Naruto to Boruto Discussion Thread

[Samlex1234]

Naw I’m not entirely discrediting him pulling it either, I think it’s a fine highball for the feat. But we do quantify the feat assuming it abides by irl physics (KE = 1/2 mv^2) so I find it slightly misleading when we pick and choose which physics we abide by and which physics we dismiss. If it doesn’t abide by irl physics, who’s to say we can quantify it using normal KE?

i understand your point. Balancing real-world physics with supernatural elements in a fictional world like the Naruto universe is tough. We use (KE = 1/2 mv^2) for estimates, but we also need to remember that some jutsu might not follow these rules. While ignoring real-world physics would make it hard to measure feats, we apply it where it makes sense and recognize its limitations in other contexts. (This is just my interpretation, and I'm fine with whether or not it's accepted widely).

 

[HelloThere1089]

I haven't gotten around to do that but the ai answer was confirming my proposal and the definition on Jisho says order of magnitude or by a digit as the primary meaning and ik that is not the ideal solution so I'll ask a friend who's got n1 certifications to confirm this

Do you agree with the other points?

The logic seems sound at the moment. But I am also not at home rn. I'd have to think about it more when I get back to my PC.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Am I the only one who is bugged by the fact In Character Kakashi refuses to utilize Rasengan?

His Raikiri is better (for him), that's probably why. He's had more time to refine it, master it, be more comfortable wielding it, etc. Probably also helps that Raiton is his natural affinity.

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

His Raikiri is better (for him), that's probably why. He's had more time to refine it, master it, be more comfortable wielding it, etc. Probably also helps that Raiton is his natural affinity.

Might be guilt or some shit stopping from using Rasengan

As for the Gates? Bro doesn't want to flex on Guy's whole schtick

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Was this statement used for upgrades before?

https://media.**********.net/attachments/1145761205022109816/1280194149454319636/IMG_8987.jpg?ex=66d73136&is=66d5dfb6&hm=b4c2472f07b1e2c0e9ec139c5a97b9e8a2a703ce77ba1ebfa01686f7fa989ee7&=&format=webp&width=2160&height=453

"In an instant, it's being reduced...! The power is an order of magnitude greater than Jigen's...!"

~ Boruto NNG #48

Supported by this and ChatGPT

Likely not literal

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Likely not literal

The Primary definitions are an order of magnitude tho?

if I'm not wrong, Bleach has a similar statement with cero oscuras that say the same thing you see on Jisho and the wiki accepts that as a 10x increase

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Likely not literal

as your scan says "it literally refers to a digit" hence it should be taken in a literal sense
plus i dont think there's other phrases to say order of magnitude since if i try translating that to JP we find the same phrase found in koji's statementhttps://media.**********.net/attachments/1130799805858324500/1280228589647691901/image.png?ex=66d75149&is=66d5ffc9&hm=a78e3953b04184f7c458d97189d90ce47e3c5d0eb6bad495a345e99767b575da&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=2160&height=910

and I know I shouldn't be talking about what the words mean as though I'm proficient but based on available resources this seems clearly to be a multiplicative statement

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

No way you linked google translate you goober

 

[Samlex1234]

The Primary definitions are an order of magnitude tho?

if I'm not wrong, Bleach has a similar statement with cero oscuras that say the same thing you see on Jisho and the wiki accepts that as a 10x increase

translation and interpretation:

解放状態にある十が使える (kaihō jōtai ni aru tō ga tsukaeru) means "can be used by Ten in a released state.

 

[NemesisZorX]

No way you linked google translate you goober

Google translate is man's best friend.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

No way you linked google translate you goober

Something is better than nothing lil bro

translation and interpretation:

解放状態にある十が使える (kaihō jōtai ni aru tō ga tsukaeru) means "can be used by Ten in a released state.

uhh okay

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Something is better than nothing lil bro

Not really providing incorrect information is worse than no info at all

 

[Samlex1234]

解放状態にある十が使える

I'm not sure too sure Ghost but I think reason the bleach one might have been accepted was because of the above.

 

[Deceived3596]

Incorrect information is in the eye of the beholder

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Cero Oscuras is a 10x AP amp cuz it’s stated to be 10x stronger than a normal Cero. Wholly irrelevant to the topic at hand.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

The Primary definitions are an order of magnitude tho?

if I'm not wrong, Bleach has a similar statement with cero oscuras that say the same thing you see on Jisho and the wiki accepts that as a 10x increase

Considering many definitions are just about it being a huge increase and Chat GPT says it's meant to be metaphorical, I'd say it's questionable at best

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Not really providing incorrect information is worse than no info at all

I don't think it is incorrect by default, if that phrase is the first thing that it shows when I demand a OOM statement then it means my initial premise is likely correct and I've supported this with an AI answer as well which should be able to put words together in a near accurate manner

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Machine learning isn’t AI agree to disagree tho, I don’t have much skin in the Isshiki = 10x Jigen debate anyway

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Considering many definitions are just about it being a huge increase and Chat GPT says it's meant to be metaphorical, I'd say it's questionable at best

Connotations exist, we use numeric phrases in non numeric contexts to imply a great change but that doesnt mean the word inherently cant mean a numeric answer,
X is infinitely stronger than Y can be just a vague superiority that's why the latter definitions list unimaginable because they can mean hyperbolic buffs

So in the absence of counter evidence the literal definition (off by a digit) should be taken

When trying to find JP counterparts for another level or unparalleled the same phrases don't show up so I think it should be treated as 10x (and again the same varying definitions show up for the ceros)

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

I don’t have much skin

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Cero Oscuras is a 10x AP amp cuz it’s stated to be 10x stronger than a normal Cero. Wholly irrelevant to the topic at hand.

Brother both of them say Keta Chigai no

if we accept 10x for Ulquiorra
we gotta accept 10x for Isshiki


https://media.**********.net/attachments/1145761205022109816/1280241037033345084/image.png?ex=66d75ce0&is=66d60b60&hm=4f4a64fb1177bf80a7f04a016a34de5ab6c391d4c52c7a1c6fa5e166a5c6ec8b&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=2160&height=501

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I didn’t contest the 10x translation. I contested it being in terms of Isshiki’s power contextually I just poked fun at you for using a translator that is notorious among Japanese language professors for being ass (at least according to my Japanese professor)

 

[Shadowbokunohero]

Deja vu

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

I didn’t contest the 10x translation. I contested it being in terms of Isshiki’s power contextually I just poked fun at you for using a translator that is notorious among Japanese language professors for being ass (at least according to my Japanese professor)

that's fine, I dropped the argument of it being AP based a while ago, IK machine translators suck I just used it in the absence of a human translator.

 

[HelloThere1089]

Even if we consider it a 10x speed amp. It would be a 10x amp on weakened Jigen right? Since that's the version KK fought. The statement is vague enough that it could be regular Jigen too, but low end would be 10x 10% Jigen.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Even if we consider it a 10x speed amp. It would be a 10x amp on weakened Jigen right? Since that's the version KK fought. The statement is vague enough that it could be regular Jigen too, but low end would be 10x 10% Jigen.

Yeah, and that would just make Isshiki's shrinking speed relative to FP Jigen's, which does make sense. It is a low-end interpretation, though, I'll grant that.

 

[HelloThere1089]

Yeah, and that would just make Isshiki's shrinking speed relative to FP Jigen's, which does make sense. It is a low-end interpretation, though, I'll grant that.

Yes. It would basically be at bare minimum 10x KK's speed.

 

[NemesisZorX]

Now that the Konoha thread is over, it's time to cook up the big planet Naruto. Honestly, I didn't want this thread to get approved, but it did in the end, so that's it.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Now that the Konoha thread is over, it's time to cook up the big planet Naruto. Honestly, I didn't want this thread to get approved, but it did in the end, so that's it.

That thread's result has absolutely no bearing on the planet's size whatsoever.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Even if we consider it a 10x speed amp. It would be a 10x amp on weakened Jigen right? Since that's the version KK fought. The statement is vague enough that it could be regular Jigen too, but low end would be 10x 10% Jigen.

I mean bald ass markless base jigen already is scaled to base boruto era naruto which is ftl

 

[HelloThere1089]

I mean bald ass markless base jigen already is scaled to base boruto era naruto which is ftl

Is bald ass markless base jigen stated to be < Karma Jigen at 10%?

 

[Nierre]

[bald ass markless base] jigen does not approve of this title

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

That thread's result has absolutely no bearing on the planet's size whatsoever.

How many times have you said this by now?

 

[NemesisZorX]

That thread's result has absolutely no bearing on the planet's size whatsoever.

I say this because I'm going to have to reanalyze some things, not that I'm going to use Konoha as an argument, in fact it's really annoying that Konoha is this size lol

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I will personally slam anyone who thinks the FoD Konoha upgrade makes the planet bigger

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Is bald ass markless base jigen stated to be < Karma Jigen at 10%?

Idk probably need to dive back to the kawaki arc , does 10% even mean anything other than stamina

Also the statement we use to get Jigen above MAS is by Koji which should mean Koji is aware of a Full Powered Jigen being superior to naruto and sasuke together
So that should remove the idea that it's only about 10% jigen

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

I will personally slam anyone

 

[HelloThere1089]

Idk probably need to dive back to the kawaki arc , does 10% even mean anything other than stamina

Also the statement we use to get Jigen above MAS is by Koji which should mean Koji is aware of a Full Powered Jigen being superior to naruto and sasuke together
So that should remove the idea that it's only about 10% jigen

I am not saying that KK is comparing Isshiki to 10% Jigen. I am saying at the bare minimum it would be that. You can very well make arguments for a solid "Isshiki is 10x 100% Jigen" scaling chain.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Connotations exist, we use numeric phrases in non numeric contexts to imply a great change but that doesnt mean the word inherently cant mean a numeric answer,
X is infinitely stronger than Y can be just a vague superiority that's why the latter definitions list unimaginable because they can mean hyperbolic buffs

Fair enough on this point

So in the absence of counter evidence the literal definition (off by a digit) should be taken

When trying to find JP counterparts for another level or unparalleled the same phrases don't show up so I think it should be treated as 10x (and again the same varying definitions show up for the ceros)

But Chat GPT is literally saying that the main meaning is metaphorical. To give an analogy of my own, saying something is done at lightning speed could be literal, but the general usage is metaphorical. I don't particularly have an issue with Isshiki being 10x above Jigen, I just don't think a strong basis can be made from one statement with multiple interpretations

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Fair enough on this point

But Chat GPT is literally saying that the main meaning is metaphorical. To give an analogy of my own, saying something is done at lightning speed could be literal, but the general usage is metaphorical. I don't particularly have an issue with Isshiki being 10x above Jigen, I just don't think a strong basis can be made from one statement with multiple interpretations

The definition straight up says digit difference

Is it used in non literal contexts? yes, but it is not limited to that, especially if this was sufficient to qualify for 10x claims on this wiki before

If it is a straight up definition I dont think scrutiny is warranted