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Cardfight speed downgrade

Agnaa said:
Y'all can continue looking for replacement feats, but Kukui created a thread attempting to revise the flight speed standards, we should probably hold off on applying a downgrade until that thread's resolved.
Click to expand...
I mean, the thread is a Q&A asking for some answers not a CRT trying to revise something. And I see no revision coming out of it tbh. I suppose people can proceed according to the current standards rather than losing this thread in the sands of time. In the unlikely scenario of something changing in the future, it can be handled later.
 
I think peak human would be the best tier for reaction for now, there isn't really any reaction real feats from what I've been watching and regular humans can react to the units throughout the series. We can bump it up if we find better feats.
 
Should we close the thread? Seems all we need now are revisions. Doesn't look like the rules are going to change for the speed scaling.
 
Well, this thread's for the revisions, right? Or do you wanna make a new thread for it since this one has gone on for so long?
 
Don't the changes still need to be made? How would the speed section look like after this revision?

The characters would still retain their MFTL+ or whatever flight speed, it just won't scale to other forms of speed. So that needs to be made clear in the speed section of the profile.
 
There really isn't really any reaction feats to scale. Most of the battles come from the cardfights. I read over the respect thread created for the profile, and being summon through lightning doesn't really scale to reaction.
 
So the profiles need to be edited to reflect that information.
 
How does this look?

Speed: Peak Human combat speed and reactions with Massively FTL+ Travel speed as a spirit (Should be at least comparable to Takuto, who's soul traveled past numerous stars in seconds to reach Planet Cray and all cardfighters transport their souls to Planet Cray when participating in cardfights) | At least Peak Human combat speed and reactions with Massively FTL+travel with Units (The souls of Cardfighters are far inferior to the Units of Planet Cray, explicitly requiring them in order to battle in cardfights; Aichi's Units have shown to be fast enough to attack his soul; Superior to the speed of Ren's Units)
 
Didn't I hear some stuff about bullet/lightning dodging earlier? And about those being attacks of certain characters? If they dodged those they should get corresponding reactions. And even if they didn't dodge them, if they use them in attacks, the speed of bullets/lightning should be listed under attack speed. This page has an example of how that's formatted/separated.
 
I couldn't find any dodging, but there is lightning attacks and guns. Lightning would receive a mhs rating correct?
 
ok this should suffice.

Speed: Peak Human reactions Massively FTL+ Travel speed as a spirit (Should be at least comparable to Takuto, who's soul traveled past numerous stars in seconds to reach Planet Cray and all cardfighters transport their souls to Planet Cray when participating in cardfights) | At least Peak Human reactions with Massively Hypersonic attack speed (Some Unit's can manipulate lightning) and Massively FTL+travel with Units (The souls of Cardfighters are far inferior to the Units of Planet Cray, explicitly requiring them in order to battle in cardfights; Aichi's Units have shown to be fast enough to attack his soul; Superior to the speed of Ren's Units)
 
Last edited:
You sure you meant combat speed (how fast characters move when fighting) and not attack speed (how fast a character's attack moves, even if they can't move their body or react that fast)?
 
You should just post the feats here. They are going to be linked in the profile.
 
Agnaa said:
You sure you meant combat speed (how fast characters move when fighting) and not attack speed (how fast a character's attack moves, even if they can't move their body or react that fast)?
Click to expand...
Yes attack speed, sorry I've never made revisions only provided input.
 
Just giving a heads up but this thread is far from finished just because the speed standards will (most likely) not change. I have arguments still regardless, my attention is just focused more on my speed thread for the general outlook of how we’re handling it before I get back to this thread.

So while I’m holding off on responding here currently, I’m not finished with this thread at all.
 
Is this thread forgotten? I'd appreciate if we can move ahead with the changes that were accepted at least and if anything needs to be done, it can be done later in another thread.
 
I am pretty sure we agreed to downgrade the speeds of characters.
 
Yes, before this thread was finished addressing everything and while I was mainly focused on the other threads before coming back to this one like I said earlier. That and some points from before that me and others already debunked, but am sure came back acting like they were never addressed in the first place.

Either way, this thread isn't done. Arguments for the travel speed scaling to other speeds still exist.
 
Quangotjokes said:
Speed: Peak Human reactions Massively FTL+ Travel speed as a spirit (Should be at least comparable to Takuto, who's soul traveled past numerous stars in seconds to reach Planet Cray and all cardfighters transport their souls to Planet Cray when participating in cardfights) | At least Peak Human reactions with Massively Hypersonic combat speed (Some Unit's can manipulate lightning) and Massively FTL+travel with Units (The souls of Cardfighters are far inferior to the Units of Planet Cray, explicitly requiring them in order to battle in cardfights; Aichi's Units have shown to be fast enough to attack his soul; Superior to the speed of Ren's Units)
Click to expand...
Also, shouldn't it be Massively Hypersonic "attack" speed, instead of combat speed if nobody reacts to lightning?
 
Anyway, im in a class right now, so later today I am going to write up an explanation for the MFTL travel speed to scale.

MHS reactions absolutely isn't happening if I have something to say about it first.
 
I hope you will bring up some new points, and not the old ones you already brought up before. And I hope we can actually get this thread to conclusion instead of stalling it endlessly, so I'd appreciate if we set a deadline for your response, so that you don't forget to reply again.
 
Alright. Disregarding the other thread(s) I made while away from this one, and getting more clarity on the speed rules now at this point, MFTL+ reactions should still exist from the travel feat(s) here under these circumstances. I will be ignoring other parts of the discussion right now to address this as the main priority.

First things first, addressing the "prepartion and slowed down" points. This will reiterate brought up points from before, since they were not countered here, but there's evidence to help claim neither of those things happened in this feat to start things off.

Takuto, the one doing this speed feat, did not prepare to do this feat beforehand. His only purpose in possessing Rekka's body was to watch Aichi and Ren's Vanguard battle for himself firsthand.

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898570306455760926/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR149L7v-yqm5gaudfn8MWm96km6vwTQ1FZFoMFzwyNWuuEeW6LyO9KGdB4
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898570463918292992/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR1TJJDrgLFfUcAxBobfbTlDHdPHsHVcUHc1tsGsoXV50ghEKmQ_TTVwsIY
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898636988297662464/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR0a81xp0Sln5bdw5M5EjSPnlEb0BNCK43vCFz92ihsYcnItsRzYAx3K8PQ
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898570574161399818/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR3DWB8svwgHppLnePXuWh73Yf8_SUhhkgGTTFgiA_HtzLtGmKKepCjdtv4

The second their battle ends, he performs the speed feat and goes to Planet Cray. The clip of the feat has been posted dozens of times here, but I'll post it again.




Spectating the Vanguard match was the literal only demonstrable thing Takuto was present here to do, to see it's outcome. There's demonstrably no instance or implication of preparing to leave for Cray beforehand as dictated in the material shown to us. He came to see the match, saw how it ended, and left. For all intents and purposes, this flight speed was done extremely immediately right off the bat.

Now, as for what happens during the actual flight and it's conclusion, evidence to prove no deceleration or slowing down happened comes from how they arrived onto the planet.

When approaching Cray and coming into the atmosphere, the sheer force of the flight itself tears through and disperses a cloud layer.

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/888417057950011412/image0.png?fbclid=IwAR2TByP5U-KOhPklpMxzJhb3D45Vfu1lKgc9cKgChGMwZ_7LEWSQnvoDupI
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898640813700050954/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR2BTjSb2blbADVegfvBoUr0FfaR7-A16GKfFBxfMWbt-7_6zQqLQ00m61E
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/888417061351616563/image0.png?fbclid=IwAR2zZVo-N7pdB-T_tR8gAagmua8LzBuOEKhF2MiM9SR5dlHqDekhkJ5dPbI
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898642488452059186/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR0Y6XuZDTlCj6CZutG76YqI3eYUMLCv_jZQw9ZUVfd_Dy9i3A-_4mnvr-Q

And in that moment when landing, causes an explosion on the planet (yes, this is being brought back up as well).

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/888417078808301588/image0.png?fbclid=IwAR3XJqDA3vBOTkqjIQE4Hi-ZWGGST_8255XRUlgakoI8KhtBVm8NJDeQAw4

Going beyond the simplicity of just saying "they don't show to be slowing down", these details and the effects unleashed by the flight itself indicate there's no deceleration happening prior to the landing. After all, dispersing a layer of clouds just by passing through them, and unleashing force to cause an explosion, implies great force is still being put into the speed. Which can't be the case if they slowed down before the landing was done.

I also reiterate this evidence again because this implies a successful landing was done. Seconds after the feat is finished, we see Takuto and Ultra Rare standing upright, unfatigued and completely fine post-landing.

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898687626016591892/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR2bOqjT8ISYRR9eBVwRVN23Yivt4OXMOsci0Tdpdhckxm8gZTGmSQ1YoGI

Also, a very strong new point not given before, that can be added to this, is Takuto having perfect control over his flight speed.

Shown here in another universe crossing flight speed feat Takuto's soul performs, he is shown to have stopped himself midair at the end of his flight feat.




By stopping himself midair, it shows Takuto is capable of having control over his flight speed to successfully halt himself when he chooses. Adding this with the above depiction of standing upright, and having no visible harm or fatigue at play, it makes the notion that Takuto can prevent himself from crashing smack-dab into the planet and freely stop himself very reasonable.

On top of that, returning to the cloud layer point from before, the location on Planet Cray that they went to was covered by those clouds, making it preventable from being seen until after they would pass through the cloud layer during the flight.
 
ProfessorKukui4Life said:
Alright. Disregarding the other thread(s) I made while away from this one, and getting more clarity on the speed rules now at this point, MFTL+ reactions should still exist from the travel feat(s) here under these circumstances. I will be ignoring other parts of the discussion right now to address this as the main priority.

First things first, addressing the "prepartion and slowed down" points. This will reiterate brought up points from before, since they were not countered here, but there's evidence to help claim neither of those things happened in this feat to start things off.

Takuto, the one doing this speed feat, did not prepare to do this feat beforehand. His only purpose in possessing Rekka's body was to watch Aichi and Ren's Vanguard battle for himself firsthand.

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898570306455760926/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR149L7v-yqm5gaudfn8MWm96km6vwTQ1FZFoMFzwyNWuuEeW6LyO9KGdB4
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898570463918292992/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR1TJJDrgLFfUcAxBobfbTlDHdPHsHVcUHc1tsGsoXV50ghEKmQ_TTVwsIY
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898636988297662464/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR0a81xp0Sln5bdw5M5EjSPnlEb0BNCK43vCFz92ihsYcnItsRzYAx3K8PQ
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898570574161399818/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR3DWB8svwgHppLnePXuWh73Yf8_SUhhkgGTTFgiA_HtzLtGmKKepCjdtv4

The second their battle ends, he performs the speed feat and goes to Planet Cray. The clip of the feat has been posted dozens of times here, but I'll post it again.




Spectating the Vanguard match was the literal only demonstrable thing Takuto was present here to do, to see it's outcome. There's demonstrably no instance or implication of preparing to leave for Cray beforehand as dictated in the material shown to us. He came to see the match, saw how it ended, and left. For all intents and purposes, this flight speed was done extremely immediately right off the bat.

Now, as for what happens during the actual flight and it's conclusion, evidence to prove no deceleration or slowing down happened comes from how they arrived onto the planet.

When approaching Cray and coming into the atmosphere, the sheer force of the flight itself tears through and disperses a cloud layer.

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/888417057950011412/image0.png?fbclid=IwAR2TByP5U-KOhPklpMxzJhb3D45Vfu1lKgc9cKgChGMwZ_7LEWSQnvoDupI
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898640813700050954/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR2BTjSb2blbADVegfvBoUr0FfaR7-A16GKfFBxfMWbt-7_6zQqLQ00m61E
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/888417061351616563/image0.png?fbclid=IwAR2zZVo-N7pdB-T_tR8gAagmua8LzBuOEKhF2MiM9SR5dlHqDekhkJ5dPbI
https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898642488452059186/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR0Y6XuZDTlCj6CZutG76YqI3eYUMLCv_jZQw9ZUVfd_Dy9i3A-_4mnvr-Q

And in that moment when landing, causes an explosion on the planet (yes, this is being brought back up as well).

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/888417078808301588/image0.png?fbclid=IwAR3XJqDA3vBOTkqjIQE4Hi-ZWGGST_8255XRUlgakoI8KhtBVm8NJDeQAw4

Going beyond the simplicity of just saying "they don't show to be slowing down", these details and the effects unleashed by the flight itself indicate there's no deceleration happening prior to the landing. After all, dispersing a layer of clouds just by passing through them, and unleashing force to cause an explosion, implies great force is still being put into the speed. Which can't be the case if they slowed down before the landing was done.

I also reiterate this evidence again because this implies a successful landing was done. Seconds after the feat is finished, we see Takuto and Ultra Rare standing upright, unfatigued and completely fine post-landing.

https://cdn.**********.com/attachments/574596090788315196/898687626016591892/unknown.png?fbclid=IwAR2bOqjT8ISYRR9eBVwRVN23Yivt4OXMOsci0Tdpdhckxm8gZTGmSQ1YoGI

Also, a very strong new point not given before, that can be added to this, is Takuto having perfect control over his flight speed.

Shown here in another universe crossing flight speed feat Takuto's soul performs, he is shown to have stopped himself midair at the end of his flight feat.




By stopping himself midair, it shows Takuto is capable of having control over his flight speed to successfully halt himself when he chooses. Adding this with the above depiction of standing upright, and having no visible harm or fatigue at play, it makes the notion that Takuto can prevent himself from crashing smack-dab into the planet and freely stop himself very reasonable.

On top of that, returning to the cloud layer point from before, the location on Planet Cray that they went to was covered by those clouds, making it preventable from being seen until after they would pass through the cloud layer during the flight.
Click to expand...

Just pointing out that I agree with this.
 
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