Low 6-B Bone Crusher Tournament: Group A - Hashirama (Naruto) vs Zapdos (Pokemon)

[DemonicDude]

Group A:
Round 11:
Same Rules as stated in the Tournament.
We are reaching towards the end As this is the 4th match of Hashirama who is looking to make a statement after back to back loses this time against dual-type electric Pokemon who is in the same boat as him, Will the Titan of Lightning capitalize on this oppertunity or Sage mode of the first Hokage out do the legendary Pokemon ?
Results:
Sage Mode Hashirama (Naruto):
Zapdos (Pokemon): 11 (Arceus, Charmander, Imgynium, Finepoint, DD, Nierre, Popted, Anonymous, Ninja, Daffy, Legendary)
Inconclusive:

 

[FinePoint]

So, if my memory serves me correctly from the last match, Hashirama can use a large assortment of hax via thought which made that match a stomp.
Isn't that what's going to happen here as well?

 

[Nierre]

Hmm well if Zapdos can amp his speed, he can probably fly and dodge Hashirama's attacks. It also has precog apparently?

 

[FinePoint]

Hmm well if Zapdos can amp his speed, he can probably fly and dodge Hashirama's attacks. It also has precog apparently?

Through detect, probably. It's a move.

• Detect: Zapdos sees its opponent's next move and dodges it.

They can't attack at the same time, though they can right after it. It can be used to dodge attacks that would otherwise be problematic.

 

[Nierre]

Okay well regardless, I doubt Zapdos is gonna do any lasting damage. I don't even see a wincon for Zapdos. Hashirama can heal, block with his wood attacks, really just stay back and spam.

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Not sure if detect could handle multiple opponents at once, since Hashimira has this:

• Mokuton: Mokujin no Jutsu (Wood Release: Wood Human Technique): The user creates a gigantic wood statue to combat a similar-sized opponent such as Madara's Final Susanoo or the Biju. It is durable and fast enough to catch a Bijudama shot from Kurama and survive its explosion with the Mokuton: Hōbi no Jutsu.

Plus, I think like it was said before, Zapdos can't attack and use detect at the same time...

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Actually though, It says Zapdos is at LEAST ftl, compared to Hashimira's Revalistic... unless speed is equal, he might Blitz

 

[FinePoint]

Actually though, It says Zapdos is at LEAST ftl, compared to Hashimira's Revalistic... unless speed is equal, he might Blitz

Speed is equal.

Not sure if detect could handle multiple opponents at once, since Hashimira has this:

I believe it can, as detect works in Battle Royals.
Unsure if this ever occurs in the anime, though.

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Well, with equal speed, then Hashimama stomps, So... Table

 

[Popted2]

Hashirama FRA

 

[Imaginym]

Well, with equal speed, then Hashimama stomps, So... Table

Hashirama stomps? Why is that?

 

[DemonicDude]

Hashirama stomps? Why is that?

Hashirama's himself is physically High 7-A he is only Low 6-B with Wood construct, Zapdos doesn't have Wincon so far unless you have one.

 

[Imaginym]

What are Hashirama's Win Conditions? What is his in-character behaviour in Sage Mode?

 

[DemonicDude]

He uses Sleep Hax and Wood golem
Here are his wincons

 

[Arceus0x]

Dang bro you're disappointing me again. One of the wincons in the thing you linked is literally "wall of haxes" like isn't this a mid-low hax tournament? What the heck bro?

 

[DemonicDude]

Zapdos has Haxes too he just doesn't use detect and attack at the same time, plus Hashi has been at disadvantage for being High 7-A literally anyone can one tap if they resist it.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Dang bro you're disappointing me again. One of the wincons in the thing you linked is literally "wall of haxes" like isn't this a mid-low hax tournament? What the heck bro?

Because well it is wall of haxes I can’t be listing them

 

[FinePoint]

Zapdos has Haxes too he just doesn't use detect and attack at the same time, plus Hashi has been at disadvantage for being High 7-A literally anyone can one tap if they resist it.

If they resist the entire wall of hax?
I don't see how being physically weak changes anything if nobody can harm him before being haxed to death.

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

I'm wondering if Zapdos has longer range...

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

If so, Zapdos could likely blast him from high enough in the sky to avoid most of his stuff

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

And, it'd be in character, since Zapdos has been said to be kinda cowardly

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

ah, nope, Hashirama has longer range, the only hope Zapdos has is outlasting Sage mode, But I'm voting against Zapdos

 

[PrinceofPein]

If so, Zapdos could likely blast him from high enough in the sky to avoid most of his stuff

Hashirama wood is low6b and that’s what he would defend with

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

Hashirama wood is low6b and that’s what he would defend with

The strat I had in mind, was Zapdos stays out of range, and outlasts his sage mode, before one shotting him with Ancient power, the flaw being here, Is that I assumed Zapdos had longer range, which it doesn't, making this stategy obsolete, the best Zapdos can do is spam detect... which could also possibly outlast Sage mode...

 

[DemonicDude]

If they resist the entire wall of hax?
I don't see how being physically weak changes anything if nobody can harm him before being haxed to death.

Obviously not everyone is gotta be 100 percent equally resisting each others Haxes or there would be inconclusive matches left and right what's the diff then, There are going to be matches where you just can't win when people were picking their groups and looking at Brackets didn't anyone thought "maybe I should pick someone who can resist most if not all of what Hashirama got ? Or Asta?" Obviously matches are not made on equality but participants still had a chance to look at what group they wanna join and who is in it and who should they pick and why. Some matches you would have that hax advantage & in some you won't, My apologies tho

 

[PrinceofPein]

The strat I had in mind, was Zapdos stays out of range, and outlasts his sage mode, before one shotting him with Ancient power, the flaw being here, Is that I assumed Zapdos had longer range, which it doesn't, making this stategy obsolete, the best Zapdos can do is spam detect... which could also possibly outlast Sage mode...

There is a bit of misinformation here
He can’t outlast hashirama sage mode as unlike Naruto hashirama can fight while staying perfectly still on the 10,000 arms budhha

 

[FinePoint]

Obviously not everyone is gotta be 100 percent equally resisting each others Haxes or there would be inconclusive matches left and right what's the diff then, There are going to be matches where you just can't win when people were picking their groups and looking at Brackets didn't anyone thought "maybe I should pick someone who can resist most if not all of what Hashirama got ? Or Asta?" Obviously matches are not made on equality but participants still had a change to look at what group they wanna join and who is in it and who should they pick and why. Some matches you would have that hax advantage & in some you won't, My apologies tho

Well when picking characters, they likely didn't think they'd have to account for resisting this many hax abilities, since the rules said none of them should be stomp-worthy.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

None of his hax are stomp worthy tho? Sleep hax is hardly some niche power that rarely shows up and wouldn’t have many that can resist it. This is just a luck of the draw thing that resulted in an unfortunate matchup.

 

[FinePoint]

None of his hax are stomp worthy tho? Sleep hax is hardly some niche power that rarely shows up and wouldn’t have many that can resist it. This is just a luck of the draw thing that resulted in an unfortunate matchup.

The linked argument just said "wall of hax", I don't think Sleep Manipulation is their only wincon.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

The linked argument just said "wall of hax", I don't think Sleep Manipulation is their only wincon.

Except it really is. His “wall of hax” is just a bunch of elemental attacks, barriers, sleep hax, perception manip that he doesn’t use, chakra absorption/suppression that requires his wood dragon to constrict the opp (and likely wouldn’t work anyway), a bunch of side effects that only come about if you absorb his energy or cells, and sealing which requires him to bury Zapdos under a bunch of tori gates. If he can land hits on a speed amped Zapdos, Zapdos is gonna lose regardless of the hax.

 

[FinePoint]

Except it really is. His “wall of hax” is just a bunch of elemental attacks, barriers, sleep hax, perception manip that he doesn’t use, chakra absorption/suppression that requires his wood dragon to constrict the opp (and likely wouldn’t work anyway), a bunch of side effects that only come about if you absorb his energy or cells, and sealing which requires him to bury Zapdos under a bunch of tori gates. If he can land hits on a speed amped Zapdos, Zapdos is gonna lose regardless of the hax.

Okay. Others have claimed his other hax are valid winconcs.
This character confuses me, and I know nothing about him.
I'm in zero position to debate the validity of either side, so I'm just going to abstain from voting for now.

Some scans would help.

 

[Arceus0x]

Oh so his abilities were kinda overrated in that description? In that case can't Zapdos speed boost and paralyze? It's detect is a valid option too and considering their AP isn't too far off it shouldn't be much trouble

 

[DemonicDude]

What are the conclusions here ?

 

[The_Legendary_Vin]

I vote for

Hashirama​

(Yes that was copy pasted)

 

[DannyF97]

Going to abstain until Hashirama is better elaborated (Blank's post is a step in the right direction) because that should change enough to give Zapdos a more real chance.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Voting Hashi. He will just toss up walls forever, can fight all night at full capacity, can sit tight for “infinite” SM, and just outlast Zapdos afaik.

 

[Popted2]

Grace

 

[GodlyCharmander]

I don't believe Hashirama can outlast Zapdos given the fact the bird has the ability Pressure, which makes your stamina gets drained faster while fighting it.

It has been concluded that Zapdos has a thousand ways of keeping it's distance and dodging via speed amps and flight, so Hashi isn't hitting the bird anytime soon. And his flying type attacks have two times the usual effect against nature-based (Grass Type) attacks.

So... What's Hashirama's woods durability?

 

[FinePoint]

I don't believe Hashirama can outlast Zapdos given the fact the bird has the ability Pressure, which makes your stamina gets drained faster while fighting it.

It has been concluded that Zapdos has a thousand ways of keeping it's distance and dodging via speed amps and flight, so Hashi isn't hitting the bird anytime soon. And his flying type attacks have two times the usual effect against nature-based (Grass Type) attacks.

So... What's Hashirama's woods durability?

Type effectiveness only works against Pokémon, not against others.
Grass Types are weak to Flying Types, but Flying Types aren't strong against all fictional grass.

 

[GodlyCharmander]

Type effectiveness only works against Pokémon, not against others.
Grass Types are weak to Flying Types, but Flying Types aren't strong against all fictional grass.

That'd be hilarious. But nope, Pokemon often get affected by elemental stuff from other shows, taking twice the amount of damage that'd cause normally. I do not think we have such double standards to consider pokemon elemental weakness something universally accepted, but not pokemon elemental advantages.

Either way, let's not forgot about Naruto's own type match ups.

Mokuton is made out of Water Style and Earth Style. Earth is weak to lightning, and water is weak to Earth. Zapdos' attacks are definitely being upscaled far higher than its usual AP either way.