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Nasuverse: Noble Phantasm Revisions

Ionliosite said:
I mean, even in Nasuverse, Leonardo da Vanci was a man, the reason the Servants appears as a woman is because he modelled that body after the Mona Lisa.
Click to expand...
Of course, why didn't I think of that... Fate is so weird
 
My Mordred calc got accepted as High 7-A and Gray's Rhongomyniad calc was also accepted as High 7-A, both of which are A+ Ranked Anti-Army and Anti-Fortress NP's

I think we have an idea how scaling NP's will work now

A Ranked Anti-Unit NP's: Small City level+ (5.7 Megatons)
  • Based on Lancelot's Arondight matching and stalemating Numeral of the Saint Gawain, who is 3x stronger than Base Gawain
A+ Ranked Anti-Unit NP's: City level (9.5 Megatons)
  • Based on Overloaded Caliburn being stronger than an attack worth 5x the amount of gems Rin used to kill Berserker once
A+ Ranked Anti-Army and Anti-Fortress NP's: Large Mountain level (1.9 Gigatons)
  • Based on Gray's Rongomyniad and Mordred's Clarent Blood Arthur calcs

Thoughts everyone?
 
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I am for downscaling x7 from Excalibur/Rhongomyniad/Caliburn, as it is explicitly stated that a fully powered Caliburn can kill Berserker seven times, and the Heaven's Feel II movie shows that Excalibur Morgan killed Berserker 7 times.
 
ShadowWhoWalks said:
I am for downscaling x7 from Excalibur/Rhongomyniad/Caliburn, as it is explicitly stated that a fully powered Caliburn can kill Berserker seven times, and the Heaven's Feel II movie shows that Excalibur Morgan killed Berserker 7 times.
Click to expand...
I don't agree with that at all, there are no Base Servant Stat feats that are even close to 7-A, leaving them at Low 7-B is fine, upgrades aren't always the most logical thing to do, Excalibur at Full Power would have been able to kill Berserker all 12 times at once, that makes it far stronger than Shirou's Projected Caliburn which could only kill Berserker 7 times, therefore backscaling from Excalibur doesn't work, also if you say that Excalibur didn't kill all of Berserker's lives in Heaven's Feel, that's because Dark Sakura intentionally made it so that Saber left Berserker's alive
 
Berserker only being killed 7 times is a Base Servant Stat feat that is important to the plot.
There is no evidence that Excalibur would be able to killer Berserker 12 times. In fact, Illya was hopeful that it would only be capable of taking five lives, so she didn't believe that it is hundreds of times more powerful than Berserker.

True Name Caliburn is explicitly stated to be as powerful as Excalibur (though it would shatter after using such power), so backscaling from Excalibur 100% works.

Caliburn and Excalibur are two different holy swords.
In a sense, Caliburn was prepared for the sake of rearing King Arthur as a king, a member of royalty.
Originally, Caliburn was meant for ceremonial use.
If it is employed in battle as a weapon and its True Name is released, firepower on the same scale as Excalibur will be displayed, but its blade will probably be unable to withstand Artoria's magical energy and break.

Sakura didn't know the details about Berserker's ability, and he only started reviving during the battle, so precisely calculating how many lives she needs to take is not possible.
 
I would just say far higher with NPs if there’s no other option and 7x isn’t agreed with.

That said, it’s only a temporary solution since we’re waiting for the movie for a new feat
 
LordGinSama said:
Killing someone 7x over isn't the same as being 7x stronger btw, it's an unquantifiable figure.
Click to expand...
It is.
When Rin blew off Berserker's head, she only killed him once. If she had five times more gems to use for the attack, she would've been able to take all of his six lives.

51-F11-12-113.jpg


Sounds perfectly quantifiable to me.
 
Once again, no killing someone 7 times over in a singular attack isn't the same as being 7 times as strong. We went over this in a previous thread which wasn't accepted. If you think otherwise make another CRT regarding the wiki standards because multipliers don't work like that.
 
You have yet to present an argument or address my refutation.
The x7 multiplier was being used before the forum move, in what way wasn't it accepted and can you reiterate the reasoning in this CRT so it can be discussed?
I don't see any conflict with the wiki's multiplier standard.
 
Multipliers need be directly stated, and no once again killing an opponent 7x over isn't a multiplier, staff members even rejected it. As for the Ren Jewl feat, the scan blatantly means if she used 5 more jewels he would have died again, which is simply 5 [ insert tier here ] attacks. Absolutely nothing here implies a legitimate multiplier, not that it matters since it's been rejected already.
 
LordGinSama said:
Multipliers need be directly stated, and no once again killing an opponent 7x over isn't a multiplier, staff members even rejected it. As for the Ren Jewl feat, the scan blatantly means if she used 5 more jewels he would have died again, which is simply 5 [ insert tier here ] attacks. Absolutely nothing here implies a legitimate multiplier, not that it matters since it's been rejected already.
Click to expand...
Still haven't responded to my request: The x7 multiplier (which is directly stated) was being used before the forum move (and thus it is already accepted by staff), in what way wasn't it accepted and can you reiterate the reasoning in this CRT so it can be discussed?
We are not talking about 'he stabbed him in the head and heart, so he killed him twice over', we are talking about the attack having seven times the energy needed to kill him.

It seems obvious from your statement that you:
  1. Failed to comprehend what the scan says
  2. Is unaware of how God's Hand works

It reads: "Berserker would have disappeared if you used five times the jewels you just used."
Rin used four jewels for her attack, which blew up Berserker's head and killed him once. (4 + 4 x 5 = 24). How are "5 more jewels" going to kill him five times?

God Hand makes Berserker highly resistant to whatever attack that injures him. So if an attack kills him, it will probably fail to kill him a second time even if it was a Noble Phantasm. Before there is a fifth injury he should be outright immune.
 
ShadowWhoWalks said:
God Hand makes Berserker highly resistant to whatever attack that injures him. So if an attack kills him, it will probably fail to kill him a second time even if it was a Noble Phantasm. Before there is a fifth injury he should be outright immune.
Click to expand...

To be fair, not even Nasu is certain how God Hand works, as be has ''changed'' how it works theoretically, but the change seems like a semantic change that wouldn't change the mechanics of the ability in anyway?
And then, there are examples of God Hand not working how it should, like in Salter fight.
 
TheUnshakableOne said:
Mordred threatens to bust up and obliterate a Mountain in Camelot [1] [2]
Maps of Camelot This is the unmarked map and this is the marked map

Additional Information for the maps
The distance from Ozy's Pyrmaid on the map to camelot is 100kilometers [3]
The fight takes place in the western village iirc?

I think violent frag, or pulv would be good for mordy?





Arash's NP can split the earth for 2,500 kilometers. [4][5][6]


Nitocris casually sustains a sandstorm that could last for days, weeks, months without end. The distance of it is from Ozy's pyrmaid to Dune's of Dawn
[7][8] [9]



Servant/Heroic Spirit Arjuna's NP in Fate/Extella Link has a cloud dispersion feat, and this is just the activation of the NP [10]


Excalibur Proto has some 6-C feats that should be looked at. The calcs are old, and who knows what has changed since then. [https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:KamiYasha/Prototype_Saber's_and_Gil's_Ap_and_Speed_Calc]



Paul Bunyan is a heroic spirit that scales to Teardrop photon ray [11] [12]

Paul supposedly can also
"Create the Mississippi river with a single blow of her axe"
"a blow from her fist can dig a hole from china"
"can shatter the entire rocky mountain range
[13]


Tesla's NP at full power (Though some believe this was boasting, or his NP is Dura Negation with no AP) [14]


Gawain leaving creating a crater in Last Encore from the canon bad end of the game Fate/Extra [15]


Spartacus in the Fate/Apoc manga created a crater with his NP tbh it looks lack luster but i truly don't know [16]


Santa Quetz NP is comparable to the asteriod that wiped out the dinosaurs [17]


This is rider quetz in babylon (though i beleive some said this is tier 2 quetz but im not sure) [18]


Servant Karna's NP is on par with scorching the earth (whatever that means) [19]



Forgot this one, but fergus lily drills an island up [20]
Click to expand...
What about the other stuff on this list minus the Arash one?
 
First of all, it was never a 7x Multiplier, I made it evidently clear that the number of lives that someone takes off Berserker at once is not linear with the multiplier, it’s a 5x Multiplier based off what Illya said, with 4 Jewels, Rin could one-shot Berserker, Illya says with 5x the amount of gems, Rin would be able to have taken out the rest of his lives in one shot, at the time, he had six lives left, that means 5x the amount of Mana she used to one-shot Berserker would have been able to kill him six times at once, therefore since Overloaded Caliburn was stated to have a power that killed Berserker seven times over, it would be stronger than the attack Illya suggested would be able to kill Berserker six times

If you don’t think 5x the Mana used at once means 5x the Attack Power, that’s one thing, but a 7x Multiplier is not being suggested and has no support at all
 
7x is only for Caliburn/Excalibur. Which was used less than a month ago, and approved in previous CRTs.
vsbattles.fandom.com

Caliburn (Fate/stay night)

Caliburn (カリバーン, Karibān) is the sword that King Arthur pulled from the stone to become king. While she wielded it for many years and favored it above all other weapons, it was destroyed in a battle where she broke the rules of chivalry, and replaced by the more famous Excalibur. Tier: High 6-C...
vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

The jewels were brought up due to Gin's claim that a multiplier is 'unquantifiable'.
Even if we go with the interpretation that Illya meant five times the gems = 6 lives, it would be linear multiplier if four gems is a slight 20% overkill. Illya in Tiger Dojo said that she is not sure that the weakened Excalibur Berserker deflected would be enough to take two lives, so there is a threshold.
 
TheUnshakableOne said:
Maps of Camelot This is the unmarked map and this is the marked map
Click to expand...
We dropped Chariot's Rhongo calc half in-part because the map wasn't usable for pixelscaling since landmarks and distance were comically smaller or larger than they should otherwise be.

Kind of annoying that a second calc using the same exact map was posted and instantly accepted.
 
Well there's plenty of calcs that need rechecked and a couple things that could be calc'ed

What supporting evidence is needed to help the map scaling?
 
Dargoo_Faust said:
We dropped Chariot's Rhongo calc half in-part because the map wasn't usable for pixelscaling since landmarks and distance were comically smaller or larger than they should otherwise be.

Kind of annoying that a second calc using the same exact map was posted and instantly accepted.
Click to expand...
Oof, didn't even know that was the reason the Rhongomyniad calc was being debated, sorry bout that

Well at least Clarent Blood Arthur would scale to 7-B via obliterating a mountain, since with our average mountain size and using either violent frag or pulverization, we get 7-B results
 
What about Servant Arjuna cloud dispersion from his NP?

Or the possible lack luster spartacus crater from fate/apoc?
 
Ok, this is what I have so far

A Ranked Anti-Unit NP's: Small City level+ (5.7 Megatons)
  • Based on Lancelot's Arondight matching and stalemating Numeral of the Saint Gawain, who is 3x stronger than Base Gawain
A+ Ranked Anti-Unit NP's: City level (9.5 Megatons)
  • Based on Overloaded Caliburn being stronger than an attack worth 5x the amount of gems Rin used to kill Berserker once
A+ Ranked Anti-Army NP's: City level (38.9 Megatons)
  • Based on pulverization of an average sized mountain
A+ Ranked Anti-Fortress NP's: Large Mountain level (1.1 Gigatons)
  • Based on Gray's Rongomyniad Calc

@Schnee_One @Dargoo_Faust @Dragonmasterxyz
How about this?
 
Schnee_One said:
Doesn’t Artoria lancer scale directly to it?
Click to expand...
Artoria Lancer's Rhongomyniad is Ranked as an A++ Anti-Fortress NP, while Gray's is an A+ Anti-Fortress NP, so her Rhongomyniad scales above Gray's Calc

As Ionliosite said, Lion King is a whole different ball game of scaling
 
Yeah I meant lion king

If she doesn’t scale to High 7A RIP to Nasuverse vs infamous matches, oh well.
 
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