Deleted member 2530
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Darkseid has defiled the world in a way that The Darkest was never able to. I am not sure how Darkseid is better in any way.
They can. Wonderwoman in JLD is a recent and popular example. Superman formed the Authority too.
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General DC Comics Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Confluctor
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- dc comics
Vondoom
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I've always thought killing is the most evil thing to do especially when you plan to do so to entire realities.
Most evil in DC comics my opinion(based on what they've done or plan to do):
-Darkseid
-TDK
-Mandrakk
-Perpetua/Anti monitor
I'm inclined to add to the joker or Eobard thawne to the list
Deleted member 2530
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I mean Darkseid does killings too but he is also running a torture camp. I mean just look at Final Crisis itself. The worlds are being smashed but evil is spreading too. He is stripping people of their freedom and turning them into an empty husk of evil and depravity. The others are evil for their goal of annihilation whereas Darkseid is evil because in his world there is no hope or happiness. It also comes down to readers' perception and the portrayal of characters I guess. For example, its really hard to pin down the likes of Mandrakk or Perpetua because they aren't that different than any other villains aside from sense of scale.
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Yes, I consider Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Mao Zedong, Xi Jinping, and Kim Jong Un, who are some of the closest real world counterparts to Darkseid that I can think of, given that they run or have run a massive number of absolutely nightmarish enslavement and genocide gulags, as far worse than generic mentally ill nihilists who want everything to end, to use the closest real world inspirations for each concept.
However, it should be noted that Darkseid is the philosophy of each of the named real world embodiments of absolute evil taken to its ultimate extreme, so he is technically conceptually even worse than all of them, although he is obviously still just a fictional character.
However, it should be noted that Darkseid is the philosophy of each of the named real world embodiments of absolute evil taken to its ultimate extreme, so he is technically conceptually even worse than all of them, although he is obviously still just a fictional character.
ShionAH
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Bumping this
Excellence616
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Vondoom
Username Only- 395
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Shouldn't the Green lantern weapon page have a 2-C possibly 2-A key like Kyle rayner, Hal Jordan, sodam yat e.t.c?
It should be updated
It should be updated
Vondoom
Username Only- 395
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Shouldn't it be unlocked and updated?
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Not that I disagree, but aren't Kyle and Sodam Yat's ratings for as Ion, and Hal's are for his own special GL ring while becoming Raw Willpower?
Vondoom
Username Only- 395
- 131
Kyle rayner as ion uses a green lantern ring, no?
Sodam yat is comparable to superboy prime so that's how he got his 2-C possibly 2-A and he uses a lantern ring
Hal Jordan is comparable to Pre-crisis superman so 2-C possibly 2-A and second key via Raw willpower was also with the ring
Hal Jordan ring was made by his willpower dosen't still refute the fact it's still a lantern ring and these guys feats come from lantern rings also.
Sodam yat is comparable to superboy prime so that's how he got his 2-C possibly 2-A and he uses a lantern ring
Hal Jordan is comparable to Pre-crisis superman so 2-C possibly 2-A and second key via Raw willpower was also with the ring
Hal Jordan ring was made by his willpower dosen't still refute the fact it's still a lantern ring and these guys feats come from lantern rings also.
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The first time he was Ion I don't think he had a ring, the second time I'm not sure. Either way though it's the GL Ring's power amplified by Ion's power, not really something that should be attributed to the GL rings.
This is totally a fair point, we already do have standard GL users in this range for Pre Crisis, so it definitely should be mentioned on the page.
The fact that it's a special ring makes it hard to let other rings scale off it. Kyle could barely even handle using Hal's ring.
Hal also doesn't need his ring to become Raw Willpower, he was already doing that when he only had Krona's Gauntlet, so that's also not contingent off the ring.
Vondoom
Username Only- 395
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Not saying all rings have that power but can reach such power for the rings themselves has nothing to do with characters who use it as it varies between them and their willpower
Thank you
It's about the level the Green lantern power ring can reach obviously not all ring users reach absurd high levels in power, Hal dosen't need it but Krona gauntlet as stated in those books has the power of 8 lantern rings iirc and when Hal fought parallax sinestro he was using a single ring when he became willpower, this shows his power increases via the lantern ring that's the point it means lantern rings can reach absurd levels by extreme willpower not anyone can reach such levels, it needs to be indicated that characters reach such level by the rings so 2-C possibly 2-A needs to be mentioned for obvious reasons not like Hal Jordan can reach such level with anything connected to the power rings.
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That's an external sort of thing though, like if the Presence put on a GL ring we wouldn't just slap on tier 1 to the GL ring page.
There can be arguments for the strongest GLs scaling/downscaling from the entities, but that's a pretty separate topic.
The Gauntlet was equal to 12 rings, but I get the point. Hal's ring still makes it a bit of an odd case since it's not really comparable to any other GL power ring, but other rings shouldn't be infinitely weaker either, so I don't mind 2-C, possibly 2-A for higher levels of Willpower.
Vondoom
Username Only- 395
- 131
Yeah this is the most accurate.
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4B Superman doesn’t make any sense to me. Considering the fact that even weaker characters like Flash and green lantern has some 2C -2A showings in the current settings . Does current Superman has any feats or showings that lvl ?
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2-C, possibly 2-A comes from peaks that they rarely use. The Flash rarely goes 2-C, possibly 2-A because of how dangerous it is, him stating he can't hold this form for very long periods of time, as well as the fact Flash at his peak has some higher showings than Supes in his 4-B self.
Hal is only 2-C, possibly 2-A when utilizing his raw willpower, something that doesn't scale to his base and a form he rarely ever uses, and he even stated he never utilized it due to the sheer environmental destruction it can cause and last time he did it blew up the planet he was on along with Sinestro.
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Vondoom
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Excellence616
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This one was already discussed and deemed unreliable to scale to main Superman.
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Yes . Retcon corps profile got removed because in that storyline they see Overvoid itself as fiction
ShionAH
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Bump
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Got a question that i am not sure about
If The Presence represents a concept of god, where he “simply has a name and a face” entirely formed by Dreams, why would he fully scale to The Overvoid?
Isnt the Overvoid this big non-dual, entirely unbound by all concepts thing?
Referring to this
vsbattles.fandom.com
If The Presence represents a concept of god, where he “simply has a name and a face” entirely formed by Dreams, why would he fully scale to The Overvoid?
Isnt the Overvoid this big non-dual, entirely unbound by all concepts thing?
Referring to this
DC Comics Cosmology Revision Project - Suggestion 2
vsbattles.fandom.com
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The Presence has the Key of the divine Presence which is the divine Presence itself Its existence is the same as the Overvoid which is Beyond the entire DC multiverse and its all concepts
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yes Divine Presence is from Comics written by JM DeMatteis I'm matching it but if you ask about Continuity from Scott then only The Presence is revealed as The Source itself and The Source Equivalent to Overvoid
"THROUGHOUT THE VOID, BEINGS LIKE PERPETUA ARE TASKED WITH STARTING MULTIVERSES. THEY DO THIS USING CONNECTIVE ENERGY, BORN OF THE PRESENCE, OF THE SOURCE.
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That's only according to jm demattis and joshua Williamson cosmology . Even the void is a part of The Divine presence.Got a question that i am not sure about
If The Presence represents a concept of god, where he “simply has a name and a face” entirely formed by Dreams, why would he fully scale to The Overvoid?
Isnt the Overvoid this big non-dual, entirely unbound by all concepts thing?
Referring to this
DC Comics Cosmology Revision Project - Suggestion 2
The current writer Joshua Williamson also treats the Overvoid as an aspect of The Darkness and Darkness as an aspect of the Source.
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According to Demattis Cosmology from the recent DC revision blog .
The tiering would be
1: The Divine presence (1A or higher) views everything including the void as fiction and dreams. The god of all mythology including Buddhism and Hindusim.
2: Pralaya (low 1A ( with aspect) or higher in true form (Maybe 1A)
3:The Spectre key (1A)
4:The creator (Brahma or the voice) (1A)
5:Indra's heaven ( High 1B or Low 1A)
6:Odin' Henchmen who punked out Lords of orders and Chaos (The same beings were stomped by Lucifer in Joshua Williamson run) (low 1C or higher)
7:Lord of orders and Chaos ( low 1C or potentially higher) . They gave birth to all the physical universes
8: Dr fate ( low 1c)
??
The tiering would be
1: The Divine presence (1A or higher) views everything including the void as fiction and dreams. The god of all mythology including Buddhism and Hindusim.
2: Pralaya (low 1A ( with aspect) or higher in true form (Maybe 1A)
3:The Spectre key (1A)
4:The creator (Brahma or the voice) (1A)
5:Indra's heaven ( High 1B or Low 1A)
6:Odin' Henchmen who punked out Lords of orders and Chaos (The same beings were stomped by Lucifer in Joshua Williamson run) (low 1C or higher)
7:Lord of orders and Chaos ( low 1C or potentially higher) . They gave birth to all the physical universes
8: Dr fate ( low 1c)
??
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at Revised DC Comics Cosmology User Blog, DeMatteis Cosmology the totality of creation earned Tier High 1-B not Heaven
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DeMatteis Cosmology Is Not 100% Covered Yet
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So basically any work of random writers on DC Cosmology is ignored? I've seen Prince of morning blog and most of the stuff from it are neglected or simply rejected in the new dc revision
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JLA comic scaling and Animal man Comics removed due to Morrison and Synder's Cosmology Merging
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Deleted member 2530
Guest
Divine Presence and Presence are the same thing. There is no difference. It just means The Presence of God. If you are strictly talking about the title then no, its not strictly DeMatteis thing.
What do you mean by concept of God? Presence is called Yahweh as he is called by a billion other names. The name carries certain power with the idea associated with it as shown in Lucifer and no he isn't formed by Dreams. His being is shaped by it. Carey has a habit of introducing concepts and dropping it without delving further in. But as Presence said, he is infinite and eternal. Makes sense since Glory remained unaffected by Dream changing the Creation again. As per why the Presence scales to Overvoid? Its the consequences of merging Snyder, Morrison and Williamson.
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