Some Naruto and Boruto Stuff

[Nierre]

Hmm. I see what you mean now.

Well, I don't think the gap is actually that large, but that's irrelevant. There is one, even if I think it's marginal.
So, the way I see it, the best way forward is probably the following:

• Sasuke scales to Low 5-B physically overall. He's very clearly not a brick wall or anything like that, as he can physically harm those who can harm him. He gets a 'higher with Chidori', and the rest of his justification largely remains the same.
• Base Naruto downscales to 5-C+.

This way we don't have any circular scaling, but at the same time, we give Sasuke the rating he definitely deserves without making too many compromises.
Sound good, @Nierre?

UchihaSlayer96/Base Naruto Note

vsbattles.fandom.com

Here's my draft for the base Naruto note. You, Sparkle, and/or Tracer can feel free to edit the sandbox as you see fit if need be, idm.

This looks fine, but just a few questions:

1) If we're accepting that Sasuke held back in AP, does that mean we accept Sasuke holding back in speed? If so, then where does that put Base Naruto? Do we downscale him to SoL? If not, then why not?
2) I'm still not sure what justification to write for Sasuke's physicals (AP/SS), do we have any statements that say he's SPSM Naruto's equal?

@MinatoSparkle You probably have something lol

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

1) If we're accepting that Sasuke held back in AP, does that mean we accept Sasuke holding back in speed?

Yes.

If so, then where does that put Base Naruto? Do we downscale him to SoL? If not, then why not?

He'd downscale to baseline FTL. I'm pretty sure we only go to SoL if they're stated to be SoL explicitly.

2) I'm still not sure what justification to write for Sasuke's physicals (AP/SS), do we have any statements that say he's SPSM Naruto's equal?

Not as such (as far as I remember anyway), but there's a lot of instances where they attack in unison (showing relative speed), their ninjutsu matches each other's, and so on.
As for the justification, it's simple. Sasuke already has SPSM Naruto level durability via direct feats. His AP will scale to that level due to the fact that he's later shown to be capable of physically harming those who can harm him.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

@MinatoSparkle You probably have something lol

I'm a living scan machine, but even I can't pull out scans that don't exist unfortunately

 

[Nierre]

His AP will scale to that level due to the fact that he's later shown to be capable of physically harming those who can harm him.

You mean later like New Era? Can we do that?

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

You mean later like New Era? Can we do that?

Later as in, like, 15 chapters later lol.

But tbh, like, I'd argue yes we should be able to argue for that if those feats didn't exist. If Sasuke was never a brick wall character before, and he never became one after, I don't see why this version in particular should have durability millions of times above his physicals lmao.

 

[Nierre]

Later as in, like, 15 chapters later lol.

But tbh, like, I'd argue yes we should be able to argue for that if those feats didn't exist. If Sasuke was never a brick wall character before, and he never became one after, I don't see why this version in particular should have durability millions of times above his physicals lmao.

OHHH I get what ur saying now. lol im slow

Okay check it out:

Speed

Naruto (II)

Naruto's Six Paths key is... very much lacking. Naruto's base speed will downscale to 1.1c due to this. One thing you'll notice is that Naruto reaches FTL+ with Empowerment. That's because he blitzes Kaguya and the value for FTL is right on the cusp of FTL+, so upscaling should be acceptable:

"FTL (Clashed with Sasuke) (1.1c) (Chapter 694/695), higher with Six Paths Sage Mode (Intercepted Pre-Shinju Absorption Ten-Tails Jinchūriki Madara's Truth-Seeking Orb. Evaded Madara's Limbo and caught Madara with his senjutsu-enhanced lava-style Rasenshuriken) (4.56c) (Chapter 672/673), even higher with Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode (Traded blows with Post-Shinju Absorption Ten-Tails Jinchūriki Madara's Limbo clones with his own Shadow clones and prior to being overpowered, Naruto using his chakra arms was briefly able to clash against Kaguya's Yasogami Kuugeki. Sidestepped Kaguya's attempt to grab him, with both Black Zetsu and Kaguya commenting on his reflexes) (9.12c) (Chapter 676/680/683), FTL+ with Empowerment (Blitzed Kaguya after being enraged by Black Zetsu's comment on Obito) (10c) (Chapter 687)"

AP

Sasuke (II)

So, I have a few gripes with Sasuke's rating.

Firstly, not a fan of his Ninjutsu justification or rating. He doesn't harm Naruto nor does he press him. He doesn't press Naruto with Fireball Jutsu at all, he blocks it quite well. When tagged by Chidori, Naruto does yelp, but he takes virtually 0 damage. He has no bruises on his body afterwards and we see lightning come off his body, suggesting that the lightning effects are what he's reacting to in the scan. Of course one could argue that he regenerated it, but I doubt it considering even within the scan where he gets tagged, there is no bruise or injury to be seen.

Secondly, the Jutsu Sasuke uses to cut Madara isn't the Sword of Kusanagi: Chidori Katana, but rather the Chidori Eisō. He doesn't use his sword when he cuts Madara, when he does use his sword, you're able to see it

Now that I've established that his Ninjutsu justification shouldn't scale to KS6PM Naruto, what should his justification be? It should scale higher due to forcing Naruto to transform. His Chidori should be Small Planet level even higher for harming Madara, and his Chidori Spear should scale far higher for bisecting him. Sasuke has no other feats with his other Ninjutsu, his fireball gets blocked easily by Naruto, he never tries anything else but his Raiton against Madara. So we have no reason to scale his other Ninjutsu to that level (We do the same with kids from the New Era, as their AP sections are updated due to the UES CRT, for example characters like Sarada and Mitsuki have keys where specific chakra natures scale above the rest, specifically Raiton):

"Small Planet level physically (Much stronger due to acquiring Six Paths Chakra, likely half as strong as Ghost Hagaromo due to inheriting half of his power. His AP should be comparable to his durability as he's able to physically harm those can harm him) (Chapter 697/698), higher with Ninjutsu (Forced Naruto to enter Kurama Six Paths Sage Mode and block his Fireball Jutsu) (Chapter 696), even higher with Chidori (Harmed Post-Shinju Absorption Ten-Tails Jinchūriki Madara alongside Naruto. Sent Naruto flying and made him grimace in pain) (Chapter 674/696), far higher with Kusanagi no Tsurugi: Chidori Katana (Bisected Madara) (Chapter 674). (And then the rest follows)"

Naruto (II)

We've decided to add a note to Base Naruto's 5-C+ rating, explaining why we won't scale Base Naruto to Sasuke due to their clash. and the reasoning is here (Thanks to UchihaSlayer).

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

OHHH I get what ur saying now. lol im slow

Okay check it out:

Yep, all looks good to me now.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

I don't see why this version in particular should have durability millions of times above his physicals lmao.

It was stated in CFYOW

OHHH I get what ur saying now. lol im slow

Okay check it out:

Maybe write out a short justification for why he's not rated equal to Sasuke?

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

It was stated in CFYOW

Indeed, as are most things.

Maybe write out a short justification for why he's not rated equal to Sasuke?

The note we wrote up will be linked to his justification section to reduce clutter.

 

[Nierre]

Awesome thanks. I'll publish the changes shortly.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

The note we wrote up will be linked to his justification section to reduce clutter.

Riiiight, that was the whole point of the note you sent earlier that I contributed to. Logic.

Don't mind me, it's 4 and I'm tired

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Riiiight, that was the whole point of the note you sent earlier that I contributed to. Logic.

Don't mind me, it's 4 and I'm tired

All good, mate. Merry Christmas!

 

[MinatoSparkle]

All good, mate. Merry Christmas!

Merry Christmas!

 

[karo_senpaii]

Yes.

He'd downscale to baseline FTL. I'm pretty sure we only go to SoL if they're stated to be SoL explicitly.

Why not just scale a casual Sasuke and base Naruto to light fang?

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Why not just scale a casual Sasuke and base Naruto to light fang?

Why would we do that?

 

[karo_senpaii]

Why would we do that?

Even though sasuke is holding back I don't really see a reason for him to hold speed back. Plus i just think a casual sasuke would still have better speed than what Naruto could do without footing

 

[Testarossa002]

Why not just scale a casual Sasuke and base Naruto to light fang?

1. 1.2c isn't really different from 1.1c
2. The naruto that performed the feat not only had a massive stat boost from base. He also had a boost in Sensory abilities which he simply has 0 of in base