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Naruto God Tiers Downgrade (Continued)

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No, it really doesn't.

The word "hurled" literally means throwing something with great power behind it. Throwing the moon at any speed would qualify.
 
Meaning: "Throwing something with great force."

If you pushed the Moon into the Earth at any speed, it would crush the planet into fine powder, alongside the Moon itself. So it does indeed qualify.
 
Kepekley23 said:
No, it really doesn't.
The word "hurled" literally means throwing something with great power behind it. Throwing the moon at any speed would qualify.
Click to expand...
Considering when Naruto and Sasuke did the exact same thing and the moon was hurled into the sky extremely quickly, this is not the case.
 
Considering when Naruto and Sasuke did the exact same thing and the moon was hurled into the sky extremely quickly, this is not the case.

Was hurled a few thousand kilometers away quickly, indeed. Not 384,400km away. The point you made disproves the point you're trying to make.

What Hagoromo and Hamura do qualify as hurling. They hurl it towards the atmosphere and it rises up quickly into low-orbit, but nowhere near enough to reach 384,400km in 30 minutes.
 
Is it used hurled in the original or something else? Is it possible to find the raw and translate the word because finding precisely which word is used is important in this type of things.
 
Lets not be stupid here people if your hurling something it has to travel at a high speed.


noun the act of throwing or casting, especially with great force or strength.


If you disagree with this please stay in school, so yes blasting is a good synonym for it.
 
> Lets not be stupid here people if your hurling something it has to travel at a high speed

Dozens of kilometers per second is indeed a very high speed, but nowhere near enough to qualify for the assumptions we use.

Rockets shoot up into the sky at high speeds, indeed, yet they take many days to reach the moon. If you tossed a ball so high into the sky that it became a dot, it would appear to have been hurled.

We literally see what is meant by "hurling" here - ie, they toss the Moon at the atmosphere (atmosphere) at very high speeds. But 384400km is much, much, unfathomably farther. It's a complete stretch to make, and the evidence we originally thought supported it, doesn't actually support it.
 
I agree with Kep. I also appreciate the tone of his arguments over others.
 
Sera EX said:
Don't start with the low-key insults.
Click to expand...
No promises but i will dial it back this thread and the one before just dosent makes sense anymore i mean do the pro downgraders know what they are debating anymore aside from Kep who is the only one makimg any efforts here.


The others just dont.


Also If you tossed a ball so high into the sky that it became a dot, it would appear to have been hurled. it is still hurled because in order for it to become a dot you need to throw it with tremendous strenght and since the moon is obviously way heavier then a rocket or a ball.


You need a bigger amount of strenght to launch it out of the atmosphere since theres still the fact that gravity and air/wind pressure would try to slow the object down.

Plus for toss noun:throw (something) somewhere lightly, easily, or casually.

Theres a obvious reasonn why they used hurl instead of toss since the only 2 definition of hurl is again great force or strenght where as toss is much more ambiguous if you dont have the right context for using it.
 
But in the DB Kakashi kamui literally is said to hurl things away in a different space and the anime shows how fast that is
 
> You need a bigger amount of strenght to launch it out of the atmosphere since theres still the fact that gravity and air/wind pressure would try to slow the object down.

Yes - accomplishing such a feat only requires that the Moon travel at somewhat higher than escape velocity, ie 15 kilometers per second, nowhere near 200 kilometers per second which is what the 30 minutes require. The moon reaching 384,400km within 30 minutes is completely unsupported. The anime, which we previously tried to use to support those 30 minutes, show the moon traveling out of the atmosphere slowly and reaching its position unspecified hours later. Again, not anywhere near what we previously sold it at.
 
Anyway going back to creeping mode and so far tatahakai pretty much debunked everything in both threads and there are way more people that disagree with the downgrades then the one's who agrees but because of what IMade did in the last thread going behind people's back in a middle of the debate when it was clearly far from finished to proceed with his debunked and baseless downgrade.

we need Ant over here to supervise this or other more trust worthy people here unless you guys have a solution for it please do tell.


And no im not being harsh you just don't do that in this wiki you guys could literally re-read the first thread for this and it is obvious what was going on especially some people who went out of there way to derail the first thread in some parts.


But yeah i give him the benefit of the doubt but i say we shouldn't count his vote or he shouldn't have the final say.

He can still debate obviously and if he doea debunk us then he wins simple as that.
 
Id honestly rather shift the debate too see if we even accept Hagoromo's calc to begin with tbh.

If Kep has an issue, then we should take his opinion very seriously and probably proceed with the downgrade.

That is...if he is willing to recalc it.
 
TataHakai said:
The moon timeframe debate should probaly be saved for another CRT.
Click to expand...
But...this is revisions for 5-B Naruto.

And that is the reason why Naruto is 5-B.

Isnt that why we made this CRT to begin with?

Edit: It won't take a few replies at best.

Someone recalcs it, get a new value. Still continue on with the debate.
 
SinsofMan said:
Id honestly rather shift the debate too see if we even accept Hagoromo's calc to begin with tbh.

If Kep has an issue, then we should take his opinion very seriously and probably proceed with the downgrade.

That is...if he is willing to recalc it.
Click to expand...

I don't understand your comment. If the calc was never accepted we wouldn't have even applied it. It was controversial as well
 
AstralKing7 said:
I don't understand your comment. If the calc was never accepted we wouldn't have even applied it. It was controversial as well
Click to expand...
It is easy to understand.

It was accepted.

Kep admitted now that the calc has an issue.

Thus, it needs to be recalced.

Because he accepted it to begin with.

Edit: I am not trying to turn this into a red herring, I still am not for the downgrade.

But if Kep has an issue, I honestly think he has a sort final say on if the calc is fine to begin with.
 
SinsofMan said:
TataHakai said:
The moon timeframe debate should probaly be saved for another CRT.
Click to expand...
But...this is revisions for 5-B Naruto.
And that is the reason why Naruto is 5-B.

Isnt that why we made this CRT to begin with?

Edit: It won't take a few replies at best.

Someone recalcs it, get a new value. Still continue on with the debate.
Click to expand...
this revision is for whether Hagoromo split his power in half for sasuke and naruto
 
which is what would be done later, for now we have to decide whether they scale from it or not, or else recalcing it is a moot point anyway.

First we decided whether they scale. After thatshadow posts his stuff and we have this entire thing done. Then we get the recalc done.

Simple and easy.
 
TataHakai said:
snip
Click to expand...
Last comment on this, I swear. But you just said it is dependant on Hagoromo's splitting his power with Sasuke and Naruto.

If the calc is wrong, then the value he gave half to each is inflated.

This isnt hard. I get how this wiki works, but we have done recalcs in a CRT before.

Each issue gets a CRT, but if there is an issue with the calc to begin with, it should be addressed here.

But I wont push this if Kep wont push this.

Still fine with where they are.
 
I'm starting to think the verse needs a calc revision in general for the top tiers, the shinjuu's tree height is heavily contested and there are tons of calcs involving it for it to be left as is.
 
@Imade

Apparently you didn't read the scan at all then, Hashirama literally states that he's giving Sasuke his Chakra as well, not just a Jutsu:

"I'll give you all of my remaining Chakra... so stop Madara."

It's my bad, for some reason imgur isn't accessible in my country which I need to use vpn which is slowing my net but you should post on OP.

  • You focus chakra but Hashirama says in the scans I posted let me give you a jutsu and Sasuke asks A jutsu and Hashirama confirms it. In your scan, he says Madara's stolen my senjutsu chakra. This is a jutsu that'll react to that chakra and bind him and then I'll give you all my remaining chakra.
>In this sca and some others we know Madara's Rinnegan awakening process.

  • Madara stole Hashirama's flesh and stitched to himself while young but Rinnegan didn't awaken.
  • While he nearly dying from old age Rinnegan awakened because Asura and Indra's chakra merged.
  • So Indra and Ashura's chakra need merge to Rinnegan awaken.
>Hashirama gives all of his remaining chakra to Sasuke for a jutsu. It's like how you claim Hagoromo gave the seals which are the thing that contains all of his chakra he gave.

  • I'm asking this did Hashirama's chakra merged with Sasuke's?
  • We know Naruto awakened Six Paths Senjutsu since in order to make Truth Seeking Balls you need Six Paths Senjutsu:
Ninjutsu - Truth-Seeking Balls
No rank, all ranges, offensive, defensive, supplementary
Users: Naruto Uzumaki, Obito Uchiha, Madara Uchiha

The one who carries the truth-seeking black orbs will be granted the truth of all things!!

*Those who blossomed the Senjutsu of Six Paths wear these black orbs, encompassing the power of all five natures and Yin―Yang. Floating behind the user in the form of a circle, each of the orbs can be manipulated at will. Although each is the size of a fist, hidden inside those orbs is the power to easily obliterate an entire forest. By simply understanding the power of all things in creation, the black orbs can be freely altered in their shape and the multiple natures inside can be combined to reveal a variety of effects. This is a power that easily exceeds both "Kekkei Genkai" and "Kekkei Tota"!

  • Six Paths Senjutsu = 9 Bijuu Chakra. The points are obvious in the fact those who had Truth Seeking Balls were solely those who had the Chakra of the 9 Bijuu. Obito, Madara and Naruto. Sasuke never got Six Paths Senjutsu because he didn't have the Chakra of the 9 Bijuu and he never had Truth Seeking Balls.
Obito and Madara don't have 9 Bijuu, they have 10-TAILS/JUUBI.

>You say Six Paths Senjutsu=9 Bijuu. TSOs were solely for who had the chakra of 9 Bijuu but there is no indication anywhere. Let's list who has TSO.

Sasuke's Six Paths Susano'o has more chakra of each of the 9 Bijuu than Naruto normally -later in their fight Sasuke comments on it even - but we don't see the TSBs anywhere near the Susano'o.

Madara and Obito are Jinchüriki of the Juubi. Juubi is not some of its parts. This means 10Tails =/= 9T+8T+7T+6T+5T+4T+3T+2T+1T in chakra or power and Juubi is a completely different entity thaother Bijuus and the Gedo Statue.

Hagoromo and Hamura while when they sealing their mother have their TSO staff before becoming JJ and awakening Tenseigan.

Even after dividing 10 tails into 9 Bijuu Hagoromo still has TSO staff of Six Paths Senjutsu. Now you gonna argue he take chakra from the tailed beasts?

Hagoromo's soul still has TSO and the markings of the Six Paths Senjutsu which we know he isn't the JJ anymore as he the Juubi divided, died and now Madara is the JJ.

After losing the Juubi, Madara and Obito lost the TSOs and Hagoromo didn't.

  • I have no idea what this is in response to.
> Pretty much comparing Madara and Obito's Juubi power up with 9 Bijuu who gave some of their chakra to Naruto. Naruto and Sasuke's Susano'o is not Gedo Statue and doesn't compare.

And all Ashura and Indra stuff.

Why the heck I disagree with it. Hagoromo only gave Ashura the leadership of the Ninshu as he clearly says.

Viz translation use bequeath and I go with that. Reading bequeath means it's clear it's power over his creed he gave Ashura.

But he still gave Naruto and Sasuke his powers as he can't give any position of power in any organization.
 
Well unless we have another calc that puts God tiers at 5B then that just means this thread should be closed and we should try to find that one other 5B by Madara or recalc the current 5B calc we are using
 
Not only 5-B, but the possibly 5-C on Obito page should be really proven to be legit.
 
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