Goku Vs. Dialga

[FateAlbane]

Why would a neutral universe go "lol no time" when Dialga dies when even his Omnipresence was stated to be only within his own realm?

Already changed the place to a place he is known to actually be in Pokémon.

Can I be honest? I have no idea why you would give Dialga home field advantage when he supposedly has this many hax that could work on Goku given the chance to use them, but sure.

In which case Goku probably nukes him along with the realm and that's it.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

"Because Dialga is the concept of time itself"

If this was true, he would be a type 1 Abstract (which he doesn't have on his profile)

Which was taken away unfairly while I was on a break.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

It was via Roar of Time, the move Dialga spams the heck out of.

Literally never led with it in-character. Only time he used it was to savehis ass from Giratina and after a while against Arceus.

Are you seriously arguing that Dialga's signature move isn't in character?

 

[PaChi2]

Which was taken away unfairly while I was on a break.

Unfairly? UNFAIRLY?

 

[Dragopentling]

Already changed the place to a place he is known to actually be in Pokémon.
Can I be honest? I have no idea why you would give Dialga home field advantage when he supposedly has this many hax that could work on Goku given the chance to use them, but sure.

In which case Goku probably nukes him along with the realm and that's it.

How does he nuke it, exactly?

 

[Kepekley23]

> Are you seriously arguing that Dialga's signature move isn't in character?

Okay, so you can't provide any examples where it is in character.

 

[FateAlbane]

Because Dialga is the concept of time itself, omnipresent or not. And it's not OoC for Dialga to do all that stuff. It's in fact wholly in character.

He doesn't have Type 1. And that was added in such a rushed way in the middle of a thread that wasn't even for an upgrade (so, sort of camouflaged), I'm somewhat surprised that it wasn't taken away before actually.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Use common sense, man. This isn't even me trying to be rude or anything. Legit use common sense.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

"Four, Roar of Time in general being the signature move of Dialga"

So by this logic does every Pokémon with a signature move start with that move? Like Arceus with Judgement, the Pikachu line with Volt Tackle, and Darkrai with Dark Void?

 

[Wokistan]

Roar of time being its signature move does imply that it gets quite a bit of usage. Whether it's always going to be the first is indeterminate, but there are definitely plausible scenarios where that's a thing that comes out real fast.

@Dragon Goku can nuke it via AP.

 

[Kepekley23]

Nobody is denying that he will use Roar of Time. What everyone is denying is that he will start with it.

There are exactly zero examples.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

"Four, Roar of Time in general being the signature move of Dialga"

So by this logic does every Pokémon with a signature move start with that move? Like Arceus with Judgement, the Pikachu line with Volt Tackle, and Darkrai with Dark Void?

Yes. Darkrai spams the crap out of Dark Void. Lucario spams Aura Sphere. Primal Kyogre spams Origin Pulse.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

I don't mean if they use the move a lot but if that's the first move they use.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

He doesn't have Type 1. And that was added in such a rushed way in the middle of a thread that wasn't even for an upgrade (so, sort of camouflaged), I'm somewhat surprised that it wasn't taken away before actually.

There are dozens of threads where things are decided in GD threads or CRTs that are of a different topic. Heck, Goku's current AP comes from a Q&A.

 

[Dragopentling]

Arceus literally started out wrecking havoc with Judgment the moment he showed up out of the portal in the movie.

 

[EmperorRorepmeThree]

...Don't mention the movie.

 

[PaChi2]

He doesn't have Type 1. And that was added in such a rushed way in the middle of a thread that wasn't even for an upgrade (so, sort of camouflaged), I'm somewhat surprised that it wasn't taken away before actually.

Tbh, I read the Demigra vs Dialga thread. I saw the Abstract Type 1 discussion and my thought of process was:

1. Okay, let's see the CRT, Im surprised I hadnt seen it.

2. Look for the CRT.

3. No CRT.

4. Look in the Arceus downgrade CRT.

5. Bingo.

6. Create the other thread. I was kinda annoyed tbh.

 

[Dragopentling]

Arceus literally started out wrecking havoc with Judgment the moment he showed up out of the portal in the movie.

Oh yea, there's also Deoxys with Psycho Boost

 

[Kepekley23]

Arceus literally started out wrecking havoc with Judgment the moment he showed up out of the portal in the movie.

Arceus has feats. Dialga doesn't.

But hey, if we want to bring up other Pokémon, I sure remember Charizard spamming Blast Burn in the second his fights started.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@Everyone. Literally everything related to Dialga talks about time. Every plotline involving Dialga has time involved in it. Dialga's powers revolve around time. Every bit of lore about Dialga has to do with time. Dia'ga's signature move is time. Dialga has abused its temporal powers before. Dia'ga is the embodiment of time itself.

Clearly Dialga leads with Scratch.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Arceus has feats. Dialga doesn't.

But hey, if we want to bring up other Pokémon, I sure remember Charizard spamming Blast Burn in the second his fights started.

I sure remember Charizard knowing Blast Burn.

 

[Kepekley23]

> Bunch of unrelated stuff, no scans.

Bingo.

 

[RotofBots]

"There are dozens of threads where things are decided in GD threads or CRTs that are of a different topic. Heck, Goku's current AP comes from a Q&A."

Sorry but that's different. Their type 1 was added in a thread titled "Arceus Omnipresence Downgrade" over 80 posts into the thread.

 

[Kepekley23]

Arceus has feats. Dialga doesn't.

But hey, if we want to bring up other Pokémon, I sure remember Charizard spamming Blast Burn in the second his fights started.

I sure remember Charizard knowing Blast Burn.

Blue's Charizard definitely knew Blast Burn.

 

[FateAlbane]

There are dozens of threads where things are decided in GD threads or CRTs that are of a different topic. Heck, Goku's current AP comes from a Q&A.

Two wrongs don't make a right. Whether or not something was wrongly added for another character or not, it doesn't change that Type 1 for Dialga was rushed and poorly discussed, as many people who would have otherwise provided an opinion if a proper thread was made didn't have a chance to because again, said revision was "camouflaged" under a completely different thread title.

I find it right that it was revised and removed based on people taking said power and re-evaluating. If you disagree, you can try and put it back on the profile, then I'll accept that argument. Until then pointing X or Y character who got one or another power doesn't help the CT's case.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Because again, I'm using common sense.

 

[Dragopentling]

> Bunch of unrelated stuff, no scans.

Bingo.

Bingo what?

You didn't see the respect threads?

 

[Kepekley23]

Because again, I'm using common sense.

Sow me Dialga leading with Roar of Time, please.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

If you disagree, you can try and put it back on the profile, then I'll accept that argument.

This would involve me doing something major on the site, and I plan for this to be the last thing I participate in.

 

[Dragopentling]

Sow me Dialga leading with Roar of Time, please.

Show us Goku leading off with his own signature move, to make it fair.

 

[Kepekley23]

> Show us Goku leading off with his own signature move, to make it fair.

That's a strawman because I'm not saying Goku will instantly Kamehameha Dialga. I'm replying to an argument that I find flawed.

 

[PaChi2]

Sow me Dialga leading with Roar of Time, please.

Dialga vs Palkia movie, first scene. They were spamming their moves iirc.

 

[Wokistan]

Not going to participate,

gg kep

He's arguing for Goku one shotting with anything though, not his signature. AP is still relevant in tier 2, and Goku has a lot of it.

 

[PaChi2]

Sow me Dialga leading with Roar of Time, please.

Show us Goku leading off with his own signature move, to make it fair.

Base Goku vs Jiren.

 

[Bobsican]

Because again, I'm using common sense.

Cal, we can´t extrapolate powers without enought evidence.

If we could, nobody would have complained about my Barney being haxed, for example.

In other words, please show some scans, and ths comes from someone that supports your ideas in this case.

 

[Dragopentling]

> Show us Goku leading off with his own signature move, to make it fair.

That's a strawman because I'm not saying Goku will instantly Kamehameha Dialga. I'm replying to an argument that I find flawed.

It's not a strawman. Also, Dialga doesn't need to spam RoT to win. He can just do the timelock thing like he did against Giratina. You can keep agreeing about Goku's resistances to time manipulation, but I see that Goku only has Type 1 Acausality....that's not half close to stopping Dialga from time-screwing him.

 

[FateAlbane]

"Why would Goku even need a Signature move" is the actual question when nearly everything he does can oneshot as he has the AP and range for that.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

Drago, you're asking for Kep to show you Goku starting with his signature move to make it fair. The problem is, Kep isnt saying Goku will start with his signature so I don't know why that's relevant.

 

[Dragopentling]

Drago, you're asking for Kep to show you Goku starting with his signature move to make it fair. The problem is, Kep isnt saying Goku will start with his signature so I don't know why that's relevant.

Well he did ask for Dialga's case, tbf.

 

[FateAlbane]

Also just in case this point still wasn't made across: Few are arguing that Goku resists Dialga's hax. What they're arguing is that Goku is more likely to kill it first or before said hax happens. That's it.

That's why even Kep who didn't cast a vote mentioned a strawman at play.

I'd be glad if people stopped acting like VS Matches are only supposed to be voted if X character 100% nopes everything the other side has.

One side or another being more or less likely to win based on advantages and disadvantages is what makes threads possible in the first place. If Goku was supposed to nope everything Dialga has in order to win or vice-versa this thread wouldn't even happen since in that case it would simply be a stomp.