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Dante (DMC) Pandora abilities additions

Netoriman

Netoriman

105
82

Pandora​

Dante doesn't have any abilities listed on his DMC 4 profile for Pandora and a few other weapons, so this is to start applying some.

We get more details on what Pandora, the Devil Arm is and can do from the Devil May Cry Deadly Fortune novel, I suggest the following for Dante's DMC 4 key.


Creation - Pandora's default state is the suitcase, Pandora can 'essentially take on the shape of any weapon as long as it's owner can imagine it', as Pandora reads it's user mind and memory, putting Dante's thoughts and imagination into reality as weaponry, such as Dante imagining Beowulf for PF398: Revenge and projecting the user's negative emotions such as 'Violated Taboo' with PF666: Omen. (page 137-138,Vol 2 Deadly Fortune)

Limited Telepathy and Mind Reading - Pandora reads the mind and memories of it's user.

Light Manipulation - Dante thinks of Beowulf who is stated to control light, Pandora becomes something akin to Beowulf's head in the Pandora's PF398: Revenge, which shoots out a great beam of light. (0:15-0:20)
(page 216, Vol 2 Deadly Fortune)

Homing Attack, Danmaku, Explosion Manipulation, Flight - The numerous rockets shot out in Pandora's PF594: Argument, home and track targets. Argument can be sat in, enabling it's user to fly. (1:23-1:28)

Homing Attack - Pandora becomes PF422: Grief, a large tri-blade shuriken that Dante throws out, enabling him to choose it's target's as he locks onto them, delivering rapid slashes. (2:11-2:15)

Empathic Manipulation (negative emotion use) - Pandora becomes PF666: Omen, Dante opens Pandora and damages his enemies with a flash of 'Violated taboo'. (0:49-0:54) (DMC 4, Styles, Gunslinger Pandora skill list)



VS BATTLE THREAD MODS
Agree: (DeagonX, agrees all except SR) (Planck69, agrees all except SR) (theglassman12, agrees all except SR) (3)

Neutral:
Disagree:

blue names
Agree: (Ang4100, JtGamer96, LuffyRuffy46307, Chosen, Spectra_Schiffer, Palito266, Silvervigilant) 7
(Random-Helper323, LordGinSama, all except SR) 2
(Vietthai96, agree all, Neutral on SR) 1

Neutral:
Disagree:

Creation, Limited Telepathy and Mind Reading (with Pandora) Light Manipulation (with PF398: Revenge), Homing Attack, Danmaku, Explosion Manipulation, Flight (with PF594: Argument), Homing Attack (with PF422: Grief) and Empathic Manipulation (Negative Emotion Use) (with PF666: Omen) (with Pandora, Dante utilises the Devil Arm to read his mind and memories, putting Dante's thoughts and memories into reality as weaponry such as shooting a great beam of light as PF398: Revenge, turning it into a flying fortress that shoots a flurry of explosive homing missiles as PF594: Argument, becoming a large tri-blade shuriken that homes on enemies delivering rapid slashes as PF422: Grief and lastly opening Pandora to channel Dante's negative thoughts of 'Violated Taboo' to damage enemies as PF666: Omen)

107. Devil May Cry Deadly Fortune :Volume 2 Page 136 (Creation, limited Telepathy and Mind Reading)


108. Devil May Cry Deadly Fortune :Volume 2 Page 216 (Light Manipulation)



109. Devil May Cry 4 (2008) Pandora Skills showcase Youtube Video
 
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This looks mostly fine, though it would need to be stipulated that the telepathy/mind reading isn't useable by Dante, it's just a mental connection between him and the weapon.

I'm not sold on subjective reality, necessarily, since it was stated to be able to transform into 666 different weapons, and the forms that it can take are actually numbered so that seems to be literal.
 
Isn't that subjective reality is more of a shapeshifting??, but well if subjective reality get accepted then i don't mind.

Anyway it should have explosion manipulation from having missiles that explode upon contact, F594 should also have danmaku due to being able to shot out barrage of projectile
 
Shouldn't be subjective reality since it's not any type of reality warping via the users thoughts/imagination but moreso the object just responding to what the user wants.
 
LordGinSama said:
Looks good aside from Subjective Reality. Should just be Creation, "any weapon you can imagine" is in reference to Pandora having 666 weapons to choose from at a whim.
Click to expand...
That would definitely seem to be the case based on the game description alone, but the weapon was able to morph to resemble a specific demon he thought of and use power like that demon. That's basically what this suggestion is all about.

Still, I'm personally wondering where the line even gets drawn between shapeshifting/creation and the suggested subjective reality in that context, since it sounds like a distinction without a difference.
 
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Haxes, powers, abilities are often overlapping each others so there is hardly any clear line to draw between abilities, you can use subjective reality in a limited fashion such as shapeshifting, transformations, creation, etc...... and it still qualify as subjective reality, just that the application of it is more limited. That why i'm not really mind if subjective reality get accepted
 
Vietthai96 said:
Isn't that subjective reality is more of a shapeshifting??, but well if subjective reality get accepted then i don't mind.

Anyway it should have explosion manipulation from having missiles that explode upon contact, F594 should also have danmaku due to being able to shot out barrage of projectile
Click to expand...
I'll add in the explosion and danmaku in a bit

Vietthai96 said:
Haxes, powers, abilities are often overlapping each others so there is hardly any clear line to draw between abilities, you can use subjective reality in a limited fashion such as shapeshifting, transformations, creation, etc...... and it still qualify as subjective reality, just that the application of it is more limited. That why i'm not really mind if subjective reality get accepted
Click to expand...
Yeah the other thread with Malphus and the demon fruit have the overlap with illusion creation.
Deagonx said:
This looks mostly fine, though it would need to be stipulated that the telepathy/mind reading isn't useable by Dante, it's just a mental connection between him and the weapon.

I'm not sold on subjective reality, necessarily, since it was stated to be able to transform into 666 different weapons, and the forms that it can take are actually numbered so that seems to be literal.
Click to expand...
I'll adjust the telepathy part later today/tomorrow
With the SR, could we label it as limited and give it a reason on its limited application like the user above suggested.
 
Netoriman said:
Dante doesn't have any abilities listed on his DMC 4 profile for Pandora and a few other weapons, so this is to start applying some.

We get more details on what Pandora, the Devil Arm is and can do from the Devil May Cry Deadly Fortune novel, I suggest the following for Dante DMC 4 key.
Click to expand...
Alright. I got the impression that we were making a Weapon profile for Pandora.
Netoriman said:
Subjective Reality (Creation/Summoning)- Pandora's default state is the suitcase, Pandora can 'essentially take on the shape of any weapon as long as it's owner can imagine it', as Pandora reads it's user mind and memory, putting Dante's thoughts and imagination into reality as weaponry, such as Dante imagining Beowulf for PF398: Revenge.

Telepathy and Mind Reading - Pandora reads the mind and memories of it's user. (Only applicable between Pandora and it's user)
Click to expand...
For Subjective Reality/Creation I have similar thoughts to @Random-Helper323. But, I don't really see a point in indexing the Telepathy and mind reading since its literally just limited to the weapon and the user. Like if it could be used against opponents then I could see a point. But here it feels a bit redundant, imo.
Netoriman said:
Light Malnipulation - Dante thinks of Beowulf who is stated to control light, Pandora becomes something akin to Beowulf's head in the Pandora's PF398: Revenge, which shoots out a great beam of light. (0:15-0:20)

Homing Attack, Danmaku, Explosion Malnipulation, Flight - The numerous rockets shot out in Pandora's PF594: Argument, home and track targets. Argument can be sat in, enabling it's user to fly. (1:23-1:28)

Homing attack - Pandora becomes PF422: Grief, a tri-blade shuriken that Dante throws out, enabling him to choose it's target's as he locks onto them, delivering rapid slashes. (2:11-2:15)
Click to expand...
The rest of this looks fine.
 
chosen said:
Coupdnt that just be limited telephaty since even it's user only iy still reada their thoughs?
Click to expand...
It would make more sense for Pandora the weapon itself to get that. But ig its fine to add it since we are arguing for limited
 
Yeah im looking to get this closed soon and applied

There's 5 that agree with everything
6 that disagree with the SR
1 that's neutral on the SR

So I've just changed it to creation, I mainly wanted Pandora on Dante's key with light mal as he seemingly doesn't have it.

I don't mind waiting a few days to see if any of the side that agrees it's SR comes with a refute to the lot that disagree on the SR however.

I can't find more evidence on it to persuade you lot otherwise though as the Deadly Fortune stuff is all I can find that expands on Pandora.
 
Netoriman said:
Yeah im looking to get this closed soon and applied

There's 5 that agree with everything
6 that disagree with the SR
1 that's neutral on the SR
Click to expand...
Uhh, only the thread mod votes count here, which is just Deagonx and Planck here. Blue names can give their input but their votes don't count in CRTs.
Netoriman said:
So I've just changed it to creation, I mainly wanted Pandora on Dante's key with light mal as he seemingly doesn't have it.

I don't mind waiting a few days to see if any of the side that agrees it's SR comes with a refute to the lot that disagree on the SR however.

I can't find more evidence on it to persuade you lot otherwise though as the Deadly Fortune stuff is all I can find that expands on Pandora.
Click to expand...
I will give it a shot.
Planck69 said:
Agree with everything bar Subjective Reality. Shapeshifting and/or Creation makes more sense there.
Click to expand...
Random-Helper323 said:
That would definitely seem to be the case based on the game description alone, but the weapon was able to morph to resemble a specific demon he thought of and use power like that demon. That's basically what this suggestion is all about.
Click to expand...
From Subjective Reality page
Creation/Summoning: The user is capable of creating and manifesting objects and entities that aren't real at all, and only "exist" in the imagination and dreams of the user and/or other beings.
Click to expand...
I suppose Limited SR from wielding Pandora could be argued going by the definitions. Because Pandora allows the user to manifest a weapon from their mind/memory or thoughts.
 
We could ask Planck and Deagonx what they think of shifting the subjective reality to creation/shapeshifting. We could also annoy Glass to come in.

It does sound as if the 666 different forms isn't entirely accurate. Unless that refers to basic templates that it uses or even to the total number of weapons Dante had thought of at the time. It could also be a bad pun on the saying of having 1001 uses.

Still, for a point of reference, I once raised limited subjective reality as a possible ability to help explain Schrodinger from Hellsing. This is a character whose entire state is under the control of his own interpretation, to the point that unless something can destroy or otherwise break the soul and non-physical existence that does the interpreting, his own interpretation negates external factors, to the point where you can't decide he's trapped at the bottom of the ocean nailed to a post with his head cut off just because you nailed him to that post, slashed his head off and dragged him to the bottom of the ocean; he decides he's luxuriating in a coffee shop sipping wine.

Subjective reality was rejected for that character on the basis that its range was too limited, if I remember correctly.
 
Deagonx said:
I would prefer that we characterize it as "limited shapeshifting."
Click to expand...
Shapeshifting is the power to transform and reshape the form of one's body. Users are often called shapeshifters or metamorphs. The users can change their forms, transforming and reshaping their genetic and cellular structures. They can impersonate others or enhance their bodies for combat. Users with particularly flexible abilities can manipulate their forms at will, combining abilities, traits, etc., being able to form limbs into weapons and such.
Click to expand...
Isn't Shapeshifting for changing one's own body? How will this be shapeshifting if Dante doesn't even change his body at all? I mean it might make sense for Pandora, but we are trying to index abilities for Dante granted by Pandora here.
 
It also adapts powers based on those forms though. Although it might have similar powers already, or just be applying demonic energy into lots of transforming, including transforming the energy.
 
Tanin_iver said:
Isn't Shapeshifting for changing one's own body? How will this be shapeshifting if Dante doesn't even change his body at all? I mean it might make sense for Pandora, but we are trying to index abilities for Dante granted by Pandora here.
Click to expand...
I mean that's just a result of us adding features of this weapon to his profile. He doesn't get the ability to create anything either.
 
Deagonx said:
I mean that's just a result of us adding features of this weapon to his profile. He doesn't get the ability to create anything either.
Click to expand...
It seems a bit weird to list anything that would imply large changes for Dante himself here. Shapeshifting would imply that he shapeshifts using the weapon and subjective reality, I don't even know what that would imply about him.

Maybe we list the abilities we've seen the weapon display, like the missiles and lasers, and maybe specify that the weapon shapeshifts while linking shapeshifting, maybe specify that it copies abilities and forms based on its user's thoughts, and link maybe creation to that?

Based on my limited history with subjective reality, if Schrodinger can't get it for being able to decide where he is in the world and what state he's in regardless of what someone does to him, then it seems kind of strange to get it for shapeshifting into weapons and copying their powers. Maybe Ditto's profile could be a precedent to look to here?
 
Random-Helper323 said:
Shapeshifting would imply that he shapeshifts using the weapon
Click to expand...
I mean, we can just clarify that he can only transform the weapon itself. Alternatively we don't even necessarily need to index this aspect of the weapon on Dante's profile.
 
Deagonx said:
I mean, we can just clarify that he can only transform the weapon itself. Alternatively we don't even necessarily need to index this aspect of the weapon on Dante's profile.
Click to expand...
Well, if you ask me, it's a bit weird to say he has shapeshifting via Pandora. Probably best to list that the weapon shapeshifts, and maybe link shapeshifting.

We also have a precedent in the form of Ditto's profile (I'm about to edit that a tiny bit so it doesn't assume that any versus thread starter will necessarily be a he, but that's beside the point). Ditto's a bit like Pandora in the sense that he shapeshifts and mimics powers. What best to say about mimicking powers from Dante's memory? Although I also have an alternative theory that maybe the weapon just has demonic energy and can also transform the form the energy takes. Or it just has those abilities already, it's hard to say for sure.
 
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Deagonx said:
That's essentially what I was getting at.
Click to expand...
How best to note it, you reckon? Perhaps call the ability it gives Dante Power Mimicry instead, and specify that Pandora shapeshifts? That is how Ditto's page is done, so maybe. I don't know how we can say his ability here is that his gun shapeshifts from a creepy briefcase into other stuff. Maybe "possesses a shapeshifting weapon" with shapeshifting linked?
 
I'd just put Pandora in "Standard Equipment" like on the Inuyasha page and list it as being able to shapeshift and read minds.
 
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