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Examining RWBY scaling for high tier characters

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Yeah people can disagree but the primary arguments for the downgrade have been answered and new evidence has been brought into the table. Bringin up a list of people who agree with the downgrade over and over isn't a particularly strong argument.

A lot of the people who've disagreed having seen the way the discussion progressed, and two that did changed sides so I'd wait.
 
WeeklyBattles said:
The majority hasnt given a legitimate counter to the counter argument other than 'look at the OP'
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The Majority have sided with my arguments, which have been constantly been debunking these "counterarguments".

You're allowed to take a side and agree with points.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
Yeah people can disagree but the primary arguments for the downgrade have been answered and new evidence has been brought into the table. Bringin up a list of people who agree with the downgrade over and over isn't a particularly strong argument.
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It isn't. However, I hope the many counteraguments I have made towards yours that have yet to be responded to proper do. Nowhere do I imply that it enhances my argument, I'm simply observing a trend and proceeding to counterargue. You're narrow-focusing on something that isn't part of my argument to attempt to debunk it.
 
@Dargoo

Nobody is talking about you. And please, no ironic quotation marks on "counterarguments". Weekly is referring to the people who posted "I agree" and then left the bandwagon.

Also in regards to Qrow and Raven, Qrow is one of the few characters aware of Maidens and their power and is considered a threat by Maiden characters. You can keep talking about the fact that they were also hunting bandits but that won't make either of those things suddenly not true.

Cinder ran from him and felt that she couldn't defeat him alone.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
@Dargoo
Nobody is talking about you. And please, no ironic quotation marks on "counterarguments". Weekly is referring to the people who posted "I agree" and then left the bandwagon.
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To be entirely fair, new evidence hasn't been brought to the table. You're re-arguing stuff Weekly has already brought up.

And I'll stop with the irony. Although using the same ironic quotes doesn't really make your argument seem any better, Matt. Please respond to my arguments, then, instead of focusing on this.
 
Not really? OP and Dargoo have pretty clearly answered any arguments, so there's nothing much anyone else can say without sounding repetitive like you and Weekly are right now. Or is it that you think yourselves to be better at assessing character tiers without reason?
 
RegisNex1232 said:
Or is it that you think yourselves to be better at assessing character tiers without reason?
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No, we simply disagree and are stating why. That's just how debates work, people have different opinions. It's not an exact science.
 
We have both made points on the same peices of evidence, and afterwards people have made desicions. Drawing out said argument doesn't add anything to the plate.

If you'd like to bring new evidence, by all means do so. But don't pretend you are when you're using the same evidence as Weekly.
 
They aren't "debunked and countered". If you look at the discussion that went on for about a hundred posts it was mostly I and Dargoo debating and disagreeing. You are literally acting that because there is one counterargument in the original post, the debate is over. That's not how it works.

To illustrate:

OP argues against something

I / Weekly / Etc argue back

Person goes "lol OP already debunked".

It's incredibly tiresome. At least Dargoo is engaging in the discussion.
 
That, I agree with. However, can't they agree with what I myself am saying? For example, Kalitas specifically cited how they agree with my sentiments alongside the OP.

Continuing the debate does not in any way marginalize opinions, especially when it is only on evidence already presented. I would wholeheartedly agree with you if you actually brought up a new statement.
 
Pros do scale to maidens. Maidens are superior but not that much honestly. I disagree with them scaling that storm to Physicals. At most I tbink pros should be 8-B
 
Hell, Mercury and emerald was able to fight a maiden lmao. It would be silly if pros didn't scale. Maidens AP wise isn't that much superior. Is mainly they just have magic. Which in rwby is a big deal according to the crew. Yea, maidens are hyped Becuae of their ability to use magic with no need of dust or semblance.

Qrow can fight raven, but he would eventually lose due to her versatility, especially flying, and ice. AP wise same leagueish. Skill same ish
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
They aren't "debunked and countered". If you look at the discussion that went on for about a hundred posts it was mostly I and Dargoo debating and disagreeing. You are literally acting that because there is one counterargument in the original post, the debate is over. That's not how it works.
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You know what, I agree with that. And I apologise for implying those statements had merit.

I encourage others to join in on the debate.
 
I mean neither of you have added anything extra to what the OP was discussing. It's pretty tiresome as well when people reiterate points that were already debunked and keep claiming that they weren't.

OP gives his reasoning.

Weekly/You don't really say anything that he hasn't already considered.

Others agree using OP/Dargoo's arguments that haven't been refuted.

And so on.
 
Artemiisia-X said:
Hell, Mercury and emerald was able to fight a maiden lmao. It would be silly if pros didn't scale. Maidens AP wise isn't that much superior. Is mainly they just have magic. Which in rwby is a big deal according to the crew. Yea, maidens are hyped Becuae of their ability to use magic with no need of dust or semblance.
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Through the use of an illusion, and sneak attacks, yes. Even then they didn't do any damage to her, and she was only weakened when Cinder Grimm Arm'd her. Like, look at this: https://youtu.be/21kIyNagC7c?t=150

She didn't seem to use her powers at the beggining of the fight, either.

Although I agree that they should be 8-B
 
Yes it is. Because no storm, none at all, ever scales to physicals and they never should. That energy to create a storm isn't the same used in their attacks. Storm feats are very unquantifiable and illogical. That's just the facts. They shouldn't scale to physicals at all.
 
Artemiisia-X said:
Yes it is. Because no storm, none at all, ever scales to physicals and they never should. That energy to create a storm isn't the same used in their attacks. Storm feats are very unquantifiable and illogical. That's just the facts. They shouldn't scale to physicals at all.
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Yes it is, they energy they use to make the storms is the same energy they use for literally all of their maiden powers including their physical strikes, this has been discussed to death
 
Yes it is? You can easily quantify storm creation for a character with magical abilities and apply that energy for their offensive magic. If you disagree with using storm feats entirely then that's another completely different matter.

Mostly just seems like an attempt to move the goalpost from "They can't scale to this feat" to "The feat is wrong".
 
Artemiisia-X said:
Yes it is. Because no storm, none at all, ever scales to physicals and they never should. That energy to create a storm isn't the same used in their attacks. Storm feats are very unquantifiable and illogical. That's just the facts. They shouldn't scale to physicals at all.
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While I personally agree with that, I don't think this is the best place to debate that, as this is ultimately a scaling debate thread.

It would be better to make a seperate CRT regarding Storm Feats, although that is already hotly debated.
 
Me, Damage, Gargoyle, Ricsi, Desmond, Rebuble, Kalitas, Rusty, Jinx, Sigurd, Kuul, Dziga, Zen, Regis, Gilga

Neutral:

Ryu

In Opposition:

Weekly, Matt, Maverik, DDM

I'll call off grace here, as there are three staff opposed now.
 
It really isn't hotly debated at all until it gets to the point where a character some people don't like gets strong because of it. It's something that's been accepted by all but a few in these select circumstances for years now.
 
No you can't. Also that feat is very outlier to the verse making it worse. The author would slap someone for thinking the maidens are physically large town level for creating a storm when the verse is consistently building level and said building level characters fought and took attacks from maidens. Gee I wonder why? Maybe because like I said storms don't scale to physicals
 
Artemiisia-X said:
No you can't. Also that feat is very outlier to the verse making it worse. The author would slap someone for thinking the maidens are physically city level for creating a storm when the verse is consistently building level and said building level characters fought and took attacks from maidens. Gee I wonder why? Maybe because like I said storms don't scale to physicals
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1. It's not an outlier when Maidens are among the strongest beings.

2. Who cares what the author thinks.
 
Also im just going to point out that in the OP one of the main reasons for Cinder running from Qrow is because 'she didnt have her aura up' when Aura is a passive barrier that doesnt go down unless its physically destroyed
 
It is an outlier when said building level characters can fight maidens... but hey, I'm not sure why I'm arguing this anyway, do what y'all want, but in actuality storms don't scale to physical. Do you
 
WeeklyBattles said:
Also im just going to point out that in the OP one of the main reasons for Cinder running from Qrow is because 'she didnt have her aura up' when Aura is a passive barrier that doesnt go down unless its physically destroyed
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That's ... not entirely true. In Season 4/5 they started introducing "not having your aura up", although that's likely just a plothole/PIS.
 
Dargoo Faust said:
That's ... not entirely true. In Season 4/5 they started introducing "not having your aura up", although that's likely just a plothole/PIS.
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Not having your aura up because its been taken down by an external force. You cant just turn your aura off
 
Dargoo Faust said:
WeeklyBattles said:
Also im just going to point out that in the OP one of the main reasons for Cinder running from Qrow is because 'she didnt have her aura up' when Aura is a passive barrier that doesnt go down unless its physically destroyed
Click to expand...
That's ... not entirely true. In Season 4/5 they started introducing "not having your aura up", although that's likely just a plothole/PIS.
Click to expand...
more like a retcon really.
 
Artemiisia-X said:
It is an outlier when said building level characters can fight maidens... but hey, I'm not sure why I'm arguing this anyway, do what y'all want, but in actuality storms don't scale to physical. Do you
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Its an outlier for the building characters yes
 
I've yet to see many new arguments/debate on the statements themselves.

I think we've both made our points, should we wait for more input?
 
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