Apeironaxim
He/Him- 3,695
- 1,444
Vegeta on Namek had a PL of 19,000-24,000, with Dodoria having a PL of 22,000. Vegeta one shot Dodoria. Even assuming he was at the highest end at 24,000, that is still a 1.09x difference
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
STRONGEST One-Punch Man Discussion Thread!
- Thread starter Phoenks
- Start date
- 3,888
- 4,239
Didn’t krillin also one shot like multiple saibamen and he wasn’t too much stronger than them power wise either right.
- 13,905
- 5,421
Power levels aren’t recognize as a linear thing from what I can tell
- 16,286
- 17,801
Yeah, Krillin (with a PL of 1,770) one-shot three Saibamen (with a PL of 1,200-1,500).
- 16,286
- 17,801
People say that, but Kaioken and Super Saiyan multiply power levels and are recognized as linear kek
Apeironaxim
He/Him- 3,695
- 1,444
Goku had a PL of 3 mil when fighting Frieza, and turning Super Saiyan, which is a 50x multiplier, got him a PL of 150 mil
- 13,905
- 5,421
Actually I remember the evidence in the crt being about “battle power gets amplified” or something like that
- 13,905
- 5,421
Also it’s important to know that power level isn’t even static either, even just charging an attack would make the power of the attack greater than the actual user of said attack
and power level gets changed or concealed all the time with rage amps and stuff. It’s just not reliable.
and power level gets changed or concealed all the time with rage amps and stuff. It’s just not reliable.
- 16,286
- 17,801
That’s not always the case, only specific attacks like the Kamehameha or Makankosappo have been shown to do that. And Vegeta didn’t use an attack like that on Cui or Dodoria, he was extremely casual in both scenarios.
Amps and suppression weren’t factors here either, Vegeta’s official power level at the time was 24,000, Cui’s official power level was 18,000 and Dodoria’s official power level was 22,000. Dragon Ball just has one-shots even when the characters don’t have that much of a power difference. So a universal one-shot multiplier for scaling ain’t gonna work.
- 6,775
- 3,686
In fact, there is, outside Dragon Ball, we have Devil May Cry for example
The wiki is around for many years, this discussion was debated a lot before
- 13,905
- 5,421
First of all, this still doesn't mean that power levels are seen as linear or consistent on the wiki either way
secondly, obviously if a way a specific verse worked was completely contradicting how the wiki assumes, then of course the verse would take precedence. The suggestion was geared towards a multiplier that would be used until proven otherwise
- 19,734
- 21,223
Goku throttled Nappa with only a few time difference via basic Kaioken.
Went from stronger but still comparable, to whipping out a 2x multiplier and crippling him.
DBZ just has one shots and stomps with negligible to a few times difference at worst.
- 22,476
- 18,726
On that note, Vegeta (who was also suppressed at the time) was well under 3x Goku/full power Nappa when he one-shot Nappa.
And it's implied suppressed Vegeta could have heavily injured Kaioken x2 Goku with a single blast if he didn't make it easier to dodge.
And it's implied suppressed Vegeta could have heavily injured Kaioken x2 Goku with a single blast if he didn't make it easier to dodge.
- 13,905
- 5,421
Here’s what I would have proposed, a minimum limit for the multiplier for one shotting, perhaps 2 times would be fine enough. In the case where it’s proven that a verse has a different one shot threshold then for that verse only the standard wouldn’t apply. But just because there’s verses with an incredibly low or high multiplier, doesn’t mean we should just screw over scaling chains in the verses without an established one shot threshold, ultimately there’s no reason for us to not have a “default” multiplier assumption for when there is a lack of info. Especially considering that if there ever was a lack of one shot requirements in that verse, it would also mean the multiplier wouldn’t be inconsistent with anything either.
If the site aims to be as accurate as possible, then we should start with not having Jotaro scaling chains occur (for lack of a better term, since it’s insane how he was like 1.1 times away from the upscale value and has an absolutely massive scaling chain lol) and just go with some kind of bare minimum 2x or so multiplier for AP stomps happening, which would at least be closer to accurate than characters with insane scaling amounting to nothing.
Well this is fair. Dragon ball is just one of thousands and thousands of verses though.
This is a generalization, but I sorta agree that this can be true often. Regardless I stand by what I said above.
If the site aims to be as accurate as possible, then we should start with not having Jotaro scaling chains occur (for lack of a better term, since it’s insane how he was like 1.1 times away from the upscale value and has an absolutely massive scaling chain lol) and just go with some kind of bare minimum 2x or so multiplier for AP stomps happening, which would at least be closer to accurate than characters with insane scaling amounting to nothing.
- 22,476
- 18,726
I still say no to a minimum limit for something this insanely arbitrary (as in the thought processes of authors themselves, not your suggestion) and inconsistent in fictional media; it's literally not accurate, and that's the problem. But I'd be lying if I also said I wasn't rooting for it to happen.
- 13,905
- 5,421
I feel as though a compromise can be made if we just keep the multiplier fairly low, or compared it to real life situations, like the amount stronger you'd on average have to be to no sell an someone's full strength attack
here's my logic train, to make it the most fair
while some people would say a one shot should take 7.5 times or something, if we keep the multiplier to something low like x2 or even x1.5 then it reduces how much we downplay characters and also guarantees it's not wank.
Usually when a character scales massively above their value then we know they're way higher but can't really quantify it, maybe a character at 1 billion joules got his value by completely tanking the full force of then and casually one shotting a character who scales above another character, who scales above that 1 billion joules. While some would agree "there's no way this guy isn't like 100 times stronger", I think the safe bet is to keep a small multiplier, so while with the 1.5 it would never reach that 100 times or whatever headcanon value, it would also be significantly closer to what they should be, than what the actual value they scale to is
like, we have point A as the value they get their scaling from, and point B as their value, and point C as what a highball might look like for their scaling chain's value
it would go from being this:
A/B - - - C
to this
A - B - - - - - C
while we would retain what would be a lowball in these situations, we'd at least be getting much closer to what the truth probably is as opposed to just not having it do any amp at all.
what I'm basically saying is, while a multiplier being too high would be very bad, a multiplier being a little too low would keep things in a safe ballpark, while being a minor solution to the issue of scaling chains amounting to nothing, and people having to resort to their own headcanon in vs threads as to if a character who upscales from a value would be able to harm a character who, say, downscales from a significantly higher value (but within the same tier, or at least lower end of a higher tier or whatever)
a less controversial minimal multiplier, is far superior to no multiplier at all. There's my case.
- 656
- 664
How good Saitama as a fighter, can he defete Bang in a haxless equal stats battle
- 11,458
- 14,440
TBH there's a massive difference between knockout one-shots (wich might just be a skill/speed/the enemy being unaware difference like the anime neck slap) where even irl you can knockout someone stronger than you by landing a hit in the hit place with one punch and instant death oneshots where a character donuts or severely gores the one they killed, like Diavolo putting a hole through other stand users's chests, Saitama one-shot exploding monsters and Goku vaporizing enemies with his Kamehameha damage amp.
- 23,476
- 21,202
Saitama is a very skilled brawler. He would probably beat Bang in a stats equals no hax match.
- 13,905
- 5,421
Saitama was probably an insane martial artist in his earlier training years, since there still existed threats he had to outskill
but until cosmic garou, he had forgotten he had that potential in him, which is why he didn't know he could copy time travel unless garou reminded him of his skill. If saitama had never outclassed the rest of the verse in strength, he'd have continued being a god tier martial artist, even better than garou lol
it lines up, since he also shows some action movie looking style when fighting the subterraneans in his dream.
but until cosmic garou, he had forgotten he had that potential in him, which is why he didn't know he could copy time travel unless garou reminded him of his skill. If saitama had never outclassed the rest of the verse in strength, he'd have continued being a god tier martial artist, even better than garou lol
it lines up, since he also shows some action movie looking style when fighting the subterraneans in his dream.
- 5,133
- 1,263
nanatsu no taizai powerlevels are SHIT.
merlin is the greatest example, being blitzed by Galand and then stomping and having higher reaction speed than the two of the strongest demons without even a major buff, the only excuse for it is that she "forgot who she was" back then.......................
merlin with 4k of powerlevel is stronger than 99% of the verse
merlin is the greatest example, being blitzed by Galand and then stomping and having higher reaction speed than the two of the strongest demons without even a major buff, the only excuse for it is that she "forgot who she was" back then.......................
merlin with 4k of powerlevel is stronger than 99% of the verse
- 7,199
- 7,583
Yes, if Saitama is serious.
He casually copied several moves from Garou's God Slaying Fist, a style of fighting which, in terms of raw skill, capabilities, and power amps, dwarfs any style Bang knows into utter insignificance. Saitama has more natural stamina and endurance. Saitama has shown the ability to strategize and use his environment while in combat, though to a limited extent. And he outright learned how to manipulate time just by looking at Garou trying to do it.
Honestly, Bang gets low-diffed even with equal stats.
- 5,133
- 1,263
the same goes for kurama, which is stronger than all bijuus together, i mean, 50% kurama>>>>> 5 bijuus....
why didnt akatsuki capture kurama first with a powerful combo and then uses it to capture the left bijuus?
and she is meant to be just a % of juubis power, and yet she is stronger than all eight bijuus combined oof
why didnt akatsuki capture kurama first with a powerful combo and then uses it to capture the left bijuus?
and she is meant to be just a % of juubis power, and yet she is stronger than all eight bijuus combined oof
- 5,133
- 1,263
yes, saitama is a genius, literally
- 7,199
- 7,583
Well that makes more sense. The Merlin point is totally valid, but naturally, the plot would avoid the Akatsuki immediately targeting our MC's Tailed-Beast, especially to give Naruto the time to train and grow so he can face them without it seeming contrived. From an in-universe perspective it's weird and makes the Akatsuki look stupid, but from a story perspective I can totally understand it.the same goes for kurama, which is stronger than all bijuus together, i mean, 50% kurama>>>>> 5 bijuus....
why didnt akatsuki capture kurama first with a powerful combo and then uses it to capture the left bijuus?
and she is meant to be just a % of juubis power, and yet she is stronger than all eight bijuus combined oof
- 7,199
- 7,583
Tbh, while I'm perfectly fine with Saitama's new rate of growth, and to some extent his power mimicry, I do feel it's a bit weird to make Saitama also be a genius that can learn insane things with ease. While it sort of makes sense under the context of what the limiter actually defines (it isn't just power, but limitations as a whole, thus, removing it would make Saitama's limit of knowledge also removed), it still just feels weird for Saitama to apparently be the most skilled fighter in existence when he feels like it, especially because a consistent plot point used as a joke is that Saitama isn't very bright or talented. Even ONE himself has said that Saitama'd be terrible in sports because Saitama doesn't know how to play sports.
- 16,286
- 17,801
I recall there being a thing where the Akatsuki were supposed to capture the Bijuu in number order, from the One-Tail to the Nine-Tails, but they kinda just… didn’t do that in canon so I dunno what the deal was.
- 13,905
- 5,421
I think the intended interpretation is that saitama is an incredible guy, but he got so strong that he was never able to express himself any more, so he just comes off as a boring dude
think back to his training and drive to fight monsters, back when he was working insanely hard to become strong. It'd make sense that in that time, he adapted some martial arts skill to become the strongest fighter he could. He used to use effort, but he became laid back since nothing can even be an obstacle to him anymore
- 24,317
- 37,750
Yeah cause the statue would've shat itself from the disorder in power
They most definitely did
- 16,286
- 17,801
Pretty sure they captured Fu before Gaara, unless I’m thinking of non-canon shit.
- 5,133
- 1,263
this theory is totally ******* when you remember that the first bijuus captured were 5 tails and 7 tails.
actually, shukaku was the third one
naruto's verse is nonsense
- 16,286
- 17,801
It’s not a theory, it’s canon, and I literally said that the Akatsuki didn’t actually do it in order
- 5,133
- 1,263
no, they did capture Fuu and Han before.
Deidara mentioned this, when talking to Naruto.
he said that Gaara was the only jinchuriki which friends were there for him and came to rescue after being captured by akatsuki
Last edited:
- 5,133
- 1,263
not talking about YOUR theory, i'm talking about anime's logic, just didnt express myself correctlyIt’s not a theory, it’s canon, and I literally said that the Akatsuki didn’t actually do it in order
- 2,280
- 1,850
Not really because Saitama is explicitly stated to have no limit to his growth numerous times. Although you really have to stretch to argue against Garou getting to 3A, for Saitama it's physically impossible to deny that he could reach that level.
Similar threads
