev only 1 feat that matches the tier, and this is just a supportive of the 4-C feats in Ninjago...
AigerTheKing said:
Nadakhan at the time is amped by EPs who have a UES + Pretty sure Djinns magic is shown weaker when physically injured, which would imply UES
Click to expand...
Meh, Nadakhan created it via Djinn Magic, not EPs, and the reason he was weaker is because Widow Tiger’s Poison was magic-draining iirc, so I don’t really think so
 
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
2 is already more than enough, as I gave examples with Gravity Falls and Wander over Yonder who haev only 1 feat that matches the tier
Click to expand...
From the page on outliers
1) Is it a big jump or drop in power? If a character with several city destruction feats is shown to be able to destroy a mountain, we cannot necessarily consider it as an outlier, for the reason that the jump between tiers is not extreme enough to be so
Click to expand...
Neither of the examples you gave have an extreme jump in power since:
1. Gravity Falls has multiple wall level, small building level and building feats. The jump from these feats to city block is not large enough to warrant it being an outlier
2. Wander over Yonder has many planetary to stellar statements, planetary feats and a brown dwarf level feat, a jump to star level here is not extreme enough for it to be considered an outlier.

While the jump in Ninjago is from Tier 7/Tier 8 feats (Multi City-Block, Town and Large Town level feats) to 4-C (Star Level) which is a massive jump that relies on 2 feats one of which is a Pocket Dimension creation feat which should be analyzed case-by-case in order to accommodate for the possibility of outliers, PIS and inconsistencies... and the other feat is the Golden Weapons feat which is already in question from previous arguments in the thread (There's also a 6-A statement but it's very vague and comes from a magazine and probably shouldn't be used as I indicated earlier and even if it were to be used it wouldn't change anything about 4-C scaling since it's still a massive jump in power)

Now it's up to staff members to consider whether star level is an outlier or not.
 
Aolphl said:
Maybe can you agree with "Possibly 4-C"?
Click to expand...
He agree with 4-C, so is would be not possibly but Pilots characters would be 6-A but if he agree with TGW feat to be possibly so Pilots characters like Samukai, Lord Garmadon (Pre-Realm of Madness), Clouse (Serpentine War Arc) would be 6-A, possibly Low 4-C.
 
REX9097 said:
He agree with 4-C, so is would be not possibly but Pilots characters would be 6-A but if he agree with TGW feat to be possibly so Pilots characters like Samukai, Lord Garmadon (Pre-Realm of Madness), Clouse (Serpentine War Arc) would be 6-A, possibly Low 4-C.
Click to expand...
I talking about possibly 4-C for main cast
 
YmTheSuper said:
1. Gravity Falls has multiple wall level, small building level and building feats. The jump from these feats to city block is not large enough to warrant it being an outlier
Click to expand...
Jump from 9-B to 9-A to 8-C to 8-B is pretty big.
YmTheSuper said:
2. Wander over Yonder has many planetary to stellar statements, planetary feats and a brown dwarf level feat, a jump to star level here is not extreme enough for it to be considered an outlier.
Click to expand...
I see only one planetary feats on the page and no other. It’s a huge jump from 10-B to Tiers 5-4. And Ninjago has multiple Star level feats regardless.

Anyways, I probably won’t be bothered by this anymore. I said everything I wanted and needed to. If 4-C gets rejected, I will just push to 10-B by the same logic, and just finally leave Ninjago alone on this website.
 
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
I see only one planetary feats on the page and no other. It’s a huge jump from 10-B to Tiers 5-4.
Click to expand...
We're derailing but this is just wrong
Lloydblitzed said:
Spaceman's said neutral towards disagree on GWs but agree on Wu's Dimension Feat
Click to expand...
I asked for clarification because he said he agrees with Wu's dimension feat but doesn't agree with upscaling the main cast which could mean that he agrees with the feat itself but not characters scaling to it. More clarification is always better.
 
It's been a while since I read this, is there any proof that the character who created the star can use the same amount of energy in his attacks?
 
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
UES is literally about the fact that all your attacks have the same energy, otherwise there is no reason for its existence, lol.
Click to expand...
Do we really work like this? If so, the part of the creation page where it says he needs to channel a similar amount of energy or greater to scale to his physiques doesn't make sense.
 
Demon_Lord18 said:
Do we really work like this? If so, the part of the creation page where it says he needs to channel a similar amount of energy or greater to scale to his physiques doesn't make sense.
Click to expand...
Maybe read the page a little better?
In order to apply to a character's capacity to harm other characters, that is their usual Attack Potency, their Creation has to be connected to their other abilities. Often that is due to a common energy system, in which the same energy used for creation is used for attacks.
Click to expand...
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
I already explained why I disagree with these.
Click to expand...
Yeah, on ur page u said you agree with the feats being 4-C, but no one scaling to it. But the argument the OP made was that Wu scaled to his 4-C creation throught a UES
This would further support the Star level rating and make it consistant (A reminder this would scale to his AP due to having a UES as explained earlier), and would upscale the cast higher into 4-C
Click to expand...
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
I already explained why I disagree with these.
Click to expand...
Your argument is just AP =/= DC though. We cannot expect for all their feats to just destroy stars, especially given that the main setting in the series is a city. Could you elaborate why you disagree with accepted UES?
Also, these were not the only reasons:
TheOrangeGuy09 said:
But the point is that Garmadon can hold Megaweapon/4 Golden Weapons, which would erase someone from existence. And they did not only clash swords but also fought physically and could harm each other. And again, Cole could hold the Megaweapon as well, so I don't see why they wouldn't be 4-C.
Click to expand...
 
I don’t disagree with UES, but I don’t think that explosion alone is enough to scale their durability to the highest feat the GWs have shown. If there were another feat showing them or stating that they tanked a full-force attack or explosion from a GW, then I’d be on board with that scaling.

As for the Lloyd part, it mentions “transformative powers,” which seems to refer to him having access to all the GWs’ abilities, not necessarily scaling to them.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
I don’t disagree with UES, but I don’t think that explosion alone is enough to scale their durability to the highest feat the GWs have shown. If there were another feat showing them or stating that they tanked a full-force attack or explosion from a GW, then I’d be on board with that scaling.
Click to expand...
What about Garmadon and Cole part?
Villains comparable to Ninjas easily take GWs explosion here as well btw, so this should be good.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
I don’t disagree with UES, but I don’t think that explosion alone is enough to scale their durability to the highest feat the GWs have shown. If there were another feat showing them or stating that they tanked a full-force attack or explosion from a GW, then I’d be on board with that scaling.
Click to expand...
What about the fact Garmadon is powerful enough to control their combined power? Is that enough proof?

LephyrTheRevanchist said:
Seems a downgrade might be in order then
Click to expand...
Nah, Planck and Glassman's comments were done thinking they agree on the Dimension feat
 
Lloydblitzed said:
What about the fact Garmadon is powerful enough to control their combined power? Is that enough proof?
Click to expand...
If surviving the explosion of their contact wouldn't scale to 4-C then there's no reason to believe that controlling their power and wielding them would scale to 4-C
Lloydblitzed said:
Nah, Planck and Glassman's comments were done thinking they agree on the Dimension feat
Click to expand...
We should probably ask for clarification rather than make assumptions so that further misunderstandings don't happen
 
I feel like I should just retract myself from this CRT. Because I'm questioning the logic behind the 4-C Rating, and I don't want to turn this into a downgrade.
 
ActuallySpaceMan42 said:
What's the actual context behind the star feat again?
Click to expand...
The 4 Golden Weapons reacted with the Megaweapon to destroy it (which is itself made of 4 golden weapons) and merged with it and then shot into got space creating a star

Also, I'd like to know if my concerns that 4-C is an outlier is valid since it scales way above all other feats the main cast scale to.
The arguments in question:
Outlier argument, Outlier argument 2, response, another response, more responses, anti-feats to support it being an outlier, anti-feats matter because star level is much higher than any other feat that the base ninja could scale to.
 
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