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Tier High 6-A The Battle of the Beast Tournament (2023): Tatsumaki vs Yami Ichika
- Thread starter DemonicDude
- Start date
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I never voted for Ichika??????
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Can someone do an actual recount of the votes, just to make sure people who voted for tatsumaki weren’t counted as voting for ichika
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- Thread starter
- #324
it's old votes message
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You can already get your L bro, there is no changing it.
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???
he didn't vote he just said he's leaning towards tatsumaki which by the way you put that he voted for ichika.
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“3 upscales” means nothing without the specifications of it.
You can upscale from a guy by punching him in the face and knocking him out instantly. You can also upscale from someone by twisting them into meat paste on a cellular level. Upscaling from the former is basically nothing at all in comparison. Tatsumaki is realms beyond her high 6-A value with her scaling chain, which you haven’t demonstrated is the same case with ichika.
this is the 2nd time in a row he’s put a tatsumaki voter on ichika’s side
the match can’t go into grace until a recount is done, or else it’s gonna be invalid.
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Flawed logic.
A gifted character would go for durability negation if their AP didn’t work (which doesn’t apply in this situation since tatsumaki AP stomps anyways). So far her AP was able to crush the most powerful opponent that she’s fought until saitama into paste, so of course she wouldn’t use durability negation.
We do not need to prove that it is in-character for her to do it, because her intelligence rating lets us know that she has something called common sense, which would prevent her from doing stupid things like that. This is like saying that tatsumaki couldn’t escape a house fire because we haven’t seen her open doors and therefore there’s no proof that it’s in-character to open doors.
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Tatsumaki couldn't swim because she hasn't shown she could swim. This is literally the rule on shit like that.
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To be fair, swimming is a skill that’s learned, not necessarily something an untrained person can do. However, if someone who can swim is fighting someone who is allergic to water, then they would know to jump in the water, even if they’ve never shown that they know how to fight a person with water allergies before.
In this case tatsumaki knows how to dura neg, and would do it if she’s fighting someone allergic to dura neg.
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When did Tats use dura neg in combat?
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I am in a hostage situation
Jim has a loaded gun in his hands
I find out that Jimmy has never killed somebody before
It must be out of character for him to kill me
I should walk up to him and try to punch him, there is clearly no way he’d shoot me, it’s out of character
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Also psykorochi was technically dura negated since she was crushed on a cellular level along with all of her roots
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liked that you wrote my nick correctly, i acknowledge you
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she doenst need to use in combat to proof thar she can use it in combat
she used a MUCH HIGHER SKILLED TECHINIC and you think that she cant simply destroy you from the inside out?
as i said, using psykorochi’s as argument is meaningless since she was fully protected by the forceshield around her, prevent any telekinesis’ assault from tatsumaki.
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And for those who voted Ichika FRA, I would appreciate a check-in to see if you have anything to add regarding new counterarguments made since your votes
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I still vote Yami
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Tatsumaki used to have regen/dura negation for that but it was taken off after a CRT Gin made to take it off so I don't think you can use that as an argument.
For the in character stuff, I'm just being consistent with the assumptions everyone else uses for other characters, Tatsumaki has shown that she can manipulate air and we've seen her level of accuracy with her TK from the pill feat she had however no one would argue that she could manipulate the air inside your lungs and pull them out to suffocate you because she's never shown she would do something like that, even if it should be plausible due to her intelligence level.
The hostage example you gave also is somewhat flawed as it is a person holding a gun to your face which would naturally obviously suggest they may be trying to kill you even if they haven't done so before.
In Tatsumaki's case she has several options beyond using pure Ap, such as trying to twist or tear her a part, trying to pierce her with sharp rock spears, trying to crush her within rocks, trying to do that weird muscle thing she did to Saitama etc
These are all things she has done before that we've watched her do before ever resorting to Dura negation. I'd be open to the idea that she might use it once all options are exhausted but I disagree with assuming it will be her go to right after Ap doesn't work because we can't confirm it.
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Could you list down the new counterarguments
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Tatsumaki wasn’t fighting to kill when fighting saitama, so anything related to that is an invalid point for what she would do in a battle to the death like this one.
For the record, Tatsumaki’s AP alone shitstomps her just with the massive upscale on top of massive upscale that should allow her to one shot anyways. But if for some reason her full AP didn’t work, then she’d just immediately go for something fatal with durability negation
Actually the play there would just be to pull out their lungs, which tatsumaki would be smart enough to do if raw power couldn’t win and she was willing to kill. Relatively simple there.
It’s the fact that tatsumaki also has a figurative gun in this situation in the form of her durability negation. The only reason she’s never used it is because her enemies have all been ants that she can just stomp on with her AP, and because she’s presumably not willing to kill against saitama.
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Also can I just add that a lot of the votes are based on the blatant misinformation that Tatsumaki’s scaling chain isn’t allowed to consider her as having the AP advantage in this match, which is concerning to say the least since that contradicts literally every other vs match’s common practice and literally has no wiki standard to back it up
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Yami FRA
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Personally I agree with her having an AP advantage and I'd vote for her if it wasn't for site rules preventing her from upscaling above the AP gap.
The Dura negation thing you could argue why didn't Tatsumaki Dura neg jet Psykos while she was getting combo'd in order to ensure her death instead of creating a massive drill instead?
Pulling out someone's lungs seems more difficult then simply pulling away the air inside someones lungs as you have to still have to rely on raw power to do so.
Despite having genius intelligence in regards to his combat, we never argue Goku would overcome an AP gap by using instant transmission to charge a kamehameha or spirit bomb for one hour and then coming back to launch it in the opponents face.
Even if you want to use the argument of "Goku wants to have fun so he wouldn't do that" (so out of character):
Vegeta himself has access to moves like kienzan and dirty fireworks, two moves that dura neg (kienzan being accepted to cut characters way stronger than the user and dirty fireworks blowing you up inside out) however android or buu saga Vegeta isn't argued to use them because he doesn't use it even in scenarios that make sense for a combat genius like him to use (who would have less inhibitions than Goku in regards to hsing them).
If these characters, especially Vegeta who has shown to have Dura neg and use it in a prior key but is never argued to use it in future keys, are not argued to use techniques that they haven't shown to use in combat in character then I imagine the same would go for Tatsumaki.
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It isn't allowed, because while you can definitely make note of her scaling chain, you can never really concretely tell how strong this makes her. It's just unquantifiably much higher. Dismiss it all you want, that's just how it is.
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Ichika also has 3 upscale chain of her own which makes Tatsumaki’s two one shot less meaningful. But yeah like you said, Tats can’t just be at an advantage via in-verse one shots based on our standards.
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Was it always like that or did it get changed recently? I remember participating in quite a few matches were the one-shot scaling chain thing lead to one-shotting characters in a match. Same with the undamaged by X tons thing.
Still, this is probably for the best since it makes matches with shounen characters with massive scaling chains much easier.
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I think it was always like this. Infact the only time I know of that the scaling chain was used as a match decided was when both parties were comparable in AP.
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It’s not directly quantifiable, but we are completely allowed to estimate the range of AP that a character should be superior to, hence us using common sense to say that tatsumaki is most likely far over 2 times stronger than a character who can get blown into pieces by a character who tatsumaki was able to then into blood paste.
I can guarantee that not a single person here actually buys that tatsumaki isn’t over twice as strong as orochi. The only thing stopping people from saying otherwise is a wiki rule that….doesn’t even exist in the first place?
See again, Jotaro Kujo not being upgraded to 8-B because everyone decided that his high 8-C upscaling chain would make him able to hurt character above baseline 8-B, meaning 8-B would be a downgrade from at least high 8-C likely far higher/even higher
It’s a common practice that happens constantly in vs threads. Hell, even in an Orochi vs Boros match, Gaia Cannon and Collapsing Star Roaring Cannon were virtually the exact same in AP since Gaia cannon upscales from about half the AP of CSRC
TL;DR: source?
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Are any of these upscales even remotely comparable to the amount of upscaling tatsumaki gets from instantly grinding psykos into meat paste? I’m going to take a wild guess and say no, but you can elaborate if you want.
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This is just wrong. Because obviously any estimates made will contain some bias in them, like assuming the upscale is enough to surpass Ichika because you want Tatsumaki to win, or me assuming it's not enough because I want Ichika to win.
The case of Jotaro is similar, it's unquantifiable just how much he scales above his High 8-C value. No estimation is a correct one
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Bro, what I'm trying to tell you is that if Tats doesn't start immediately with dura neg (which I'm sure was removed in a Gin CRT), Tats is just going to be stomped into oblivion. And Tats has never started with tough neg, not even against blatantly dangerous Dragon-level opponents.
And what does this information change here?
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Honestly, if Ziller is going to continue to sustain his vote on bullshits that VsB doesn't follow, Ziller's vote should be removed.
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