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My thoughts exactly.
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DMC Minor God Tier Revision
- Thread starter Mister6ame6
- Start date
- 1,577
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- Thread starter
- #122
Well, the entire reason is because of Tony saying that DMC2 Dante being more serius then others versions of Dante means that Bolverk ''surviving'' a fight with a casual DMC2 Dante is a feat for hinself because that DMC2 Dante never let anything alive in his way in the game.
I very iffy on this logic tbh, so i'm let you guys decide what to do with that.
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I never even remotely implied Bolverk was on par with Dante, I just said he has the "feat" of surviving against him once which considering DMC 2 its hard to believe someone could pull that. What I mean with this is that it works as a supporting feat for him for whatever tier he gets, not that he should scale to Dante.
Also what's with Sparda sealed key? Why are we scaling him to Argosax and saying he is tier 6? I have no idea why it has that or why pre Rebellion is tier 6 or why he even has that key at all.
The OP shouldn't be changed, it creates a ton of confusion.
Also what's with Sparda sealed key? Why are we scaling him to Argosax and saying he is tier 6? I have no idea why it has that or why pre Rebellion is tier 6 or why he even has that key at all.
The OP shouldn't be changed, it creates a ton of confusion.
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He just runs away the first fight, and dies in the second fight. He doesn’t even have a Nelo Angelo cutscene of Dante being overwhelmed by him in the second game so him scaling to Dante in any way doesn’t seem right.
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But I just said he shouldn't scale . - .
- 1,577
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- Thread starter
- #126
How does surviving a casual Dante helps with whatever tier he get? Casual Dante is unquantificable to know which tier he gets. So better just leave him description that he fougth Dante afterwall along with removing the key completely.
Well, the Tier 6 Pre Rebelion is by scaling above Mundus's generals is the worst you can downplay that statement. Is more because of fighting Bolverk then anything else in his sealed state, Argosax is there as supporting feat.
But i'm asked to add DMC1 Dante and Nelo Angelo some time ago, did you forgot that?
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- Thread starter
- #128
That's still means that fighting a casual Dante don't gives you tiers and is uselless to use that justificy to the ratings.
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That's not my point
I just saying Dante will not use tier 7 levels of power against tier 6 and above on the verse.
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- Thread starter
- #130
Oh yeah, in that case you are right on that
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Well we see his fights much better in the anime where even Tier 9 and 8 Demons are not one shotted by him, so
Like I said earlier, this thread got WAY too sidetracked, better we get the OP accepted and go for our other projects. Like I said on discord, Bolverk scales to a version of Sparda and that’s the main reason for his tier, his fight against Dante give us nothing to really work with
Like I said earlier, this thread got WAY too sidetracked, better we get the OP accepted and go for our other projects. Like I said on discord, Bolverk scales to a version of Sparda and that’s the main reason for his tier, his fight against Dante give us nothing to really work with
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Was sparda implied to take Bolverk as a serious opponent or is he just like Beowulf? Cause if it’s another Beowulf incident idk if we should scale him to sparda.
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- 1,577
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- Thread starter
- #134
Anyway if there is anything to do here, then i'm guess we can conclude this now and apply stuff?
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Aside from changing the Bolverk explanation to sparda, the rest is fine.
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- Thread starter
- #136
Well, finished the changes in the profiles, so this thread can be closed now.
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I added the references because someone royally screwed up (LOOKING AT YOU MISTER).
So sealed Sparda is now 6-C to High 4-C then? Doesn't he fight against Argosax on his own as per the lore? Sparda literally stalemates Argosax and only needs help to seal him off, not to actually 1v1 against him.
So sealed Sparda is now 6-C to High 4-C then? Doesn't he fight against Argosax on his own as per the lore? Sparda literally stalemates Argosax and only needs help to seal him off, not to actually 1v1 against him.
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Not just that, giving him Tier 6 likely tier 4 because he fought tier 2 doens't work even by downscalling, he either is tier 2 or not.
Sealed Sparda fighting Argosax is literally lore, not interpretation or headcanon, denying the feat is lower than tier 2 gives the precedent and bad image for allowing headcanon for the sake of X or Y interpretation.
Sealed Mundus still holds the demon world and Fully sealed Argosax fuses the worlds like its tuesday for him
meanwhile peak sparda who's vastly stronger than Argosax and Mundus, just sealed part of his power, yes part not 100% like he did with argosax and mundus, him still sealed would easily upscale above sealed mundus and argosax.
If Mundus and Peak Sparda had to fight with only using 50%, sparda would still win against mundus.
To give a example: 50% of 400 is still bigger than 50% of 200.
TLDR: Sealed Sparda >= Argosax and Mundus before they got sealed>Sealed Mundus and Argosax
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- Thread starter
- #139
Thank you for fixing the references
Well, is because is denied vague of how Sealed Sparta fought Argosax since he have help from the Villa the Marli Clan, the argument is that since we don't know the details of how the fight went, we can't assume he was stalemetes Argo. That's all.
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- Thread starter
- #140
Weakened Mundus still sustaining the DW is unknow tho, we don't have the proof he can do that on his weakened form.
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He can
If argosax while 100% sealed can literally return everything to his original form casually, then Mundus who already ressurected and had the seal weakening him less as time passes.
Logically he would be able to do soo, he's being less affected by the seal compared to argosax, even more when sustaining the demon world is a less powerful feat compared to what argo did.
And both are almost equals, if argo can do, mundus can do similar or the same.
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- Thread starter
- #142
There is some years of time gap between BtN and DMC2 where the seal got way more weaker for Argo being capable to return everything to his original form casually, so i'm don't think we can assume that Mundus is sustaining the DW in DMC3 events.
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Wdym by BtN
Timeframe here is irrelevant but since you mentioned, it actually helps me since Mundus had 2000+ years of ressurecting while argosax just got sealed 200+ years ago
Mundus logically would be more powerful than Argosax due to the seal affecting him less and despite that a recently sealed Argosax casually performs tier 2 feat.
Both on the same position would do similar feats since again, both are almost or flat out equals, even more Mundus just has to sustain the Demon world, a less powerful feat compared to the feat done by Argosax.
And its never going to be about Mundus. As long Sealed Argosax has tier 2 feat, sealed Mundus scales.
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- Thread starter
- #144
So, are you saying that Mundus in DMC 3 is 2-C?
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Everyone talking about the Tier 6 and 4 but nobody talks about the FTL+ rating
The old FTL+ came from DMC1 DT scaling, which means, it's for 2-Cs, not High 4-Cs, DMC3 is getting revised so they shouldn't be used aswell, so it's better leave it at Unknown
The old FTL+ came from DMC1 DT scaling, which means, it's for 2-Cs, not High 4-Cs, DMC3 is getting revised so they shouldn't be used aswell, so it's better leave it at Unknown
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Yes
The lowball always was Mundus sustaining the demon world, but Argosax on way worse state than Mundus is able to casually perform 2-C feat, Mundus who's on a better state than Argosax would absolutely able to do the same feat.
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- #147
Hmm, well if we go with that then Arkham with FE, Diabólica Sanctus with DSS and End Game Dante, Vergil and Nero are 2-C by scaling decently above Sealed Mundus.
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There's no need for FTL+ asides from archiving purposes if something happens to immeasurable rating
DMC3 Endgame Dante and Vergil in the future might become 2-C and immeasurable or vastly upscale from Ripper's infinite speed feat.
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For whatever reason FE didn't become Sparda Sword (which it should he unsealed it with the amulets like Dante does in DMC1).
But in any case DMC3 is not the topic of the thread.
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- Thread starter
- #150
The sword can choose it own user, so i'm guess that's is the reason why FE didn't become DSS despite being unsealed by the amulets and Arkham being too weak physicaly and mentally.
Yeah you are right on that, DMC3 is a topic for another thread.
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Yeah I agree
I'll remove it and leave their speed at Massively Hypersonic+ (Since they are scaled higher than Mundus Generals) until you guys decide the proposal for that
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- Thread starter
- #152
All tier 6 guys should all scale to infinity speed above the Rippers, but that's a story for another thread.
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We never agreed to downgrade anyone tho, why did sealed sparda and bolverk went to tier 6? Why is argosax in the justifications for Sparda if he is tier 6?
Sparda fights Argosax and defeats him but it was with the help of an island full of half demons, he should obviously downscale. Nowhere in the lore says Sparda 1v1 him or that the clan demons were the ones responsables of sealing Argosax away. The only thing that is fully stated is that Sparda along with the Clan fought and sealed Argosax.
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Some of that I removed, indeed it does not make sense for Demon Kings being on their Tier 6 descriptions
I think some agreed with downgrading but I don't remember if the new tier was decided ? One thing is agreeinf Bolverk was weaker in the past, the other is pinpointing his previous Tier, same goes to Sparda
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- #155
Fine by me too
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We don't have a key for pre-rebellion sparda and its useless since we don't know exactly how strong he was. Now as for his nerfed key, we can probably scale Bolverk to that, sealed Sparda also downscales from Argosax and Bolverk should downscale from Sparda.
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- Thread starter
- #157
Pre-Rebellion Sparda would either be tier 6 or tier 2, which we are going to tier 6 in this, i'm guess.
About Sealed Sparda and Bolverk, you are correct on that.
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- #159
Yeap
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- #160
Só, can we upgrade Bolverk and Sealed Sparda back to 2-C now?
