XenoGoku vs WebNovel Rimuru (Reopened)

[Jozaysmith?]

This is a stomp i am voting for the slime

 

[Braking]

goku combat speed isn't even FTL maybe ultra instinct later is but meh rimuru combat speed wayyyyyy better

i think you forgot the ? at the end there again

 

[ImmortalDread]

i think you forgot the ? at the end there again

Leave him.

 

[Braking]

Velzard, a character from Tensura

 

[Dereck03]

This is a stomp i am voting for the slime

If this was a stomp then votes are not counted tho

 

[ImmortalDread]

If this was a stomp then votes are not counted tho

Fr

 

[ImmortalDread]

But it is not stomp, I will wait for more inputs tho.

 

[Ss3micah]

@Dread and @Starfeldway

Not sure if your both are intentionally or unintentionally spreading misinformation about Arale (I’ll assume you had no intent on doing so and are just going off the little information you have) but clearly your both misunderstanding a few things.

I’m honestly not hear to debate because I’m currently overwhelmed with too many projects, calcs and upgrades I have in store for some of my favorite verses plus I’m also working IRL so I lack the time to debate nowadays.

But just to make a a few truths clear, after my work is done, I’ll be making a short summary post to clear up whatever misgivings and misunderstandings you made have as well as briefly address the Concern of the Canonicity situation.

Also my post will have no impact, influence or change on how this debate goes.

 

[ImmortalDread]

@Dread and @Starfeldway

Not sure if your both are intentionally or unintentionally spreading misinformation about Arale (I’ll assume you had no intent on doing so and are just going off the little information you have) but clearly your both misunderstanding a few things.

I’m honestly not hear to debate because I’m currently overwhelmed with too many projects, calcs and upgrades I have in store for some of my favorite verses plus I’m also working IRL so I lack the time to debate nowadays.

But just to make a a few truths clear, after my work is done, I’ll be making a short summary post to clear up whatever misgivings and misunderstandings you made have as well as briefly address the Concern of the Canonicity situation.

Also my post will have no impact, influence or change on how this debate goes.

I talked about Arale? I wonder tho.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Unless you mean about the issue of the canonicity status, it was not misinformation, I asked many supporters, and they all said Xeno Goku does not summon her, rather it is CC Goku, one of supporters confirmed it here.

So I can guarantee you that I did not talk about Arale functions at all.

 

[Ss3micah]

Unless you mean about the issue of the canonicity status, it was not misinformation, I asked many supporters, and they all said Xeno Goku does not summon her, rather it is CC Goku, one of supporters confirmed it here.

So I can guarantee you that I did not talk about Arale functions at all.

Lololol
Relax Dread
This is not an attack lol
I just want to clear the air a bit is all and answer any questions you (and others) may have

 

[Braking]

Lololol
Relax Dread
This is not an attack lol
I just want to clear the air a bit is all and answer any questions you (and others) may have

Those emojis have boiling blood in em becareful

 

[Ss3micah]

CC goku can summon arale, xeno goku cannot iirc

#1
This is True
CC Goku alone can summon Arale and by extension CC Vegito and Gogeta. Xeno Goku can't summon her directly so Arale should likely have no influence nor factorization on this battle. The only way you could argue Xeno Goku gets Arale out is by summoning CC Goku first (which he can do) then have CC Goku summon Arale. But other than that, Xenoku can't summon Arale himself

Tori-Bot will be Low 1-C if his profile gets made

People are making his profile btw

#2
This is True
I as well as others are personally overseeing the creation and proper structuring of the profile, complete with scans and proper sourcing. It is however taking time because there is alot of content to comb through. On top of that I am also working on proper and accurate calcs and upgrades which I will I tell you nothing about for now because I don't do spoilers
(actually I could ask for Dread's opinion on some of the Upgrades I had in mind since she knows alot about certain hax I'm tackling)

Well the plot manipulation on arale isn't even clear and I think the current thread for goku downgrade can cover that..if not..
would you think arale can do anything to kill rimuru or its an incon to me it's an incon ill wait for your input
my reason is
1. HGR nothing attached as in he doesn't need any thing to regenerate his body from uter destruction also can her plot manipulation work on imaginary space? uh well if it does which it would then wouldn't rimuru....nihility barrier do something against that or maybe
if arale says "turn null is useless" then ig that's the only way..
or is arale even a valid summon to goku tho lol
and arale plot manipulation is 4D so ig non existent 4D won't be affected

Her plot manipulation only altered 4D structure as far as I am concerned. Also, correct if I am wrong, is she included?

#3
These are false
As I said before I will keep my points brief. Arale's plot manipulation is 5-D (Low 1-C). We have been through this already. As for why that is so its because in a nutshell, not only can she completely manipulate the narrative if her own world, but she is capable of creating stories/worlds similarly to the Author Avatars. She also scales to the Author Avatars (who essentially 5-D beings) capable of manipulating stories/worlds on a whim and can even hax/manipulate the Author Avatar world itself (which is a 5-D world) as well as capable of haxing other Author Avatars (who are also 5-D beings).

I don't think it is his first move. Also, I think the reason we don't use Arale's summoning is because of canonicity questions
Unless they've been settled, and I'm not aware of it

#4
The Canonicity questions were already addressed. There is a note on Arale's profile which clearly outlines that Dr. Slump events scale to Dr. Slump cast that appeared in DB and Dr. Slump cast from DBS upscales from Dr. Slump cast from DB (unless you wanna argue that DB is no longer canon to DBS). DBH Arale (the summon) is an iteration of Arale from DBS. Because she is a Summon and follows the UNIVERSAL GAME LOGIC of RPG summons only showing up to use one attack and then bouncing, she doesnt use Plot Hax or any other hax for that matter in DBH proper. But because VSB disregards the UNIVERSAL RPG SUMMONING GAME MECHANIC of Summons just only being capable of doing one shit and leaving, there is no reason why Summon Arale would not be able to use Plot Hax and her other hax when DBH arale is just an iteration of DBS Arale who experienced the Events of DB and Dr. Slump.

#5
The Cosmology is the real issue here. I have compiled a long list of evidence that could easily prove that Dr. Slump and DB share the same cosmology. The problem I have is that I dont want to go through with it. Why? Because while you have some Doves out there that may welcome the idea of DB having a Tier 1 cosmology, there are Vultures out there that hate the idea of DB having a Tier 1 cosmology EVEN IF ABSOLUTELY NO DB CHARACTER CAN EVER SCALE TO IT. Because of that I am reworking my cosmology blog to make the Cosmology of DB canon to Dr. Slump which I can easily prove but not make Dr. Slumps Cosmology Canon to DB. I could do so but I really dont want to deal with Vultures so Im gonna refrain from doing so. Because you should know more than I that even if the logic is flawless... if some people cant accept it they will debate and debunk it to hell with half-baked reasons that they hope just stick

 

[Ss3micah]

Those emojis have boiling blood in em becareful

On the Contrary
I have the outmost respect for Dread
I mean she and her crew did the unimaginable and got MG up to Tier 1 Finally
Im proud of her and all the MG community for trying so hard and finally achieving the unthinkable

Plus I tend to browse her CTRS from Time to Time
She always have interesting ideas that I try to emulate lolol

 

[Peak]

On the Contrary
I have the outmost respect for Dread
I mean she and her crew did the unimaginable and got MG up to Tier 1 Finally
Im proud of her and all the MG community for trying so hard and finally achieving the unthinkable

Plus I tend to browse her CTRS from Time to Time
She always have interesting ideas that I try to emulate lolol

I thought it was cute

 

[Quantu]

Good luck with everything, Micah

 

[ImmortalDread]

On the Contrary
I have the outmost respect for Dread
I mean she and her crew did the unimaginable and got MG up to Tier 1 Finally
Im proud of her and all the MG community for trying so hard and finally achieving the unthinkable

Plus I tend to browse her CTRS from Time to Time
She always have interesting ideas that I try to emulate lolol

Thanks for the compliment

 

[ImmortalDread]

Also thanks for the information, seems my mistake from my side.

 

[Tempestdragon6]

Rimuru fra layered time stop and ae 1

 

[Ss3micah]

I thought it was cute

Lololol

Good luck with everything, Micah

Lolol, THANK YOU!!!

Thanks for the compliment

WELX!!!!

Also thanks for the information, seems my mistake from my side.

NO PROBS!!!

 

[ImmortalDread]

Also I felt cute while reading ur message

 

[Shiraito983]

rims take this.

 

[Starfeldway]

Also I felt cute while reading ur message

disagree with this opinion,feel cute when am the one...

 

[Starfeldway]

#1
This is True
CC Goku alone can summon Arale and by extension CC Vegito and Gogeta. Xeno Goku can't summon her directly so Arale should likely have no influence nor factorization on this battle. The only way you could argue Xeno Goku gets Arale out is by summoning CC Goku first (which he can do) then have CC Goku summon Arale. But other than that, Xenoku can't summon Arale himself



#2
This is True
I as well as others are personally overseeing the creation and proper structuring of the profile, complete with scans and proper sourcing. It is however taking time because there is alot of content to comb through. On top of that I am also working on proper and accurate calcs and upgrades which I will I tell you nothing about for now because I don't do spoilers
(actually I could ask for Dread's opinion on some of the Upgrades I had in mind since she knows alot about certain hax I'm tackling)



#3
These are false
As I said before I will keep my points brief. Arale's plot manipulation is 5-D (Low 1-C). We have been through this already. As for why that is so its because in a nutshell, not only can she completely manipulate the narrative if her own world, but she is capable of creating stories/worlds similarly to the Author Avatars. She also scales to the Author Avatars (who essentially 5-D beings) capable of manipulating stories/worlds on a whim and can even hax/manipulate the Author Avatar world itself (which is a 5-D world) as well as capable of haxing other Author Avatars (who are also 5-D beings).


#4
The Canonicity questions were already addressed. There is a note on Arale's profile which clearly outlines that Dr. Slump events scale to Dr. Slump cast that appeared in DB and Dr. Slump cast from DBS upscales from Dr. Slump cast from DB (unless you wanna argue that DB is no longer canon to DBS). DBH Arale (the summon) is an iteration of Arale from DBS. Because she is a Summon and follows the UNIVERSAL GAME LOGIC of RPG summons only showing up to use one attack and then bouncing, she doesnt use Plot Hax or any other hax for that matter in DBH proper. But because VSB disregards the UNIVERSAL RPG SUMMONING GAME MECHANIC of Summons just only being capable of doing one shit and leaving, there is no reason why Summon Arale would not be able to use Plot Hax and her other hax when DBH arale is just an iteration of DBS Arale who experienced the Events of DB and Dr. Slump.

#5
The Cosmology is the real issue here. I have compiled a long list of evidence that could easily prove that Dr. Slump and DB share the same cosmology. The problem I have is that I dont want to go through with it. Why? Because while you have some Doves out there that may welcome the idea of DB having a Tier 1 cosmology, there are Vultures out there that hate the idea of DB having a Tier 1 cosmology EVEN IF ABSOLUTELY NO DB CHARACTER CAN EVER SCALE TO IT. Because of that I am reworking my cosmology blog to make the Cosmology of DB canon to Dr. Slump which I can easily prove but not make Dr. Slumps Cosmology Canon to DB. I could do so but I really dont want to deal with Vultures so Im gonna refrain from doing so. Because you should know more than I that even if the logic is flawless... if some people cant accept it they will debate and debunk it to hell with half-baked reasons that they hope just stick

so I see,what's your output on this then

 

[Ss3micah]

so I see,what's your output on this then

Well I did said I would not debate in this match....
(Mainly cause DBH is under revision (AGAIN) and I would prefer to wait for the revision to be over so I can know what I am working with definitively)

But I suppose another reason I would not like to debate yet is because as Dread said.... Rimuru has been through some upgrades and frankly I dont know what they are so I dont what Im explicitly debating against. I'd like to know Rimuru's power house Skill and Ability Set before debating

All in All, this Matchup just came at a bad time when all DBH supporters focus has to be elsewhere while also not knowing what Spinach Rimuru has been eating to get so buff

 

[Starfeldway]

Well I did said I would not debate in this match....
(Mainly cause DBH is under revision (AGAIN) and I would prefer to wait for the revision to be over so I can know what I am working with definitively)

But I suppose another reason I would not like to debate yet is because as Dread said.... Rimuru has been through some upgrades and frankly I dont know what they are so I dont what Im explicitly debating against. I'd like to know Rimuru's power house Skill and Ability Set before debating

All in All, this Matchup just came at a bad time when all DBH supporters focus has to be elsewhere while also not knowing what Spinach Rimuru has been eating to get so buff

@Dread have the op so as not to stress it I'll post it myself
here is for his ae1 based on concept
4D higher degree acasuality type 4transduality
non existent physiology
this doesn't matter in the fight but uhmm tier 2-A ap and range
well they are other arguments and other upgrades something like resistance to 4D destruction which his transduality covers already and more

 

[Starfeldway]

this fight seems boring....
any goku supporter here....?? @Dread
sorry for tagging wanted to know if you know anything about the argument

I should tag admins

 

[Quantu]

They won't get a notification

 

[Starfeldway]

They won't get a notification

how lovely

 

[Quantu]

Anyways Goku can't interact with AE1 Rimuru, I see no reason why this shouldn't be closed

 

[Ss3micah]

@Dread have the op so as not to stress it I'll post it myself
here is for his ae1 based on concept
4D higher degree acasuality type 4transduality
non existent physiology
this doesn't matter in the fight but uhmm tier 2-A ap and range
well they are other arguments and other upgrades something like resistance to 4D destruction which his transduality covers already and more

Lol Sorry I was asleep lol

But yeah Concept Based AE1 is gonna be a problem since Xenoku can’t interact with that as far as I’m aware

Not sure what purpose a Higher Degree of Acausality Type 4 serves especially since Acausal 4 is subjective to what the Acausality is based around. Like Demons from SMT have regular Acausal Type 4 but their reasons for having it completely ***** on Rimuru’s “Higher Degree” justifications. So again not sure what a higher degree will achieve here but I suppose it is note worthy

I’ll be honest, I’m not sure what perks Trans Type 1 would give and more so what these perks would add to rimuru. According to what I have heard it would make him immune/resistant to the dual systems that he has Transcended over. Not sure what those are for Rimuru but it’s OP none the less

NEP 1 can be countered by TP users so he could potentially summon one to own Rimuru…POTENTIALLY

Pretty sure Goku is higher into 2-A than Rimuru (as of the writing of this message)

But yeah that Concept based AE1 means Goku ain’t interacting with Rimuru and since TP lost Concept Hax then summons won’t do anything either. The only one who could actually smack Rimuru even with all his shit is Arale as per the new rules all state of existences (wether abstract, transdual or Nonexistence) is limited by Dimensionality so higher D Hax would still clap him. But I won’t make this an Arale vs Rimuru debate

Case and Point Rimuru wins if not for AE then for other reasons I could name

 

[Ss3micah]

And if I’m saying this then your not gonna get any other DBH supporters to say otherwise

anyways this match can be closed now

 

[Peak]

Not sure what purpose a Higher Degree of Acausality Type 4 serves especially since Acausal 4 is subjective to what the Acausality is based around. Like Demons from SMT have regular Acausal Type 4 but their reasons for having it completely ***** on Rimuru’s “Higher Degree” justifications. So again not sure what a higher degree will achieve here but I suppose it is note worthy

you can find more details in this thread about larger time stop and acausality 4

I’ll be honest, I’m not sure what perks Trans Type 1 would give and more so what these perks would add to rimuru. According to what I have heard it would make him immune/resistant to the dual systems that he has Transcended over. Not sure what those are for Rimuru but it’s OP none the less

Yeah, Rimuru's transduality makes him immune to things like information(type 2), time, space, concept (type 1), fire, water, life, death, light and darkness (I think that's it for now)

Pretty sure Goku is higher into 2-A than Rimuru (as of the writing of this message)

For sure, Goku is much stronger and much faster than Rimuru, in fact the AP is not even applicable to combat

The only one who could actually smack Rimuru even with all his shit is Arale as per the new rules all state of existences (wether abstract, transdual or Nonexistence) is limited by Dimensionality so higher D Hax would still clap him. But I won’t make this an Arale vs Rimuru debate

I agree, but I think Rimuru can activate the layered time stop before Xeno Goku summons CC Goku who finally summons Arale, otherwise Rimuru has nothing against plot manipulation

And if I’m saying this then your not gonna get any other DBH supporters to say otherwise

anyways this match can be closed now

Thank you for your help

actually I was waiting for you since you are one of the biggest connoisseurs of DBH

 

[ImmortalDread]

Me too, I waited for you as well

 

[ImmortalDread]

@Ottavio_Merluzzo Do you also think Goku has no chance to win this due to AE type 1?

 

[Ottavio_Merluzzo]

@Ottavio_Merluzzo Do you also think Goku has no chance to win this due to AE type 1?

Yeah, since he can't interact with it.

 

[ImmortalDread]

Alright guys. So basically it is a stomp in favor for Rimuru Web Novel. The match is removed (previous one).

 

[Starfeldway]

Lol Sorry I was asleep lol

But yeah Concept Based AE1 is gonna be a problem since Xenoku can’t interact with that as far as I’m aware

Not sure what purpose a Higher Degree of Acausality Type 4 serves especially since Acausal 4 is subjective to what the Acausality is based around. Like Demons from SMT have regular Acausal Type 4 but their reasons for having it completely ***** on Rimuru’s “Higher Degree” justifications. So again not sure what a higher degree will achieve here but I suppose it is note worthy

I’ll be honest, I’m not sure what perks Trans Type 1 would give and more so what these perks would add to rimuru. According to what I have heard it would make him immune/resistant to the dual systems that he has Transcended over. Not sure what those are for Rimuru but it’s OP none the less

NEP 1 can be countered by TP users so he could potentially summon one to own Rimuru…POTENTIALLY

Pretty sure Goku is higher into 2-A than Rimuru (as of the writing of this message)

But yeah that Concept based AE1 means Goku ain’t interacting with Rimuru and since TP lost Concept Hax then summons won’t do anything either. The only one who could actually smack Rimuru even with all his shit is Arale as per the new rules all state of existences (wether abstract, transdual or Nonexistence) is limited by Dimensionality so higher D Hax would still clap him. But I won’t make this an Arale vs Rimuru debate

Case and Point Rimuru wins if not for AE then for other reasons I could name

what's tp
ultimate skill users are 4D in ap reasons is gluttony king being able to devour the concept of time
rimuru gained higher level immunity due to void god
and rimuru naturally resist void god azatoth
so that's like 3 layered acca4
there's more reason all the note tho... for his transduality type 1
things such as time and space manipulation,darkness and light manipulation,destruction and information manipulation and other stuff can't affect him or can't work due to nature and not resistance like a skill issue
his non existent physiology is based on nothingness created everything and existed before everything he can use that as energy supply for his body which was said he extract straight out of nothing
turn null also is like primodial shit that can create even god skills so like this is another layered 4D forgive me if this rubbish
the note to why goku can't affect rimuru is he can't affect abstractions themselves which are abstract ideas
I think his nep1....kinna is useful in this since nothingness is more...
Well not gonna keep talking about this I agree on your output and consider mine let me hear more
also this thread can be closed if everyone here agrees to rimuru wining

 

[Starfeldway]

Alright guys. So basically it is a stomp in favor for Rimuru Web Novel. The match is removed (previous one).

you can close thread then?
and update the win

 

[ImmortalDread]

Will do (I will update it in my thread, but it won't be added in the matches because it stomp)