- 26,160
- 3,653
Yes. And it didn't have much of anything to hook me to it.
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Ikki's fights, skills and character.
- Thread starter Firephoenixearl
- Start date
- 26,160
- 3,653
The thing I dislike most about Rakudai is that, as far as I am awere, no one really gets close to doing the stuff Ikki does while being cripplingly weak. He had nothing making him special, but apparently no other F class dude ever tried as hard as he did since he is pretty damn special.
Like, someone somewhere was aught to have trained as hard as him, no? And the idea of him being innately more skilled just goes against the whole point, so...
Like, someone somewhere was aught to have trained as hard as him, no? And the idea of him being innately more skilled just goes against the whole point, so...
- 20,509
- 1,590
- Thread starter
- #163
That's actually explained.
1. It needs insane willpower. Like he was being kicked out of society, almost killed, attacked, expelled, banished by his parents etc. Literally the only reason Ikki could actually do it was cus first he admired Ryouma and second because Ryouma himself, his idol, encouraged him when Ikki was just about to break down.
2. F ranks are just as rare if not more rare than A ranks. And A ranks as you may know are literally born once in several decades. Imagine an F rank.
3. Being a blazer is not mandatory. As Ikki's father said, he could have just continued a normal life.
4. Other people with magic aren't as skilled cus it's pointless to train that hard. Like Stella with raw talent actually beat Ikki (in the 2nd fight before Ikki became a desperado but i won't count that as pure skill). When you can amp to oblivion and do stuff like Fate and Probability hax people to oblivio or even Time hax or EE people, it's pointless you would generally gain a lot more from training your ability.
1. It needs insane willpower. Like he was being kicked out of society, almost killed, attacked, expelled, banished by his parents etc. Literally the only reason Ikki could actually do it was cus first he admired Ryouma and second because Ryouma himself, his idol, encouraged him when Ikki was just about to break down.
2. F ranks are just as rare if not more rare than A ranks. And A ranks as you may know are literally born once in several decades. Imagine an F rank.
3. Being a blazer is not mandatory. As Ikki's father said, he could have just continued a normal life.
4. Other people with magic aren't as skilled cus it's pointless to train that hard. Like Stella with raw talent actually beat Ikki (in the 2nd fight before Ikki became a desperado but i won't count that as pure skill). When you can amp to oblivion and do stuff like Fate and Probability hax people to oblivio or even Time hax or EE people, it's pointless you would generally gain a lot more from training your ability.
- 173
- 21
That would be interesting, if his development wasn't entirely thrown through exposition. What you really watch these fight for is not for him but the method, some of which are increasingly precise and it got to the point where they seemed flawed in execution. Sometimes the expense of these fights take away the credibility of his opponents ability and this is when people begin to see through the skill that he presents. He is the mid point for OP characters, not good or bad and that comes down to how fast he prepares which are made cheap and easy by his eyes and blade steal and also with no room to mentally grow. However, to balance that out he has a motivation and that is deal breaker that stops him from being a bad OP character. Now to comment on the unpredictable fights and I have to admit, they sometimes can be from a technical standard but when that doesn't hit it feels like a cop out. If it continues with the Ikki-streak, it woud become repetitive. From what I see of Ikki right now, his traites would have been better for a mentor character.
- 20,509
- 1,590
- Thread starter
- #165
Well he is supposed to be a form of mentor that's why the very first thing that happens in the show is kurono saying "Follow Kurogane's footsteps" and he actually opens up a mini fighting school.
Though i'll have to disgress on the "repetitiveness". He almost never wins 2 fights the same way.
Though i'll have to disgress on the "repetitiveness". He almost never wins 2 fights the same way.
- 173
- 21
And that was a neat touch but it really didn't seem too serious about it.
- 26,160
- 3,653
There are people that gain sexual pleasure from ripping their body apart in an attempt to become stronger. There would be someone that would keep pushing themselves till they can, magic or not.
- 20,509
- 1,590
- Thread starter
- #168
Though what i love about the Ikki fights, they are made in such a way that he doens't win through ass pulls or bland ways like "lol rasetsu right off the bat". He actually counters all of the enemies techniques before winning.
Against Kirihara he countered invisibility (instead of as actually stated just winning the fight right away).
Against Stella he countered all of her attacks.
Against touka he countered her speed, and counters all of her abilities later on etc.
But about that teaching thing. It feels like that cus it wasn't the scope of the show. But he is supposed to be a mentor. Like in every case it is just him showing others what he can do and people being amazed and trying to learn from him. Especially in the Vermillion Empire arc where he fights in the war, he feels EXTREMELY mentor-esque.
Against Kirihara he countered invisibility (instead of as actually stated just winning the fight right away).
Against Stella he countered all of her attacks.
Against touka he countered her speed, and counters all of her abilities later on etc.
But about that teaching thing. It feels like that cus it wasn't the scope of the show. But he is supposed to be a mentor. Like in every case it is just him showing others what he can do and people being amazed and trying to learn from him. Especially in the Vermillion Empire arc where he fights in the war, he feels EXTREMELY mentor-esque.
- 10,462
- 1,521
With the price of death.Firephoenixearl said:
- 10,462
- 1,521
I like when a character can legit lose a fight though he's the main one, or most OP one.
- 20,509
- 1,590
- 15,998
- 6,001
While I haven't read it, imo, I don't hate Ikki nor Rakudai as a whole. I find it pretty silly to hate an entire verse and or list yourself as an opponent of the verse simply because of the character's abilities, not their actual character.
- 4,498
- 1,117
I do agree that I would have preferred more of a "show don't tell" approach to Ikki's character, but he at least comes across as likeable and driven enough that I can still root for him. Also I love his and Stella's relationship, and Stella herself
- 8,753
- 1,617
Like I said before, I really couldn't care less how unlikely or improbable the chances of a character winning are. There's a reason they are improbable, not impossible.
What I care for is the process of battle, aside from whether it is entertaining or not, as past things build up to cement the decisions the protagonist makes, the trump cards that he pulls off, the hardships that have molded him, etc.
Just see, again, my example with Yukihira Soma. Someone who knows about cooking can just see Souma's ingredients and many times guess what he's doing just from his past recipes and his personality. Likewise for Souma's opponents or allies. Or Negi Vs Rakan, where Negi has to train like a goddamn lunatic, pull off every trump cars he can imagine because schemes and applying difficult magic is his forte, and all the while he does this to beat Rakan where he excels so he can get recognized as a man. Negi should have little chance, but he makes up with effort, he braves the danger for personal and understandable reasons, is just... there's a whole story behind the confrontation and reasons for this ans that, and you can see that and understand that.
Yet I can't really feel this in Rakudai, or when it seems like it tries it flops on it. Perhaps I just set high standards but that's how it feels to me. The fights are entertaining, yet I can't help feeling that this is lacking and is what doesn't endear me much to Ikki's battles.
One of the examples I can think of that do pleased me more is like his Perfect Vision. He was pushed into the spot, we had already seen his massive insight and quickness to adapt, and then he applied this in his moment of greatest need. It is actually built on something, his Blade Steal, and he used it against the perfect person, Archer dude who has pretty personal reasons for fighting and acting the way he does. That feels good. But it doesn't deliver in this way most of the time.
That's more or less the Crux of what annoys me about Rakudai, battle wise.
Story and character wise... Eh, other reasons.
What I care for is the process of battle, aside from whether it is entertaining or not, as past things build up to cement the decisions the protagonist makes, the trump cards that he pulls off, the hardships that have molded him, etc.
Just see, again, my example with Yukihira Soma. Someone who knows about cooking can just see Souma's ingredients and many times guess what he's doing just from his past recipes and his personality. Likewise for Souma's opponents or allies. Or Negi Vs Rakan, where Negi has to train like a goddamn lunatic, pull off every trump cars he can imagine because schemes and applying difficult magic is his forte, and all the while he does this to beat Rakan where he excels so he can get recognized as a man. Negi should have little chance, but he makes up with effort, he braves the danger for personal and understandable reasons, is just... there's a whole story behind the confrontation and reasons for this ans that, and you can see that and understand that.
Yet I can't really feel this in Rakudai, or when it seems like it tries it flops on it. Perhaps I just set high standards but that's how it feels to me. The fights are entertaining, yet I can't help feeling that this is lacking and is what doesn't endear me much to Ikki's battles.
One of the examples I can think of that do pleased me more is like his Perfect Vision. He was pushed into the spot, we had already seen his massive insight and quickness to adapt, and then he applied this in his moment of greatest need. It is actually built on something, his Blade Steal, and he used it against the perfect person, Archer dude who has pretty personal reasons for fighting and acting the way he does. That feels good. But it doesn't deliver in this way most of the time.
That's more or less the Crux of what annoys me about Rakudai, battle wise.
Story and character wise... Eh, other reasons.
- 5,322
- 433
Opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to logically who should win in imporbable to impossible situations but it's simply a matter of different taste 
- 8,753
- 1,617
I mean, there's a reason they are improbable and not impossible. The shitty thing for me is not that it happens, is that the author doesn't come up with a good narrative that can make you believe stuff went this way.
There's a reason theory of narrative causality exists. Things need to happen for a story to exist, but they need to be told well or it just feels like a cheap cop out.
There's a reason theory of narrative causality exists. Things need to happen for a story to exist, but they need to be told well or it just feels like a cheap cop out.
- 20,509
- 1,590
- Thread starter
- #177
I wouldn't really look at rakudai like that. It's not the best series around. It is by no means a masterpiece but it is in no way bad.
If ya need a masterpiece go for grand blue.
If ya need a masterpiece go for grand blue.
- 5,322
- 433
For me improbable victories aren't that good, I hate under dog stories where they go against ridiculous odds and win. like I said I don't care about narrative causality, I care about what is logically presented, the power/resources and how a battle/fight/story should go from a logical standpoint.
Certain things do need to happen for a story to exist, but a story doesn't require a happy ending, our main character doesn't need to win or survive to tell a complete story. He doesn't need to pull victory from the jaws of defeat, he should fail/die if he's up against improbable odds. As I said above I dislike most underdog stories as a general rule of thumb.
Saying that Im well aware my taste are...Bizarre/extreme to most and I perfectly understand why others enjoy the stories, the uplifting spirit of overcoming adversity through hard work, skill, or even luck. Its just not something I enjoy. Happy or depressing I crave logical outcomes.
Certain things do need to happen for a story to exist, but a story doesn't require a happy ending, our main character doesn't need to win or survive to tell a complete story. He doesn't need to pull victory from the jaws of defeat, he should fail/die if he's up against improbable odds. As I said above I dislike most underdog stories as a general rule of thumb.
Saying that Im well aware my taste are...Bizarre/extreme to most and I perfectly understand why others enjoy the stories, the uplifting spirit of overcoming adversity through hard work, skill, or even luck. Its just not something I enjoy. Happy or depressing I crave logical outcomes.
- 4,498
- 1,117
Once again, while I don't particularly agree, I find that philosophy very fascinating.
What do you think of a series like Gurren Lagann? It certainly has its core as an underdog story about willpower fighting against fate and impossibility, but the audience is later given a very thorough, logical, scientific explanation about how the mechanics of the verse itself allow the main characters to achieve the determination-fueled spikes in power that they do.
So an underdog story in terms of plot, but with a well-established and well thought out system of logic that allows said story to take place.
(Bonus points for ending on a very satisfying but bittersweet note)
What do you think of a series like Gurren Lagann? It certainly has its core as an underdog story about willpower fighting against fate and impossibility, but the audience is later given a very thorough, logical, scientific explanation about how the mechanics of the verse itself allow the main characters to achieve the determination-fueled spikes in power that they do.
So an underdog story in terms of plot, but with a well-established and well thought out system of logic that allows said story to take place.
(Bonus points for ending on a very satisfying but bittersweet note)
- 5,322
- 433
I can't say off the bat as I don't know the series but reading over the synopsis it seems like a case of a classical underdog story, Simon gets lucky finds something to let him chase his dream and becomes embroiled in a conflict beyond him only to succeed because luck/skill ect. If it's well explained later on I can appreciate that but it's not really enough for me overall. The same way ikki having skill isn't enough for me to buy him overcoming challengers with several advantages.
Simon a person in way over his head against god like beings that should have been well beyond his reach and it seems like these beings fail/struggle due to there own incompetence. Though him becoming a wandering vagrant does appeal to me in some ways.
A bigger problem I think I'd have with the verse is well.. It has 1-c beings and as a general rule I avoid verses that dip beyond teir 2 unless they're meant to be explorations of existential horror/dread. Everything beyond tier 2 is infinity upon infinite nonsense to me and often feels less then necessary to the overarching story.
Simon a person in way over his head against god like beings that should have been well beyond his reach and it seems like these beings fail/struggle due to there own incompetence. Though him becoming a wandering vagrant does appeal to me in some ways.
A bigger problem I think I'd have with the verse is well.. It has 1-c beings and as a general rule I avoid verses that dip beyond teir 2 unless they're meant to be explorations of existential horror/dread. Everything beyond tier 2 is infinity upon infinite nonsense to me and often feels less then necessary to the overarching story.
- 5,322
- 433
Note this is my first take based off the information I gleaned from a very light search, apologies if I'm totally off base, Im just giving my thoughts based on my limited knowledge.
- 63,529
- 8,506
High 1C literally comes from a statement on where they lie as that's pretty much it, doesn't have anything to do with the story barring that.
- 3,074
- 676
- 5,322
- 433
So question why didn't the anti spiral just nuke the planet? It seems like an incredibly powerful being and it wants to prevent the evolution of spiral power, why let a planet continue to exist when it could contribute to the creation of the spiral nemesis. Its supposedly over a thousand years old why allow the planet to continue to exist at all? Im guessing Im missing a bunch of context there but that's my question for the moment.
- 3,074
- 676
He wanted to spare life as long as they weren't threats, iirc. Spiral warriors always popped up to fight him, but his weaker armies generally dealt with them, and by the point he noticed Simon and co. were real threats it was already too late.
There was something about Spiral Power that made him cautious iirc, but I don't quite remember what it was.
There was something about Spiral Power that made him cautious iirc, but I don't quite remember what it was.
Agnaa
VS Battles
Super Moderator
Administrator
Calculation Group
Translation Helper
Human Resources
Gold Supporter
- 15,568
- 13,860
In case you're curious, here's an explanation of why it isn't really luck/skill and how Simon fought against those odds (under a collapsible for anyone who doesn't want to get spoiled).
To answer your question (this answer makes more sense after reading the collapsible), they let the planet exist because they don't just want to take over the universe, they're doing this to preserve as much life as possible, and it's better to let them live underground, never advancing to the space age and thus never risking destroying the universe, than to destroy them.
TTGL Explanation |
| The main conceit of the story is "What if all helix-based lifeforms, i.e. ones with DNA, could warp reality/reverse entropy through hope?" and the entire universe/story logically evolves from that premise. At the start of the series, Simon is similar to 99.99% of humans - trapped underground on Earth. Why? Because a long time ago, a tyrannical human realized this reality warping power and trapped all other humans underground, and created massive non-helix-based mechs to terrorize any humans that tried coming above ground. This kept the vast majority of humanity from having hope of getting to the surface, however... A small number of humans made their way to the surface and through technology and ingenuity hijacked/fought the mechs, letting them fight back against the tyrant. But you may be wondering, why is this tyrant intent on oppressing all of humanity? That's because of the Anti-Spiral. The Anti-Spiral is a galactic civilization that constantly monitors planets in the universe for signs of helix-based lifeforms emerging, and wipes out those planets, so that those civilizations will never warp reality to encroach on the domain that they reside over. But then why do they want to oppress other lifeforms? Is it just so they can rule over the universe? Well actually... As the Anti-Spiral advanced as a civilization, they performed simulations on their universe, and realized that life, at that galactic level, could keep on multiplying and expanding, until the universe was essentially full, at which point all life would stop being possible, so they forced every other race into hiding, and locked their own race into simulations so they could occupy as little of the universe as possible, preventing this overpopulation crisis forever. All of the plot series, from the villains and their motivations, to why character power up, to why villains sometimes gave the heroes a chance to save their friends all logically extends. The antagonists explain stuff, show them their friends being held captive, so that they can remove the protagonist's hope, making it harder for Simon to warp reality, power up, and win. |
- 8,753
- 1,617
Because the anti-spirals ****** up stuff for the sake of saving, not for the sake of destruction. If life continues undaunted everyone would be ****** effectively for eternity due to how Spiral Power works, but leaving a lifeless and empty universe is putting the cart before the horse.
More or less, Spirals are the dudes that put you in a perfect paradise where you have no choice for your own life but you live well. As hellish as some people may find that because they live without any any direction or any purpose... you still live. And that's better than nothing, especially when they feel 100% sure that the universe is finished if Spiral Power doesn't get a lid put on it.
But they put everyone in situations where the barest hope they have ends up crushed, because the best way to extinguish someone's will is giving them hope then shutting it down. But Simon had more willpower than they thought, and his connection with Nia let him do what no one else did - find their homeworld.
Honestly I could ramble about it a lot but, eh.
Though, in a purely logical sense, I can't agree with a logical perspective when it comes to stories. If you adhere fully to simply logic, a story feels flimsy and dead. Cohesion and a sense of "I can roll with that" is far more important to me, because otherwise you kill much of what stories are made for.
Also, I am not trying to say Rakudai is a masterpiece or is trying to be, is goddamn dumb people criticize stuff for not trying to be super different. What tropes are used and how good they are used are not the same thing (even though some are much harder to implement without flopping them), but that doesn't matter because I am simply saying what I think Rakudai could have done better and what it did that I just didn't... like, and why.
More or less, Spirals are the dudes that put you in a perfect paradise where you have no choice for your own life but you live well. As hellish as some people may find that because they live without any any direction or any purpose... you still live. And that's better than nothing, especially when they feel 100% sure that the universe is finished if Spiral Power doesn't get a lid put on it.
But they put everyone in situations where the barest hope they have ends up crushed, because the best way to extinguish someone's will is giving them hope then shutting it down. But Simon had more willpower than they thought, and his connection with Nia let him do what no one else did - find their homeworld.
Honestly I could ramble about it a lot but, eh.
Though, in a purely logical sense, I can't agree with a logical perspective when it comes to stories. If you adhere fully to simply logic, a story feels flimsy and dead. Cohesion and a sense of "I can roll with that" is far more important to me, because otherwise you kill much of what stories are made for.
Also, I am not trying to say Rakudai is a masterpiece or is trying to be, is goddamn dumb people criticize stuff for not trying to be super different. What tropes are used and how good they are used are not the same thing (even though some are much harder to implement without flopping them), but that doesn't matter because I am simply saying what I think Rakudai could have done better and what it did that I just didn't... like, and why.
- 7,936
- 8,868
I think he mentioned at some point that Spiral power is tricky to deal with because if he just killed them, new spiral warriors would feel inspired and rise among the crowd, so the only way to stop a society who achieved it from progressing is by breaking their will entirely so they lose hope,give up and stop newer generations from trying to fight back.InfiniteSped said:
The fight we see Kamina leading at the start of the series is NOT the first time humanity fought against the Anti-spiral, all the ones before simply ended in loss and reset of progress
Spoiler |
| this is shown specially well in Gurren Lagann parallel works 8, which shows how King genome ,after witnessing Anti-spiral's power,Turned from humanity's savior into it's biggest tyrant, slaughtering his own army and using their own greatest weapon to oppress humans back into the underground and rule the surface,all that just so he can keep humanity's number in check and make sure it never surpasses a million,which would bring the Anti-spiral's wrath and possibly extinction. |
- 8,753
- 1,617
Nah, if you see the short you see that Genome was shown the Spiral Nemesis. Like he tells Viral, Simon knows no matter what that it is no bluff and it is the truth. He is talking from experience.
The inevitability destroys him. It isn't simply giving up against the anti spirals, is agreeing with them. Otherwise he could have escaped afraid instead of destroying all resistance.
The inevitability destroys him. It isn't simply giving up against the anti spirals, is agreeing with them. Otherwise he could have escaped afraid instead of destroying all resistance.
- 5,322
- 433
So he overcomes everything through hope... the villains plans are meant to break simons hope leaving them open to retaliation/problems as they underestimate him. (Ive seen that trope before but in this context its not as egregious as there is some legitimate reasoning behind there actions) Though I question them not showing simon his friends desiccated corpses if they wanted to extinguish his hope.
Why does this hyper advanced species care at all about threatening helix based life? They're worried about the reality warping helix based life is capable of and the idea they will eventually lead to a massive reality destroying problem. You say they solved the problem forever but it sounds like they set up a system that was doomed to inevitably fail, they are dealing with reality warping via hope, short of full on extinction, leaks and decimation are inevitable.
Lance You say its them putting the cart before the horse if they go straight for mass extinction, Im not sure I agree. their civilization has alreadyset itself up, they're set. the only real therat t them is helix based life thus letting helix based life develop/exist can only be a detriment to their continued existence. I suppose it's morality of some kind binding them to there course it just seems like the simpler solution would have been mass extinction to avoid this exact scenario from ever occurring. Also you said they aren't the first to resist just the first to succeed and that sorta ties back into my problem with underdog stories like this. Am I to believe simon had more hope then any of those that struggled before him?
Hmmm...I don't think this series would be for me though I may check it out in the future and give it a full shot. For the moment it sounds like a well told underdog story set in an interesting if complex mecha universe and Im just not particularly interested atm sorry!
I can roll with many things, there are just some things I can't abide. Don't know why but its simply how I am
Why does this hyper advanced species care at all about threatening helix based life? They're worried about the reality warping helix based life is capable of and the idea they will eventually lead to a massive reality destroying problem. You say they solved the problem forever but it sounds like they set up a system that was doomed to inevitably fail, they are dealing with reality warping via hope, short of full on extinction, leaks and decimation are inevitable.
Lance You say its them putting the cart before the horse if they go straight for mass extinction, Im not sure I agree. their civilization has alreadyset itself up, they're set. the only real therat t them is helix based life thus letting helix based life develop/exist can only be a detriment to their continued existence. I suppose it's morality of some kind binding them to there course it just seems like the simpler solution would have been mass extinction to avoid this exact scenario from ever occurring. Also you said they aren't the first to resist just the first to succeed and that sorta ties back into my problem with underdog stories like this. Am I to believe simon had more hope then any of those that struggled before him?
Hmmm...I don't think this series would be for me though I may check it out in the future and give it a full shot. For the moment it sounds like a well told underdog story set in an interesting if complex mecha universe and Im just not particularly interested atm sorry!
I can roll with many things, there are just some things I can't abide. Don't know why but its simply how I am
- 63,529
- 8,506
Question
Why do you like Prototype?
Why do you like Prototype?
- 2,405
- 336
Why is Prototype being brought up in this thread? XD
- 63,529
- 8,506
Same reason Gurren Lagann is
So again, why do you like it.
So again, why do you like it.
Agnaa
VS Battles
Super Moderator
Administrator
Calculation Group
Translation Helper
Human Resources
Gold Supporter
- 15,568
- 13,860
Though I question them not showing simon his friends desiccated corpses if they wanted to extinguish his hope.
Well they did actually teleport him to a graveyard of everyone who got up to that point in fighting against the Anti-Spirals (discovered their home base, got up to fighting their strongest) but failed, filled with thousands of different alien races' corpses.
Also I did say "showed their friends held captive" but I believe they also MC'd/tortured the protagonist's friend (that they'd captured) in front of Simon.
You say they solved the problem forever but it sounds like they set up a system that was doomed to inevitably fail, they are dealing with reality warping via hope, short of full on extinction, leaks and decimation are inevitable.
If it's either:
their civilization has alreadyset itself up, they're set. the only real therat t them is helix based life thus letting helix based life develop/exist can only be a detriment to their continued existence.
This might be a valid criticism, but it's been a while since I've watched the show or watched an analysis, so there may be a justification for it I've forgotten.
I can roll with many things, there are just some things I can't abide. Don't know why but its simply how I am
Fair enough, but it does lead to interesting discussion.
Well they did actually teleport him to a graveyard of everyone who got up to that point in fighting against the Anti-Spirals (discovered their home base, got up to fighting their strongest) but failed, filled with thousands of different alien races' corpses.
Also I did say "showed their friends held captive" but I believe they also MC'd/tortured the protagonist's friend (that they'd captured) in front of Simon.
You say they solved the problem forever but it sounds like they set up a system that was doomed to inevitably fail, they are dealing with reality warping via hope, short of full on extinction, leaks and decimation are inevitable.
If it's either:
- Destroy all life
- Subjugate all life so there's only a small chance for them to turn galactic and destroy all life
their civilization has alreadyset itself up, they're set. the only real therat t them is helix based life thus letting helix based life develop/exist can only be a detriment to their continued existence.
This might be a valid criticism, but it's been a while since I've watched the show or watched an analysis, so there may be a justification for it I've forgotten.
I can roll with many things, there are just some things I can't abide. Don't know why but its simply how I am
Fair enough, but it does lead to interesting discussion.
- 7,936
- 8,868
I won't spoil you,but this is not the type of show where the protagonist is simply a gary stu who overcomes everything through will, hope and friendship,and there are things such as impossible dreams,who remain unfulfilled even after the fairly bittersweet conclusion.
the first episodes make you believe it will be a fairy tail, but you're in for a surprise<s/>
- 15,686
- 13,202
Prototype was fun as shit, can confirm.
As for anti-spiral not destroying other planets outright, that would have to assume he's evil or malevolent, he isn't.
As for anti-spiral not destroying other planets outright, that would have to assume he's evil or malevolent, he isn't.
- 15,686
- 13,202
Episode 8 never forget.
- 2,405
- 336
Prototype is a series where the protagonist has all these amazing yet terrifying powers. While the sheer sandbox-like mayhem you can cause in the game is what intrigued me about the game at first, the idea of what these horrifying powers could do and what the protagonist (Alex Mercer specifically) could interact with their surroundings with it is also what kept my interest. And the revelation that the protagonist of Prototype 1 was never a human all along, and that he actually is the source of his own powers (which is a virus)... Well, that was what intrigued me about Alex Mercer as a character.Schnee One said:
There are many things you could explore with that type of character. Like, how would a literal sapient virus created as a weapon of mass destruction interact with human morals and values? How can the said virus deal with the memories/minds of thousands that he has absorbed screaming in his head and not be driven to insanity from it? How would the said virus interact with their surroundings now that they know of their true nature as a sentient virus? As the virus isn't a human, would that mean that their own morals and values should be different from an ordinary human's, thus giving them Blue and Orange Morality? Etc.
While there could've been more to Alex Mercer's character in Prototype 1, and that his character could've been more defined and simpler to grasp, the sheer inhumanity of his nature and existence was what gained my interest over his character. At the very least, Mercer isn't one of those overused heroic characters who wants to save everyone as he only cares about finding out the truth and protecting those that are close to him.
There could me more to why I'm interested in Prototype, but those are the reasons why I was hooked into Prototype at the top of my head.
- 5,322
- 433
So they tortured his friends that is better then them simply capturing them though I still feel they should have killed them when they had the chance. While I dislike them dragging it out long enough to screw them over I can accept it.
If it's either:
*Destroy all life
*Subjugate all life so there's only a small chance for them to turn galactic and destroy all life
You'd obviously pick the latter over the former.
Im not sure I agree here, the threat of reality tearing itself aprat is a big one. They should have either let life continued uninterrupted or wiped it all out to ensure the threat could never overtake them. I don't know if I can condone the half measure they took. They still caused mass casualties to force other species under ground, so there hands aren't free of blood. Not only did they cause mass amounts of death in there campaign to stave off a threat, they let the threat continue to exist. Threat to the fabric of reality? Seems like the right time for overkill.
This might be a valid criticism, but it's been a while since I've watched the show or watched an analysis, so there may be a justification for it I've forgotten.
Fair Im just basing this off my own rather light understanding at the moment so its likely Im misunderstanding something as well.
Fair enough, but it does lead to interesting discussion
True enough that's why I'm here
@Schnee
Cool abilities and a main character who is a sentient virus. Plus I like writing fanfiction and I can do a lot with that biological potential. I also have far to many fond memories of throwing tanks into helicopters and devouring everything in my path.
Writing was poor and characterization lacked real depth. Bunch of ideas and abilities never got explored and that potential draws my interest. So to answer your question nostalgia, unexplored potential and the fact the game itself is just fricken fun. Saying that if prototype had simply been a light novel or anime It likely wouldn't have caught my interest, being a fun game overall is why it's still a series I look back on fondly.
It also happens to lack the underdog trope, even on the highest difficulty the game makes you feel like an absolute god and the story while having several moments that are incredibly stupid never makes you feel like you are overcoming some improbable odds. You're memory devouring super virus that can suplex a tank and throw it a city block. Your a god and the city is just your destructible playground.
If it's either:
*Destroy all life
*Subjugate all life so there's only a small chance for them to turn galactic and destroy all life
You'd obviously pick the latter over the former.
Im not sure I agree here, the threat of reality tearing itself aprat is a big one. They should have either let life continued uninterrupted or wiped it all out to ensure the threat could never overtake them. I don't know if I can condone the half measure they took. They still caused mass casualties to force other species under ground, so there hands aren't free of blood. Not only did they cause mass amounts of death in there campaign to stave off a threat, they let the threat continue to exist. Threat to the fabric of reality? Seems like the right time for overkill.
This might be a valid criticism, but it's been a while since I've watched the show or watched an analysis, so there may be a justification for it I've forgotten.
Fair Im just basing this off my own rather light understanding at the moment so its likely Im misunderstanding something as well.
Fair enough, but it does lead to interesting discussion
True enough that's why I'm here
@Schnee
Cool abilities and a main character who is a sentient virus. Plus I like writing fanfiction and I can do a lot with that biological potential. I also have far to many fond memories of throwing tanks into helicopters and devouring everything in my path.
Writing was poor and characterization lacked real depth. Bunch of ideas and abilities never got explored and that potential draws my interest. So to answer your question nostalgia, unexplored potential and the fact the game itself is just fricken fun. Saying that if prototype had simply been a light novel or anime It likely wouldn't have caught my interest, being a fun game overall is why it's still a series I look back on fondly.
It also happens to lack the underdog trope, even on the highest difficulty the game makes you feel like an absolute god and the story while having several moments that are incredibly stupid never makes you feel like you are overcoming some improbable odds. You're memory devouring super virus that can suplex a tank and throw it a city block. Your a god and the city is just your destructible playground.
